A Haunting in Connecticut

dassercha
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A Haunting in Connecticut

 

So I joined this forum oh so long ago for a myriad of reasons, but I am still plagued by how so many here can just dismiss the supernatural out of hand just like that. I happened across this show on the Discovery Channel & once again, here is yet another example of MANY people with indisputable experiences. These are rational skeptics who are experiencing WILD stuff. How can you dismiss this as BS? 

A Haunting in Connecticut
Part 1
TV-PG, CC

In 1986, the Parker family contacted Edward and Lorraine Warren, a demonologist and clairvoyant to rid their home of supernatural entities. The Warrens performed a church-sanctioned exorcism to rid the house of its unwanted inhabitants.

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Indisputable

Indisputable experiences??? I've watched the episode, nothing they have no evidence any of that occured.  They just have stories.

Sounds made up...
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Magus wrote:Indisputable

Magus wrote:

Indisputable experiences??? I've watched the episode, nothing they have no evidence any of that occured.  They just have stories.

Yes I realize it's "their word" we're going on, but did you watch how the team member was so freaked by the one experience? How is it that SO MANY people through the ages report these types of things? OK, isolated wackos here & there--check. But this? This rivals UFO sightings, abductions etc. ALL these people can't just be making stuff up out of boredom.

 

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How should i explain

How should i explain this...

 

IF such supernatural things as ghosts... or spirits... the undead, what have you... IF any such thing existed, you can bet that my life would be devoted to its research and subsequent abuse of the knowledge gained. Sadly, such things do not exist... (i really... really wanted to be a necromancer as a child    )

 

Never take the word of some one who stands to profit directly from you believing in their word... unless its Doomy's word, because thats golden...

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The Doomed Soul wrote:How

The Doomed Soul wrote:

How should i explain this...

 

IF such supernatural things as ghosts... or spirits... the undead, what have you... IF any such thing existed, you can bet that my life would be devoted to its research and subsequent abuse of the knowledge gained. Sadly, such things do not exist... (i really... really wanted to be a necromancer as a child    )

 

Never take the word of some one who stands to profit directly from you believing in their word... unless its Doomy's word, because thats golden...

Problem is...not all of this is profit driven--at all. Again, too many people throughout the ages have had INTENSE experiences that were hardly magic tricks, deluded minds etc.

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dassercha wrote:Problem

dassercha wrote:

Problem is...not all of this is profit driven--at all. Again, too many people throughout the ages have had INTENSE experiences that were hardly magic tricks, deluded minds etc.

Ok, lets go completely batshit insane here for awhile.

 

Lets say Ghosts. Spirits, and the undead exist.

Now, lets reverse engineer from that point.

Is there any energy to be had in these creatures?

Is there a process for their appeance?

Is there a purpose to their existence?

Can such beings be detected with anything other than the naked eye?

Is there any observable force associated with these beings?

 

If no, then they dont fucking exist

If yes, Doomy is becoming a necromancer, tonight, god damn it!

 

I would love for such things to exist... because it would make all my dark, deluded fantasies possible... BUT they dont, no one can prove that they do, and i dont lose any sleep over it -_-

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OK, so could you not join

OK, so could you not join some uber-"satanic" cult, figure out how to commune withh the dead, entities whatever? Seems lots of folks have...just say'n.

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fine... you know what, we'll

fine... you know what, we'll settle this in a proper manner

 

Internet Rule #34

Generally accepted internet rule that states that pornography or sexually related material exists for any conceivable subject

 

I submit that, if ghosts exist, there HAS to be ghost porn somewhere on the internet, go find us the proof

 (edit before i pwn myself.... anime/manga/hentai do not count.... w00t, saved... )

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dassercha wrote:Magus

dassercha wrote:

Magus wrote:

Indisputable experiences??? I've watched the episode, nothing they have no evidence any of that occured.  They just have stories.

Yes I realize it's "their word" we're going on, but did you watch how the team member was so freaked by the one experience? How is it that SO MANY people through the ages report these types of things? OK, isolated wackos here & there--check. But this? This rivals UFO sightings, abductions etc. ALL these people can't just be making stuff up out of boredom.

 

I am not saying nothing happened.  I am saying that there is no verifiable way to determine the cause of said events.  Lets take this story, but instead say it was aliens that were tormenting these people.   How would you be able to tell the difference?  We need something to work with which we don't have because there is no evidence to back it up.  It could be a prank, it could be real.  Since we don't have any way of verifing what happened we should opt for the natural explaination, because we have evidence that natrual things occur.

 

Your doubt into what people will do to stave off boredom is the only thing I see as strange here.

Sounds made up...
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Magus wrote:Your doubt into

Magus wrote:

Your doubt into what people will do to stave off boredom is the only thing I see as strange here.

 

<-- Classic example

 

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Communing with Hitler on my

Communing with Hitler on my Ougi board, while i wait for Ghost porn

 

Oh, Hitler mentioned something about pumpkin pie... but i didnt really understand

 

... damn it, now im hungry for pumpkin pie...

 

ZOMG! that must be proof ghosts exists!

 

>.< fuck, self-defeatism strikes again

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dassercha wrote:So I joined

dassercha wrote:

So I joined this forum oh so long ago for a myriad of reasons, but I am still plagued by how so many here can just dismiss the supernatural out of hand just like that.

Few people here "dismiss the supernatural out of hand." We just want evidence.

dassercha wrote:
How is it that SO MANY people through the ages report these types of things? OK, isolated wackos here & there--check. But this? This rivals UFO sightings, abductions etc. ALL these people can't just be making stuff up out of boredom.

If the validity of a claim was based solely on how many people had intense experiences that are relevant to the claim, then certainly, God would be at the top of the list.

Most people don't make these things up out of boredom; that much is obvious. They reach these conclusions because they want to, to explain things that they can't otherwise explain and to satisfy instincts that they don't know how to satisfy. Sure, some pseudo-scientific/conspiracy/etc. claims might have some validity, but unless there is concrete evidence, all one can do is refer to subjective anecdotes and make ad populum arguments, which, coincidentally, is what you're doing right now.  

dassercha wrote:
Again, too many people throughout the ages have had INTENSE experiences that were hardly magic tricks, deluded minds etc.

For example? Such as?

 

 

 

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


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Are you kidding?

  It's  A  F&*&ing TV SHOW!!!!  Come on Dude.  Secondly, look at who was invited to explore and examine...  a bunch of whack jobs that make money doing this shit.  Get past the theatrics and the smoke and mirrors.  Get past people telling their stories twisted with their own interpretations, fears and ignorance.  Look at the situation with a rational mind.  It's a load of crap.  Don't get sucked in.  Whether it's a TV show, an article or your neighbor...  but most of all.. A TV SHOW???  COME ON.  Trim the subjective assumptions and theatrical, emotional or ignorant interpretations and you'll get two things.  Closer to the truth and something that the producers won't be too interested in.


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The Doomed Soul really does

The Doomed Soul really does have it right,

A lot of atheists love sci fi, fantasy and general spookiness.

I want to be a vampire, I want to meet aliens and go around in flying saucers. I want to be the anti-christ and have lots of cool demonic powers, hey I even want to be good looking.

Alas none of this is real or has any evidence that it could be real.

If it was well then I would be your first undead poster


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dassercha wrote:The Doomed

dassercha wrote:

The Doomed Soul wrote:

How should i explain this...

 

IF such supernatural things as ghosts... or spirits... the undead, what have you... IF any such thing existed, you can bet that my life would be devoted to its research and subsequent abuse of the knowledge gained. Sadly, such things do not exist... (i really... really wanted to be a necromancer as a child    )

 

Never take the word of some one who stands to profit directly from you believing in their word... unless its Doomy's word, because thats golden...

Problem is...not all of this is profit driven--at all. Again, too many people throughout the ages have had INTENSE experiences that were hardly magic tricks, deluded minds etc.

Billions of people throughout the ages have believed in god.  Are you that stupid?


 

BigUniverse wrote,

"Well the things that happen less often are more likely to be the result of the supper natural. A thing like loosing my keys in the morning is not likely supper natural, but finding a thousand dollars or meeting a celebrity might be."


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OK, some background: I grew

OK, some background:

I grew up with EXTREME fundamentalist christian parents who would spend hours with friends talking about their former dabbling or either serious involvement in the "occult": organized groups a la OTO seitans, "sorcery," etc.

These tales scared the 'hell' out of me as a kid and to this day, I get creeped out & easily horrified.

Since then I have had trustworthy friends describe similar experiences. I mean non-Christians, new agers, wiccans, etc--not media/Internet.
 
So, guess that's where I'm stuck. Can't get past the early years brainwashing coupled with friends, plus media/Internet reinforcement.

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mrjonno wrote:If it was well

mrjonno wrote:

If it was well then I would be your first undead poster

 

No way, MrJonno! I'd use my time machine and kill myself then go back in time to post my first undead post before you. So there!

 

Any posters know if this would work? I'm concerned that my bravado may have outpaced my abilities here.

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Abu Lahab wrote:mrjonno

Abu Lahab wrote:

mrjonno wrote:

If it was well then I would be your first undead poster

 

No way, MrJonno! I'd use my time machine and kill myself then go back in time to post my first undead post before you. So there!

 

Any posters know if this would work? I'm concerned that my bravado may have outpaced my abilities here.

 

No it would not work... primarily because YOU wouldnt be UNDEAD...

 

That... and depending on how time travel works...

1. You created a time paradox that destroy's existence

2. You created a time paradox that "self corrects" you out of existence (ala Legacy of Kain/ SoulReaver)

3. You created a time paradox that does nothing, and only continuously loops in regards to yourself

4. You created a time paradox that creates an alternate universe but destroys the one you came from

(probably other possibilities... but ergo, your still not Undead)

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and im still waiting on my

and im still waiting on my god damn Ghost porn, Dass!

 

Porn for the Porn God! Poon for the Poon Throne!

*slaps self*

stupid Slaanesh >.>

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here you go doomy.  Now you

here you go doomy.  Now you owe me an undead housekeeper.

 

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the hell i do?!? just a

the hell i do?!? just a mirror and a child with a camera...

 

no "giggity giggity" at all...

not that my brain would allow my eyes to register such a feat, if that grandmother has anything to do with it

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Liam wrote:  It's  A

Liam wrote:

  It's  A  F&*&ing TV SHOW!!!!  Come on Dude.  Secondly, look at who was invited to explore and examine...  a bunch of whack jobs that make money doing this shit.  Get past the theatrics and the smoke and mirrors.  Get past people telling their stories twisted with their own interpretations, fears and ignorance.  Look at the situation with a rational mind.  It's a load of crap.  Don't get sucked in.  Whether it's a TV show, an article or your neighbor...  but most of all.. A TV SHOW???  COME ON.  Trim the subjective assumptions and theatrical, emotional or ignorant interpretations and you'll get two things.  Closer to the truth and something that the producers won't be too interested in.

Welcome to the RRS Liam.  You're right on.  I've seen the History Channel put on programs that seriously examine the bible and try to present it as fact even to the point of tweaking history.  These are being shown on television/cable and these companies are in the entertaimnent business. 

Dassercha, when we are kids our world view is reflective of our parents world view.  We depend on them to teach us and generally accept whatever we are told.  I remember being scared shitless of things that go bump in the night, even after deciding god didn't exist at the tender young age of about 11.  My mind was primed with all kinds of nonsense, most of it gleaned from television and movies.  Until I started getting more interested in the sciences and started reading books with fact instead of fiction I only had that crap to draw on.  In spite of not believing in an invisible friend in the sky I still kinda sorta thought werewolves and vampires might still exist because they were portrayed as having been humans at one time. 

The people who describe supernatural happenings might actually believe it because they know so little about the natural world around them.  Others don't want to be left out of the group and simply make shit up.  Just because someone says it happened does not mean it did.  Look at the famous face on the surface of Mars.    Light and shadow is all that is.  Part of being a skeptic is requiring proof for extraordinary claims of the super and not so supernatural.  Photos can be affected by a myriad of things: the age of the film used, the paper it is printed on, lighting, reflections, alterations, etc.

I can't think of any of these claims that cannot be refuted in one way or another.

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I work with someone who has

I work with someone who has no reason to lie. He can barely stand to live in his house & has described in great detail what goes on. At first I was like you guys. BULLSHIT! Then, other colleagues who have been to his house have verified there is "something" going on there. Several people HAVE ALL experienced something there that defies rational explanation. None of these people have anystake in gaining from attention, money etc.

All I'm saying...just b/c we haven't had those experiences dosen't mean others haven't. I've never been raped, but that doesn't invalidate others who have. OK, now I'm gonna get this for that analogy, but hey...

 

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dassercha wrote:Magus

dassercha wrote:

Magus wrote:

Indisputable experiences??? I've watched the episode, nothing they have no evidence any of that occured.  They just have stories.

Yes I realize it's "their word" we're going on, but did you watch how the team member was so freaked by the one experience? How is it that SO MANY people through the ages report these types of things? OK, isolated wackos here & there--check. But this? This rivals UFO sightings, abductions etc. ALL these people can't just be making stuff up out of boredom.

 

It is bullshit. If I truely believe that I am Napolean, would you believe me? Or, would you think that I am self deluded?

"I saw it on TV so therefore it must be real"........"An idiot's guide to logic".

Camera's can be manipulated and humans can sell lies and delude themselves into thinking they are not. In this case, the producers of the show and the networks DONT CARE about using or manipulating gullible people to sell add time.

You want to convince me ghosts exist? Ok, get someone to volunteer in a science lab, to have their brains blown out with a shotgun, then have their "spirit" subject itself to an interview and DNA test with independent media, and scientists unrelated.

Otherwise I think it is best for you to stop being so gullible and realize that these people are either self deluded and are being used by the network to make money, OR they don't care and will sell you this crap because they want the fame and attention.

Emotions can be faked and camera's can be manipulated, and people are capable of believing false things and deluding themselves to the point of making crap up because they want something to be real, even if it isn't.

NO serious science journal or association would give crap like this the time of day.

Beings with no physical brains ARE PURE FANTASY!

 

 

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dassercha wrote:I work with

dassercha wrote:

I work with someone who has no reason to lie. He can barely stand to live in his house & has described in great detail what goes on. At first I was like you guys. BULLSHIT! Then, other colleagues who have been to his house have verified there is "something" going on there. Several people HAVE ALL experienced something there that defies rational explanation. None of these people have anystake in gaining from attention, money etc.

All I'm saying...just b/c we haven't had those experiences dosen't mean others haven't. I've never been raped, but that doesn't invalidate others who have. OK, now I'm gonna get this for that analogy, but hey...

 

"Whatever" is going on, will never include beings with no body or brain floating around spooking people like Casper.

The doors in my house swing on their own when I let go of them....OHHHHHHHHHH........or maybe it is because THE FLOORS ARE NOT LEVEL?

There is a difference between Uri Geller, a lier and con artist, and Penn & Teller who admit what they do is an illusion.

The brain can be easly foold. The old camera trick making the hallway look real only to have the actor walk to the back eventually having to crawl because the hallway was merely a painting and an illusion. If you really want to believe something, you will.

These shows are nothing but scams to sell add time and the networks don't care if the people partisipating in them, or the viewers are that stupid and gullible to buy that show, just as long as they buy products from the advertisers.

They would sell an Eskimo a ice cooler.

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If I really thought I saw a

If I really thought I saw a ghost. I wouldn't think it was real.

I would think that my concious and subconcious were mixing.

Or I was on drugs

Or I was becoming mentally ill.

Or someone was pulling an elaborate scam on me.

Those are rational explinations.

What is stupid and pure fantacy is to think that thought can exist outside the physical brain after death.

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If Ghosts/Spirits

If Ghosts/Spirits exist....

Demons exist...

and the Afterlife exists...

subsequently, Hell as well...

If Hell exists, surely Heaven must...

If Heaven exists, well, clearly God does

If God exists...

 

 

 

My my my, what a slippery slope O_O

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The Doomed Soul

The Doomed Soul wrote:
the hell i do?!? just a mirror and a child with a camera...

 

no "giggity giggity" at all...

 

not that my brain would allow my eyes to register such a feat, if that grandmother has anything to do with it

 

Now, now...

 

You know damned well that rule #34 does not guarantee gigity. If you want, I can do a photochop with miss September but in order to make it ghostly, she will be so out of focus that you don't get any giggity despite the hotness.

 

Also, a cat is fine too...

 

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Alright, thnaks for all the

Alright, thnaks for all the input guys--I get the points made, but guess it will be very hard for me to break from the years of fundy damage "bestowed" upon me as a kid.

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Well, it is kind of

Well, it is kind of like learning to ride a bicycle. At first it may seem impossible, especially when your older brother kicks your training wheels up. But one day a big black dog will bark and run down the street in your general direction and you will get it. After that, you will do fine...

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