Adam and Eve explained by a Christian....What do you think?
This is an explanation of Genesis I got in my email the other day. I think this person was responding to something I said in a stick am Chat. I mentioned if any Christians want to try to explain the genesis story in a way that makes sense feel free. (not that I need it explained) But I just thought I would post this and see what you guys think.
The universe was not created in a day, the Bible says that "in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" (from memory). From this it is obvious that no limit is set upon the age of the universe or the earth -- this permits any number such as billions of years that scientists may desire.
The purpose with the creation of a man and a woman was to have them multiply so as to fill the earth. That wouldn't quite have worked so well with two men now, would it? b. side issue: The work the couple and consequently mankind were given was to be care takers of the whole earth.
Gen 1:28, . . . Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. (ASV)
There was nothing magical about the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil." It represented the acceptance or the refusal by man of God's right to decide what is good and evil for man -- his right to rule us through his Theocracy.
God had provided plenty of food of all kinds for them to eat. The pointing out of that one food product as having been prohibited brought no hardship upon them in any manner at all.
However, it did test their obedience to him their God and maker, one may also say that it tested even their love for him.
Their disobedience brought about at the worst possible time (before they had conceived children) was a rejection of the rule through love that worked thru willful obedience.
God does not want people to obey him because they know the police will do this and that to them, or such. He wants willful obedience bases on love. That is why today too, only those that choose to willingly serve him and obey him (yes a lot of disobedient people call themselves Christian, but their willful sins will be the end of them) and put faith in his arrangements shall be saved.
Thus the rebellion against this rule that works only by willful obedience, theocracy, caused a legal issue to occur. Satan had challenged (not God's power, that would have ended in an instant) God's rule. A. He claimed that men didn't need God's rule to be trouble free -- therefore, the time for testing this was accorded. B. He claimed that no human would serve God when forced into loosing all his material possessions (at the time of Job) C. He claimed that no human would serve God if they had to prove it by dying for it.
This legal issue has been decided in the heavenly court for many centuries now, and the decision has been reached. That is why we believe we are in what is named the "last days of this system of things."
6. Satan was an angel that sinned and used his free will for selfish purposes. He wanted to be like God. He was the ventriloquist behind that poor innocent animal everybody talks about. (angels being invisible to human eyes unless not wanting it, it would seem as if the serpent talked since nobody else was about) Because Eve had recently been created and was unfamiliar with the animals, Eve didn't know that the animal couldn't talk. That is why the Bible says that she was utterly deceived while her husband knew instantly what had occurred.
It would be like one of us going to another earth like world and not knowing which life form/s was/were intelligent enough to communicate with.
These two humans were as intelligent as you and I. Since they were alone on earth, why should they worry about being naked. Even between a man and his wife today there is no shame. However, if I was found doing something unnatural by my wife I probably would feel shame.
The same happened to them. They knew they had disobeyed and felt shame so the covered up. Even today when someone does something truly stupid they tend to hide their faces in their hands or something to that effect.
Co-Founder of the Atheist/Freethought website Pathofreason.com
Check it out
Textom wrote:But since the Tree of Life was keeping Adam & Eve immortal that whole time, I personally don't see how you can be sure it wasn't 15 billion years.
as shitty a storyteller as the person was who came up with that piece of crap i still don't think they would just omit 15 billion years in the middle of the story. wouldn't they say something? also it seems like in 15 billion years something would occur that was at least mildly noteworthy. i think it's pretty fair to assume that much time didn't pass.
Well, since the priests who constructed the Genesis story were cannibalizing from two or possibly three different source texts--none of which we still have--we don't know for sure what they left out and/or what they added in.
But the Gen 2-3 gap kind of makes all those reams of apologetic writing about the literal meaning of "day" kind of moot. Usher's calculations were exact to the hour of creation, so if even a couple of years or a century or two went by, he'd be wrong. I've never been able to find out how he decided how much time passed in that interval.
 Okay, I found it. Ussher assumed that, because the Bible says Adam was 130 when Seth was born, that the earth was 130 years old at that time.
But the obvious flaw here is that there's no evidence one way or the other that Adam's age was counted from his creation, rather than from the time of the fall. If there was no death in the garden, was there aging and time? I don't think anybody can adequately answer that question based on what's in the Bible.
"After Jesus was born, the Old Testament basically became a way for Bible publishers to keep their word count up." -Stephen Colbert
Veils of Maya wrote:
Misadventure? I wouldn't associate the potential of eternal punishment a "youthful misadventure."
No more than an accident with a hot oven that left life-long permanent scarring, which is the sense in which I meant it. I didn't mean to be unduly pleasant by it, I intended a neutral statement to be read from that context.
Your story seemed to trivialize what is the pivotal point in the fall of man and all life on earth.
veils of maya wrote:
Your analogy doesn't match up. God is the one's who was angry and held man responsible. Not the other way around. And Christians seem bound and determined to remind you of this fact at every turn.
This nicely outlines the distinction between a book and its readership. don't you think?
Reading the book itself it's basically impossible to find any literal support for an angry, blaming God in genesis 3.
You're correct in that there is no explicit indication of God's state of mind. However, the story doesn't imply that Adam or Eve were angry either. But, of the two scenarios you described, it appears that God is the one who's holding a grudge.
Most of the consequences related in 3-14:19 are linked directly to the action of eating the fruit. ie Because you ate it the ground is cursed; (to the snake) because you have done this you will eat dust.
God takes personal credit for three things and those are laid on woman - the enmity between children and snakes, pain in childbirth and female subservience. To infer from this that god was angry you must first assume that these are things that an almighty God would do out of anger because God is never literally described as being angry over this event. This invokes the question which you see in debate over the problem of evil, greater good. The book itself doesn't specify the why's and wherefore's and it most definitely does not say God was angry.
The bible says all animals were created as vegitarians. Since this is obviously no longer the case, this seems to imply Man's disobedience caused some animals, such as tigers and piranhas, to become carnivorous. Their entire physiological structures of were changed to kill and eat meat. Those who remained vegetarians suddenly became prey. Animals began to die a violent death on a regular basis.
In addition, man is made mortal. God, in is infinite ability and intelligence, had an unlimited number of options at his disposal, but he essentially sentences Adam and Eve to a life of struggle and eventual death. Based on the choice he made, I'd say he was far from being happy with them.
finally God dresses adam and eve in skins and sets a guard over the 'tree of life'. If anything is to be inferred from these last few lines of genesis three then it must be that a greater good was intended to be served.
God did not initially forbid man to eat from the Tree of Life. His resending this offer could quite easily be interpreted as punishment since it caused their eventual death. Again, God chooses death, which he uses as punishment in numerous other senerios in the Bible.
BTW re "match-up" You do realise I am not a christian apologist, yes? I have no obligation to 'match up' with christian dogma.
But it's helpful if your analogies actually 'match up' with topic at hand: the Biblical story of Adam and Eve.
In addition, your story seemed to imply that some of us were acting like ungrateful children, angry at God for leaving us unattended in the Garden of Eden. Personally, I don't believe in God, so I can't blame or be angry with someone who doesn't exist.
Generally I like Genesis, can you tell? It is a deeply philosophical story, IMO. Still... that is JMHO.
It makes you feel warm and fuzzy, so it must be true?
Do you like Harry Potter as well?
As a matter of fact, I love Harry Potter.
The author of the Harry Potter series knew the importance of writing to her audience. She not only entertained her readers, but did so in a way that covered a wide range of subjects, such as good vs. evil, friendship, teamwork and even death. To do so, she put Harry and his friends in an magical environment - allowing her to orchestrate situations that clearly illustrated these very subjects.
While we may or may not like the story, the real question is "does the story of the Garden of Eden have any basis in reality?" That is, God really created Adam and Eve as perfect beings, then punished them for his disobedience. Or is God simply another plot device, like magic in the Harry Potter series?
We do not learn by experience, but by our capacity for experience.