On selfishness and selflessness: Even bacteria make choices for the betterment of all

Vastet
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On selfishness and selflessness: Even bacteria make choices for the betterment of all

"Our findings suggest new principles for collective decisions that allow both random behavior by individuals and nonrandom outcomes for the population as a whole," said study co-author Eshel Ben-Jacob, a senior investigator at CTBP and adjunct professor of biochemistry and cell biology at Rice. "These new principles could be broadly applicable, from the study of cancer metastasis to the study of collective decisions by humans during times of stress."
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Some species of bacteria live in complex colonies that can contain millions of individual cells. An increasing body of research on bacterial colonies has found that members often cooperate -- even to the point of sacrificing their lives -- for the survival of their colony.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130422123042.htm

Always fun to shove another nail into EXC's coffin.

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EXC
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Cooperation is based on give

Cooperation is based on give and take. Bacteria or any other organism aren't going to keep giving with no assurance of anything in return.

You believe in birth right entitlements, that is not cooperation. This means you can get without ever being required to give. Such people become a cancer to others.

What would the bacteria do if any organism can be inserted into their colony in unlimited quantity. Would they survive? Would they eventually learn to treat the visitors as enemies if they wanted to survive? Or would they do as you suggest, guarantee their survival and allow them to breed limitless?

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


Vastet
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EXC wrote:Cooperation is

EXC wrote:

Cooperation is based on give and take. Bacteria or any other organism aren't going to keep giving with no assurance of anything in return.

This proves you wrong. Your denial of empirical evidence further proves your irrational attachment to ideas with no merit. I much appreciate your display.

EXC wrote:

You believe in birth right entitlements, that is not cooperation.

That is a mischaracterisation at best, and a blatant lie at worst.

EXC wrote:
This means you can get without ever being required to give. Such people become a cancer to others.

Since your premise is flawed, so must be your conclusion.

EXC wrote:
What would the bacteria do if any organism can be inserted into their colony in unlimited quantity.

Gee that isn't happening, to bacteria or us. So it really isn't relevant.

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EXC
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Vastet wrote:You believe in

You believe in birth right entitlements, that is not cooperation.

Vastet wrote:
That is a mischaracterisation at best, and a blatant lie at worst.

No. The only thing one should do to get benefits is be born. If not, tell us the conditions when under which people can't get benefits and rights.

 

BTW. There are some anthrax spores in need of a host to help them out. Could you show us how much you care and provide them with one unselfishly?

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


Vastet
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EXC wrote:You believe in

EXC wrote:
You believe in birth right entitlements, that is not cooperation.

Repeating your lies doesn't make them more true.

EXC wrote:
No. The only thing one should do to get benefits is be born. If not, tell us the conditions when under which people can't get benefits and rights.

I've already done so at least a dozen times. I'm not going to repeat myself every time you stop by to make a fool of yourself.

EXC wrote:
BTW. There are some anthrax spores in need of a host to help them out. Could you show us how much you care and provide them with one unselfishly?

I'd be happy to see you off as you sacrifice yourself, since the well being of anthrax means so much to you.

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Vastet wrote: I've already

Vastet wrote:
I've already done so at least a dozen times. I'm not going to repeat myself every time you stop by to make a fool of yourself.

Never. You say recipients of benefits should attend job training, but if they don't, nothing happens to them. So it's a birthright effectively. Under what circumstances would someone not recive food, shelter, healthcare or the right to reproduce? For you it is never. This means it is a birthright, which is not cooperation.

 

Vastet wrote:
I'd be happy to see you off as you sacrifice yourself, since the well being of anthrax means so much to you.

I'm not the one that preaches so much in self sacrifice, I say live for yourself unashamed. The fact that you don't care about anthrax shows you only practice selective caring, selective unselfishness. In other words, always looking out for No. 1.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


Vastet
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EXC wrote:Never. Habitual

EXC wrote:
Never.

Habitual liar, or simply a horrible memory coupled with self delusion? I'll let the audience decide. All anyone has to do to prove this is a lie is to look through EXC's and my posting histories, and read through topics we've both posted in which have economic or political themes. There you'll find I've literally refuted this exact same bs at least thrice a year since EXC joined.

EXC wrote:
You say recipients of benefits should attend job training, but if they don't, nothing happens to them.

Lies.

EXC wrote:
Under what circumstances would someone not recive food, shelter, healthcare or the right to reproduce?

I even already refuted this in the last 24 hours in another thread!
Oh it's too easy.

EXC wrote:
I'm not the one that preaches so much in self sacrifice,

No you're a psychopath who has no appreciation for anyone but himself, and who is completely locked in his own little world where you make up your opponents arguments and shoot them down, poorly

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Vastet
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EXC wrote:The fact that you

EXC wrote:
The fact that you don't care about anthrax shows you only practice selective caring, selective unselfishness. In other words, always looking out for No. 1.

Ridiculous.

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Vastet wrote: Habitual

Vastet wrote:
Habitual liar, or simply a horrible memory coupled with self delusion? I'll let the audience decide. All anyone has to do to prove this is a lie is to look through EXC's and my posting histories, and read through topics we've both posted in which have economic or political themes. There you'll find I've literally refuted this exact same bs at least thrice a year since EXC joined.

So you're saying we have the same political views, this is all a bit misunderstanding?

The fact is you spin words to fit your delusional view of reality. You say you're not for birth right entitlements, but then you won't plainly state when people are to be cut off from entitlements. Yes, I know we're all supposed to understand your great intellect from your vast number of postings, so therefore you just can't plainly answer a direct question. How convenient for you! You can call me liar, but then present no evidence, just take your word for it.

The fact is that any organism that survives develops symbiotic relationships with those it can cooperate with and immunity against those that behave like parasites. Your political views are to let parasites keep feeding on the hosts. Otherwise you could plainly state when people are cut off from welfare and reproductive rights. To you they are a birthright.

Vastet wrote:
No you're a psychopath who has no appreciation for anyone but himself, and who is completely locked in his own little world where you make up your opponents arguments and shoot them down, poorly

I didn't know you were qualified to make medical diagnosis just from internet postings. Just show how delusional you are and how weak your arguments are that you must resort to personal attacks.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


Jean Chauvin
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Existentialism on the other hand...

Existentialism on the other hand is completely antithetical to the designed behavior of the bacteria inside them. Selfishness and exploitation are the way we survive. The essence or substance of the person (e.g. soul, values, doing the right thing) are absolutely irrelavant. Sarte and Nietzche agree.

I met a homeless man who looks up to Nietzche as his hero he told me. As a result, he proudly talks about exploiting the government at all cost and ripping off the tax payers. He is going to get free housing through section 8, free food, free heat. Man is the center of all things. He smiles with "gusto" regarding this. It is not a coincidence that he is also an "atheist."

Ironically, Existentialism, though not always consistent, is the very hearbeat of all denominations of atheism. Take away existentialism, and atheism dies a cold and cruel death.

Respectfully,

Jean Chauvin (Jude 3).

A Rational Christian of Intelligence (rare)with a valid and sound justification for my epistemology and a logical refutation for those with logical fallacies and false worldviews upon their normative of thinking in retrospect to objective normative(s). This is only understood via the imago dei in which we all are.

Respectfully,

Jean Chauvin (Jude 3).