Should everything be scrutinized?

Technarch
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Should everything be scrutinized?

There are things that can be dismissed, and things that can be disproven. Some of the things that can be dismissed cannot always be disproven, as they lack anything testable or verifiable. For example, a child says that a dinosaur walked by three minutes ago. You could ignore him until he gets tired of trying to convince you, you could make a realistic statement in hopes that it will stop him from talking (dinosaurs died out years ago), or you could go the excessive route and provide detailed research data proving that no large creature left any evidence of travelling in the area within the last three minutes, including witness reports and traffic data. The last option is a decision of whether or not effort should be placed in something that can easily be dismissed. By putting an unrealistic statement into the same playing field as realistic scrutiny, it becomes treated like it's legitimate to a certain extent. The person making the claims can then come up with their own "evidence" or new claims and continue to believe them, making their lies stronger when challenged instead of being forgotten. On the other hand, too much of these untended and uncontrolled lies can cause a memetic effect, becoming part of culture as a set of irrational beliefs. So which deserve intense scientific criticism to refute every last detail, and which don't? Are there some you consider "mostly harmless" or should everything irrational be criticized and challenged?

New Age spirituality, Wicca, Paganism, Laveyan Satanism, Astral Projection, Kabbalah, Hermeticism/Rosicrucianism/Alchemy, Shamanism, Cargo cults, UFOs, Bigfoot, Snake handling, Cults, Scientology, Landmark Education, Ramtha's School of Enlightenment, Get rich quick schemes, business and financial scams, books and videos with false claims on health, business or nutrition, unproven alternative medicine, unproven medical products or procedures, unproven herbal and alternative supplements, conspiracy theories about New World Order, Illuminati, Freemasonry, Satanic cults, Jewish media/political/bank control, racist conspiracy theories, Holocaust denial, AIDS conspiracies, 9/11 conspiracies, Fortune telling, tarot, psychics, phone psychics, palm reading, astrology, newspaper astrology, chinese astrology, spiritual mediums, past lives psychics, psychic consultants, hypnotherapists, feng shui, quantum touch, faith healing, Chakras, Rastafarianism, Hare Krishna, Hinduism, Mormonism, Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, Baha'i, Shinto, Sikhism, Jainism, local superstitions, superstitious beliefs, superstitious practices, superstitious social customs, superstitious laws, laws based on religious beliefs, folk beliefs, folk religions, tribal religions and spiritual beliefs, pseudoscience, biblical science, young Earth and creationism.

Anything else you'd add? Chiropractors are considered pseudoscience by some. Acupuncture and acupressure seem to work in some studies, and so do some herbs and alternative medicines. In this case scientific scrutiny would be a good thing. But then there are unfounded beliefs in altering chi, blood alkalinity, or exaggerated scientific studies to make untrue statements about effectiveness. Then there are products that are claimed to work beyond the current understanding of science, or are "waiting" to be proven, or claim to be part of large coverup/conspiracy that suppresses their effectiveness. Ionic water, ionized silver, magnet therapy, cancer and aids "cures." With some products, faith is more important to selling than science.


Hambydammit
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I just don't think this

I just don't think this question is worth scrutiny.

(sorry.  Couldn't resist.)

 

Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin

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xamination
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I think that all beliefs are

I think that all beliefs are mostly harmless, so I didn't take a very close look at the list.  Usually it is not the belief that is the problem, it is the way people act on it.

I hope that when the world comes to an end I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to.


shikko
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xamination wrote: I think

xamination wrote:
I think that all beliefs are mostly harmless, so I didn't take a very close look at the list. Usually it is not the belief that is the problem, it is the way people act on it.

Not true; some of that stuff can be actually harmful. Alchemy, snake-handling, and unproven medical claims can actually kill people. Any of the other scams (Landmark, scientology, MLM/get-rick-quick, etc.) harm you indirectly through fraud.

As an aside, the phrase "alternative medicine" is a huge pet peeve for me. If it has been proven to work in a randomized, double-blind study, it's not alternative; it's medicine. If it hasn't, it's unsubstantiated claims at best and quackery at worst.

Herbalism is sort of in the middle. Some hugely powerful drugs can be found in plants, but that does not make herbalism as a whole useful.

I'd add homeopathy to your list (unless I missed it) as being in both categories above: fraudulent and potentially fatal. I'd also add "colon therapy" as well in the fraud section, with bonus points for humour potential.

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xamination
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shikko wrote: xamination

shikko wrote:
xamination wrote:
I think that all beliefs are mostly harmless, so I didn't take a very close look at the list. Usually it is not the belief that is the problem, it is the way people act on it.

Not true; some of that stuff can be actually harmful. Alchemy, snake-handling, and unproven medical claims can actually kill people. Any of the other scams (Landmark, scientology, MLM/get-rick-quick, etc.) harm you indirectly through fraud.

Yes, there are certain things that are harmful to the believer, but these are all done voluntarily.  So if you are a snake-handler and get bit, it just proves your belief wrong and probably kills you.  

 And lets be honest: who actaully believes in Scientology?

I hope that when the world comes to an end I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to.


CrimsonEdge
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xamination wrote: And lets

xamination wrote:
And lets be honest: who actaully believes in Scientology?

Tom Cruise. 


ParanoidAgnostic
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I sometimes think that

I sometimes think that debating with creationsts has the nasty side-effect of implying that their ideas are worthy of debate. By going to and effort to disproove their claims we unintentionally add credibility to them. At the very least it gives them the ability to say "There's still debate on the subject".

Maybe we should run some public debates on the existence of the flying spaghetti monster. They would show that even if you debate something ridiculous it's still ridiculous... Or we could really screw up and create real pastafarians.

Oh, a lesson in not changing history from Mr. I'm-My-Own-Grandpa!


Technarch
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That's what I'm saying, are

That's what I'm saying, are there certain things that are irrational but best left to being irrational?  Would you leave newspaper astrology alone for being relatively harmless, or would you put the effort into debunking it, and if you did, would it only indirectly legitimize in some way?  Are certain things not worth debunking for this reason, or would you debunk everything irrational?