The only thing more interesting than a creaitonist appealing to the 2nd law of Thermal Dynamics to defend the falsity of evolution is their intuitive understanding of a system.  I say intuitive since I am not really sure what they mean by system other than they want to claim that the universe is a closed system.  Which to me, who barely passed high school physics with a C, sounds reasonable enough but again, I got a C in physics.  However, i think a very fundamental question is: what the hell is a system?  It seems to me that creationists want to claim that the universe is a closed system and that Natural selection is a closed system (which doesn;t really make sense to me either but I'll get to that later), it seems that, in their understanding of system, that it can apply to any group of objects that have function since the universe has a function, maintain all the objects and processes within it, and natural selection has a function, select benficial adaptations (as well as deselect the non beneficial ones I guess).  This means that any group of objects that has some sort of function can be a system in their view.  So what other group of objects has a function?  A family has a function (or many functions) since a family, not only produces offspring, but maintains and helps offspring function as well as having other functions within a larger system known as society.  Here is what this means.  When offspring from one family mates with offspring from another family, new information is introduced into the original family since the offspring from the different family is coming from an entirely different system.  What this means now is, even within a closed system, there can be an indefinite amount of open systems which can recieve new information from outside sources.  This also means, that with their own logic, natural selection must also be an open system since natural slection relies on families intermigling gaining or losing information in order for it to function properly.  Of course, can natural selection really be a system?  It is a process no question but does a process necessitate it being a system?  Its not like a family, in which, there is a definate product, offspring.  Nor does natural selection really dictate what offsrping must do, rather the offspring, as well as the enviornment, can effect natural selection.  Furthermore, its not like any offspring can stop the production of natural selection just as there are various things that can stop the production of a family such as infertility or death.  Anyhoo, aside from totally showing my lack of understanding of what a system is as well as the laws of thermal dynamics, the overall point is to show their lack of knlowedge of what a system is since, using princibles based on their understanding of the 2nd law od thermal dynamics, i showed how there can be numerous open systems within a closed system, thus, making their claim of "no new information can be gained" dubious since this depends on conditions of the system we are talking about.  For example, a family that inbreeds would be a closed system but this causes many problems since, well, no new information is gains, rather the same information is reddestributed creating a higher chance of getting deleterious traits.  So, it would seem that the universe, as a whole woudl require open systems to create variety.  Any thoguhts, questions, or corrections?