Introduction

1-24
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Introduction

I would like to say hello, to everyone at the RR Squad. This is my very first post although I've read a few other peoples introductions. I originally heard about this website when a number of representatives went on youtube to blaspheme against the Holy Spirit. I must admit that I thought it was very bold and provocative but simultaneously misguided. I grew up going to a Catholic Church and although no religion has me now, I am quite sure that neither the Bible nor the Holy Spirit are what you mean to be condeming. I have studied quite a few Sacred Texts and the Bible is the most truthful of them all. If you are as rational as you all claim or believe, then perhaps you just haven't read it correctly. I don't particularly blame anyone for condeming members of Christian religions as they often haven't been very prudent about the placement of their faith, but the Bible is beyond reasonable doubt as truthful as it gets.  So, that is my introduction message and I hope I can get to understand exactly where you hearts are in relation to the Bible and also Religion and perhaps I'd also like to know whether or not you all believe that Atheism and Rational thinking are synonymous? It seems like they go hand and hand on this website.

 

Til next post..

1-24


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/sigh ... in before that

/sigh

 

 

... in before that stupid cat

 

welcome and such, dont worry... we'll knock that truthiness of yours, right out of that head

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All atheists are not

All atheists are not rational, but all rational people are atheists.

Doomed, every thread you post in gets screwed up for me by the pic in your signature.  Could you do as Brian requested and shrink it to half of it's current size?  Thanks.

"I am an atheist, thank God." -Oriana Fallaci


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Ive been workin on that

Ive been workin on that Watcher, i havent figured out a way that wont destroy it >.<

Can you give me some info on how it screws up the post? so i can fix it

(and if you didnt notice, it has shrunk dramatically since its first incarnation)

 

yay for derails ^_^

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Welcome to the forums!When

Welcome to the forums!

When you say that the bible is the most truthful religious book of them all you are implying that it holds truth. Please expound on what those truths are.

-Renee

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Thank you all for the

Thank you all for the welcome.

In response to your request Renee, I see truths in the Bible such as the one that is in the Signature area of your reply... only it is not spelled out in that manner. The Bible is written in metaphors and so it's truth is not to be caught at a glance. I don't know how keenly you've attempted to read it but it is there. As far as the Watcher's response concerning the relationship between Atheism and Rationalism, thank you for clearing that up. But when one says he is an atheist, does he believe in no Power at all or just no deity in the sky?


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Geezz 1 - 24, "Sacred Texts"

Geezz 1 - 24, "Sacred Texts" ? So ya think the council of superstitious powerful greedy MEN who while murdering one another etc were "divinely inspired" ????

"The Canon of Truth , referring to the restriction of the number of books that compose the sacred volume. As such it was first used in the year A.D. 367. " .... So divine authority and inspiration ended in A.D. 367 ??? sheezzzz

How can a restriction be truth ???

I get it, .... science is not divine inspiration ... is that because it never claims authority ? Jesus was better than Buddha better than Einstein better than Carl Sagan better than ME and YOU ? You make me 

When I say "Love Love" do you melt into Joy ?    Do ya love gods little yellow inspiration friends ? I do.  ....   Me and god are more than just friends ..... I AM GOD !

 


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Atheist for the most part

 

Atheist for the most part do not believe there is no possible chance of a God, they just do not believe in something without a preponderance of evidence. To an atheist God is a possibility but so is a teapot orbiting Earth.

Faith is belief without evidence, atheists however believe only what can be proven and acknowledge other stuff is possible but not supported by evidence. Belief in a God is accepting something as real with no proof. You are basically saying ‘shit I am too stupid to comprehend the universe so I will say a magic man created it’. Atheists see things and they say that it all came from the big bang because that is what the evidence shows. What came before the big bang? We have no fucking clue yet. However we sure as hell aren’t idiotic and deluded enough to say it must be the work of some magical man. Sure it is possible it was a magic man, it is also possible some scientist created us in a beaker.

Atheists do not make crazy assumptions based on absolutely no evidence because it makes them feel good inside. Atheists demand evidence, you are different, you read scripture written thousands of years ago by people with no concept of the universe and believe it. You read their supernatural explanations for things we can know explain scientifically and just assume it’s the truth.  

Chances are you are not too smart and have absolutely no concept of modern science. So you just point and say that it must be created by supernatural magic.

So yes atheism is rational and belief in God isn’t.

NOTE: I realize I am generalizing and not all atheists have the same set of beliefs, I am talking in general so no atheists itching about how they do not believe in the big bang.

 

If Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.


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Right on NickB, just one nit

Right on NickB, just one nit pick ,

If [ theist's] Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.

If [an atheist's] Jesus was born today he would be promply murdered by the likes of the CIA in cooperation of the religious types.     Am I generalizing ?   

 

 


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truth

1. You need a history lesson regarding the bible. It appears by your letter that you are not familiar with the history of the bible and who wrote it.

2. Do insects have 4 legs?

3. Is the earth flat?

4. Are bats birds?

5. Is the earth flat?

6. Does the sun revolve around the earth?

If you answered yes to any of the above (2-6), than you must admit that the authors of bible made some very basic mistakes. There are more errors in the bible then there are words in the bible (I stole that quote from Bart Ehrman).


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Wow, Okay..

GOd, nice to meet you too. Is that a capital or lower case 'd'? Let me know so I can get it right the next time.

With a name like that, one would presume you had some pretty big shoes to fill. Size 3 I bet? 3 1/2? ... I'm going to assume that you are one of the irrational atheists because when people make assumptions, they assume things. - .

 

Now, who said that divine authority and inspiration ended in A.D.367? And why does this council, whose members didn't even write the passages have anything to do with the authority of the book? Even if they did write it, truth is true no matter where it comes from.

And yeah, Jesus was greater than Buddha, Einstein and Carl Sagan - not because of the miracles he performed, but because he knew his purpose, which is more than we can say about you GOd with a lower case 'd'... for now.

You going to live your life undermining religion? Surely your not doing this for the sake of rationality since we already established you are an irrational atheists. GOd, the laughs on you.

There's a reason why you can find a Bible in every hotel across America and there's a reason why no one wants to find you in any hotel across America.

But let me not right you off. I have no idea what the qualms you have with the Bible are, but I'm almost sure it has to do with a misunderstanding of what it means. Read Mark 4:12 because I know you have a Bible.

 

1-24

 


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Nick B.

Well Nick B,if a qualification of being an atheist is one does not believe in things without evidence, then call me an atheist. I am very much so a person who relies on evidence - and sure, everyone says they have evidence but I don't endorse anything without sufficient evidence. I don't make any assumptions because it makes me feel good inside, and I don't write off the merit of someones words because they existed 2 millenia before me. And if atheism is rational, then so is belief in God, because as I said, I do not believe in things without evidence, and I also believe in God.

1-24


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Entomophila,

Thanks for the post. To tell you the truth, I've never seen the earth revolve around the sun. Now sure, that is the accepted truth presently, but so is Christianity.

 

1-24


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The Doomed Soul wrote:Ive

The Doomed Soul wrote:

Ive been workin on that Watcher, i havent figured out a way that wont destroy it >.<

Can you give me some info on how it screws up the post? so i can fix it

(and if you didnt notice, it has shrunk dramatically since its first incarnation)

 

yay for derails ^_^

 

Or better yet, you can tell me how do you put an image in your siggy, cuz I can't. Yeah, I'm an internet moron, but c'mon, help me spread the miracle of Lenore (my intended siggy)

Lenore, The Cute Little Dead Girl. Twice as good as Jesus.


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An important aspect of

An important aspect of rational thinking is to not believe something purely on some other person's words or writing, without some appropriate level of supporting evidence, ie more than just their testimony. Many people on this site have been lead to a position of atheism from a position of strong belief by careful study of the Bible. usually in a more or less desperate attempt to counter doubts or arguments against belief they have encountered.

Many thinking people have found a thorough study of the Bible a very strong argument against Xian beliefs.

Once you start interpreting a text metaphorically, you are open to the strong possibility of finding support for an open-ended range of ideas, and can certainly NEVER establish anything with any degree of certainty. You can then find 'evidence' for virtually any idea, just a matter of finding the 'appropriate' metaphor, which ultimately constitutes evidence for nothing.

If a metaphorical reading of the Bible is your main 'evidence' for a belief in God, then you are building a temple on quicksand.

I personally find even the idea of a 'higher power' a very primitive, fundamentally incoherent and irrational idea, the lame attempt to 'explain' the mysteries of the world around us with an undefined open-ended greater mystery.

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

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Quote:I have studied quite a

Quote:
I have studied quite a few Sacred Texts and the Bible is the most truthful of them all.

An excellent observation. And for those of us vastly more interested in 'thruthfulness' rather than 'factfulness', this must be seen as a huge boon for The Good Book.

Quote:
"Natasha has just come up to the window from the courtyard and opened it wider so that the air may enter more freely into my room. I can see the bright green strip of grass beneath the wall, and the clear blue sky above the wall, and sunlight everywhere. Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression and violence, and enjoy it to the full."

- Leon Trotsky, Last Will & Testament
February 27, 1940


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  Answering:  Okay 1 - 24

  Answering:  Okay 1 - 24 , in name of my atheist Jesus Christ ..... always remember I love you, we are one, evolving.

I assume nothing, I don't need too regarding me GOD, gOd, goD, GOd, DOG

About A.D.367 ? ... you tell me friend ?????

Which Jesus ?????

Religion ? in the glorious name of my Jesus Christ of "SAVING" ideas, yes FUCK RELIGION

A TV in every hotel

Qualms ? Yes I have a Bible and a SWORD ....

 

 

 


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1-24 wrote:Well Nick B,if a

1-24 wrote:

Well Nick B,if a qualification of being an atheist is one does not believe in things without evidence, then call me an atheist. I am very much so a person who relies on evidence - and sure, everyone says they have evidence but I don't endorse anything without sufficient evidence. I don't make any assumptions because it makes me feel good inside, and I don't write off the merit of someones words because they existed 2 millenia before me. And if atheism is rational, then so is belief in God, because as I said, I do not believe in things without evidence, and I also believe in God.

1-24



What an incredibly stupid answer. It's stupid because now I am going to ask you for the evidence that God exists and you are going to make yourself look like an idiot in front of all these people.

What is your evidence for the existence of God?

 

If Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.


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Bobspence1,

Thank you for your post..

 

"If a metaphorical reading of the Bible is your main 'evidence' for a belief in God, then you are building a temple on quicksand."

 

My evidence is not a metaphorical reading. My evidence is logic. What I'm saying is that the Bible is a story concerning the logic that governs existence. The Bible is a testimony of that logic which governs our own existence. Moreover, there are enough inconsistencies in the story for you to find out that it is not literal. I argue that if you are a logical person, then you will see that the Bible testifies about your logic. That is it, plain and simple. Now, you probably argue the contrary; that if you are a logical person the Bible will not testify about your logic. But who does the burden of proof rest upon?

 

1-24


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 Hey 1 - 24 , you have

 Hey 1 - 24 , you have entered into a room a high priests of Divine Sacred  Wisdom, .... lucky you, feel the love here ?  Jesus did get mad too,  cause he cared. Try being super nice to yourself for a whole RRS week .... no , nicer yet ....   "Jesus is RRS resurrecting" ..... A metaphor I want you to think on ..... cause I care ...... I know you will .....     


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What an incredibly stupid




What an incredibly stupid answer. It's stupid because now I am going to ask you for the evidence that God exists and you are going to make yourself look like an idiot in front of all these people.

What is your evidence for the existence of God?

 

 

My evidence is logic, what is your evidence for His non-existence?


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I AM GOD AS YOU,

I'm not so sure I follow your sentence structure. I'm not so quick witted.


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1-24 wrote:I'm not so sure I

1-24 wrote:

I'm not so sure I follow your sentence structure. I'm not so quick witted.

 

Your not the only one...

 

Dont look to far into it though, we tend to just chalk it up as our resident eccentric ^_^

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  What is your evidence for

  What is your evidence for the existence of God? asks 1 - 24 //////////

None was ever required .....?????  or did you mean "God of Abe" ? Yes you did. Well "God of Abe" of separation is , to kindly say , is a retarded idea ....  geeezzz really think about it please ..... 


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  SO .... God is a little

  SO .... God is a little hard to understand ??? , beer sometimes helps ! 


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1-24 wrote:Thank you for

1-24 wrote:

Thank you for your post..

 

"If a metaphorical reading of the Bible is your main 'evidence' for a belief in God, then you are building a temple on quicksand."

 

My evidence is not a metaphorical reading. My evidence is logic. What I'm saying is that the Bible is a story concerning the logic that governs existence. The Bible is a testimony of that logic which governs our own existence. Moreover, there are enough inconsistencies in the story for you to find out that it is not literal. I argue that if you are a logical person, then you will see that the Bible testifies about your logic. That is it, plain and simple. Now, you probably argue the contrary; that if you are a logical person the Bible will not testify about your logic. But who does the burden of proof rest upon?

 

1-24

Logic is never in itself evidence for anything. Logic is 'merely' a vital tool for keeping our arguments and thinking 'on track', ie avoiding a range of fallacies which can rapidly lead us off into nonsense.

The bible is a collection of ancient myths, tribal narratives, moral fables, accounts of ancient supernatural ideas and prophecies, etc.

It displays a deep ignorance of the nature of existence as we have come to understand it today, as would be expected.

Its inconsistencies indicate a lack of logical coherence at the literal level, so any attempt to read some 'deeper' underlying 'logic' into it is entirely fanciful. Even if it were logically coherent, that would not by itself 'prove' any of its claims, that would require that its 'logic' was applied to some valid starting assumptions. There is little indication in the scriptures of any real understanding of the nature of the earth and life on our planet and its history, let alone the nature of the wider universe, so it could LOGICALLY be both deeply logical and totally in error....

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology


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 So, you basically have no

 

So, you basically have no evidence?

Logic is a system of reasoning. It relies on proper thinking to arrive at correct conclusion. Logic has to have a base from which that particular type of thinking is derived.

Is your thinking logical in the broad spectrum? NO

Is your thinking logical based on the bible? YES

You present a logic based argument using outdated logic derived from scripture. That is why your argument is doomed to failure. Your logic is based in a supernatural world full of God’s and ghosts. The problem is that in the real world we have no evidence for God, ghosts, vampires, unicorns, etc. When you base logic on fantasy and try to use that logic against real world evidence you make yourself look like an idiot.

You have no evidence; you have an argument based on flawed logic. You claimed evidence of God so either show us the evidence or open a fucking book and learn something (try non-fiction this time).

 What is my evidence God does not exist? I never said God does not exist.  I acknowledge that science does not know what happened before the big bang. I acknowledge it could have been a creator. But I give the creator theory just as much value as the theory that we were created in a beaker in some science lab. Just because I do not know the answers I do not make shit up and call it an answer. 


 

If Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.


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Bobspence1,

"Logic is never in itself evidence for anything. Logic is 'merely' a vital tool for keeping our arguments and thinking 'on track', ie avoiding a range of fallacies which can rapidly lead us off into nonsense."

 

That track on which I keep my argument leads only to God. Excuse my brief answer, I've got to get sleep. I will answer in better detail tomorrow.

 

Til next post..

1-24


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1-24 wrote:That track on

1-24 wrote:
That track on which I keep my argument leads only to God.


A track we rational people call blind faith.

 

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  Sweetest dreams to ya 1 -

  Sweetest dreams to ya 1 - 24 ..... god accepts you   pass it on ....  no "faith' required .....


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1-24 wrote:"Logic is never

1-24 wrote:

"Logic is never in itself evidence for anything. Logic is 'merely' a vital tool for keeping our arguments and thinking 'on track', ie avoiding a range of fallacies which can rapidly lead us off into nonsense."

 

That track on which I keep my argument leads only to God. Excuse my brief answer, I've got to get sleep. I will answer in better detail tomorrow.

 

Til next post..

1-24

OK.

We will be waiting breathlessly for the actual evidence to which you apply your logic.

You have yet to  provide any actual substantive arguments, which is why you may have detected some impatience in the responses here...

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology


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1-24 wrote:. The Bible is

1-24 wrote:

. The Bible is written in metaphors and so it's truth is not to be caught at a glance.

How do you know this is true and not people who say it is literal?Why would god try confuse us with metaphors?

1-24 wrote:

And yeah, Jesus was greater than Buddha, Einstein and Carl Sagan - not because of the miracles he performed, but because he knew his purpose, which is more than we can say about you GOd with a lower case 'd'... for now.

The works of Einstein and Sagan are clearly documented.(Don't know much about Buddhism).Can the same be said for jesus' miracles.Outside the bible of course.

1-24 wrote:

There's a reason why you can find a Bible in every hotel across America and there's a reason why no one wants to find you in any hotel across America.

And why is that?And what's wrong with having me in your room..

1-24 wrote:

And if atheism is rational, then so is belief in God, because as I said, I do not believe in things without evidence, and I also believe in God.

So this begs the question,what evidence?

1-24 wrote:

Moreover, there are enough inconsistencies in the story for you to find out that it is not literal. I argue that if you are a logical person, then you will see that the Bible testifies about your logic.

I fail to see how something being inconsistent and contradictory is testament to its logic. Also,I was taught the bible is the literal and perfect word of god. If you can't believe that,doesn't it say something for the 'quality' of the bible?

1-24 wrote:

But who does the burden of proof rest upon?

 

You.

1-24 wrote:

My evidence is logic, what is your evidence for His non-existence?

 

See above

1-24 wrote:

That track on which I keep my argument leads only to God.

 

I like NickB's answer.

1-24 wrote:

I will answer in better detail tomorrow.

 

Til next post..

 

See ya..

 

 

Psalm 14:1 "the fool hath said in his heart there is a God"-From a 1763 misprinted edition of the bible

dudeofthemoment wrote:
This is getting redudnant. My patience with the unteachable[atheists] is limited.

Argument from Sadism: Theist presents argument in a wall of text with no punctuation and wrong spelling. Atheist cannot read and is forced to concede.


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1-24 wrote: In response to

1-24 wrote:
In response to your request Renee, I see truths in the Bible such as the one that is in the Signature area of your reply... only it is not spelled out in that manner. The Bible is written in metaphors and so it's truth is not to be caught at a glance. I don't know how keenly you've attempted to read it but it is there.

Funny you would say that you see truths in my signature that correspond to what you see in the bible and yet state that those truths you hold aren't spelled out in that exact manner(the quote is from Epicurus). You are admitting that each persons interpretation may be a bit different, do you feel yours is the only right interpretation? I have to laugh about your metaphor statement and the truth that can't be caught at a glance...so metaphors are truth? Or lets go back to my first sentence, they are truths only to the mind that considers them truths? And BTW, the bible was the most exciting book I read as a child, as a teen and as an adult. My eagerness to find answers was paramount only to catching butterflies, getting my drivers license and drinking beer(all in order of age) so to question whether I read the bible based on the fact that I didn't "find the truth" that you did isn't logical.

 

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1-24 wrote:You going to live

1-24 wrote:

You going to live your life undermining religion?

No, I a plan to live my life promoting reason and science. If religious people choose to see this as undermining religion, that is their problem.

1-24 wrote:

There's a reason why you can find a Bible in every hotel across America and there's a reason why no one wants to find you in any hotel across America.

Some hotels I've seen have a Baghavad Gita in every room too... They must be satanist hotels, right?

1-24 wrote:
But let me not right you off. I have no idea what the qualms you have with the Bible are,

Have you actually read anything on this site?

1-24 wrote:
but I'm almost sure it has to do with a misunderstanding of what it means. Read Mark 4:12 because I know you have a Bible.

1-24

There's been no misunderstanding. I just don't consider talking snakes to be real, whales to be fish, or expect people to live much longer than 120 years at the most, ESPECIALLY during a time when most people rarely lived past 40 or 50.

“It is true that in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. It is equally true that in the land of the blind, the two-eyed man is an enemy of the state, the people, and domestic tranquility… and necessarily so. Someone has to rearrange the furniture.”


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Adding to

Adding to fulltimedefendent's list of bullshit Atheists do not believe in:

I believe I speak for all atheists when I say

We do not believe the Earth is flat and sits on pillars.

We do not believe the earth is covered by a magic dome with lights called stars affixed to the dome.

We do not believe the Sun revolves around the Earth.

We do not believe that the moon emits light.

If Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.


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1-24 wrote:And if atheism is

1-24 wrote:

And if atheism is rational, then so is belief in God, because as I said, I do not believe in things without evidence, and I also believe in God.

1-24

1-24 wrote:

What an incredibly stupid answer. It's stupid because now I am going to ask you for the evidence that God exists and you are going to make yourself look like an idiot in front of all these people.

What is your evidence for the existence of God?

WTF is this guy talking about?  Is it just me or is he arguing with himself?

 

"I am an atheist, thank God." -Oriana Fallaci


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Hw was quoting me and

Hw was quoting me and answering my question.... or his crazy, both make sense.


Loc
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NickB wrote:Hw was quoting

NickB wrote:

Hw was quoting me and answering my question.... or his crazy, both make sense.

I vote for the second one.So is he going to come back?Is it just me or has there been alot of hit and runs lately.

 

 

Psalm 14:1 "the fool hath said in his heart there is a God"-From a 1763 misprinted edition of the bible

dudeofthemoment wrote:
This is getting redudnant. My patience with the unteachable[atheists] is limited.

Argument from Sadism: Theist presents argument in a wall of text with no punctuation and wrong spelling. Atheist cannot read and is forced to concede.


entomophila
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the bible says it is so...

You didn't answer the rest of the questions.  I suppose to answer them would put you in the position of having to admit that there are mistakes in the bible. And these aren't little mistakes. They are HUGE mistakes. And this is just the tip of the iceberg.

And...what? You've never looked up at the sky? You've never noticed the change of light during the day? You never looked at the photographs of the earth taken from the moon or satellites?

You seem to be confused about the words "truth" and "fact".

 

 


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This is no hit and run.-.

This is no hit and run. God exists. In fact, I can prove it; beyond a reasonable doubt - as there is a small element of faith to it.  And I am so sure that I can prove it that if I do not prove it - beyond a reasonable doubt- I will donate a significant amount of money to your cause of atheism and laying God to rest. What do you think? Sound fair?

 

1-24


Loc
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1-24 wrote:This is no hit

1-24 wrote:

This is no hit and run. God exists. In fact, I can prove it; beyond a reasonable doubt - as there is a small element of faith to it.  And I am so sure that I can prove it that if I do not prove it - beyond a reasonable doubt- I will donate a significant amount of money to your cause of atheism and laying God to rest. What do you think? Sound fair?

 

1-24

Sorry for doubting you..

Well if you could prove it that would be remarkable,but what do you mean by "A small element of faith."?  Are you saying we will need faith to accept your proof?

Psalm 14:1 "the fool hath said in his heart there is a God"-From a 1763 misprinted edition of the bible

dudeofthemoment wrote:
This is getting redudnant. My patience with the unteachable[atheists] is limited.

Argument from Sadism: Theist presents argument in a wall of text with no punctuation and wrong spelling. Atheist cannot read and is forced to concede.


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1-24 wrote:This is no hit

1-24 wrote:

This is no hit and run. God exists. In fact, I can prove it; beyond a reasonable doubt - as there is a small element of faith to it.  And I am so sure that I can prove it that if I do not prove it - beyond a reasonable doubt- I will donate a significant amount of money to your cause of atheism and laying God to rest. What do you think? Sound fair?

 

1-24

Well stop beating around the fucking bush and answer the question I asked you 8 hours ago.

What evidence do you have for the existence of GOD?

If you can prove beyond all reasonable doubt God exists I will donate $5,000 to you or to a charity of your choosing.

If Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.


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Renee,

Thank you for your post..

I don't know how to do the quote clipping, I'm not so computer savvy.  But you said in your last post, 

 

"You are admitting that each persons interpretation may be a bit different"

I'm not sure if this is meant to be a question or a statement. If it is meant to be a statement, then I'll have to rebut, and say that I never made such a claim. If its meant to be a question, then my response is yes, each persons interpretation may be a bit different.

And because of this I am convinced that my interpretation is the correct one. Like those things that you are convinced of, they stem from some substantial evidence. Well so do the things that I am convinced of. And its correctness does not stem from my interpretation of it, but rather the evidence that begets it. So when you ask, 'do you feel yours is the only right one' I refuse to answer that question. The interpretation is not 'mine' as though I made it up. It is 'mine' insofar as I promote the evidence used to affirm its accuracy.

And as far as your final words in that post go,

"so to question whether I read the bible based on the fact that I didn't "find the truth" that you did isn't logical."

You're correct it isn't logical. But nor is it illogical. The reason one has for asking a question doesn't have to be concerned with logic. One usually just asks a question to get an answer.

 

1-24


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Nick B,

What, you think I can just do it in 30 seconds?? I tell you what, give me 3 days, on the 7th I'll have it laid out for you to judge. In the mean time, gather your people if they really want to know God. If you and your atheist prove to me beyond a reasonable doubt that my logic is flawed or, if I don't prove to you beyond a reasonable doubt that my logic is flawless, I promise to donate $1290 to this website. And whoever proves my logic flawed -beyond a reasonable doubt- I'll send them $695. You have my word.

 

1-24


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1-24 wrote:I tell you what,

1-24 wrote:

I tell you what, give me 3 days, on the 7th I'll have it laid out for you to judge.

Not this shit again.  This is where the person runs away and never returns with what they promised to deliver.  I've seen it a hundred times.

"I am an atheist, thank God." -Oriana Fallaci


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this could be

this could be interesting.

"Beyond a reasonable doubt" is a very high standard.

It is also an easily abused one if one isn't careful.

 

"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin


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1-24 wrote:What, you think I

1-24 wrote:

What, you think I can just do it in 30 seconds?? I tell you what, give me 3 days, on the 7th I'll have it laid out for you to judge. In the mean time, gather your people if they really want to know God. If you and your atheist prove to me beyond a reasonable doubt that my logic is flawed or, if I don't prove to you beyond a reasonable doubt that my logic is flawless, I promise to donate $1290 to this website. And whoever proves my logic flawed -beyond a reasonable doubt- I'll send them $695. You have my word.

 

1-24

Challenge accepted. You now have 3-4 days to provide evidence for that which people have been unsuccessfully seeking to prove for millenia. I look forward to Friday.

What would Jesus say if he knew you were betting with money (not that I actually think you'd pay up, much less admit you're wrong) on your own god's existence? Keep in mind, the burden of proof is DEFINITELY on you. You're the one offering up money over a largely anonymous web forum. That's hardly rational, is it?

 

“It is true that in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. It is equally true that in the land of the blind, the two-eyed man is an enemy of the state, the people, and domestic tranquility… and necessarily so. Someone has to rearrange the furniture.”


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1-24 wrote:What, you think I

1-24 wrote:

What, you think I can just do it in 30 seconds?? I tell you what, give me 3 days, on the 7th I'll have it laid out for you to judge. In the mean time, gather your people if they really want to know God. If you and your atheist prove to me beyond a reasonable doubt that my logic is flawed or, if I don't prove to you beyond a reasonable doubt that my logic is flawless, I promise to donate $1290 to this website. And whoever proves my logic flawed -beyond a reasonable doubt- I'll send them $695. You have my word.

 

1-24



I find it funny that you said you have evidence but now all of a sudden it is going to take days for you to present it. Enough bullshit man, you said you have evidence so lay it out or run off back to your delusions and live out the rest of your enslaved life.

Guys does this all sound a little biblical or is it just me? He is basically saying......

'on the 7th day I shall return and I will carry with me knowledge that will forever change the course of human history'

This guy really does sound a little crazy.

If Jesus was born today he would be institutionalized as a schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur.


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I'm rather looking forward

I'm rather looking forward to Friday now.But if he had proof god exists,wouldn't he sell it to the news instead of telling one little site? Doesn't he want as many people as possible to hear the 'good news'?

Psalm 14:1 "the fool hath said in his heart there is a God"-From a 1763 misprinted edition of the bible

dudeofthemoment wrote:
This is getting redudnant. My patience with the unteachable[atheists] is limited.

Argument from Sadism: Theist presents argument in a wall of text with no punctuation and wrong spelling. Atheist cannot read and is forced to concede.


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1-24 wrote:This is no hit

1-24 wrote:

This is no hit and run. God exists. In fact, I can prove it; beyond a reasonable doubt - as there is a small element of faith to it.  And I am so sure that I can prove it that if I do not prove it - beyond a reasonable doubt- I will donate a significant amount of money to your cause of atheism and laying God to rest. What do you think? Sound fair?

 

1-24

A few points to consider before you start:

- Words like "prove" and "evidence" have meanings that are not open to interpretation.  Just because you consider something to be evidence of a god's existence does not mean anyone else will (or has to) agree with you.  There are rules regarding logic and evidence, and you must follow them to be convincing.  These are not our rules; these are the rules of argumentation, which we follow.  Just because you consider something to be a proof doesn't mean the rest of the world will.  In short, thinking you are right does not make you right.

- Who decides what is "reasonable doubt"?  Is it reasonable if you have a claim for which we have a completely natural, simpler explanation?  Is it reasonable if your proof relies on an interpretation of something that is subjective and we do not share?  If the answer to either of these questions is no, don't bother posting your argument, since it will not be found convincing.

- If someone here points out an error, you probably made an error.  Getting defensive about having made a mistake will only harm you.  However, given that you are offering money if you are wrong, I doubt challenging your logic will do anything but make you defensive.  The best thing you can do is: understand the objection, understand how it applies, and figure out how you made it.

- Any argument that contains a step that boils down to "now, assume what I'm trying to prove is true" automatically fails.  I am leery of your argument from the get-go because of your statement that your proof has "a small element of faith to it".  Faith is not evidence, and faith is not an element of a rational argument.

 

Now given all of these things, do you still feel that you have a solid argument that no one has thought of over the last few thousand years?  If not, don't take it too hard: some of the greatest minds that have ever existed haven't been able to conclusively prove the existence of (any) god.

 

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I do love the biblical

I do love the biblical truths, because the biblical truths were used to commit atrocious crimes against jews throughout the centuries because the truth of the jews was in the bible, that they were Jesus killers (except jesus was a jew, but lets not get the facts in the way for metaphorical truths and stories right) or to keep slaves in the south (again it was alright in the bible and god said it to be fine therefore it is true men can be kept as slaves) even through today we find it morally reprehensible.

The great thing about truth in the bible is that it changes from decade to decade and from century to century. It never really stays the same throughout history because it is up to interpretation. Of course you would have to have bothered with history to know this.