Smokers Need Not Apply

Beyond Saving
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Smokers Need Not Apply

http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/business/2012/01/27/for-casino-workers-smoking-is-no-dice.html

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DAYTON DAILY NEWS http://www.dispatch.com/content/digital/images/bullet.gif); background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; font-family: Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; background-position: 0px 50%; background-repeat: no-repeat no-repeat; ">Friday January 27, 2012 5:17 AM

 

Job-seekers who smoke, chew tobacco or even use nicotine patches won’t be considered for the 3,200 casino jobs in Toledo and Columbus when Penn National starts filling positions later this year.

Ameet Patel, general manager of the Hollywood Casino Columbus, said applicants who test positive for nicotine will be disqualified, and workers will be subject to random tests during employment.

Penn National’s policy will mean no tobacco use on or off the job for its 3,200 workers, and Ohio’s indoor smoking ban means customers will have to step outside before lighting up.

Penn National is joining the ranks of thousands of companies and hospitals that refuse to hire smokers in the hope of curbing medical costs and encouraging a healthier work force.

This is a growing trend among large companies because smoking makes health insurance costs a lot higher. It disturbs me that companies get so involved with their employees lives away from work. But, I understand that hiring smokers adds a significant cost to employers. That is the problem when you expect someone else to pay for your healthcare. Suddenly they have a strong financial interest in how well you take care of your body.

 

 


.

 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


digitalbeachbum
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 Smoking wouldn't be as bad

 Smoking wouldn't be as bad if they didn't have such a poisonous product.


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          What's next, refusal to hire employees who consume alcohol, ride motorcycles, live in two story homes ( risk of falling down stairs ) weigh beyond their ideal body weight ?

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ProzacDeathWish wrote:   

ProzacDeathWish wrote:

 

 

          What's next, refusal to hire employees who consume alcohol, ride motorcycles, live in two story homes ( risk of falling down stairs ) weigh beyond their ideal body weight ?

"Anyone who doesn't try out for the Iron Man challenge"

edit:Personally... your tobacco consumption is guaranteed not to bother me. Tobacco industry makes the best argument to lift the "Cuban Embargo"... because plenty of socialites want their Havanna Handwrappeds and will spend glorious sums of money to get their hands on such "luxuries".

“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)


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Quote:What's next, refusal

Quote:
What's next, refusal to hire employees who consume alcohol, ride motorcycles, live in two story homes ( risk of falling down stairs ) weigh beyond their ideal body weight ?

 

Medi-cal already denies you insurance if you exceed a certain body weight and charge you more if you go above their set ceiling which is like 279 or something.  They take into account some people are naturally bigger in muscle and other factors, but still it's like uhh riiight...

 

More to the point, what's next, employers will deny you employment if you smoke marij-....oh....yeah....

"When the majority believes in what is false, the truth becomes a quest." - Me


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Do you read the shit you

Do you read the shit you shovel. You have no problem with these big tobacco companies making money. What's next? Prohibition? Alcohol causes disease and and drunk driving injury and death.

You don't even see what the fuck you are doing to society. On the one hand you want everyone to to be free to do what they want, but if they cant afford health care, let them die. It is nothing but a war on the middle class and poor.

Don't be half assed about it Beyond if it is about saving money for the company, then pool your Citizen's United Monopoly PAC money and pay your overlords to either outlaw all tobacco, which will merely drive it into a black market and create more crime, or have the middle class and poor arrested for buying something they have the right to buy.

You are just as dogmatic about your economics as a theist can be with religion.

This is has nothing to do with freedom. It has to do with money equals power and might makes right. And "rights" to you merely means, when you get what you want.

 

 

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Brian37 wrote:Do you read

Brian37 wrote:

Do you read the shit you shovel. You have no problem with these big tobacco companies making money. What's next? Prohibition? Alcohol causes disease and and drunk driving injury and death.

You don't even see what the fuck you are doing to society. On the one hand you want everyone to to be free to do what they want, but if they cant afford health care, let them die. It is nothing but a war on the middle class and poor.

Don't be half assed about it Beyond if it is about saving money for the company, then pool your Citizen's United Monopoly PAC money and pay your overlords to either outlaw all tobacco, which will merely drive it into a black market and create more crime, or have the middle class and poor arrested for buying something they have the right to buy.

You are just as dogmatic about your economics as a theist can be with religion.

This is has nothing to do with freedom. It has to do with money equals power and might makes right. And "rights" to you merely means, when you get what you want.

 

What part of " It disturbs me that companies get so involved with their employees lives away from work. " do you not understand? I have no interest in banning my employees from smoking, it would be a little hypocritical since I am a casual smoker myself. And yeah, prohibition very well might be next- although I suspect that weight problems will come first because after smoking, weight is the second largest factor in health insurance prices. Actually age is the largest factor, but hiring based on age is already illegal if mostly unenforceable so if companies do start discriminating on age they won't advertise it like they are with smoking.  

 

I believe you ought to be able to smoke any substance you desire at home and neither the government nor your employer should penalize you for it. 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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They have no argument here.

They have no argument here. Companies don't need to concern themselves with healthcare anywhere near as much.

They would lose any challenge if they ever tried it in Canada. It's illegal to discriminate.

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Beyond Saving wrote:

This is a growing trend among large companies because smoking makes health insurance costs a lot higher. It disturbs me that companies get so involved with their employees lives away from work. But, I understand that hiring smokers adds a significant cost to employers. That is the problem when you expect someone else to pay for your healthcare. Suddenly they have a strong financial interest in how well you take care of your body.

Myself, I am waiting for the most important hiring ban of all, overweight, IF in fact the purpose is to reduce medical costs.

As a smoker, consider that full disclosure, now retired, I started looking at my created working life public image of hard living, hard drinking, work hard play hard and decided I was not going to make it to my 80s that way. I prioritized. I cut my drinking to a small fraction, dropped 40 pounds and my smoking by more than 2/3rds. And sugar tastes funny now and red meat tastes best when infrequent. (It is easier when older.) By all the actuarial tables and all the papers I am way ahead of people who have only quit smoking and can't see their feet even when not blocked by a bacon cheeseburger. I have not stopped anything but I have cut WAY DOWN. I still enjoy all my vices.

Not enough? Of all the causes of death smoking "related" diseases have the shortest time to death of them all. That is from fatal heart attacks to even lung cancer. From diagnosis to death is at best two years. And most diagnoses -- on the order of 90% -- are on the retired and Medicare gets the bill.

Still not enough? What idiot thought a reduction in smoking would not result in an increase in obesity? All of them apparently. Even "second hand" smoke might reduce obesity but I would not bet on it but if it spoils your appetite, GOOD!

Factually smoking has been codemned by puritans since it arrived in Europe. Nothing has changed. It has nothing to do with the medical costs of smoking. It has to do with fat people, walking heart attacks, looking to feel sanctimonious.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

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digitalbeachbum wrote:
Smoking wouldn't be as bad if they didn't have such a poisonous product.

Equally "poisonous" are the people who produce sugar, alcohol, and those who raise cattle and any kind of transportation other than walking for that matter.

Obesity is worse for health care costs.

Smoking is a politically correct thing to attack. But if they were serious, obesity would be the number one reason to refuse to hire and cause to fire.

=====

This is an edit.

I can not back up that claim right now. I would have to repeat a lot of research that for some odd reason I did not archive.

The basic problem is that there are a very few identifiable causes of death. Most of them are broad categories such as stroke and heart attack. There are many contributors to these few causes. They have to overlap. There are NO studies of multiple factors as death contributors.

The bottom line is, the primary cause of death is birth. After that is it all in the details.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

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Sage_Override wrote:

Medi-cal already denies you insurance if you exceed a certain body weight and charge you more if you go above their set ceiling which is like 279 or something.  They take into account some people are naturally bigger in muscle and other factors, but still it's like uhh riiight...

279? No one other than a male in professional sports needs weigh even 200. But politically correct folks say a 5'2" woman can weigh 279.


 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

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I Hate Anti-Smoking-Nazis

I smoke cigarettes

 

And there's NOTHING MORE AGGREVATING than Anti-Smoking-Nazis

 

Nothing grinds my gears more than tis

 

A woman once told me she didn't thinl people should smoke on the street!

 

To which I said

 

Well you can always go inside WHERE YOU CAN'T SMOKE!

 

 

In other words, these people were the ones behind making all bars and restaurants no smoking and now they are working

 

on banning it outsde!

 

That's bullshit!

 

Here in philadelphia, we cant smoke on the El Platform even tho its outside

 

The anti smoking nazis wont stop until cigs are $20 a pack and you cant smoke anywhere!

 

And what the OP posted about employers not permitting smoking because of health care premiums

 

I would tell them where to stick it

 

Just another weapon of the anti smoking nazi

 

And one last thing:

 

There is NO SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE AT ALL That Says Outdoor Second Hand Smoke Causes Cancer

 

All Anti-Smoking Propaganda!


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radioboyintj wrote:

...


The anti smoking nazis wont stop until cigs are $20 a pack and you cant smoke anywhere!

www.giwersworld.org/smoking/index.phtml


Roll your own and screw the gov.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

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www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml


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radioboyintj wrote:
I smoke cigarettes

And there's NOTHING MORE AGGREVATING than Anti-Smoking-Nazis

 

For a fact anti-smoking laws got a very late start in Germany for the fact that Hitler started restricting smoking in Germany in 1938. Another littke known fact is that he used the royalties from Mein Kampf to pay for the research that first established the health consequences of smoking upon which the laws were justified.

 

 

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

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A_Nony_Mouse

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:

radioboyintj wrote:

...


 

The anti smoking nazis wont stop until cigs are $20 a pack and you cant smoke anywhere!

www.giwersworld.org/smoking/index.phtml


 

Roll your own and screw the gov.

 

As long as you don't roll one on a room near me should be fine.

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As long as smoking is legal

As long as smoking is legal I don't understand how this legal. I understand why they want to do it but even so. I could accept banning smoking during work hours but nothing more than that.

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Tapey wrote:As long as

Tapey wrote:

As long as smoking is legal I don't understand how this legal. I understand why they want to do it but even so. I could accept banning smoking during work hours but nothing more than that.

 

A lot of cities in the States have smoking bans now.  No smoking at work places, at restaurants, at bars, grocery stores, any store, airports.....  Some cities allow smoking in designated areas only - so you can smoke at a bar or restaurant or work place if you do so where it is ventilated.  I am not allergic or asthmatic, so it doesn't bother me that way.  Some people have strong reactions, however.  But I also think it stinks - terribly.  And I do not appreciate inhaling tobacco smoke when it makes me want to gag.  And smoker's hair and clothes also stink.  They can't tell because their sense of smell is knocked out.  I feel the same way about strong perfumes. 

It is legal because it is framed as a health issue.  There is ample evidence that second hand smoke - inhaling the smoke from someone else burning tobacco - is just as dangerous as inhaling it directly from the cigarette or whatever.  The attitude is, if you want to kill yourself, fine.  But you have no right to kill the others around you as well.

There is some controversy over this.  I'm not saying it has been proven 100% certain sure.  Just that that is the argument.  And it doesn't bother me, because I don't like the stench and I have never smoked.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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cj wrote:...It is legal

cj wrote:
...

It is legal because it is framed as a health issue.  There is ample evidence that second hand smoke - inhaling the smoke from someone else burning tobacco - is just as dangerous as inhaling it directly from the cigarette or whatever.  The attitude is, if you want to kill yourself, fine.  But you have no right to kill the others around you as well.

That is exactly what is not in evidence, tobacco smoke. Not smoke, tobacco smoke.


The mechanics of smoking are quite simple. The flame front vaporizes the volatile materials just in behind it -- towards the inhale. Those are inhaled and cooled in the lungs and condense. The exhale is of uncondensed carbon particulates. The smoke directly from the cigarette flame front is also carbon particulates. The smell comes from the smouldering cigarette not being inhaled that turns to gas and spreads into the room because of the higher volume of gas over liquid. Partial combustion as in extinguished cigarettes create different compounds which also smell.

Therefore any data on smoke has to be in comparison to all other sources of smoke. Meaning incense and candles, all sources of open flame, should also be banned along with BBQing. Just by eyeballing it, the smoke from a single BBQ is many, many cartons of cigarettes. Also ban oven broiling and pan frying for the same reasons and worse because carcinogens are not only inhaled but eaten. Make only boiled beef legal and no browning ever. If your burger has a crisp outer crust you are eating carcinogens. Only White Castle burgers are safe.

Do not forget to ban consumption of peanuts. Essentially all peanuts in any form include aflotoxin which is one of the most powerful concinogens known.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

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And also

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:

Do not forget to ban consumption of peanuts.

The combustion engine too.

 

 


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I'm thinking the waste

I'm thinking the waste products of most "steam" engines are equally as destructive for the environment and human health... ever looked up the symptoms of fly ash poisoning? How about radiation poisoning?

Quote:
Potentially toxic trace elements in coal include arsenic, beryllium, cadmium, barium, chromium, copper, lead, mercury, molybdenum, nickel, radium, selenium, thorium, uranium, vanadium, and zinc. Approximately 10 percent of the mass of coals burned in the United States consists of unburnable mineral material that becomes ash, so the concentration of most trace elements in coal ash is approximately 10 times the concentration in the original coal. A 1997 analysis by the U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) found that fly ash typically contained 10 to 30 ppm of uranium, comparable to the levels found in some granitic rocks, phosphate rock, and black shale. [...] In June 2008, the U.S. House of Representatives held an oversight hearing on the Federal government's role in addressing health and environmental risks of fly ash. [...]

Crystalline silica and lime along with toxic chemicals are among the exposure concerns. Although industry has claimed that fly ash is "neither toxic nor poisonous," this is disputed. Exposure to fly ash through skin contact, inhalation of fine particle dust and drinking water may well present health risks. The National Academy of Sciences noted in 2007 that "the presence of high contaminant levels in many CCR (coal combustion residue) leachates may create human health and ecological concerns."  Fine crystalline silica present in fly ash has been linked with lung damage, in particular silicosis. OSHA allows 0.10 mg/m3, (one ten-thousandth of a gram per cubic meter of air).  Another fly ash component of some concern is lime (CaO). This chemical reacts with water (H2O) to form calcium hydroxide [Ca(OH)2], giving fly ash a pH somewhere between 10 and 12, a medium to strong base. This can also cause lung damage if present in sufficient quantities.

Apparently, unregulated power generation in Beijing has made this a problem, but there are other instances of shoddy, pro-industry lack of health regulations behaving destructively on the environment and human health.

There's also the thing about paper mills and dioxins. Who needs paper in this day and age? Touchscreens and .pdf documents have taken the place of physical documentation, have they not?

“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)


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I find it amusing whenever I

I find it amusing whenever I hear the old wives tale that smoking has ANY effect on taste or smell. It certainly never had any on mine. All my senses have always been superior to those around me. I'll be in a room full of non-smokers and still be the first one to smell the fire or gas leak.
What happens is that you get accustomed to the smell of smoke, and therefore simply don't notice it as much.

Kapkao points out what should be the obvious: if the health of society is so important that we have to take away personal freedom, then why the hell do we tolerate a billion practices which are all far more dangerous and unhealthy? Why can a company that releases more toxins than a million smokers tell its 50 employees not to smoke?

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 As someone who smokes once

 As someone who smokes once a week at most I really notice the smell the next morning because I never really get used to it. However, I have found the clothes with omnishield don't pick up the smell. Since they are also stain and water resistant they make the perfect drinking clothes, you can drink and smoke all night without your clothes smelling like stale tobacco and beer. Now if they could just figure out how to make omnishield for your hair and some omnishield soap....

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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I think the same applies for

I think the same applies for marijuana smokers in regards to not really paying attention to smoke after awhile because I'm pretty sure I don't smell like cannabis after using my pipe or bong, but then again anyone that comes into contact with me might say differently although I have yet to get a "damn, have you been getting high?" inquiry.  I despise cigarettes; the smell, the finger/teeth staining, the cancerous effects, all of it.  But hey, as long as you're not blowing that shit in my face and it isn't in my home, you can act like an industrial rooftop exhaust vent in Stockton for all I care and if it's weed smoke, you can do the exact opposite of what I just said    

"When the majority believes in what is false, the truth becomes a quest." - Me