Huh?  What happened?

Thanks for saying that Kevin.  It's nice to have the support of the community.  Now let's all just pray to Jake that Greydon gets the help he needs and overcomes this struggle.  I'll be fine in the long term, or as fine as can be under the circumstances. 

P.S.  This is why I never leave the house.  (anyone hearing me yet... wink at Kelly and Rook)

  I'm with his Willness,   you've got everyone  curious as all done out;  what the hell happened!!!!!!!!!?

Brian and a number of other people from the RRS were at a secular humanist convention in the Washington District of Columbia. Greydon Square was there to both promote his CD and simply be another atheistic representative.

Greydon is, as I understand it, bipolar - and was not taking his medication. He confronted Brian at the convention over a paranoid delusion he'd developed as a result, regarding the CDs that Brian and bought and was selling at the convention (feeling that he was somehow being taken advantage of, regardless of the fact that these were CDs Brian had already paid Greydon for), and psychotically attacked and attempted to beat Brian to death (nearly succeeding in the endeavor).

Brian explained this story to the best of his ability to as many people as possible on Stickam, just after getting out of the hospital. He looked like he'd been hit by a truck.

To say the least, Greydon's in prison right now, charges are pending.

Such a waste.

nothing but love for you kevin but that came out beyond canadian...

This guy has some facts of the event right...

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Popular blog post from an atheist that had second hand knowledge of the event:

Take it easy Brian (as if). Here's hoping you'll both be patched up and good to go soon.

As an aside for everyone, if you've not already seen it and don't have personal experience with that particular disorder I recommend Stephen Fry's deeply personal and disarmingly honest documentary detailing his own struggle with manic depression and that of more severe sufferers. "The Secret Life of the Manic Depressive," filmed for and released by the BBC.

Holy shit.   I had no idea.

This sucks on so many levels. 

Brian, I hope you're doing better.

On edit: This really bothers me because if Greydon wasn't on medication, he isn't entirely responsible for his actions.  Yet I'm extremely concerned about Brian.  No winners here.  It just plain sucks.

I have a severe form of unipolar depression.  I've never developed delusions or psychoses.  I've never become violent toward others.  However, my doctor just tried to change one of my medications (sans psychiatrist because there aren't any good ones in this county).  I've been at the edge of a panic attack for about two weeks as a result.  I think (hope?)  I'm turning the corner.  It got so bad that at several points I was like, "Please, I'll believe in anything, god...just fix me!"  Of course, I don't believe in god, nor do I think I could make myself, but it was that bad.  I've been an atheist for many years and haven't felt anything like this in quite some time.

Mental illness is awful, especially because of the stigma and loss of self-respect that often follow.  For Greydon it's hard enough to be a black atheist.  Once he's well enough to realize what he's done to Brian (and probably his own career), he's going to be in a lot of pain.  I'm with Brian: Let's pray to Jake that Greydon gets the help he needs.

Again: Brian, I'm sorry this happened to you.  Rest well.  What a huge shock to you, both mentally and physically.

Two words: Eric Harris.

Two more words: Ted Bundy

Four more words: WHY WON'T PEOPLE LEARN!?!?

I've already seen that video response Greydon made after his prior arrest. Guess what it's full of? Gloating and contempt. It's not simply a case of remorse: he's glad he did it, h'es glad he got the attention for doing it and he's all so impressed with himself that he can hide behind his amicable smokescreen so well.

He's a clinical sociopath, and it wouldn't take a professional criminal psychologist more than 30 minutes to diagnose him as such. He should be behind bars for the rest of his life, for the safety of everyone around him.

If it were my world, he'd be fertilizer by now, and there'd be no need to worry about it. But that's for another thread...

FWIW: There is no evidence to suggest that cd sales increased as a result of people hating on him in reference to his last arrest (as he suggests in that old video)

He's bipolar, not a sociopath. My brother's bipolar, and he has the same kind of strange behaviour. The giddiness, especially when in bad situations, is typical (from what I understand) and it's more of a coping mechanism. If he goes back on medication (which should be court-ordered) and still doesn't express any kind of remorse, then you're talking about a completely different thing. 

Anyway, I've had that kind of beating bestowed upon me, Brian, so I feel your pain. Of course, in my case, it was a sporting event, so it's not quite the same. I'm with you in hoping Greydon gets the help he needs.

Shouldn't his picture be removed from the banner at the top?

I've also had personal experience with someone, who I at first really cared about, with bipolar disorder. It lasted about 6 months. I know each individual case is a little bit different, however, from my involvement with her I've developed a prejudice. I'm sorry.

If I find out someone is bipolar, I walk away. Goodbye, adiós, see ya, and good luck. I do not ever want to even be in the same room or the same neighborhood, or even talk to a bipolar on the telephone from a different city, medication or not. They are a timebomb. The question is not 'if' but 'when' will they explode.

It was extremely painful to endure.

Perhaps I should list fear of bipolars along with flying as one of my irrational fears in the other thread

Bipolar or any other form of depression does not make you violent against others (it can make you self destructive) and I'm a little concerned that this is giving a bad reputation to suffers

There are a few mental illnesses that can cause violence but in the majority of cases violent people are just bad people.

Sheesh! I had no idea Greydon was hiding this aspect of himself...

Deepest sympathy to you Brian.

My first reaction to the minimal account of what happened was to feel some sympathy for Greydon as a victim of a mental disorder, but as the account has filled out, I find it all but impossible to feel any respect for him.

Seconded. Unfortunate that the Norwegian word for "good" is "god" (drives a bilingual atheist Norwegian nuts, let me tell you). But that fact that it's pronounced "goo" is kind of fun.

Hope you're mending.

Add to "to do" list:

Find a good atheist rapper who does not require medication. 

Now that I know what happened, you can throw my best wishes, thoughts, and prayers to both Jake and the FSM in to the ring too.  Best of luck with the recovery Sapient.

I've never understood why people start refusing to take meds, even if they are artists and their creativity gets affected.  The downside in almost all situations I've come across (including ones that don't end up in situations like this) still don't seem worth it to me yet by the time the person gets back on the meds they've formed other rationalisations which make them not see the real affects that everyone around them sees of being off the meds.  It makes it that much easier for them to convince themself next time to stop taking them etc and turns it in to a recurring circle.  The sooner he gets back on them to realise what he's done the better. 

I hadn't bought any Greydon CD's in the past because the music just isn't my style.  It's something I probably wouldn't even listen to once, so I never bothered with the purchase.  May as well make a donation via another form as I've done via the gold membership.

Our vote is Syqnys.  Proclaim is great as well.  However both artists work harder on their real life careers as opposed to their rap careers.  Proclaim and Syqnys will likely be the biggest winners here.

Now this pisses me off.  Hopefully, he will show remorse if he gets his head on straight, but Jesus! 

Brian, I am SO SORRY. 

Do you get this a lot?

Wow, sorry to hear that Brian.  Hope you make a full recovery. 

Yes, so we have heard in Norway too - in Sweden it's an offense not to accuse a person of being in some way Norwegian.

But seriously folks - for a bunch of so-called atheists I've never seen so many people "praying" for a guy's recovery before. Jake or Jesus - who cares - but aren't we all beyond sending entreaties out into the ether hoping some invisible friend will lend a hand? Either tell the guy you hope he gets well soon, or if it's the Greydon lad tell him he's a piece of worthless crap, but cut the praying out, please. It's causing a stink in here. 

I second your remarks. In my past I interacted with a bipolar person who, too often, didn't take her meds. She was a really good person on the meds, but off the meds she did some horrible stuff (neglected her baby, hurt herself and was violent when she thought she was being provoked). I don't think he is necessarily a bad person and might have a few compounded issues.

Isn't the number one emotion that causes violence in apes the feeling of not being treated fairly, or being cheated, whether it is true or not?

I am not justifying what happened though. I believe he should be held accountable because he made the conscious choice to not take his medications and that resulted in a horrible situation. Hope your healing well brian, I know what it's like to get your face busted up. Been fighting for years and have got many cuts on my face. All of mine healed perfectly though, so I am guessing yours will too. Anyways, goodluck.

You see even atheists can have a mental disorder.  Ever think what atheists would do before meds even existed?  To say someone who flips out to: "Go back on your meds" is a flippant remark that might even aggravate the mentally challenged.

Scientists don't know too much how the brain works in bi-polar cases.  The brain is like a giant DNA computer with neurotransmitters running all along the neurons.  You need an emphathetic individual who understands what a bi-polar person is going through and that takes experience.  Every bi-polar person may be different - different triggers like personal insults can make them flip, some bipolars have "rapid cyclying" in which a person can suddenly flip when everything seems normal.

They bi-polars that I knew didn't take any meds except for illegal drugs.  The hard drugs can make bi-polars go even more crazy, but pot seems to mellow the ones I knew.

I don't even know what a psychologist prescribes nowadays.  It probably won't help much anyways.  The real therapeatic drugs were the psychoactives like LSD, psylocibin back in the 50s-60s where they would give mentally ill patient doses of psychoactives and by anecdotal evidence many have had therapuetic effects.  Here's one story:

I have many experiences I could share that to me are amazing and entertaining, but that is not the reason for what I'm sharing here.
I wish to express the symptomatic relief that mushrooms gave me from depression, social anxiety, panic attacks, manias, and alcoholism. I have spent most of the last 17 years taking trials of medications that psychiatrists prescribed to me with mixed and disastrous results. It was coincidental that acquaintences of mine offered me mushrooms at a party. (I was not taking meds at this time.)

Someone at the party produced a large bag of mushrooms he 'claimed' weighed about 30lbs. He also claimed that he stole them from a biology lab at his local Colorado college where fungicides were being tested. He alleges the growing process made them extremely potent for clinical purposes. The mushrooms were of different sizes and colors. The small baby ones were dark blue and juicy. The large ones were dry like ashes and golden in color with large caps.

That night I was apprehensive, so it took about six beers before I was disinhibited enough to even consider trying the shrooms. The atmosphere was alcohol induced giddiness, and the peer group was of low emotional and intellectual evolution. They prodded me a lot, since I have bad reactions to pot I was scared of getting the paranoias and anxiety, I knew nothing about mushrooms at the time. I did my own literary research afterward. I was definitely curious.

I finally broke down and ate about six of them, some small and some large. I think someone with a scale told me they weighed about 4 to 6 grams total. What followed was the most beautiful experience of my life. I had multi-dimensional visions, and I was tranported to other
places. I heard beautiful music, and felt a strong connection to the other guests, the universe, and some interpretation of 'God' being in me and everywhere around me in different abstract forms.

Needless to say I enjoyed the experience and repeated it again a handful of times over the next year or two. What I find most profound is that the experience changed me on multiple levels in my life while not under the influence of the shrooms. My symptoms of mental illness disappeared for several years afterward. I was constantly full of energy, and I spoke to people I previously would have found unapproachable or uninteresting. I became fully involved with life, and enjoyed things I never would have considered before. I slept normally, had no depression or panic attacks, etc. What is most amazing is this relief lasted long after the sessions ended. I found I did not enjoy sessions where the atmosphere was party like or the people were just trying to get a 'buzz'. I would prefer to retreat with one other person where I could enjoy the experience in a mutually interactive way, or just drift quietly. I don't recall if I ever did a session alone. Another interesting fact is that my concentration improved and I was better at tasks that require careful attention.

I suspect my psycho-illness symptoms result from a mixture of biological predisposition (family history), and post-traumatic childhood violence and sexual abuse. I am just happy to share that mushrooms effectively relieved my suffering without daily taking pills with terrible mental and physical side-effects.

This was about 5 years ago and I haven't had any shrooms since. I have regressed slowly to my previous state, with some degenerative symptoms. I am diagnosed with bipolar affective disorder with rapid cycling, panic disorder, and post traumatic stress. I think the trials of psych-meds have damaged my thought processes and I continue to feel degenerative effects. It is really sad that the war on drugs halted the research of hallucinogens in the field of psychotherapy. I truly believe a medical miracle is being supressed. Can anyone else relate to this?

I am afraid to try eating shrooms again because Paxil and loads of other meds I don't take anymore have left my brain chemistry terribly imbalanced. I am also physically dependent on oxycodone and hydrocodone opoids I take for pain and depression. Are there medical contraindications for mixing these with mushrooms? I am also contemplating getting on Methadone maintenance to balance out the mood swings the pain-pills induce and avoid the withdrawals they cause. If I am making a mistake it is mine to learn.

Good luck to people out there seeking enlightenment through hallucinogens. Maybe we will live to see the day when the war on drugs eases up and medicine will use our planets precious resources to heal our minds and bodies.

http://www.erowid.org/experiences/exp.php?ID=4855

But you see a "real" doctor wouldn't prescribe shrooms for mental disorders.  Yeah medicine that grows on cow shit.

-RR

yo Brian, that's some fucked up shit! I feel for you mang and will always be a proud member of RRS.

Let me know if you want to sell some cds for me...I promise not to attack you over it, word up...

preace bro,

PROCLAIM
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