PLEASE MAKE
SURE TO
FOLLOW THE
RULES!
RULES
This is the
Kill Em
With
Kindness
Forum!
PLEASE MAKE
SURE TO
FOLLOW THE
RULES!
RULES
This is the
Kill Em
With
Kindness
Forum!
PLEASE MAKE
SURE TO
FOLLOW THE
RULES!
This is the
Kill Em
With
Kindness
Forum!
RULES
PLEASE MAKE
SURE TO
FOLLOW THE
RULES!
This is the
Kill Em
With
Kindness
Forum!
PLEASE MAKE
SURE TO
FOLLOW THE
RULES!
RULES
This is the
Kill Em
With
Kindness
Forum!
PLEASE MAKE
SURE TO
FOLLOW THE
RULES!
Good question. I myself have wondered what the members of the RRS do at their cult meetings.
Goat sacrifice mainly with the odd bit of nudity thrown in for good measure.
This site helps to educate people with rational, logical thought. Taking donations to help keep the site and radio show running is not equivalent to a religion. Don't even go there
Biochemist & Law Student
"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as His father, in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter." -Thomas Jefferson
It's my turn this week to set up the 'science alter' where we all pray to Darwin and Dawkins.
http://atheismisrational.blogspot.com/
Why would you pray to Dawkins when his writings get such mixed reviews? If it was Holy Scripture, then the New York Review of Books wouldn't tell people to check it out at the library instead of spending money on it, would it?
I take pride in being a newb. I'm not all experienced and boring like the normies.
Is National Public Radio a cult because they ask for donations? PBS? I highly doubt there is a Masterpiece Theater cult lurking around out there. Just because this site asks for donations does not make it a cult or a scam.
Are they requiring that you pay to post? When you signed up here, did the ask for a credit card number?
If god takes life he's an indian giver
It was a joke.
Theists often tell me that I 'pray' to Dawkins and Darwin, which is a silly assertation.
I didn't even LIKE the God Delusion that much.
http://atheismisrational.blogspot.com/
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I'm simply curious about the motivation for this site although I doubt you'll be running off to the Bahamas soon I believe the question is valid. is this a money making business. based upon anti-faith principles ?
cult By extension, "cult" has come to connote the total cultural aspects of a religion, as they are distinguished from others through change and individualizationI hope Brian, Rook and Kelly make some money off this site. They certainly earn it. But I think that they probably roll all the money that comes in back into the ongoing RRS efforts.
I know, Reverend, that you would never question the integrity of the RRS just because they ask for donations to help the cause. That might be construed as "casting the first stone."
Lazy is a word we use when someone isn't doing what we want them to do.
- Dr. Joy Brown
I'm not quite sure why you're so hell bent on the whole cult angle. It's not even close to being a cult.
If god takes life he's an indian giver
No kidding.
Cult = give us ALL your money and never talk to your friends and family.
RRS = give us something if you can and if you can't no biggy
Lazy is a word we use when someone isn't doing what we want them to do.
- Dr. Joy Brown
Dude, if they wanted to make money this would be a porn site.
Next question.
Exactly!:D
After slogging through some pretty heated posts this evening, this one provided a much-needed laugh-out-loud moment. Of course, there is also a ring of truth to it!
Thank you!
Atheist Books, purchases on Amazon support the Rational Response Squad server.
OWNED!!!!
LOL, that was awesome.
Lazy is a word we use when someone isn't doing what we want them to do.
- Dr. Joy Brown
Only if they get tax-free priviledges!
Judge: god, you have been accused of existence! What do you have to say for yourself?
god: I am innocent until proven guilty, your honour!
This topic as been brought up before, be careful with the topic and make sure you back up the things you say.
http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/miscellanous_forums/trollville/4465
That's bending it a little Rev. By your logic, anyone that asks for donation is in it to make money for themselves.
Church included, or are you picking and choosing?
I'm picking and choosing. I'm also casting the first stone with glee. "Universal Life Church" Reverend Devilin. I'm a minister of atheism. and I like to testify brethren
I've just listened to one of the radio show's it starts in a remarkably similar way to any TV evangelist. including the bad use of the English language
"You are help supporting a good cause when you do this. we are working very hard to get rational thought spread to those who need it most. And with your financial support we will be able to do that"
If it ain't broke, don't fix it, right? TV evangelists have proven remarkably adept at extracting funds for their cause - it would make sense to steal some pages from their book.
The difference between the RRS and TV blow-dries? The RRS doesn't scare kids and little old ladies with threats of hell if they fail to give. They also don't claim to miraculously heal anyone.
Lazy is a word we use when someone isn't doing what we want them to do.
- Dr. Joy Brown
"working very hard to get rational thought spread to those who need it most " so it's money for the cause Tilberian. I see
Tilberian maybe you can help. this is obviously done with the greatest transparency to avoid any untoward accusations. could you point me to the yearly statement ?Sapient has talked about that funding page and how it isn't really up to date. Now with a yearly statement the biggest problem you will run into is the fact that would have real names on it. Whats wrong with real names? Death threats...
Tilberian's point was that RRS doesn't talk about how people are going to burn then ask for money. If I remember right the bible even says a person MUST give some amount so there isn't a comparison. Here you can give if you want, there you must give or burn.
I don't even remember the last time sapient talked about donations unless he was talking about someone who gave a large amount.
Now you do realize this whole "you're just as bad as they are" kind of argument is poor right? This is pretty much telling me you give up on any real argument and just want to drag us down to the same level.
Y'know what Rev? If Sapient and Kelly were spending every cent on cocaine and hookers I wouldn't give a rat's ass as long as the website stays up. As far as I'm concerned, this presence on the net is worth every penny they collect.
Why don't you lay your cards on the table and state clearly your interest in all this?
Lazy is a word we use when someone isn't doing what we want them to do.
- Dr. Joy Brown
On another note, since the RRS is not a 501(c)3 organization, any accouting is purely "complimentary" since it is not required.
Yup. The folks that donate here don't even get a tax deduction!
Atheist Books, purchases on Amazon support the Rational Response Squad server.
Glad to Tilberian hypocrisy read your own statement. you happily admit to blindly following the money making cause. if this was another web site and another money making cause undoubtedly you would condemn it. "Religion itself is nothing more than a moneymaking scam " first principles of any religious organization get some devoted followers and start raking in the money. atheism is a faith that uses logic and science to explain the fundamental questions of life. Christianity Judaism Islam are faiths that use magical books of fairy tales to explain these fundamental questions. Christianity Judaism Islam atheism. at there're root are all based in faith. Tilberian you are a devoted follower of a faith-based organization that's making money. excuse me for playing devil's advocate but there are obvious parallels
Voiderest I'm just pointing out you'll already at the same level no dragging needed
If the intention of this organization is nonprofit then surely it should register as a charity so its followers can get tax deduction
Pariahjane first the denial (1) then so what if I am (2) this organization any organization of this nature will always be skating on very thin ice. as by its very nature it attracts devoted followers to the cause. to suggest "It's not even close to being a cult" I believe would be incorrect and you may wish to revise it to something more appropriate
I think the bottom line here is that it really doesn't matter, does it? Those that donate do so because they want to support the RRS. This allows everyone to participate whether they subscribe or not.
As far as comparing this to a cult - wrong. No one here tells me what to think. Ever. I am free to debate, learn, disagree or even leave if I want.
I suppose you could compare it to an anti-religious religious organization, but then I think they should apply for the non-profit status. Funny, though, I think they might be denied.
Now you are saying 'atheism' is based on faith... Btw the charge hypocrisy of has been done before.
So what does that make you Reverend (minister of atheism)? Personally I don't see why any atheist would be apart of any church especially a leader of one. Here you tell us we are apart of an anti-religion money making scheme, but you are an atheist playing along with the religious as your job.
Non-profit has a lot of disadvantages. One someone would have to put there real name on the paper work and that is a matter of public record. Two no more political talk. No, it doesn't matter that churches do it and get away with it, the RRS wouldn't.
Can we get back on topic?
I'd like to know more about this atheist porn site. Atheist chicks are far more sexy.
Hi Voiderest
http://www.themonastery.org/
The Reverend title comes from the above site. were you give your e-mail address to become a ordained minister. it's nondenominational in fact no belief in anything is request. it is not my vocation I'm a factory worker. I have not now in the past nor do I intend in the future to make any money out of being a minister. I just found it to be a humus concept and I sill do " minister of atheism "
"Now you are saying 'atheism' is based on faith "
Atheism is based on faith. I will not deny verifiable truth. for any personal belief system I might have. wiil you ?
"it doesn't matter that churches do it and get away with it, the RRS wouldn't. "
have they tried ?
People who think there is something they refer to as god don't ask enough questions.
How so? Have you bought into the idea you have faith in your car the same way a theist has faith in their god?
I don't think the co-founders are dumb enough to try. You may not realize it but there have been groups (however short a life span or how small) formed to destroy the RRS and they are looking for anyway to do it.
HAH! Me to! Thats what the reverend stuff is about in my avatar lol.
www.garageband.com/artist/abandonmypeace
Reality
http://www.quantum.at/news/detailview/article/7/losing-a-grip-on-reality.html
{FIXED}
"How so? Have you bought into the idea you have faith in your car the same way a theist has faith in their god?"
faith in your own existence. and what you perceived as reality is reality
"I don't think the co-founders are dumb enough to try. You may not realize it but there have been groups (however short a life span or how small) formed to destroy the RRS and they are looking for anyway to do it."
I was unaware of this. but wouldn't this in itself call for greater clarity in this organization
Really faith in reality.
Well I know I'm not 100% sure on reality, but it doesn't take much "faith" for a person to know they exist and realize they are in an enviornment. God on the other hand... Well what reasoning do they base things on? I can poke the world around me can you poke god?
Oh so whatever I think is going on is going on? This would mean everyone is right and wrong at the same time. Good luck with that.
How so? Because Sapient doesn't want to be stalked or be bound to terms set forth by the government he wouldn't otherwise be bound by?
"Really faith in reality.
Well I know I'm not 100% sure on reality, but it doesn't take much "faith"
But that's all it takes. I cannot deny this element of faith. although I consider myself a atheist. it's there so I must except it. to deny truth would be hypocritical. (I am sometimes hypocritical but I try not to be)
"Oh so whatever I think is going on is going on? This would mean everyone is right and wrong at the same time. Good luck with that."
I'm not entirely sure what you mean here ?
"How so? Because Sapient doesn't want to be stalked or be bound to terms set forth by the government he wouldn't otherwise be bound by?"
I need time to think about this, I've only recently become aware of the real physical danger atheists may have in the USA.
Well, these demented fuckwits are making a good living for themselves, that's for sure... There's nothing quite like attending an adult industry event and getting proselytized by these jerks for Jesus. The founders made a shitload of money with porn sites before they got Jesus. Now they spend their time convincing people in the adult biz to leave the industry and come to Jesus; and among the "civilians" (i.e. porn consumers) that they can help them get over "porn addiction." Although I suppose if you're gullible enough to believe there's a god not only watching you, but is going to put a black mark in your "book of life" for every instance of bishop-flogging, I guess you'd be naive enough to believe that only Jesus can save you.
While I can't say whether the founders and core members of XXXChurch truly converted or not, I've gotta admit it's quite the racket! Ex-porn stars to do the "booth babe" thing, and a percentage (or maybe ALL) of the sales of filtering software for all of the guys who (mistakenly) believe their time's better spent denying their natural instincts and thumping a bible than whacking their weasels.
Oh, and I'd just LOVE to get a review of the Porn Debate between Ron Jeremy and the "Porn Pastor" Craig Gross - if any of you happen to be in cities on their tour and attend (if just to heckle!).
Invisible friends are for children and psychopaths.
You might want to define faith and explain how you have faith in reality.
It sounded like your argument centers around subjectivism. Almost as if you are trying to say because reality can be subjective that means one must have faith in reality.
Welcome to the most religious country in the world outside of those run by fundy Muslims. For all their whining about discrimination and persecution, I'm quite sure it's more likely that I (or any other unapologetic, vocal and "out" atheist) would be the victim of a "religiously motivated" attack, either on our persons or property.
Just out of curiosity... how many here have walked out to their cars to find that one of their Darwin fish or godless bumper stickers has been removed or defaced? Or noticed that theirs is the only car in the parking lot with a Chick tract stuck in the window? I know it's happened to me more than once - and I've only been "out" for about 5 years.
Invisible friends are for children and psychopaths.
Although theists also have faith in reality, a contingent faith (I can't see how anybody could not have a contingent faith in reality, after all, everyone expects the sun to shine tomorrow); theists also have noncontingent faith or religious faith. It is a faith in "nothing" or they call it god. It is based on nothing.
Faith in reality or contingent faith is based on past experience. I have faith the sun will shine tomorrow because the sun has shone everyday in the past by experience. No one has had any empirical experience with a god, thus, religious faith has no contingency.
People who think there is something they refer to as god don't ask enough questions.
If it were truly based on nothing, it would not exist. Since it clearly does exist, it must be based on something.
The practice of faith in God is also contingent (or appears to be by its adherents). One has problems or hopes or aspirations, one trusts God with them, one takes action (enlightened by God's grace and the wisdom of others) and then a positive outcome is reached (often different and better than the outcome imagined by the individual)….lather, rinse, repeat...until theistic faith is based on past experience. One may argue that the outcome would have taken place without the "trusting God" step but why try to get someone to change a belief system that's working for them?
/peace
It doesn't quite work like that jive Turkey
faith in one's own existence is a prerequisite. we have no choice but to accept that what one perceive as reality is reality
So from this we move on, faith is still require because the foundation of the philosophy of one's existence is based in faith. but one must strive to remove as much faith as possible to discover the truth. adding more faith will distance you from any possibility of discovering the truth
Historically this has been shown to be true in itself
Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus
Faith my definition. belief in that which cannot be proved
Subjectivism maybe to constrictive as a definition. I'll quote my reply to jive Turkey. for an understanding of the way I perceive things
It is attribute we subscribe to. and I cannot wiil-not deny the truth of it. thus faith
(in philosophy the truth will set you free. in reality quite the opposite effect may happen please use caution with truth in public venues )
Hands down the business of religion wins, a smart conman gets himself involved in the business of religion, and honest man gets himself involved in that which isn't as financially rewarding for the betterment of society.
Vote for Democrats to save us all from the anti-American Republican party!
Please become a Patron of Brian Sapient
I don't know if you guys are non-profit or not, but I don't see a problem in trying to earn a salary off of activism. Activism needs full-time members to create any real noise and to push things along. If people are capable of accepting donations and people support their methods enough to donate, then that's advantageous for the movement as a whole.
Profiting from it is a whole nother story. But people can and will be profitable from it either way. Book writers, movie makers, activists, there's always going to be some that are going to take advantage of hype to earn a buck.
But you look at the numbers, and Sapient is right..the smart conman gets himself into religion to earn his buck. At least for now.
So you do not think it is possible to prove you exist?
I am 100% sure I exist, just as you and anyone else is 100% sure they exist.
Cogito ergo sum?
When it comes to other people or other aspects of my reality I am not 100% sure, but I do not have anything else to go on.
When most theist say they have faith in god they mean they are 100% sure yet do not hold it to the same standards as other things. I'm not sure if by faith you mean "something that I think is probably true based on logic and experience" or "something that I think is true"
Now lets say for a second you are right, everyone must have faith. Your argument against us is that because we have some faith we can't criticize other's faith. If thats true I have faith that they are wrong. You can't criticize me now. Then again if everything we were saying here was based on faith then you shouldn't have been criticizing us to begin with.
Of course that wasn't your beginning argument, it was just used as your proof the RRS is a cult. However that doesn't help you because that would make any org a cult...
Voiderest you are able to dismiss the possibility that you are not a virtual mind. thus proving without doubt or uncertainty that you think so therefore you exist. then please elaborate on this !00% certain and doubt free knowledge
I like your logic
My personal goal is to dismiss as much faith as possible. while being ever mindful of the truth. I exist in a faith-based existence. so I also try to avoid the hypocrisy trap
ie to suggest atheism isn't based in faith would be apocryphal
Criticizing faith leads to the truth and I belief it should be encouraged.
Thus my original premise was about money not faith
Criticizing faith and profiting from this criticism. brings into question the motivation for this criticism