Aussie Floods: 10 Dead, 90 Missing: Punishment From God, Says Pastor

Atheistextremist
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Aussie Floods: 10 Dead, 90 Missing: Punishment From God, Says Pastor

 

A CHRISTIAN pastor has blamed Foreign Minister Kevin Rudd for the floods devastating Queensland.

That's because Mr Rudd "spoke against Israel" in December 2010, Daniel Nalliah from the Catch the Fire Ministries has written on his website.

"It is very interesting that Kevin Rudd is from Queensland. Is God trying to get our attention? I believe so," he said.

Mr Rudd, during a visit to Israel in December, called on the Jewish state to allow international inspectors into its nuclear facilities.

He also called for a halt to the construction of Jewish settlements in East Jerusalem and the West Bank.

Mr Nalliah said every time America went against Israel there was "disaster in the land."

He sees the Queensland floods as a parallel. In 2008, Mr Nalliah caused controversy when he said bushfires that killed hundreds of people in Victoria were a result of that state's decriminalisation of abortion.

Nalliah was recently seen building a corrugated iron caravel in his backyard, with a hills hoist for a mast and a tartan travel rug-sail borrowed from his mother, Beryl. Neighbours say the vessel is being filled with all 'kinds' of animals, including Nalliah's pet cat, two guinea pigs and a goat named Alan.

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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 That's ridiculous,

 That's ridiculous, everyone knows it was global warming. 


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No, God wasn't punishing

No, God wasn't punishing humans, he was trying to get rid of his fucked up animals. Pouches? Slow bears, wambats, dingos? WHAT THE HELL ? Or is it he thought the rain would make people lose their grips on the ceilings and fall to the floor where they belong?

 

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God Works

Funny how God is supposed to work in mysterious ways his wonders to perform. Unless you happen to be a Reverend or a Church Official. They "know" exactly what the motivations of god are and why he does all the things he does.

Unless someone throws an argument at them that they can not answer. Then they fall back on the "God is a Mystery" argument. God is only a mystery when they conveniently need him to be. God is unknowable when they need him to be.

Otherwise, they know all the reasons behind god's motivations.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
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Brian37 wrote:No, God wasn't

Brian37 wrote:

No, God wasn't punishing humans, he was trying to get rid of his fucked up animals. Pouches? Slow bears, wambats, dingos? WHAT THE HELL ? Or is it he thought the rain would make people lose their grips on the ceilings and fall to the floor where they belong?

 

 

ROFL.

 

Sorry, I mean this is a human tragedy and we should all feel terrible for the deluded pastor.

Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.


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harleysportster

harleysportster wrote:

Otherwise, they know all the reasons behind god's motivations.

 

Well, he tweets them every day, so of course they know.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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cj wrote:harleysportster

cj wrote:

harleysportster wrote:

Otherwise, they know all the reasons behind god's motivations.

 

Well, he tweets them every day, so of course they know.

 

You've read God's speeches in the Bible - do you really think he could keep it to 140 characters?

"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
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jcgadfly wrote:cj

jcgadfly wrote:

cj wrote:

harleysportster wrote:

Otherwise, they know all the reasons behind god's motivations.

Well, he tweets them every day, so of course they know.

You've read God's speeches in the Bible - do you really think he could keep it to 140 characters?

 

Good point, but I believe () god/s/dess is capable of flexibility. 

 

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Hi - from one of the

Hi - from one of the disaster areas. Although my house is something like 100 feet above the peak river level, the main roads are cut off in every direction.

Had a brief power outage yesterday, but been ok since.

Just sorting out my photos, will post some up soon. Nothing too dramatic, I'm sure you've seen the really news-worthy clips.

I was pleased to hear someone on our off-air TV acknowledge that this sort of thing was likely to happen more in future, due to climate change. The first super-flood in this city in historic times was in the 1890's, next really big one was in 1974, now 2011. This one was higher than '74 in places, lower in others. A bit of a worry, especially since we have built a major dam since '74 which probably helped moderate it.

So a strong probability that global warming/climate change contributed to this.

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I'm glad you're both safe. 

I'm glad you're both safe.

 

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Death toll is up to 13. 

Death toll is up to 13.

A guy was found in his car.

EDIT:

Still not counted as part of official toll, currently being investigated.

So current toll is 12 dead, 74 missing.

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Some photos:    This was

Some photos:

 

 

 

This was looking along a 4-lane highway - those are lighting poles along between the two directions of the highway:

The waters have just started to recede on the other side of my 'island', this morning at sunrise:

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12000 homes have been

12000 homes have been inundated across Brisbane.

I was touched to hear a woman speaking on a cell-phone, down at a local shopping area, telling a friend or relative that "the house is gone . We lost everything...".

It's one thing to see it on TV news, it is another to see/hear a 'real' person so affected...

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BobSpence1 wrote:12000 homes

BobSpence1 wrote:

12000 homes have been inundated across Brisbane.

I was touched to hear a woman speaking on a cell-phone, down at a local shopping area, telling a friend or relative that "the house is gone . We lost everything...".

It's one thing to see it on TV news, it is another to see/hear a 'real' person so affected...

This is horrible, I feel for these unfortunate people.  I can't even imagine this kind of thing happening to my community.  My heart goes out to you and your community.

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Yeah - those images tell the story.

 

I didn't realise how prone to flooding Queensland actually was. So much of it is flood plain. The water across that highway is a metre and a half? Like you my sis in Wynnum has been lucky to live on higher ground.

As the papers are saying, there was a reason homes in the North of NSW and in Qld were built on stilts - no just for ventilation but to get them out of the way of floods.

 

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A couple of shots of that

A couple of shots of that highway about 12 hours later:

From that overpass:

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You guys should be proud of

You guys should be proud of how your government has handled things so far.  If this happened in America it would be a giant cluster-fuck but you've managed to keep damage minimal and stay more or less on top of things.

 

Has there been much speculation yet about the longer term repercussions?

 

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Yeah, quite a bit.An

Yeah, quite a bit.

An economist has estimated its overall  impact on the economy will be comparable, in relative terms, to Katrina in the US.

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Atheistextremist wrote:

Atheistextremist wrote:

A CHRISTIAN pastor has blamed Foreign Minister Kevin Rudd for the floods devastating Queensland.

That's because Mr Rudd "spoke against Israel" in December 2010, Daniel Nalliah from the Catch the Fire Ministries has written on his website.

"It is very interesting that Kevin Rudd is from Queensland. Is God trying to get our attention? I believe so," he said.

Mr Rudd, during a visit to Israel in December, called on the Jewish state to allow international inspectors into its nuclear facilities.

He also called for a halt to the construction of Jewish settlements in East Jerusalem and the West Bank.

Mr Nalliah said every time America went against Israel there was "disaster in the land."

He sees the Queensland floods as a parallel. In 2008, Mr Nalliah caused controversy when he said bushfires that killed hundreds of people in Victoria were a result of that state's decriminalisation of abortion.

Nalliah was recently seen building a corrugated iron caravel in his backyard, with a hills hoist for a mast and a tartan travel rug-sail borrowed from his mother, Beryl. Neighbours say the vessel is being filled with all 'kinds' of animals, including Nalliah's pet cat, two guinea pigs and a goat named Alan.

Mr Rudd sounds like a very reasonable man, I couldn't agree more about his judgement of Israeli state policy. Australians are lucky to have such a politician.

But seriously, what's Mr Nalliah (....whatever he's doing instead of) thinking, he practically slanders God with terrorism, taking hostages, arsony, etc. (aren't Catch Fire Ministries named after the Victorian bushfires??? ) Even religious organizations should have enough sense to tuck away their own fools. I wonder why they give him to the news at all.

Australians have my sincere condolences. Floods are always a terrible thing, by how unpreventable they are, there's no help, as long as you live in a wrong place and global economy doesn't decrease production and deforestation. Lots of that water was safely hidden in icebergs and rainforests and should have remained that way, plus heat trapped by greenhouse effect. That's powering all the hurricanes, right?

Hey Bob, I don't know if that is an advantage, to have a great state and relatively few millions of people there to pay the taxes. Unless Perth contributes by the money for its mineral riches.  How are the dams holding up? I thought they are full, but Wikipedia says Wivehhoe dam just contained 191%, no shit Sad

My little country has a long tradition of floods, they're here nearly every year, sometimes more often than that. It's interesting how rich people in central flat regions get flooded and poor people in mountainous border regions don't get so flooded. Looks like geology knows more justice than God.

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Queensland actually sells a

Queensland actually sells a lot of coal to places like China. We have some other mineral resources too.

And of course the Federal government will definitely be helping out - the army is heavily involved, we have 19 helicopters from them helping with search and rescue, and bringing in supplies to isolated people, and men and vehicles on the ground as well. They have vehicles which are well suited to getting through damaged roads and debris-strewn countryside.

We have also had pledges of help from other countries.

The irony of the rich here has been that there was a premium on river-front properties... May drop a little now.

Our dams are holding up. The main dam relevant to this flood may well have helped keep it a meter or so below what it might have been, but it has been overflowing on its main spillway for a while now (hence the 190%). They have been trying to let a little out now, not enough to push the flood levels up again, but trying to get the dam levels back down, in case there is another heavy period of rain that they can catch and hold back from making the flood worse again.

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I just saw on our TV news

I just saw on our TV news that Brazil, a far more religious country than Australia, has had a flood and landslide disaster from heavy rain that has killed more than 20 times as many people as our floods.

Good one, God.

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BobSpence1 wrote:I just saw

BobSpence1 wrote:

I just saw on our TV news that Brazil, a far more religious country than Australia, has had a flood and landslide disaster from heavy rain that has killed more than 20 times as many people as our floods.

Good one, God.

I bet if we asked the religious community leaders for an explanation of that, there answer would be : God works in mysterious ways and we can not know his will (unless it fits their needs of course, hehe).

Thanks for the updates about the situation down under. I wish you guys the best of luck.

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Things are coming good

Things are coming good faster than expected, at least in Brisbane.

River levels falling faster than expected, power being reconnected.

My local supermarket is back in action.

They expect the city center to be getting back to something like normal next week.

Obviously a lot of cleanup work, a lot of homes and businesses seriously affected, but a lot of people volunteering to help those who were more badly affected.

The only person on TV who I have heard mention 'God' was Rudd, our previous Prime Minister, and then it was just the conventional "Thank God that...", nothing remotely like a prayer or invocation, even though he is known to be moderately religious.

Damn, as I was typing that, they were interviewing someone who had lost their parents in the flood and just made a more explicit reference to God.

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Not so fast, Bob!

BobSpence1 wrote:

Things are coming good faster than expected, at least in Brisbane.

River levels falling faster than expected, power being reconnected.

My local supermarket is back in action.

They expect the city center to be getting back to something like normal next week.

Obviously a lot of cleanup work, a lot of homes and businesses seriously affected, but a lot of people volunteering to help those who were more badly affected.

The only person on TV who I have heard mention 'God' was Rudd, our previous Prime Minister, and then it was just the conventional "Thank God that...", nothing remotely like a prayer or invocation, even though he is known to be moderately religious.

Damn, as I was typing that, they were interviewing someone who had lost their parents in the flood and just made a more explicit reference to God.

 

Opposition leader Tony Abbott this yesterday was moved to say "The rain falls on the just and the unjust alike..."

Does that count?

 

 

 

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Atheistextremist

Atheistextremist wrote:

BobSpence1 wrote:

Things are coming good faster than expected, at least in Brisbane.

River levels falling faster than expected, power being reconnected.

My local supermarket is back in action.

They expect the city center to be getting back to something like normal next week.

Obviously a lot of cleanup work, a lot of homes and businesses seriously affected, but a lot of people volunteering to help those who were more badly affected.

The only person on TV who I have heard mention 'God' was Rudd, our previous Prime Minister, and then it was just the conventional "Thank God that...", nothing remotely like a prayer or invocation, even though he is known to be moderately religious.

Damn, as I was typing that, they were interviewing someone who had lost their parents in the flood and just made a more explicit reference to God.

Opposition leader Tony Abbott this yesterday was moved to say "The rain falls on the just and the unjust alike..."

Does that count?

I didn't hear that, although I saw him speaking to a reporter shortly after that other bit. I didn't listen closely to the whole interview - what I did hear made no such references, which did surprise me a little, but I would have been really surprised if he hadn't slipped in something like that at some point.

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Hey Bob, Good to hear you're

Hey Bob, Good to hear you're alright. What a helluva week this has been. I spent my teens living in the Lockyer valley so I've been on tenterhooks waiting for news of my friends on and over the range. Out here on the granite belt we got some really serious flooding on Monday when a private dam broke banks. It has hung around right through the week. Fortunately no casualties beyond the hundred or so creek front homes and streets that are now basically mince. My house is on a hill far enough away from the rising water to have got by unscathed and town is having a big communal clean up tomorrow so I'm breaking out the rake and gumboots to go help the neighbours at the other end of my street.

One thing I want to say, about this event. I live on a Mountain 1km above sea level, it would seem living here a person could feel pretty secure about their chances in a flood. But Monday afternoon absolutely shook me to the core - Toowoomba is a Mountain city only 2-300m lower than the Summit of the Great Dividing Range in QLD, by any cursory estimation it would seem an ideal place to run when water got high.  That I'd ever witness such a great torrent of water rushing straight down the main street of a mountain top city was virtually unthinkable before this week. The idea of it is enough to give one nightmares for a long time, let alone the fact that you might have friends in the midst of drama.

Another shock was the idea that after record flooding in Northern NSW compounded with inconceivably immense flooding across QLD, cutting towns off for days to weeks, there could imaginably be more and far far worse to come ? I haven't seen its like in all my life. The roads all around me were already chopped up by rushing water, Two of my friends had already been stranded at my house, consecutive weeks, while travelling, and people in Warwick were just moving their stuff back in, Rockhampton hadn't even peaked, Condamine and Theodore were still evacuated. I'm sure I could be forgiven for having expected things were due to calm down for a while...

So Bob, how about you, was there a moment during this week that shook your personal assumptions out of their cosy pocket?

PS Anyone want to see pics of the floods in my town?

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Atheistextremist

Atheistextremist wrote:

 

Opposition leader Tony Abbott this yesterday was moved to say "The rain falls on the just and the unjust alike..."

Does that count?

 

 

 

 

I'd say yes, AE. Argh seriously, could he be more of a tool if he tried? Giving interviews from his holiday home during the worst moments and today he visited Brisbane stepping daintily through the mud in his thousand dollar shoes, hiking his more expensive suit pants above the waterline as the irony of him delivering advice to us about the need for resilience and toughness flew swiftly over his perfectly coiffed head.. not a good look at all.  Compared to Bligh and Rudd, sweaty and dishevelled, busy delivering their state from crisis he was positively pathetic.

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Since it's from God, does

Since it's from God, does this mean the politicians are off the hook for not building better flood control systems? No need to improve the dams and dykes in the future?

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yes, Eloise

I would like to see flood pictures of your town.

Western US - Rockies or Cascades - often has floods.  I'm about 200 feet above a creek that floods almost every year.  They recently rebuilt a bridge over it so maybe it won't go over the road this year.  I have no idea why some people live near this creek, but they do and they get flooded.

My sister-in-law had to live in the country.  So they bought a house - that flooded before they ever moved in.  It was rebuilt 12 feet higher on a platform.  And they still have to have flood insurance.  And, they are in the coastal mountains.  My first question before even looking at a house to buy around here - has it ever flooded?  If so, then I won't even go look at it.  Thank goodness for the full disclosure real estate laws that says they have to tell if there has been significant damage that they know of and they have to tell.

 

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Eloise, I experienced the

Eloise, I experienced the 1974 flood from the other side of the river, and was far closer to the effects of it. That was a far more stunning experience, as the flood crept a few feet into the very lowest corner of our backyard before stopping. I witnessed it progressively engulfing the houses further down the slope of the street.

I actually went out onto it in my inflatable boat, and helped rescue some floating property for my neighbours, including sliding a refrigerator out of the kitchen window of a house two doors away and balancing it across my boat.

This time was very different. The dominant impression was the disparity between the normalcy of my experience in and around my house and the surrounding neighbourhood, with only a couple of hours loss of power, with what I saw when I travelled in either direction along the main road route through the area until I reached the 'road closed' signs. I estimate my property is about 100 feet above the peak, so if it ever got to me, our city would truly be history.

That was surreal. Right up to that point where I could see the water, everything looked normal, especially once the rain had mostly cleared. I went out several times to look, including in the very early morning when the water was expected to be around its peak, just to bring home to me the reality that it was an event of similar magnitude to '74.

I kept following the coverage from ABC-TV's 24-hour news channel, to remind myself of it, as much as anything.

I was disappointed, but not entirely surprised, that very few acknowledged the very real likelihood that this sort of thing was no longer a 'once in a century' event, with the progress of climate change. So many people did reassure themselves that it was still such an event, and unlikely to hit them again. Understandable of course, but that does worry me.

Eighty years between the first historical flood in Brisbane in the 1890's, another 40 years to this one, which has been far more widespread both within the state and beyond. Not proof of the GW connection, but entirely consistent with the scenario.

At least one or two local expert commentators, and one who spoke from the US, did point this out.

I genuinely experienced pangs of empathic sorrow for the various tragic personal stories covered in the news.

If I had not experienced '74, as my younger fellow citizens had not, I am sure it would have had far more impact on me emotionally.

The military choppers flying everywhere was another difference from '74.

Those scenes of the torrents in Toowoomba and the Lockyer Valley are seared into my memory.

By yesterday afternoon, they had already opened one direction of that flooded highway I photographed, as well as both directions of the bridge, so I have been impressed at the pace of recovery, although the effects will linger for a long time in some areas, for many people.

So no shaking of my assumptions, it has just further strengthened, if anything, my understanding that there is no purpose or ultimate meaning to the world we inhabit, at any level beyond the important reality of our empathy for the other members of our society. The amount of help being offered by neighbours and even complete strangers, whenever the opportunity arose, was encouraging. I experienced and participated in that in '74.

Nature can strike at any time. There is no ultimate justice, no 'higher power', apart from the blind power of cosmic forces, no balancing of good vs evil, beyond what we can effect ourselves.

This time, I wondered if I should register as a volunteer, and I would have gone out if it was all happening much closer, and I did not have some pressing work to get done.

 

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology


BobSpence
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A view across that

A view across that previously flooded highway to the suburban area that has emerged from the subsiding waters.

A sample of the things which have been scooped up from the streets as part of the cleanup, and deposited temporarily in part of an area of public land near where I live:

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology


Atheistextremist
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Crikey

 

Now one third of the entire state of Victoria is underwater. El Nina. You evil girl.

 

 

 

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My street on the 10th of

My street on the 10th of January. This is downhill from my house to the east.

View from an adjoining road northward.

A neighbouring street that was evacuated. Water rose much higher in the following two days, the area became a hazard to go near.

To give you some idea of the roaring current.

This is the area west of my house down the hill. The road on the south and along the highway stayed open for approximately 12 more hours and then we were effectively an island for the rest of the week.

 

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I lived and worked in

I lived and worked in Toowoomba for 10 months early in my career, so I still feel some extra empathy for and connection to the place.

I drove regularly thru or near those places in the Lockyer valley on my frequent commutes to and from Brisbane, as well.

The main residual problem for me now is shortages of my favorite vegetables on supermarket shelves.

The last shopping center that I regularly visit to come back 'online' (ie get power restored) was back in action yesterday, although it must have only just got back, since they were still restocking many of the shelves, especially in the freezers, that they would have had to clear out after the sustained loss of power they experienced.

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology


Atheistextremist
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Jeeze Eloise.

 

 

Those images are really full on. It's hard to appreciate the power of moving water. Thankfully you're ok and hope your friends and family, too.

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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Even in '74, I never saw any

Even in '74, I never saw any strong current near my house. At that time, I did get a glimpse of the main channel of the river from my boat, through a band of trees.

This time, I couldn't get close enough to the main river channel to see the current. I didn't bother to even try to launch my boat or kayak - I really wasn't close enough to a suitable place to launch it.

Went out on my bike this morning around one of my regular routes, which took me through the lowest area near here.

There was still a fair amount of smelly mud on the edges of the road in places, but it was really sad to see all the ruined furniture, personal possessions, etc, in great piles on the footpath ('sidewalk') in front of houses that had been really inundated. I couldn't bring myself to photograph it.

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology