An introduction

Eloise
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An introduction

Hi everyone at RSS,

I've been around the forums a few days now, and it has occured to me that I might be coming across confusing. I've earned myself a Theist badge pretty early on, and it is accurate, I do think there is a God, what I am concerned about is the confusion other members might have when it starts to emerge that I am neither Christian nor religious in any real sense at all. Already I have had a long conversation with a regular where it seems I have come across as not a 'real theist' at all, so I have decided to lay out a little background information hopefully it will serve as an easy reference for anyone confused or unsure about how to take my position on forum topics.

 First I was raised in Sydney, Australia. My parents are existentalist and advocated logic and ethics as first principles. I am part Native American and part Scottish descent so I was also raised into Native American and Pagan spirituality as well as having been taught the usual Judeo-Christian stories in schools and churches as a young'un. I feel it was a pretty good mix all round in those days the churches were moderate and indoctrination wasn't such a prevalent practice I learned about it, but noone asked me to fear it until I was 17 and had my first encounter with an evangelical christian. To this day I can still recall enjoying pointing out his arrogance and stupidity in damning me to hell as an introduction to his faith.

 I am also a person with a natural affinity for literature and art. This is the elementary cause for my interest in mythology and theology. The only fundamental spiritual tenet I was ever given by my elders to follow was seek concientiously. And I think it was the only best one that anyone could have given me, I followed it, it's basically still all the religion I believe in and I openly shun other kinds. I disdain worship, it is tragic and I think little of ritual, it is blind. I'm well read in various mythologies and spirituality, and I study mathematics chemistry and physics which I love equally. 

On the softer side, the God which I have faith in existing resembles the pantheistic creator God of Native American spirituality most of all. 

And just so you know, I applaud anyone who sticks up for truth and conscience. I'm not here to prosetylise or convert anyone from that cause.

Best to you

Eloise. 


JCE
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Welcome!  Thank you for

Welcome!  Thank you for posting this.  It always helps to understand the viewpoints of other members.  I have not had the opportunity to interact with you in any of the threads yet, but I think your input will be quite welcome here. 

I am a fan of literature and art as well.  I am trying to beef up my science knowledge, but it is hard for me.  What kind of literature and art do you like?  Favorite author?  Favorite artist? 

(Funny - someone actually used the 'no true scotsman' argument against you?  Oh how atheists do love to argue!  LOL)

 


Eloise
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jce wrote:

jce wrote:

Welcome! Thank you for posting this. It always helps to understand the viewpoints of other members. I have not had the opportunity to interact with you in any of the threads yet, but I think your input will be quite welcome here.

I am a fan of literature and art as well. I am trying to beef up my science knowledge, but it is hard for me. What kind of literature and art do you like? Favorite author? Favorite artist?

(Funny - someone actually used the 'no true scotsman' argument against you? Oh how atheists do love to argue! LOL)

 

Actually, sorry no one actually argued the no true scotsman directly with me. It was just sort of indicated when they stopped talking to me, but anyway, I love a debate myself so I can relate.

Literature, I like all kinds; I read, kind of, for the sake of reading. I enjoy poetry and fiction but they're not generally what I read the most. My favourite author can change with the weather depending on what hits the shelves, a couple of enduring preferreds for me are C.S. Lewis, Lewis Carroll (poems mostly), Clive Barker and J.K. Rowling.

Art I am generally more a music lover than anything, a list of favourites would take too long so lets just say a lot, LOL, in other arts I adore Monet.

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Welcome to the hizzle.

Welcome to the hizzle.


Jacob Cordingley
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Welcome Eloise.

Welcome Eloise.


American Atheist
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Welcome.

Welcome.


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Eloise wrote: in other

Eloise wrote:

in other arts I adore Monet.

Ahhhh, Monet!  There's an absolutely gorgeous Monet at the Nelson Atkins Museum here in Kansas City that I'd just love to put in my living room.  You gotta love those Impressionists!

An official welcome to the forums Eloise!  I very much enjoyed your introduction and had to chuckle about your first encounter with an evangelical christian.  (Yeah.  It can get ugly, can't it?)

We're glad you're here.

 

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Eloise, first off I want to

Eloise, first off I want to say that I clearly respect the standpoint of Pantheism. I posted this question in another thread and thought I'd post it hear too as well for someone who's really a Pantheist to answer, what role does agnosticism play in respect to Pantheism?

Slimm,

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"When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called Insanity. When many people suffer from a delusion, it is called Religion." - Robert M. Pirsig,


Eloise
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Slimm wrote:

Slimm wrote:

Eloise, first off I want to say that I clearly respect the standpoint of Pantheism. I posted this question in another thread and thought I'd post it hear too as well for someone who's really a Pantheist to answer, what role does agnosticism play in respect to Pantheism?

Slimm,

Hi Slimm, thanks for the kind words.

To you question, I can only speak for myself and I might not represent any true average, but I'll have a go anyhow.

Pantheism crops up in a few ways, for some its a common thread extractable from all theological literature, for others it's the one exposition of a spiritual creator being that was found in best preserved and uncorrupted theologies. (Monotheistic ones tend to lose out in those stakes but that's no wonder.) From that I suppose myself that a lot of pantheists that choose like this probably have gone through some agnosticism about church gospel on their way, generally I think there is a rejection of church dogma in the history of a pantheist, maybe not always the case but I think it's probably frequent enough to mention.

The basis of pantheism is a connected universe as synchronous entity, so in that sense we are agnostic about specifying a form for the god entity, in pantheism it is represented in all forms through the naturalistic world and pantheists idealise the embracing of life itself as a whole expression of a loving god which leaves us usually contentedly agnostic about the rest because we have the important part already, if a god is revealed then it is revealed in that, because where else could it be revealed.

Addtionally pantheism is fairly agnostic about what a creator God would expect of humans, life itself asks many questions and from a pantheistic point of view all that would be fundamentally required of a human is to give life's questions attention, the equivalency of giving god our attention. There's no need to know any more specific demands than what is put directly in front of you to do your best with; the God of Spinoza doesn't get confused about who he is talking to. Tongue out

Overall pantheism is most agnostic about religious dogma, irrational confusing elements in any exposition of god are unknowable, demands that go against your best nature are unknowable, and whether you're going to live after you die and go to paradise or burn is unknowable too, you can only do your best with what you've got and you can't know that something is right if you know somehow it's not right, so you are agnostic about those things and that is probably the biggest role of agnosticism in pantheism.

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Welcome Eloise! I've seen

Welcome Eloise! I've seen you posting a lot and was really excited to see you wrote an introduction. Very interesting history of yourself and your beliefs. Have you by chance read a book called, The Universe is a Green Dragon? I think, it may be considered a pantheist novel concerning the universe. I thought I'd ask since you may have come across it during your readings. I read it when I was a freshman in college and it was really good! Again many welcomes, and I hope to hear from you soon.

 

The implication that we should put Darwinism on trial overlooks the fact that Darwinism has always been on trial within the scientific community. -- From Finding Darwin's God by Kenneth R. Miller

Chaos and chance don't mean the absence of law and order, but rather the presence of order so complex that it lies beyond our abilities to grasp and describe it. -- From From Certainty to Uncertainty by F. David Peat


I AM GOD AS YOU
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This has been nice, reading

This has been nice, reading Eloise. The A's and P's make a good team, and the progressive Buddhists etc too .....


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Yearh, I'm with I Am God As

Yearh, I'm with I Am God As You on this one. A's and P's and progressive Buddhists for... eh... President? ...s? Or something...

Well I was born an original sinner
I was spawned from original sin
And if I had a dollar bill for all the things I've done
There'd be a mountain of money piled up to my chin


inspectormustard
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Eloise wrote:I am also a

Eloise wrote:

I am also a person with a natural affinity for literature and art. This is the elementary cause for my interest in mythology and theology. The only fundamental spiritual tenet I was ever given by my elders to follow was seek concientiously. And I think it was the only best one that anyone could have given me, I followed it, it's basically still all the religion I believe in and I openly shun other kinds. I disdain worship, it is tragic and I think little of ritual, it is blind. I'm well read in various mythologies and spirituality, and I study mathematics chemistry and physics which I love equally.

There is something to be said for ritual, if nothing else. A ritual may be nothing more than a set of symbols which honor their meaning, and acknowledging this without subterfuge can still be deeply emotional and gratifying. One simple example of this is a toast where well wishers raise their glasses in unison to the subject of speech. A well performed ritual can meet on an intelectual level the heights of emotion possibly only comparable to the physical level of sex. If I could take anything away from religion it would be the emotional aspects of ritual; mysteriousness without the mystery.


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Pow wow

Welcome Eloise,when reading your Intro.it made me wonder if you ever went too a Native American Pow-Wow,or a Native American Arts and Crafts Festival.There is a really good one in New Jersey,The Powhatan Renape Nation, Rankokus Indian Res. every Memorial Day and Labor Day weekend,it's a real eye-opener, Tribes from South America,and Tribes from many of the States,comes together to celebrate and educate, it's a three day event.check out their web page at www.Powhatan.org if your interested

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