I really dont know what to say about this. I'm sure the guy will probably get written off and no one will really look into why he flipped out, but I think its pretty telling.

It always gets to me that video games, tv, sex, etc. are so easy to blame for the cause, but no one ever thinks to level the blame at religion. To even publicly blame religion would get you laughed at.  

Quite honestly, from just this one article, it sounds to me like his relatives accused him of molesting a relative and he followed them to church.

I'm a bit baffled that he let all the children go and killed strangers, though.

From the article it's very hard to tell what his motivation was.  He was all over the map.  Like you said, he was pissed at family, but killed strangers. 

If he understands Christian teachings, he may have shown fury at the church when he asked if anyone was willing to die in the place of his hostage.   When I read that, I got a really sick feeling, especially when the situation culminated in the death of the man in question...ugh. The congregation is definitely going to deal with survivors' guilt.  They had a chance to follow the teachings of Jesus and they--quite understandably--were not able to do it.

"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay his life down for his friend." <--one of the many bible verses I memorized as a fundy.  The example of Jesus laying his life down for strangers who didn't deserve it is supposed to be emulated.  Obviously, it isn't. 

I doubt I would have been waving my hand in the air, clamoring to die in place of the hostage.  In that situation, we'd all be pretty stuck, I think. 

If religion played a role, I guess we'll eventually find out.  Regardless, it sounds to me like this man didn't have all his bats in the same belfry.  

It sickens me.  God, I hope I am NEVER put into a situation like that!  

Yeah, I don't get how this is religious.

It doesn't say he's an atheist, or that "Liars" referred to anything in particular.

I know there's that other article that indicated he said something like "what you believe is a lie."  Judging by the distance from the story, and the fact that it's not included in the other stories, I kind of doubt it, but who knows.

As I said in Pineapple's thread, I don't see how this has anything to do with anything.  There are atheists and theists who are fucked in the head.  This dude is fucked in the head.  End of story.

I don't see that this has anything at all to do with the question of whether god exists, or whether religion is a good or bad thing.

And Pineapple, I know you don't see how it's different.  We're happy to claim that Muslims perform honor killings because of religion, and yet we refuse to accept this story as evidence of anything.  I know it seems like a contradiction, but it's not.

Atheism is not a religion.  Atheism is a lack of religion.  People don't do anything because of atheism.  They may have other beliefs that cause them to do bad things, but they don't do them because of atheism.

Bottom line: 

Nobody does anything because of atheism.

Lots of people do things because of religion.

Therefore, religion can be examined in light of what its adherents do, and why they do it, without atheism ever coming into the discussion.  If, on the whole, religion causes more harm than good, then it's a bad thing.

If you'd like to say that it causes more good than harm, you've got a tough road ahead of you.   After all, there is nothing uniquely good about any religion.  People do good things anyway.  There is no evidence that I'm aware of that points to any more altruistic behavior in religious people than in non-religious.  All we have to do, then, is demonstrate that people do bad things because of religion, and the argument is finished.  Religion is bad.

I know.  That's what I just said.

Correct.

Because religion is, pardon me, a two edged sword.  It says, "Do good things because your invisible friend says so."  We would do those things anyway, so it's pretty easy to follow that command, and we just go about feeling good about pleasing our invisible friend.  Religion (Christianity) also tells us to stone homosexuals.  Since it's against the law in our country, very few homosexuals get stoned.  But, in order to feel good about the invisible friend, lots of people try to pass laws discriminating against them, and you get people dragged behind trucks, and beaten up and left for dead.  Granted, some homosexuals would probably get beaten up in a world without religion, but there would simply be no basis for believing that kind of behavior was a good thing.  It would be deviant.  Science tells us that homosexuality is normal.  Science is correct.  Religion tells us that it's a sin.  Religion is wrong.  People believe religion over science because religion encourages us to believe things without proof.

Again, you're missing the point completely.

There are non-religious reasons to do bad things.  And when people do them, we get mad and punish them.  Sometimes they get away with it for a long time, but eventually, someone calls them what they are... bad people.

When people do bad things because of religion, they often believe they're doing good because the religion says so.  Without the religion, at the very least, they'd know they were doing bad.

My mother is a Christian, and she's one of the most kind hearted people I know.  And she thinks homosexuals are evil.  Because the bible tells her so.  I've explained to her that science disagrees with the bible, but she will hear none of it.  Why?  Because of religion.  Without religion, she could have simply done what she does in every other aspect of her life, namely, used logic and science and gotten the correct answer.  Religion stops her from doing this.

Furthermore, we often excuse or condone behavior we think is bad, simply because it's religious behavior.

Without religion, behavior is judged based on logic and science.  It isn't foolproof, but at least the standard is consistent, and there is hope of improvement.

With religion, the truth is whatever the leaders say it is, without regard to the facts, and people believe specifically because of religion.

Shall we return to the topic of this incident?