Tried for 20 years.  Didn't work.   

Many here have explicitly stated they are former believers.  We already know the enemy.

Why would that be?  Miffed at the pope's recent exclusionary remarks perhaps?

Not scared, just have better things to do with my time. 

The occasions that I have "visited" church must number in the thousands..

- Many of the people I met and got to know were nice. 

- Many of the people I met and got to know put on a fake plastic smile and were not so nice!  Some even could be best described with a concept humans refer to as evil !

Just like the regular population it turns out...however, none of the church-goers I've ever met were successful at embracing reality or had ever learned to be honest with themselves. 

Sorry Sapphen, but I can't do it for the following reasons:

1) I hate Jesus

2) I've never read the bible

3) A traumatic event in my life happened at church

4) I know God exists but shun his love

5) My parents used to beat me with a book of hymns

6) God touched me in bad places

7) Satan has better dental

My mind is closed to the truth

9) God hasn't opened my eyes yet

10) I've never heard of Pascal's Wager

I never expected them to be anything but human. I don't talk to them mostly because I don't have a reason to. They are there to answer the specifics of their faith not to debate with non-believers.  I don't think they would appreciate my demands for proof when their time could be better spent (from their perspective) working wih the faithful.  

Constantly. 

This is something I've never understood about christianity. The hatred of catholocism. I get that different sects have slightly different beliefs and therefore dissagre but everyone (except the catholics) singles out the catholics as the worst. Is it tall poppy syndrome? The catholic church is the oldest, richest and (historically atleast) the most powerful version of christianity. It this jelousy or is there a good reason that you think the catholic church is evil? Don't they have the strongest claim of being true christianity?

I have been to church a few times. Mostly catholic I admit but some of other denominations too. I went to a catholic highschool and attendance at certain masses were compulsary. I also discussed my non-belief at length with my religious education teachers.

I'm sorry to say that attending mass only strenghtened my disbelief. All I saw was empty ceremony and parts that looked a lot like brainwashing.  

The only thing that scared me about church was the way it took away people's individuality, atleast temporarily. The memories of people mindlessly reciting responses in monotonous unison are burnt into my mind.

I just don't get anything from being preached to. One-way information exchange doesn't do much for me. I like to discuss, to challenge ideas when I hear something that doesn't add up. I'd galdly chat with a pastor though if I knew of one willing to take part in two-way communication and not approach me as a potential convert, to accept that I probably wont believe everything he tells me. 

I don't think any atheist is scared to go to church.  It's more likely that they simply don't think it would be any more productive than going to the Creationism Museum. 

What exactly do you think someone could learn from going to church.  So far you have suggested that it would help someone understand that it's not a bad place or full of bad people.  I don't think anyone is really disputing that (as in, most would agree that churches, like everywhere else, contain both good and bad people.  "good" and "bad" being used in a very general sense).

I will take your word for it, and I understand that you enjoy it.  However, what benefit would there be for someone who does not?  Feelings of warmth or compansionship are good, but they are not in any way evidence of god. 

That's how I became an atheist. I understand why you ask the question, though. When I was a theist, it was really difficult for me to understand that the certainty of atheists wasn't the same as the certainty I felt. When you believe that certainty is absolute, and belief blind, it's almost impossible to understand what it's like to be certain, yet open minded. I know. I've been on both sides.

Like probably 2/3 of the atheists here, I've been there and done that. Just so you know, when I was a theist, I was a church musician, and I'm pretty sure I've played at least twenty or twenty five different denominations, from Catholic to Pentecostal and everything in between, and probably attended two hundred different churches. I can say with confidence that I have already received the full tour.

I'm a bit rusty, but I've read the entire bible at least three times, in different translations. I was an apologist, and read Stroble, Lewis, Graham, Robertson, Fallwell, etc... I've probably read more theist books than I have secular books (at least about theism) Safe to say I know what Christianity is about.

Oh, and I'm the only person I know who actually read significant portions of the Qumran scrolls.

I agree to some extent. Hellfire and brimstone pastors really piss me off, but Catholic services are insanely boring unless they're doing a High Mass complete with the Latin and the fancy duds.

Wednesday pot luck got me through a financial settlement from a divorce. There was a church down the street from my house, so I could walk there and eat a free meal. I just took a book to read during the sermon, though. I'd already heard enough sermons.

These days, it's my opinion that my presence in a church implies that I condone the activity, and I don't. So, I stay away from them.

I think you might find that you seriously underestimate the experience we've had with church. The core members are all ex-Christians, and lots of us mods and regular members were active church goers.

When I was a theist, I was just sure that all atheists needed was a good experience, and to hear someone explain things just long enough for god to "touch their heart." What I didn't understand is that the atheists were chuckling at my naivety when I suggested such things. One of the biggest shocks for me when I became an atheist was when I started talking to other atheists, and told them all the exciting things I'd figured out, and how shocked I was to learn that I simply had been naive. Almost without fail, they would be nonchalant, as if they'd heard it all a thousand times before. They had.

I have always been proud of my intellect. I don't mind admitting that. When I was a theist, I was still a very smart guy -- I just hadn't examined my theism with the same critical eye that I used for everything else. When I did that, it opened up an amazing world for me, but it was also extremely humbling. I learned a very valuable lesson. No matter how certain I think I am, I could be wrong. The best way to know if I'm right or wrong is to learn, and to do things in the right order... Facts first, then conclusions. Sometimes the conclusions are not what I'd like, but it's better to know that I'm approaching life honestly.

After many years as an atheist, I am more certain than ever that there is no god. As I've learned more about history, psychology, and critical thinking, I've seen first hand that literally everything I've seen that is testable and verifiable points to the non-existence of god.

Could I be wrong? Sure. Any time someone says they have a new proof for the existence of god, I listen to it. So far, every single time that happens, the 'proof' is simply one of the same defeated arguments I've heard hundreds, if not thousands of times.

So, Sapphen, I tell you this honestly: I recognize myself in you. Not me now, but me in another decade -- another universe, really. I said everything you have said in these forums, and believed things that are probably very similar to what you believe. One of the reasons I get so easily aggravated with you is that you remind me of when I was like you, and I don't like thinking about that time. I don't like feeling naive, and I feel embarrassed when I remember how arrogantly I dismissed people who knew more than I did, simply because I knew in my heart that I was right and they, with their years of education and experience, were wrong.

Take this for what you want, Sapphen. If you think I'm just trying to make you feel small, that is your right. But Sapphen, you accused me of not being as mature as I think I am. I tell you in all honesty that I have been where you are now, and I have never had a more humbling and maturing experience than when I looked back at my years as a brainwashed theist and cringed at my own immaturity and intellectual dishonesty.

For future reference sapphen there are these two keys on your keyboard, ones on the lower left and the other is one the lower right, they are called shift keys. Use them. 

I've been going to church every goddamn week for the past 17 years. Think I don't know the church's message? Think I don't know the Bible? Hell, I've heard it all and thought it over hundreds of times. If anything made me an atheist, it was going to church and listening and thinking about the pastor's nonsensical dribble, going to youth meetings and seeing children be taught to hate, and taught nonsense as if it were truth.

so i came here and questioned my beliefs but are you able to do the same? 

i think you might find that church isn't as bad as you think but i understand if you too scared to go.

No, you have never questioned your beliefs.. If you truely have you would never have made that statement. You might be fooling yourself into believing you are, but you aren't questioning anything about your faith. You are simply questioning ours...

I spent years and I mean years just questioning my lack of faith and trying to get rid of the guilt associated with not having any, just wondering why I was different. Searching for whatever it was I was missing that everyone else had, but the more I searched the more I realised there's nothing there.

Religion isn't all bad but it does have a big flaw, it creates an enviornment to make people feel better about themselves for no good reason. If you don't believe me, then go to any city and ask yourself why there are homeless people in a society that is 80% Christian. I figure, if you ever want to know how many true Christians we have in the U.S. all you have to do is determine how many homeless people we have and assume it's some number less than that.

I live in Boston, which is where the headquarters of the Church of Christ, Scientist (aka Christian Science) is located. I go to their services all the time. I'm planning on doing some Youtube videos about this place, which I find disturbing yet strangely alluring at the same time. Hopefully, they allow cameras inside during services.

sapphen wrote: 

Our world is rife with humans who refuse to grow up and spend their entire lives believing in one form of magic or another.  While it makes those humans easy to control, it seriously stunts our progress as individuals and as a species.

I get so tired of seeing this overdone parent-child analogy.  You would think an omnipotent creator could create an original analogy.  I have often worked w/ abused children and have seen the horrible acts parents are capable of, although I haven't seen many that drowned all of their own children when they would not obey, and what kind of sick, twisted mind would call this love? 

First things first.   After we've destroyed every Creed CD on the planet, how about we recognize how jaw-droppingly egotistical the idea of a "personal" god is ?  While I'm begging to borrow money, how many children are slowly dying of starvation around the world ?  How many children are being drowned in a bathtub by a parent ?, etc. How about we turn a blind eye to this and blame it on another being who doesn't exist ? 

Stop trying to sell a car.  he doesn't want your love...your god (meaning the ridiculous concept of his existence) wants your worship and your obedience.  That, sapphen runs contrary to love.   So a kind and understanding father would allow a disobedient child to be tortured forever in a lake of fire is that it ?  What's next, the ordering of the death and mutilation of entire towns...except the virgins.. we always want to save those?  Whoops, too late.  Already been done!

I can't believe I actually believed this crap at one time.  Indoctrination is a mother........----!

neat idea manchild, i feel that is a good project.  i would encourage you look at it with an open mind. a true observer would try to find the good and bad rather than making another propaganda video.  think of it as studying the behaviors of a foreign species.  i would also consider maybe some other churches in the area.  one church represents christianity as well as a random atheist represents atheism.

--------------------------------------------- 

latin, thank you for a very well constructed post.  i easily followed your logic and see a lot of truth in it.  "what would it take for me not to believe?"  i'm afraid another user already had me pegged when he said there is no hope for me.  God is inside me, this i know because of my personally relationship with Him.  it is all encompassing.  i am in constant conversation with Him and He speaks back to me in many different ways.  i think the only way i would ever fit into an atheist majority society would be in a mental hosipital in which i would live happily the rest of my days talking to God.

i hope i did not disrespect you in any way.  i read an incredible reply from you that poses much thought for me and for that i am grateful.

---------------------------------------------

americanidle... what makes you think that i am easy to control?  who are you to group me up with your belief of what a christian is?  i think there is a child inside us all and to forget that nature you could set aside a lot of fine attributes that come from such an innocent mindset.

 i did not come here to defend God's actions.  He is more than capable of doing that Himself.  i do not understand why He did what He did and i don't think you do either.  you are saying that God does not exist yet He is cruel?  how does His judgment deny His existence?

the being you should blame for the drownings are the parents that did it.  we are given free will to act how we wish on this earth.  i think that starving children is a terrible thing and if you feel a conviction i suggest you do what you can to help them.  their government and the parents that had those children are the ones that have this issue and need to find ways to work through it.  God works through people and i am sure there are a lot of religious people that are over there doing everything they can to help and feed these people.

despite your constructs our God wants our love.  some of us work for Him and some do not, that is lead by our personal convictions.  you can state your interpretation of "your" god but please do not try to tell me of mine.  Jesus came to save us from "the lake of fire" not to put us there.  save is the key word here and whether you believe it or not that is my opinion.  He can not save you if you do not acknowledge His existence.

seems like you are very angry with this issue and i would suspect in your case, it goes deeper than you can admit.  i'm sorry to toss you a bunch of "christian mombo jumbo" but if you talk to me rationally i will try to respond rationally.  calling my belief crap and saying that my God does not exist and He is really mean... well, that is crap.

Taking you too serious, I'm probably guilty of that. Although if you think you aren't calling people cowards, I have to wonder what you think you are saying...

Challenging people to be brave, thus assuming they aren't? 

Brave: possessing or displaying courage

So I have no courage?

Saying people are scared to goto Church.

scared: made afraid; "the frightened child cowered in the corner"; "too shocked and scared to move"

coward: a person who shows fear or timidity

It's not that atheist are cowards, it's that we are unbrave and scared to go to church?

So If I don't take you too serious, then I have to assume you are simply teasing us, as if we are afraid to ride a roller coaster for example?

The problem is religion isn't like a roller coaster, it's more analogous to a tank. You're not afraid to be in the tank, you're afraid to be out of it.

It all boils down to credentials...

If you call yourself a plumber: I assume you can fix plumbing

If you call yourself an auto-mechanic: I assume you can fix cars

If you call yourself a Christian: I assume you are attempting to be Christ like

I can call myself whatever I want but if I don't meet the criteria, we can assume they are falsifying their credentials.

So if 8 out of 10 American's are Christians what would you expect this country to be like? War, Homeless, Murder rate, etc

It's a simple fact that the evidence does not support the numbers. So what's the reasoning for falsifying their credentials? My guess is it's to feel good about themselves.

Let me call myself a Doctor to feel good about myself. 

The problem that arises is this, when I attempt to make a decision based upon those credentials. Since you don't meet the criteria how can you make an accurate decision?

If a group of doctors make a medical decision do you feel comfortable? I do if they have the credentials.

If a group of Christians make a moral decision do you feel comfortable? I don't because they don't have the credentials.

When they raise the bar on what it is to be a Christian, then maybe we can respect the credentials.

Signed,

Not too serious

a lot better reply neptewn, thank you.  i can see that we may have a better understanding of each other now.

i really didn't mean to directly relate the title, "brace yourselves and be brave... this is about church", to actually going to church but i can completely understand what you are saying.  i really don't want to get over particular in what appears to be a misinterpretation and misrepresentation but if someone asks you to be brave that doesn't necessarily mean that you are not.

on your second point i think that you are mostly right.  most people do claim to be christians just to feel good about themselves.  i can't really argue about what a "true scotsman" is.  i feel that no one is perfect and we all make mistakes.  i am so far away from being "Christ-like" it isn't even funny.  i feel everyone has their purpose and in another's eyes they may have done some good things.

feeling good about yourself is a vast subject that stretches beyond morals and doctors.  you don't have to have credentials to say that you look professional in that suit.  i'm not sure how you feel about the spiritual side of a person so i really can't give an accurate example that you could relate to.  people tend to look for reassurance and if they respect the person they rarely need the credentials to feel better about themselves.  i claim that a positive attitude is enough and can go beyond what experience one has.

a doctor could have credentials and tell you that "you have cancer and you are going to die" or he could say that "you have cancer and there are somethings you can do to improve the life you have left".  to feel good about yourself is subject to a persons feelings, interpretations and personal expectations.

latian, i have not always been a christian nor do i think i have not truly questioned my beliefs.  it is jumping to conclusions to assume that if one was to truly question their beliefs they would not be a christian.  i don't want to put words into your mouth but that is what i personally interpreted so please correct me if i am wrong.

still today i question what i believe but maybe the difference is the questions we ask.  i have to come to highly respect logic and reasoning but i also have faith.  i feel that logic is as true as the logician and reasoning is subject to the reasons.  i feel faith and logic works hand in hand and only by using both can we truly find our goals.  i do not wish to tread on your conclusions and it seems you have put a lot of time into your quest.

i can not argue what a certain civilizations will do with or without religion. i feel there will always be corruption within government no matter what "tool" they use.  i think we should build towards a better society and religion may have done some bad things to hinder that growth.  i also feel God is separate from religion and we could work towards a better society without taking away anyone's beliefs.

i am very against politicians/leaders/people of power that use religion to control the mass and from what i have read i feel that the bible says the same thing.  i personally feel that religious leaders should have no power or wealth and only the means to live comfortably (feed their family and pay the bills).  i don't know if that opinion would change if i won the lottery.

it is difficult for me to answer the question "what will it take for me not to believe", in my point of view that is like asking you "what would it take for you not to believe in your computer" (if you are using a computer).  of course you can see your computer and it is a physical object but i can not see it.  you could send me a picture but that could be fake or you could take it to me but i could claim it is not yours.  yet responding to my post is proof that it does but i feel the knowledge we have to be able to respond to posts is proof that God does exist.  the only way is to go into your house and personally see that it resides there.  unfortunately you can not go into my heart and see God but i can not think of something that would disprove God when He is a part of me.

I may have incorrectly posted my thoughts here. What i meant was not that you wouldn't be a christian, but many a believer i have found always are willing to ask what it would take to believe, but they rarely (and I do mean very very very rarely) ask themselves what it would take to disbelieve. You believe in god, you believe that you have a personal relationship, but there is no evidence that god exists, there is no miracle or anything that has occurred in the bible that we can verify this at all. All claims towards this god cannot be verified at all by indepenedent sources. You believe, however you do not have facts, evidence and reasoning.

Belief in god is not the same as belief in science as one can verify the studies of science, i can verify my computer, i can verify many many things, i cannot verify god exists. I can show the probability is very very small, nearly non existant that the god of the bible exist, but i cannot say he doesn't exists 100 percent for sure.

I know science is not 100 percent of the time correct, but it is self correcting, with new evidence correcting previous errors, but belief in god and religious ideas don't change, they change the facts and views to fit the dogmatic beliefs, but that is not the same.

As for corruption in goverment, i agree there will always be corruption. however my point was the more dogmatic it is, the more corrupt it gets. It's adherence to beliefs without questioning is really bad for society for it lends itself to corruption. The worse are those of theocracies/dogmatic goverments (i don't even know if this is the correct spelling) that do not allow basic human freedoms, such as freedom of thought, speech, sexuality and religious views. Being that I have heard the speeches of many religious leaders in the US, it is amazing how they live in a country they say they love, yet would gladly punish homosexuals, atheists, communists, freethinkers, scientists, etc and anyone that would speak against the church if they were in power, yet atheists for the most part wouldn't be the same way. A secular society with non dogmatic system is far better off. However I do not want to put words in your mouth as well, I assume you are far more tolerant than those type of preachers.

lol Sapphen.  I will pretend like I didn't read what you said, if it will make you happy.

Seriously, though, I'm curious why you're meticulously avoiding the point in front of you.  Granted, you haven't been directly asked, but geez, the question's sitting in front of you begging for an answer.

What would it take for you to disbelieve?

We all know that we can't prove with 100% certainty that anything doesn't exist, so that shouldn't be an escape hatch for you.  You don't believe in unicorns, so clearly the lack of a disproof doesn't stop you from disbelieving in some things.

So... recognizing that you will never receive a disproof of god any more than you will unicorns, what would it take for you to put god in the same circular file as unicorns?

humm... as one of my last points i would say the thing that would make me disbelieve is if God came down and told me not to believe in Him anymore.

i would hate to end with such sarcastic answer to a honest question.  i've tried to answer that question a few times in my above posts but at the moment i am unable to give an answer that would fill the question.

perhaps i will ponder this question in my time away and could provide an better answer but please keep in mind that i do have my own personal proof that God exists.  i have not asked anyone to accept that but i can not deny that proof.

i see Him everywhere and in everything, He is the core of my being.  i've been without Him and He called out to me.  i am in His service now and He has given me the proof i needed, that i begged Him too time and time again.

i've doubted Him before.  i used to walk outside at night through out my grandfather's farm.  i was at the my ends crying and begging Him to show me some proof.  i was trying to help the marriage between my sister and her husband but i felt fruitless.  i dropped to my knees and asked God why did He put me in the middle of it and why doesn't He help me water the seeds i planted... then it started raining.

this is merely one example of many experiences i have had.  God speaks to us all if we could only listen.

Well, it is what it is.

I guess I'm going to use this post as an example, because it's really illustrative.

I don't doubt that you have had something happen, or have seen something that convinces you of the existence of god. Since you believe, there is obviously a reason for your belief.

Unfortunately, this is not pertinent at all. Everyone who believes anything has a reason for that belief, and as you can clearly see, not all beliefs are true, despite the conviction of the believer.

In fact, many people who are completely certain of a belief are wrong. We see this every day if we just walk around and talk to people. It happens to me damn near every time I play trivial pursuit.

So, stating that you have a reason for your god belief is adding absolutely nothing to the discussion, nor is it doing anything to justify your belief.

Again, this is great for you, but it doesn't do anything for the discussion. You're simply telling us that you believe... again.

And surely, you can understand that it rains sometimes, and that there are billions of people on the planet, so the odds are pretty damn good that someone will pray, and it will rain on them.

Yes, it seemed real. Yes, it was quite a coincidence. But, in light of the overwhelming philosophical, scientific, and logical evidence that god does not exist, it's difficult to understand why you wouldn't want a little more proof than this.

One time, I was driving down the road, and I was thinking about someone I hadn't seen in years. The very next song that came on the radio was a song I hadn't heard in years, and which had great significance to this friend. Amazing coincidence, but I recognize it for that. Coincidences happen, and sometimes they happen when people are praying for proof of god.

Why, then, do coincidences happen to everyone? When I was in a casino once, I gave some dude a free meal ticket I'd been given because I knew he was having a hard time. When I played Blackjack right after that, I hit four blackjacks in a row! The odds against that are staggering! Would you suggest that god was rewarding an atheist for gambling because he had acted altruistically towards someone?  Why have some really bad things happened when you were just trying to do the right thing, Sapphen?  It's easy to assign value to the good coincidences, while forgetting that there are also bad coincidences, and times when things don't work out.  In fact, there are many more of them.

Coincidences happen.

Why do people all over the world, when they hear god speaking to them, hear wildly different stories? Is god lying to some and telling the truth to others? Or are all the other people who think god is talking to them wrong? Is it just coincidence for them, and god for you?

I understand, Sapphen. You really, really, really want to continue believing in god, and it scares you to think that if you tell us something that would convince you you're wrong, we might be able to produce it.  Admitting the possibility of being wrong is opening the door to disbelief, and you really really want to believe.

I am sure you're not thinking that consciously, Sapphen, but examine that answer you gave, deep down, and ask yourself if you're not afraid to answer the question because then you might have to give up god.

I know the question wasn't addressed to me, but I'd like to answer it anyway, if no one minds.

For me to disbelieve, my beliefs would have to make my life more difficult than it would be without them. Otherwise, I don't care. I'll believe in unicorns and fairies and leprechauns and orbiting teapots and the Goddess (all hail Discordia!) and fruit smoothies until the day I drop dead, and nothing you will say or do, short of showing up at my place of residence and putting a gun to my head, will likely ever change that. I don't care about your "objective truth," your "reality," your "facts," or any such thing. I have my own truth, my own reality, and my own facts, and I'd appreciate if you kept your filthy paws off them, you damn dirty apes.

Those are my thoughts on the matter. 

LOL... can i borrow losingstreak's answer!

I think that about covers it. 

The only problem is I did have bad experiences in church, but I consider those experiences to be supporting evidence against religion.  Even if everything was perfect in churches, I'd find it impossible to believe the supernatural garbage.  My skills as a logician have progressed too far.  

(Granted, they aren't as finely honed as are the skills of many rational responders, but they're good enough to keep me from believing in invisible sky fairies.)

Word.

That's probably the main reason I get aggravated with some theists, Hamby, especially the fundy ones.  I am still a little pissed off with myself for being that gullible.  Sure, I was brainwashed into it, but it's still sickening to realize I continued to believe it into my early twenties.
 

Emotional and irrational?  How so?  

I told you that my experiences were anecdotal.  So were yours. Touché.  

I assure you I was not feeling very emotional during my response.  I was merely showing you that churches and preachers can be corrupt.  If you'd rather not confront that reality (as well as other realities), I suppose it's your choice.

I think you may be either reading too much into a single post and/or projecting.   

Um, I've already found logic.  You are the one who is not applying it equally to all areas of your life.

I really don't see how my relating bad experiences I had at church makes me irrational, especially in light of the fact you believe a man died for your sins and rose from the dead.

sapphen, I don't want your sympathy.  I don't want or need sympathy.  I was merely trying to show you another side of church.  Even under the best of circumstances, churches are places of brainwashing and indoctrination and are, therefore, bad places.  I would never recommend that someone go to church.  That's akin to sending them to a Scientology audit.

I do hate religion.  It's not bad to hate some things. 

Actually, I get along fine with some theists.  I was telling you about the asshole preachers I've known and how they have abused their power.  If that makes you uncomfortable, perhaps you should ask yourself why instead of projecting your illogic and irrationality onto me. 

Yes.  I wish you would go back and read that post with a little more detachment.  I was not feeling overly emotional.  I was merely relating experiences.  I think perhaps you brought something of your own into reading it.  I wrote it before I learned you had some bad experiences in church.  I honestly think you are projecting your thoughts and feelings onto me.

I wasn't attacking you personally.  I was, however, attacking religion, churches, pastors, etc.  I think religion causes people to do horrible things they would not have otherwise done.  I don't hate the players.  I just hate the game. (That reminds me too much of "love the sinner; hate the sin," but it's the way I feel.) 

Actually, I appreciate the lessons I learned from Christianity.  I learned to question everything.  I learned to question authority. I learned to be more careful about what I believed.  I learned that religion is--in the main--detrimental to society.  I would have rather learned some of these lessons a different way, but now that I have learned them, I plan to use the lessons I've learned to help others who have escaped religion or wish to escape it.