Strong Atheism and Faith
Offline I don't have issues with weak atheism, but I do with strong atheism. For the purpose of this thread I am going to take a "agnostic/deistic" perspective on the creation of the universe. (I am well aware that my "deistic" conclusions can be substituted for the 'god of the gaps' argument). As a deist, I am not refering to an anthropomorphical biblical god, but a "transcendental entity/force " responsible for the creation of the cosmos.
My arguement is that strong atheism requires faith; a suspension of logic, reason, and empirics. How can a strong atheist boldy make the claim that there is not a "transcendental entity/force" responsible for the creation of the cosmos. As an agnostic, not all the evidence is in to disprove the existence of a transcendental entity.
I asked to be banned, so I was banned.
I have skepticism about my deism, but simply put, a deistic god is responsible for the creation of the universe. Perhaps, in time the creation of the universe will boil down to a scientific law like gravity. That does not rule out the deistic god, since this so called hypothetically scientific law of the creation of the universe can be synonymous to a deistic conception of god: the force responsible for the creation of the universe
If there was a force responsible for the creation of the universe, then I can refer this to as ‘god’. I make no claim that ‘god’ is intelligent or moral or anthropomorphic…that would require a leap of faith.
Perhaps, out of my ignorance and a language barrier, but doesn't a “strong” atheist claims that there is nothing responsible for the creation of the universe? It rules out a creator even if this creator is not biblical.My deistic ‘god’ is not parallel to unicorns and flying spaghetti monster, but the force/entity responsible for the creation of the universe.
How can a “strong” atheist claim that nothing caused the creation of the universe? To me that requires ‘faith’ or induction and not deduction.
I asked to be banned, so I was banned.
What evidence do you have for this claim?
If you re-define your desitic God to mean "the ultimate cause of the universe no matter what they might turn out to be" then your just playing with words. Your just re-defiing God to be what ever turns out to be correct!!!!
Right so what ever turns out to be correct about the origins of the universe you will label God. Thats great if you want to do that but why bother? Its merely a word game in re-defining the word God.
No. It says nothing about the creation of the universe other than, as a necessary logical consiquence, that it was not created or caused by a God.
Yes but it does not rule out any other cause.
This presuposes that the unievrse was indeed created. May be its just always been there. This is a distinct possability. The universe could simply have existed for eternity it was never created it was just there all the time. We really do not know for certain. But looking at the evidence I think I can safely conclued that the universe was not created by any God.
We don;t we merely claim that no God did.
To me its fairly obvious that teh universe is just no the type of place where any god or god like entity exists. More importantly if we try to explain the universes creation by positing a God then it really does just beg the question who made God? The God theory answers nothing and posits the existence of a completely new and unkown type of entity without a shred of evidence to bakc it up. It really just does not work.
Thanks for the feedback, it was helpful.
Perhaps, you are right. Exactly, why bother? I do struggle with deism and have my skepticism. As I cultivate and learn more, I am becoming more of a "fence sitter".
I am not sure that it is exactly a word game and re-defining god. The word 'god' has many definitions to many people and these definitions change over time.
Agian, I agree with you that it is possible that the universe existed for entertity. Its a difficult concept to grasp.
Again, if it was created, then this does not necessarily imply "a cuase."--another difficult concept to grasp.
I asked to be banned, so I was banned.