A good example of the problem with the feds

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A good example of the problem with the feds

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303492504579115970922504940.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_LEFTTopStories

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But the federal government turned down Republican South Dakota Gov. Dennis Daugaard's offer to keep the Mount Rushmore National Memorial open with state workers. The National Park Service told state officials that it was required to use federal employees, not state employees, at the monument, and that opening Mount Rushmore would set a precedent to open the other federal parks.

States and localities have been offering money and people to keep National Parks and National Forests open. But heaven forbid, you can't have state workers! That would set a bad precedent. Yeah, it might set a precedent that we don't need the fucking federal government involved in all these details. Can't have people realizing how unnecessary they are.

It is exceedingly obvious that they don't give a fuck about us, and it clearly is not about the money. For example, they "closed" the fucking ocean

http://www.examiner.com/article/feds-close-florida-oceans-florida-bay-charter-owner-says-they-re-killing-us

In a move that costs more money to have rangers out there making sure that people don't use the ocean than it costs to run day to day operations. This kind of shit is happening around the country. Today, I took a little jaunt on some nearby federal hunting property before Zeus decided to throw a few lightning bolts at me (Zeus is obviously a big Bama lover) and they had gone through the effort to put up barriers in the parking lot. It isn't like they actually do shit to maintain those parking lots. They are in terrible condition and you really should have 4-wheel drive before attempting to park. How are you saving money by closing it? I wonder if they actually had the barriers on hand or if they paid to rent them. 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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  Yes, it's all political

  Yes, it's all political theater designed purely for show.  In spite of the shut down the R's have offered to fund select items to keep services available but still exclude Obama's ACA program.  The D's all or nothing attitude is praised as being courageous but when the R's adopt the same tactic it's just them being obstructionist "anarchists".   As usual the progs are being two faced drama queens.

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The D's have to turn down

The D's have to turn down everything. Anything else will simply prolong the issue. In order to secure the act they have to hammer in the last nail while they have control of the senate and the white house. That's why the R's are fighting it this way. It's pathetically transparent.
The irony is that the R's are actually losing votes. If they force a default they'll probably be out of all 3 branches of government. I wouldn't think they'd be dumb enough to go there, but then they're dumb enough to screw over hundreds of thousands of people, which will have an immediate and decidedly negative impact on the economy at a time where the economy isn't all that great anyway, so maybe they are that dumb.

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in comparison

It is comparable to the local police going on strike and local security firms offering to do police work. While possible and even permissible and perhaps even better the laws would not permit it.

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Vastet wrote:The D's have to

Vastet wrote:
The D's have to turn down everything. Anything else will simply prolong the issue. In order to secure the act they have to hammer in the last nail while they have control of the senate and the white house. That's why the R's are fighting it this way. It's pathetically transparent. The irony is that the R's are actually losing votes. If they force a default they'll probably be out of all 3 branches of government. I wouldn't think they'd be dumb enough to go there, but then they're dumb enough to screw over hundreds of thousands of people, which will have an immediate and decidedly negative impact on the economy at a time where the economy isn't all that great anyway, so maybe they are that dumb.

The republicans can't force a default even if they wanted to. The treasury secretary has complete power to prioritize payments and pay off the debt obligations first. A default can only happen if the treasury secretary wants it to happen and since the secretary is directly under the President, it can only happen if Obama wants it to happen. The idea that the republicans are using the threat of default as leverage is a red herring. Congress has already passed a law that would force the treasury secretary to pay debt obligations first and that bill is sitting around and can be voted on by the Senate any day.

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/113/hr807/text

The only leverage the republicans have is they can refuse to raise the debt ceiling which would force the treasury secretary to balance the budget and decide what bills get paid and what gets cut. Which means that all government programs would have to be cut an average of 25% (that is how much we are borrowing this year). A significant cut in government and one that "radicals" like me would absolutely love to see forced. I think it is blindingly obvious that no one in congress is going to voluntarily vote to balance the budget and if we don't balance the budget, our debt IS going to grow to a point where default will be a real danger. We can't continue to borrow forever and we are increasing our debt worse than a crack addict who discovered payday advances.

 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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That 'red herring' is a

That 'red herring' is a strawman. I never suggested the R's were trying to force a default. But if they refuse to raise the debt ceiling, and the D's refuse to cut spending and default, then the perception will be that the R's forced it to happen; and in politics perception is everything. So the D's can default and blame it on the R's, which the public will accept, and then the R's will lose control of the House to the D's, and the D's will raise the ceiling and appear to have saved the US. And have all 3 branches of government.

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US bankruptcy is inevitable.

US bankruptcy is inevitable. You have to borrow just to make interest payments. You can't cut social spending without increasing social problems, which would simply increase the cost of enforcing the peace and so would accomplish nothing. Medicare is effectively the same boat.

The only thing the US can actually do to cut spending is disband the empire. And less than 1% of the population would agree to disband the empire. Not one politician or military authority would see cutting the defence budget as an option.

The US will sink. It's only a matter of time. It has to. There's nothing that can be done to save it now.

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Vastet wrote:US bankruptcy

Vastet wrote:
US bankruptcy is inevitable. You have to borrow just to make interest payments. You can't cut social spending without increasing social problems, which would simply increase the cost of enforcing the peace and so would accomplish nothing. Medicare is effectively the same boat. The only thing the US can actually do to cut spending is disband the empire. And less than 1% of the population would agree to disband the empire. Not one politician or military authority would see cutting the defence budget as an option. The US will sink. It's only a matter of time. It has to. There's nothing that can be done to save it now.

Sadly I think you are right.

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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Some of the things 'shut

Some of the things 'shut down' are seemingly quite irrational, nigh ridiculous.

Please correct me if this is wrong, but some of the landmarks closed charge admission and/or sell things to patrons generating revenue for the continued operation.

Let alone the problems with kicking homeowners off of government-controlled land and businesses on those lands forced to close as well.

It's a self-fulfilling prophecy that these places will lose money for private citizens, but also sales tax revenue thus creating a need for more money once reopened in addition to shortfalls in revenue.

And on a side note: Should NASA TV be shut down? Wasn't THIS the president that privatized them anyway?

 

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A_Nony_Mouse wrote:It is

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:

It is comparable to the local police going on strike and local security firms offering to do police work. While possible and even permissible and perhaps even better the laws would not permit it.

Libertarians everywhere would ejaculate simultaneously.

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