Steve Gregg Christian Radio vs Atheists - RRS (#21)

RationalResponseSquad's picture



5:10 Give me a reason why we should believe in god.

6:00 By Steve Gregg's logic the Flying Spaghetti Monster is real

6:50 Rook begins to challenge the historical existence of Jesus

7:20 Rook challenges Steve on those who provided contemporary evidence of Jesus

9:40 Mike asks about the supernatural claims in the bible, even if we are to accept that the history is correct.

14:05 We have no evidence to believe that a person can be dead for three days and then come back to life.

15:15 There is a difference between a disciple and an apostle

16:55 “I don't understand why you keep thinking the earliest account of Christianity is the book of Acts. The book of Acts was written after Luke.” “Why do you think there is any evidence of a historical Jesus.” - Rook Hawkins

18:15 P 52 Fragment is the only living piece of the Gospels from 150 CE dated to that particular time period. You don't have anything earlier than that.

18:50 Steve proposes that the creator of our Universe was so pathetic that he dispensed his story to the world in a whisper down the lane manner with nobody who wrote a word about Jesus while Jesus was alive... you know... the guy that came down to Earth just to die for your sins... that he created.

21:05 What books from the New Testament were actually authentic?

22:20 Rook asks about the contradiction between Acts and Gallatians where Paul goes to Jerusalem immediately after his conversion in one and in three years in the other.

23:10 Paul never met Jesus... ever.

25:20 Rook and Steve get into a back and forth about who knows more about the history of Christianity.

29:20 Razorcade asks about how Steve would go about proving a character is real when pulling a book at random in the library. Mike expounds on the question by asking how we can prove a miraculous story about a character from history that we know existed.

30:40 Steve posits that we have 4 corroborating stories about Jesus.

31:40 Mike explains that to a scientifically minded person an eyewitness account isn't a proof for such an extraordinary claim.

32:30 Mike says “evidence is required in direct proportion to the extraordinary nature of the claim.”

32:39 Steve Gregg responds by stating “I don't agree with that. I would say that evidence is required of a sort that is suited to the particular kind of claims.”

33:20 Mike explains that this [biblical] testimony is worthless. Steve and Mike go on to expand on the scientific falsifiability of the Bible. A key point from Mike is the notion that the claims in the Bible are so extraordinary that a few “witnesses” accounts of things we know to be impossible is not enough evidence for these over the top claims. Steve says that Mike is “selectively skeptical” which draws the ire of the atheist hosts. The conversation about scientific voracity of Biblical claims continues...

36:00 Steve is held up on a point that he makes about not liking to believe things without evidence as the atheists point out that he just said testimony was evidence, but didn't accept a testimony about a contemporary Jesus.

36:50 David Koresh and his followers were brought up.

37:00 Rook brings up Simon Magus and the stories about how people claimed he was a god and challenges Steve on continuity in his belief structure which would seem to indicate he might accept those stories as factual as well. Steve discounts them with selective logic, it's ironic he accused the atheists of that at 33:20.

38:40 Steve explains some of the reasons why he believes Jesus was the son of God and Rook conflates that with belief in a man from Krypton. Rook says you need to understand the difference between reality and mythology.

40:10 Razorcade asks “what your definition of revelation is.” Steve answers and then the discussion moves on to Paul's visions about Jesus and whether he saw Jesus in the flesh.

43:00 Mike restates the point is that Paul never saw Jesus in the flesh. Steve disputes this point. Mike seeks clarity by making sure “In his vision Paul never sees Christ on Earth, correct.” Steve Gregg agrees with this point at 44:00 stating “Paul never claims to be a witness to what happened to Christ on Earth.”

45:00 and on... a heated exchange develops between Rook and Steve about what the bible says. Both players interpret the bible differently and Steve disputes Rook on two passages that don't seem to juxtapose well.

49:30 Steve believes our claim that he is so biased towards religion due to upbringing is false, yet he was brought up religious. On the other end, Steve believes our bias is towards skepticism yet we were all brought up religious. From there a discussion ensues about skepticism about claims in general and researching topics before wholeheartedly believing them.

53:00 “Take something like a resurrection. That goes against every empirical observation of death ever made.” - Mike the RRS Science Geek The discussion continues to surround the topic of what level of evidence and proof is required to believe supernatural claims.

55:45 Steve Gregg posits that he believes miracles may happen and the atheist show hosts don't. He is promptly corrected by Mike at 56:45.

57:40 Rook brings up supposed biblical historical events that have no other contemporary evidence for them, like the slaughter of the innocents.

59:00-1:03:00 Rook monopolizes the mic on a rant.

1:03:00 Sapient interrupts and allows Steve to get the final word, at which point Steve makes a few minutes of closing comments.

1:06:00 Sapient apologizes for any lack of civility during the show and Steve comments that we were tame enough. Sapient then responds to a few of Steve's closing points. First about a presupposition that we don't want to believe in the supernatural fails to acknowledge that all show hosts grew up believing in the supernatural. Also Sapient challenges Steve on a comment he made about not soliciting money. Sapient points out that on Steve's website he accepts donations through Paypal and seems to encourage financial contributions. A brief back and forth about raising money ensues.

1:10:15 Mike's closing statements deal with the fact that God is all knowing and knows how to satisfy Mike's standards of evidence but has chosen not to.

1:11:20 Sapient responds to Steve's idiotic claim that he finds it more difficult to live as a believer by saying “It's more difficult to be in the majority and live a happy blissful existence with a belief in something that makes you feel like you're going to live forever?”


digitalbeachbum's picture

I listened to about 80% of

I listened to about 80% of it and had enough of his bullshit. When pressed he showed that he was cherry picking his evidence.

When pressed he started to crack. 

He should haven't been asked about other religions and all the gods and writings and witnesses who give suppor to their religions (other than the religion of Abraham).