Denying the Holy Spirit pisses people off (videos of dissent)

MattShizzle
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Denying the Holy Spirit pisses people off (videos of dissent)

I'm actually surprised how pissed off people get. Some of the comments on the videos for one thing. I also put a link to mine on another site and someone said it was the most offensive thing she ever saw in her life! Shocked

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hethsixoespa wrote:A website

hethsixoespa wrote:
A website such as this does not communitcate a desire to be left alone, but rather to stimulate discussion, which is a good thing.

You're right. We don't want people to be left alone. We don't want people to stop trying to convince others of their position, if we wanted that we'd have no teachers and people willing to impart wisdom on to others. We want people to have proof for the things they'd want others to believe. Christians don't annoy me because they preach, they annoy me because they think I'll be dumb enough to fall for their patently ridiculous claims.

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hethsixoespa

hethsixoespa wrote:
Martha-

What I meant was that if Jeremiah Smith does not want to be preached at, it would be better to not say anything which would stimulate such a response. However I do not believe that anyone should keep quiet and that being preached at is a natural consequence of disagreeing with most people about most things. It isn't necessarily a negative thing to encounter.

And if you want Christians to leave you alone, then live peacably in your belief as Christians do who want to be left alone. A website such as this does not communitcate a desire to be left alone, but rather to stimulate discussion, which is a good thing.

No offense intended.

hethsixoespa,

First, I like your parakeet.

Second, if the religious would keep their beliefs in their churches and homes, we wouldn't need to be out here expressing our views. Unfortunately, the religious feel the need to knock uninvited on our doors, get into our government and attempt to get into our lives.

We have a president who claims god told him to invade Iraq. Sam Harris said it well:

http://www.slumdance.com/blogs/brian_flemming/archives/002304.html

We have the religious trying to control women's bodies. We have the Jehovan's Witnesses knocking on our doors. We have the religious flying airplanes into buildings. We have the religious trying to pass morality laws.

Being "preached at" is not a natural consequence of disagreeing with most people about most things. People don't preach in disagreements about politics, art, music, books to read, what television program to watch or how much time to spend on web forums.

Being "preached at" is a consequence of having opposing views about religion. Please note that I didn't say "expressing opposing views" to that person. If you read some of the other threads in this forum, you will see examples of messages we have received from people that contacted us out of the blue.

If religion were kept in churches and homes, the Rational Response Squad wouldn't be so very necessary.

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Sapient
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More rationalizations on why

More rationalizations on why you can't deny the holy spirit, a look into the mind of someone who will believe the impossible and also denies the existence of dictionaries... (which define deny differently then him)...

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Anybody else see this: The

Anybody else see this:

The DVD offer is a scam

The video features snopes.com, but when I searched snopes for the article, I came up with nothing. Anyone know what's up with it?

Shaun

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ShaunPhilly wrote:Anybody

ShaunPhilly wrote:
Anybody else see this:

The DVD offer is a scam

The video features snopes.com, but when I searched snopes for the article, I came up with nothing. Anyone know what's up with it?

Shaun

The level of dishonesty in theists never ceases to amaze me.

Flag his video as inappropriate for committing libel. (Libel is against Youtube TOS)

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hethsixoespa
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To all who responded to my last post...

Indeed it is hard to avoid those who oppose your views no matter what you believe and considering such everyone should be well versed in what they believe so as to be able to defend it if they feel necessary.

Indeed religion has caused much upset in the world throughout history and for most of it I would not attempt to justify, especially what I hear from those who would claim to be a fellow Christian with me.

To Susan,it's actually a Sun Conure, a small species of Parrot...and he is a very good pet, but if you like birds and would consider getting one, make sure you don't mind being able to hear him yell from across the street.

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ImmaculateDeception- Perhaps

ImmaculateDeception-

Perhaps your interpretation is correct, but also notice that I did not advocate that.

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hethsixoespa

hethsixoespa wrote:
ImmaculateDeception-

Perhaps your interpretation is correct, but also notice that I did not advocate that.

True enough, you said that explicitly after all. I was just pointing out why most people around here don't typically follow that kind of mindset.

Jesus died for somebody's sins, but not mine


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At another site, I spent a

At another site, I spent a lot of time answering those same stupid arguments. I also got sick of Christian catch-phrases I'd heard my entire life. Don't they understand I spent the first eighteen years of my life in a fundamentalist bubble? I can tell them I used to be a fundy Christian and that nothing they say is new to me, but it falls on deaf ears.

My biggest pet peeve: "Christianity isn't a religion; it's a personal relationship with Jesus Christ."

Oh yes? And when was the last time you invited Jesus over for dinner and a movie. Did he like the movie? What did he have to say about the theme, the acting, the plot? What was he wearing?

How can somebody invisible and unprovable be a personal friend? As Dawkins pointed out in his book, it is remarkably akin to children having invisible friends. The fact that grown-ups still believe this shit is patently embarrassing.

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Iruka Naminori
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Is that a baby sun conure or a baby jenday? :)

I used to raise parrots--African greys and Senegals, specifically. I've had my current pet, a double yellowhead, for almost twenty years. Smiling

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Iruka Naminori
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Sapient wrote:It's offensive

Sapient wrote:
It's offensive if we don't speak up. If we don't speak up we let our fellow man be governed myth, that's offensive and obscene to me.

Hi Sapient,

I met you on video chat about a week ago or so. I'm sure you have addressed the issue elsewhere, but I'm wondering if you could answer my post concerning the biggest obstacle to deconversion in the Freethinking Anonymous forum. (Of course I'd like for others to contribute as well.)

My counselor (yes, I have one) keeps asking this question and I'm not sure what to tell her. She notes that it has been one helluva rocky ride for me. Yes, it has. I was willing to give up everything and follow the truth. The fact that friends and family can turn their backs on you when you deconvert is a HUGE obstacle to your (our?) cause.

I'm still deciding how active I want to be and how I want to approach the issue of supernatural belief in others. "Live and let live" doesn't seem to work, yet I'm not convinced that direct confrontation is necessarily the best way, either.

I'm currently watching Beyond Belief, 2006 to get various opinions on the issue. (And no, I don't care about the opinions of theists on this issue. Sorry, theists.) Krauss and Shermer (is that how you spell it?) think direct confrontation is not the way to go. They say that you should, instead, focus on what is true and teach it passionately.

I'm passionate about natural history because I was deprived of a decent scientific education. I love paleontology and get excited by new fossil finds and questions like "What caused the Permian extinction?" When my extreme right-wing fundy mother visits, I often find myself talking about my latest learning experience. For example, I wondered what fossil is most representative of the common ancestor of birds and mammals. My parrot likely descended from small theropod dinosaurs, yet we share many things in common (convergent evolution): endothermia, a four-chambered heart and (I believe) similar emotions and ways of viewing the world (see Dr. Irene Pepperberg's work with Alex the African grey parrot). I was curious as to how many years of evolution separates us.

Someone on another forum gave me a link to "amniotes." These creatures lived 300 million years ago. They were lizard-like, yet laid eggs without a shell like amphibians. Cool, huh? It's amazing that such a primitive creature could be representative of the ancestor of both my parrot and me.

When I excitedly told my mother about amniotes, she did what she always does. She shut off. It doesn't mesh with her creationist world view, so she refuses to participate in the conversation. To be fair, when she starts in about church, I do the same thing. She recently told me that recent church services were entitled: "The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Universe." I love Douglas Adams, but I just HAD to point out that Adams (author of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy was an ardent atheist.

It appears we fail to have a meeting of meanings. Sad Most of the time we can only talk about things that interest neither of us. How shallow. How BORING.

And yes, I've flown off on a tangent and written far too much, so let me ask again:

What can we offer to religionists to replace their world view and give them meaning?

Does each person have to find his or her own meaning? It would seem to follow that freethinking would lead to free meaning. Still, we certainly don't offer group harmony, a social life and life after death. I would argue that the first two are attainable, but I'm simply not sure how to offer them for everybody. Life after death has a huge allure. It doesn't make it true, but religionists cling to it like a life raft. I am not sure how to ease their fears.

Okay, I'm shutting up now. Smiling

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I'm very busy today and will

I'm very busy today and will be through January 1st, so for the most part I'll be keeping my posts short. I will try to weigh in on your other thread if I see something. I just wanted to give you some food for thought here....

Iruka Naminori wrote:

I'm currently watching Beyond Belief, 2006 to get various opinions on the issue. (And no, I don't care about the opinions of theists on this issue. Sorry, theists.) Krauss and Shermer (is that how you spell it?) think direct confrontation is not the way to go. They say that you should, instead, focus on what is true and teach it passionately.

There is a common ground among Shermer and Harris, and that is simply: the need to speak up. So with that said I think you should make sure that at the minimum, you speak up even if it's the non-confrontational type. I think it is important for me to note, that the non-confrontational style of Shermer is extremely important in the discussion about science and religion. I've said this in the show, but imagine he's the good cop and we're the bad cop. I see theists as generally unwilling to change their beliefs, if simple non confrontational reasoning was good enough to steer people away from religion, then religion wouldn't exist today. So as I see it, there is a truth, a truth that Shermer offers that many theists are unwilling to accept. Here is where I see the Dawkins, Harris, and RRSs of the world playing a role. Imagine a pill of truth, Shermer has the pill but the theist is unwilling to accept the pill because he already knows the truth: God exists. Well Dawkins and I are here to take that pill and shove it down your throat, we're here to use blunt almost insultive (yet true) language that makes you realize that there may be some need to research further. Sure you may be turned off by our tactics but we make a lasting impression. Essentially, Dawkins and I have taken the pill of truth and lodged it in your throat. It's stuck, you can't get it out, and it's not going anywhere, you still are a theist. Now along comes Shermer with his glass of water. He's pure, polite, kind, and would not say anything of an insultive nature to your face, he makes the pill easy to swallow. It's my opinion however that the Shermers of the world (which could be you should you choose) would be much less effective without RRS, Dawkins, Harris, etc. The theist would not need to swallow the pill with your water, as the theist wouldn't even have the pill in his/her mouth.

Again, don't forget, the common ground amongst Shermer and I is that we both speak up, don't forget that. FWIW, Shermer called certain beliefs of theists "moronic" at a lecture in Philly I attended. When I asked him how that coincides with his kid gloves technique, he noted that he was amongst friends, and didn't feel the need to be as polite with his language.

Personally what I find works best is a combination of both methods and knowing when to use them. Someone who says to you "I've been considering giving up my religion" is not someone who you want to shove a pill down their throat, and I'd be an idiot for trying to do so. They are saying to you, "hey I found this pill, could you help me swallow it." Know who you're talking to, and adapt accordingly. The trick is to remain consistent in what you think and say, even if you engage in varying degrees of civility.

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Way to go!

Way to go!


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My response to Marcus at

My response to Marcus at Transplant Ministries:

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Thank you, Sapient. I have

Thank you, Sapient. I have been giving this a lot of thought.

Even when I was a Christian I didn't like to evangelize; however, I am really pissed off at the way Christians treat atheists. Right now Dawkins and Harris sound pretty good to me because I imagine forcing certain closed-minded Christians to listen to them and read their books. Smiling I guess I've been in a "that's the last straw" sort of mood for the past few years due to personal and political pressures.

At the same time, I don't want to go off on some kind of tangent, so I'm trying to digest all sides of the atheist argument. (Like I said, I don't give a rip what the theists think. Smiling )

Thanks for your input. I must think about this for awhile.

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Great video! I love how you

Great video! I love how you pointed out that Marcus technically comitted the unforgiviable sin and if Christianity is correct, he's going to hell, too! Laughing out loud

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MattShizzle wrote:Great

MattShizzle wrote:
Great video! I love how you pointed out that Marcus technically comitted the unforgiviable sin and if Christianity is correct, he's going to hell, too! :lol:

Yeah, that totally kicked ass. However, I wonder if Marcus slept well after watching. When I was about 12, I thought I had committed the unforgivable sin in my thoughts and I totally freaked. I guess what really gets me is that we are expected to worship such a capricious being. It's totally nuts. It's a damn good thing the Holy Spirit doesn't exist. Whoops. I did it again, didn't I? Smiling

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30 seconds in I was writing

30 seconds in I was writing this atheist a comment about how he'd had been brainwashed by Christians who rationalized incorrectly how to blaspheme the holy spirit and I come to find out he was a Christian. His logic was shitty from square one. For those who don't know the website he's promoting is known for being crap amongst Infidel Guy fans.

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Even though her prayers will

Even though her prayers will do nothing, she'll be praying to god to make him change his perfect word so that unforgivable sins can be forgiven:

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Sapient wrote:Even though

Sapient wrote:
Even though her prayers will do nothing, she'll be praying to god to make him change his perfect word so that unforgivable sins can be forgiven:

Shame. To quote J.G. Thirlwell, in "Heuldoch #7B": "Why are the pretty ones always insane?"

Götter sind für Arten, die sich selbst verraten -- in den Glauben flüchten um sich hinzurichten. Menschen brauchen Götter um sich zu verletzen, um sich zu vernichten -- das sind wir.


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Sapient wrote:30 seconds in

Sapient wrote:
30 seconds in I was writing this atheist a comment about how he'd had been brainwashed by Christians who rationalized incorrectly how to blaspheme the holy spirit and I come to find out he was a Christian. His logic was shitty from square one.

I agree with you Sapient. This was Way out there.

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Iruka- Greetings fellow bird

Iruka-

Greetings fellow bird lover.

Having a relationship with God is more simple than you think. First of all, having a relationship with anyone doesn't imply that you see them, like being friends with someone across the country or the world. You can maintain communication with anyone, never see them, and still have a close relationship with them. The key to a relationship is love and communication. Not just romantic love, but brotherly love, or perhaps family love...and communication is what maintains a relationship. It's that simple. I can have a personal relationship with God by loving Him, as He also loves us, and by communicating with Him, i.e. prayer.

Hethsixoespa; To learn you must love discipline, it is stupid to hate correction.


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Please, we don't believe in

Please, we don't believe in bullshit!


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VioletKitty responds to the

VioletKitty responds to the Blasphemy Challenge! lol For those who don't know as far as we can tell Violet Kitty is the only person in the history of the world who has ever had an atheist jihad declared on them.

Captain Awesome declares atheist jihad on Violet Kitty from



Violet Kitty responds to the Blasphemy Challenge with this video, would someone please explain pascals wager to her. In fact someone on behalf of the RRS should just make a thorough video on pascals wager for us to post in the future:



Violet Kitty claims to be standing up for the non existent Christ (re: blasphemy challenge)

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"It grieves me"

"It grieves me"

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Is this a rational response?

By questioning the very basis of this project I realize that I will probably be flamed, and piss some people off on here, but oh well; I’m a philosophy student, it’s generally what I do. I recently saw on the news, and littered throughout the internet community what is called a “blasphemy challenge“, presented by those who claim to be members of a “Rational Response Squad”. The idea of the challenge is to “commit the ultimate sin” and blaspheme or deny the holy spirit publicly on a website to get a free copy of Brian Flemming‘s DVD “The God Who Wasn‘t There“.

Most videos that I have had the patience to watch contain an atheist individual saying something like “I (insert name), in response to the blasphemy challenge by the Rational Response Squad deny the Holy Spirit”. Sometimes there is a bit more, perhaps adding “and I am not afraid” at the end or “through rational deduction I have concluded there is no holy spirit, but generally these types of videos are the videos I’m seeing. The videos usually contain the following: introduction, simple denial of the Holy Spirit, and that individual expecting a free DVD. Now, rationality is a difficult thing to pin down in the field of epistemology, but generally rationalists commit themselves to the claim that philosophically or epistemically you ought to have good reasons for your beliefs, which can be, and are usually stated. If statements are made like “I deny the holy spirit” without any good reasons presented then philosophically and epistemically that is not a rational response. One can rationally conclude, if I may, that the mere denial of the Holy Spirit is not a rational response, nor is it a good philosophical response.

The “Rational Response Squad” asks an atheist to merely deny the Holy Spirit that is all. The challenge is to get several people to deny the Holy Spirit, not present good reasons for that denial. During this challenge the Rational Response Squad encourages everyone to participate, from little children to the elderly. Now I’m not entirely sure what Flemming or the Rational Response Squad desires in doing this challenge, perhaps it’s to annoy Christians, perhaps it’s propaganda, the latter of which may be interesting to continue to think about.

Reason has always been presented as the “good way of thinking”, in all cases of violence reason and rationality has played some part, violence is always a sufficient solution to a more complex problem. While religion may be responsible for many deaths, it seems to me what is frequently called “reason” or we describe as reason is present in every war, murder, and execution in the west. What has been called “reason” also seems to share what I thoroughly detest about religion: in the words of John Raulston Saul reason is “A narrow system swollen into ideology. With time and power it has become a dogma, devoid of direction and disguised as disinterested inquiry. Like most religions, reason presents itself as the solution to the problems it has created.”

I actually have a copy of Flemmings DVD, and the reasoning and conclusion is questionable. The basic thesis seems to be that Jesus, the man in history, did not exist. This does not seem to be a very good video because the thesis rests upon the declaration that there is no real sufficient evidence that he did exist, and basically denying what scholars have often thought to be evidence for Jesus as evidence. Logically speaking this is incredibly fallacious; having no evidence and saying it is evidence does not lead to a good conclusion in any argument and is not a good rational argument. The thesis in general has been debated for a few years and recently been discarded by most scholars as a scholarly dead end, and some would say the thesis rests upon an error in reasoning by committing a fallacy known as the argument from ignorance. Perhaps this is why Flemming is giving away his DVD’s (that was a joke by the way).

So to conclude, I wish to encourage the individuals on this site to do several things. First, ask yourself whether responding to the blasphemy challenge is really a rational response to Christians. Second, question everything a person who espouses the best “Rational” conclusion. In several cases the "rational" conclusion is merely propaganda: reason and what is rational, or what counts as sufficient evidence is not clearly defined by that individual, nor is it a good rational response to just call their position the “real rational” position or say "through logical deduction I have concluded..." and leave it at that. Last I wish to encourage everyone to respond rationally to Christians: in other words give good reasons and arguments for your conclusions!


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Drummermonkey, I could

Drummermonkey, I could respond to what you said but due to lack of time to enter any lengthy discussion I have hopes that someone else will. And I do hope that you aren't flamed.

I will however ask you one question and based on your answer may have a follow up, I do hope you answer honestly and without a creative dodge of the question. My question is simple... do you believe in a god, if so which one?

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Good question Sapient,

Good question Sapient, indeed it is also a simple question, but the answer is not all together easy to give so I hope this will satisfy your curiosity. The question is: do I believe in god, and if so which one? The idea behind the question, I take it, is: where hermeneutically do I speak from? What is my own position? Philosophically I am primarily concerned with phenomenological and epistemological claims about belief in god or lack there of. In laymen’s terms I consider myself a philosopher of and about religion. Religiously I would say I am of the Judeo-Christian tradition with the following “proviso” given by Richard Kearney in “The God Who May Be”: “…where this tradition.. offends [love and justice], I prefer to call myself religious in the sense of seeking God in a way that neither excludes other religions nor purports to possess the final truth. And where the religious so offends, I would call myself a seeker of love and justice tout court.”


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that's it. I'm going out to

that's it. I'm going out to buy a webcam tomorrow so I can do this. (the bank isn't open today, and I've lost my bankcard, otherwise I would do it today)


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drummermonkey wrote: I would

drummermonkey wrote:
I would say I am of the Judeo-Christian tradition with the following “proviso...”

My follow up question would be: Can you defend belief in god through reasoning as logically justifiable and tenable? And if so, how?

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MattShizzle wrote:Fuck

MattShizzle wrote:
Fuck religion!

Listen mother fucker. You must be pollitically correct! YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO OFFEND ANYONE! (Meek voice follows) mother fucker...

We cant offend anyone:

Atheists
Jews
Blacks
gays
Muslims
Christians
Asians
Mexicans

ALL OFF LIMITS! YOU HEAR ME!

Freedom of speech means we say nice things about them and they can say all the mean things about us they want!

M-kay? Do we have an understanding?

All the crybabies might have to take responsibility for their own self esteem. We wouldn't want that now would we?

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As a philosopher myself

As a philosopher myself (having earned my MA three years ago), I can appreciate your points, drummermonkey.

I think that people don't try and justify, rationally, their blasphemy in the short videos because that was not the point of the challenge. IF people want to know why we deny the Holy Spirit, or gods in general, they can follow the breadcrumbs and read our reasons here. The challenge is simply to declare publicly that we are not worth trying to convert now since we're damned, that we truly do not believe (many theists refuse to accept that we actually lack belief), and show that we are sure enough about what we lack belief in to stand up and show people that we really mean it, and perhaps we are sure for a reason.

Per your points abut the historicity of Jesus, I can say that I don't tend to accept propositions that don't have sufficient evidence. To me, it really doesn't matter if Jesus really lived, but I am not convinced that he did. It's possible that he really did exist despite lack of evidence, but if that were the case, then what the New Testament claims would almost surely be false. Someone who did something that important would have some record from historians. Anyway, there are already threads about that topic, so I'll leave it alone here.

My justification for my lack of belief in any god is the utter lack of evidence for, lack of explanatory power of, and (in many cases) the logical impossibility of gods. I could just say "sure, there's a god." But if I did that I would not be adding anything to my understanding of the world nor explaining anything. God is a hypothetical being that does not stand up to scrutiny. If it gives people comfort, that does not lend credibility to its truth.

As a philosopher, I'm interested in truth. There is simply no reason to believe that the god hypothesis is true. That is, even if religion and theism hurt nobody and instead only helped people, I would still be interested in the truth of the matter.

As Sapient asked, do you have any reason to believe god exists? Because, if god did exist, I'd want to know.

Shaun

I'll fight for a person's right to speak so long as that person will, in return, fight to allow me to challenge their opinions and ridicule them as the content of their ideas merit.


Sapient
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More thoughts against the

More thoughts against the Blasphemy Challenge from a youth pastor. Looking for a defense of our non-belief (much like DrummerMonkey)

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OK, who else did that

OK, who else did that redneck "Traditional American" send his dumb "Hey Atheists" video to?


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Someone likes to rationalize

Someone likes to rationalize the irrational:

So an unforgivable sin is forgivable? Got it.

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Sapient wrote:Someone likes

Sapient wrote:
Someone likes to rationalize the irrational:
...

So an unforgivable sin is forgivable? Got it.

I like the fact that he thinks the Blasphemy Challenge participants are trying to be "naughty and wicked" and trying to go to hell. ROTF
The fact is, noone's doing it to be a rebel, like "Oooh, take THAT holy spirit, booya!"
Laughing out loud


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"You can believe what you

"You can believe what you want to believe and that's ok. (I'm smart enough, etc. and gosh darnit, people like me)." Is he related to Stewart Smalley? :ROTF:


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See anything about

See anything about needing to believe in God to show a lack of reverence or contempt? I don't. Leave it up to a Christian to redefine a word to their liking. What does it matter anyway? Nonbelievers are going to hell because (the character of) gods ego can't take it.

Merriam-Webster's Dictionary
Main Entry: blas·phe·my
Pronunciation: 'blas-f&-mE
Function: noun
Inflected Form: plural -mies

1. insulting or showing contempt or lack of reverence for God or a religion and its doctrines and writings and esp. God as perceived by Christianity and Christian doctrines and writings

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Sapient wrote: See anything

Sapient wrote:

See anything about needing to believe in God to show a lack of reverence or contempt? I don't. Leave it up to a Christian to redefine a word to their liking. What does it matter anyway? Nonbelievers are going to hell because (the character of) gods ego can't take it.

She also disregards the fact that many people taking the challenge DID lead christian lives beforehand. They were believers. SO, according to her, they ARE blasphemers.


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Two semi relatied things

Two semi relatied things from with in this thread:

One: Atheist Jihad 2

Two: I plan on going through this list on YouTube. At least one released each day starting when ever I get that camcorder.


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"Don't go down the secular

"Don't go down the secular road, that's what the illuminati want."

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Sapient wrote:"Don't go down

Sapient wrote:
"Don't go down the secular road, that's what the illuminati want."

Hahaha. The illuminati... what's next? The jews secertly run the world?
I wonder what he means when he says "spiritual war", that was kinda scary.


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Jonathan

Jonathan wrote:
Exactly.

Huh?

If it is not an act of blasphemy for someone who finds god to be a work of fiction, then why are the followers of claimed deity far to ready to call us names and demonize us?

BECAUSE THEY DO BELIEVE that we will go to hell and THEY DO BELIEVE that. We never claimed we did.

It is so typical of the theist when called on something to dodge. If one wants to claim that some people have that interpretation I cant argue that. But others do see what we do as blaspheming and do use their claims of what they think their deity would do to us and demonize us and threaten us with what they believe.

Saying that all christians are not using the same in interpretation is a NO DUH. But to claim that it is not blasphemy because you dont think it can be is discounting the people who do think it can be.If those people who think it IS blasphemy can vote and put people in office who DO think it is, that affects my life. So it is important to us to point out that there ARE BLEIVERS that threaten us with hell because THEY not us, think WE ARE blaspheming.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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hethsixoespa

hethsixoespa wrote:
Iruka-

Greetings fellow bird lover.

Having a relationship with God is more simple than you think. First of all, having a relationship with anyone doesn't imply that you see them, like being friends with someone across the country or the world. You can maintain communication with anyone, never see them, and still have a close relationship with them. The key to a relationship is love and communication. Not just romantic love, but brotherly love, or perhaps family love...and communication is what maintains a relationship. It's that simple. I can have a personal relationship with God by loving Him, as He also loves us, and by communicating with Him, i.e. prayer.

Hi, Hethsixoespa.

How old is your sunny? I bet he's changed since that picture. For everyone who isn't familiar with parrots, that sun conure is a baby that hasn't yet molted into his extra-gorgeous adult plumage. Even after he acquires his "adult plumage," he'll still be a baby for awhile. Smiling

Come August, I will have had my Amazon parrot for twenty years. When I first got him, I was still a Christian attending a Christian university. I named him "Gabriel" after the archangel..."Gabby" for short. I taught him how to say, "Hallelujah" and sing the first line of "Jesus Loves Me." Thank the God Who Isn't There he's long since dropped that crap from his repertoire! Smiling

I'm sorry to have to be the one to tell you this, Hethsixoespa, but when you communicate with "God," there isn't anyone on the other end of the line. What you're doing is communicating with a part of yourself. In The Varieties of Religious Experience, William James pointed out that all religions have an experience similar to what you feel when you communicate with God. In fact, even those who don't believe in a god can recreate the experience with a little bit of practice. I'm currently thinking of delving into Buddhist and Taoist meditation--sans superstition--to recreate the "altered reality" experience of the years when I believed in Jesus.

When I was just a little kid, a sense of wonder came over me when I thought about Santa Claus, his elves and the wonderful presents that came on Christmas Day. It was a "religious" feeling, but it certainly didn't make Santa Claus real. The truth is, there is absolutely no good reason to believe in a personal god. His existence is about as likely as the existence of Santa Claus. The only difference is that adults persist in the delusion of god, whereas they cast aside the delusion of Santa. The Greeks believed just as strongly in their gods as you do in yours, but no one believes in Zeus, Apollo and Athena anymore. The same thing will inevitably happen with Jesus. I just hope we make it through our delusional phase alive. I also hope we don't replace Jesus, YHWH and Allah with yet another delusion...ACK!

Think about your religious experiences. There is nothing you can point to outside yourself to prove the existence of your invisible friend. Think about the people you are talking to on this forum. Most of us grew up believing in and talking to Jesus, only to realize that no one was listening.

Once you're ready to admit this possibility to yourself (yes, it can be very scary!), you'll have real atheists to talk to about it, right here at rationalresponders.com. I had absolutely no one, but I was still able to think my way out of the delusion. It can be hard, but as Carl Sagan said, "It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."

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oh dear Jesus, that young

oh dear Jesus, that young man from Colorado is simply scary.


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Iruka- My sun is about 11

Iruka-

My sun is about 11 months old now, we just got him last spring. And yes, that is a young picture of him, he is quite a bit more colorful now, and getting even more so. We named him Idgie, for no particular reason, and the only thing he can say yet is "up up", that we can understand anyway. We also have a 12 year old cockitiel and a 13 year old love bird. I love birds. I thought you might have been an amazon owner when I saw your little picture. They are quite the characters, I know of one who is 29 and can say all kinds of things and impersonate noises.

As to the rest, I will respond sometime on thursday, hopefully, very busy this week.

-Heth

Hethsixoespa; To learn you must love discipline, it is stupid to hate correction.


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<object width="425"

 He almost breaks down in the middle.  The giggling is his way of coping with wanting so much for his beliefs to not be the delusions they are. 

 He's created verbage in the bible that isn't there.  Blasphemy of the holy spirit had no rules attached to it about needing to believe.

 


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I went out and bought a

I went out and bought a webcam, but now I need to try and get my mic working. I've un-muted the mic in sndvol32, but Creative's software for the X-Fi is not making it easy.


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Not a single statement

Not a single statement is backed up with any sort of proof.  This video represents the need to speak up.  We don't question enough the things that people would want us to believe without proof. 

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Awww, he's so cute. 

Awww, he's so cute.  "Those people are bad examples of Christians" followed by insult after insult an f-bomb, and more insults.  Not just insults directed at Flemming, insults directed at Christians as well. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faRDcqAFmCE

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