Being closed-minded

aminoacid
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Being closed-minded

Yay for being called closed-minded for being an Atheist! 

That's such a joke!

My mother, my grandmother, and sister are all calling me closed-minded... How the hell am I closed minded? The simple fact is that believing in a "higher power" of any sort is just plain ridiculous! That's not being closed-minded, that's called being a skeptic, asking questions... being rational


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Oh that is funny!!  Yes,

Oh that is funny!!  Yes, you are closed minded - close minded to unsupported beliefs.  Yeah, that's a real sin.  Ask them if they are so open-minded, then why don't they worship ALL of the false gods instead of just one.


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Jce is right, you are

Jce is right, you are closed minded to unsupported beliefs.

I'm the same way. 


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There is nothing wrong for

There is nothing wrong for stating your beliefs and standing up for yourself. That hardly makes you closed minded. I think your family can't handle you having you own worldview that does not match theirs. To them because you think differently you are closed minded, but to go against the grain shows how open your mind is.


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Well nobody can disprove

Well nobody can disprove this higher power thing.  But you aren't closed-minded for doubting this higher-power thing without anything but word of mouth to go by.  That actually makes you open-minded.

 But don't hate on your family.  Even if they hate on you sometimes.  That makes you more christian than them!

Religion is the ultimate con-job. It cons the conned, and it cons the conner.

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My favorite retort for

My favorite retort for anyone that accuses me of being 'close-minded' is:

There's a big difference between being open-minded and loose-minded. 

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Seems like classic

Seems like classic projection to me.


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zntneo wrote: Seems like

zntneo wrote:
Seems like classic projection to me.

Why is this so common??? 


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Zach's right. However, I

Zach's right. However, I lose people's attention spans when I try to explain why I think they're projecting.

After all, few people want to hear about their flaws from others. When I do find someone willing to discuss themselves more than me, it makes for good friendships. lol.

Maybe if psychology 101 were encapsulated enough to discuss with the family members the accusations of close-mindedness would subside a little?

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Is being closed minded to

Is being closed minded to something you don't believe equate to not listening to the other side?

What is faith? Is it to believe that which is evident? No. It is perfectly evident to my mind that there exists a necessary, eternal, supreme, and intelligent being. This is no matter of faith, but of reason. - Voltaire


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aminoacid wrote:Yay for

This series of comments has been moved here.


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Iruka Naminori

Iruka Naminori wrote:

zntneo wrote:
Seems like classic projection to me.

Why is this so common???

 

I think it's because its one of the basic self-defense mechinisms, but then again i could be pulling shit out of my ass so I don't know.

 

[edit] I'll know more about these sellf-defense mechinisms after this summer. Taking normal psychology. I might be able to explain it to you then Smiling


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razorphreak wrote: Is being

razorphreak wrote:
Is being closed minded to something you don't believe equate to not listening to the other side?

If you take out the 'to something you don't believe' in your question it makes better sense to me. 

Being close-minded is not listening to the other side.

I think you'll find that there are people who simply refuse to listen to anyone yet demand that others listen to them.

Even beyond that there are more people who WILL not comprehend as opposed to those who CANNOT comprehend what is being said.

It was a worthy endeavor, razorphreak. However, approaching the subject in that manner of enjoining the qualifier of belief to the question shows a marked close-mindedness on your part in my opinion. 

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razorphreak
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darth_josh wrote: I think

darth_josh wrote:
I think you'll find that there are people who simply refuse to listen to anyone yet demand that others listen to them.

That include when someone makes a point and the other shruggs them off as being "delusional"?? 

darth_josh wrote:
Even beyond that there are more people who WILL not comprehend as opposed to those who CANNOT comprehend what is being said.

I don't know if you wanna call that closed minded.  Being that I do not wish to accept evolution over creation does not make me closed minded to what evolution is all about.  I'm perfectly willing to listen but it does not mean I must accept.

darth_josh wrote:
It was a worthy endeavor, razorphreak. However, approaching the subject in that manner of enjoining the qualifier of belief to the question shows a marked close-mindedness on your part in my opinion.

Persusaion should not be a part of being open minded.  I do not persuade anyone to believe as I do; I don't believe that I am capable of this (hence my quote).  So sticking to my beliefs even though i wish to listen...that makes me closed minded? 

What is faith? Is it to believe that which is evident? No. It is perfectly evident to my mind that there exists a necessary, eternal, supreme, and intelligent being. This is no matter of faith, but of reason. - Voltaire


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Quote: That include when

Quote:
That include when someone makes a point and the other shruggs them off as being "delusional"??

razorfreak, you've been playing this card too long, I think. As many people have pointed out to you in this and other threads, we call you delusional because you can't back up your beliefs with facts, and worse still, your beliefs are contradictory and nonsensical. It is not closed minded to point this out to you. In fact, razor, you have been asked numerous times to please, please, please, make with the evidence so that we can take your claims seriously. In all cases, you have beaten a quick path to the hills and come back claiming that we don't listen to a word you say because our mind is made up.

That's just it, razor. Our mind is not made up. Yours is. All we ask is logical, factual evidence that you're right. If you provide it, we will accept what you say. We have demonstrated repeatedly that your beliefs are not logical, and rather than try to learn, you immediately retreat behind your special little god-shield and tell us that despite everything you haven't heard us say, that you are still right.... just because.

Quote:
I don't know if you wanna call that closed minded. Being that I do not wish to accept evolution over creation does not make me closed minded to what evolution is all about. I'm perfectly willing to listen but it does not mean I must accept.

Begin listening here.

If you're honest about being willing to listen and learn, read the links in that thread. All of them.

Listening with a promise of not accepting is closed minded. If you are open minded, there is a possibility that upon learning about evolution, you will accept it as true. I know you well enough, though, razor. Your words are empty because you already know you're right. I'm open to the possibility of being wrong, though. Maybe you will actually do your own homework and become a more rational person because of it. Why don't you prove me wrong, and I'll be the first to line up and say I was wrong.

Quote:
Persusaion should not be a part of being open minded. I do not persuade anyone to believe as I do; I don't believe that I am capable of this (hence my quote). So sticking to my beliefs even though i wish to listen...that makes me closed minded?

You've missed his whole point here, razor. Put your thinking cap on and re-read the section you quoted this from.

 

Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin

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razorphreak
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Hambydammit

Hambydammit wrote:
razorfreak, you've been playing this card too long, I think. As many people have pointed out to you in this and other threads, we call you delusional because you can't back up your beliefs with facts, and worse still, your beliefs are contradictory and nonsensical.

hamby my dear RRS buddy, I knew I could count on you to be on my heels.  I ask that you might read this thread in full before you respond to it.

You know for as long as I've been posting here, the "heavy hitters" of this forum seem to answer my posts with the delusional "card" so action brought about how I respond. No debate insued...only a brush off. Can you really blame me for that?

My beliefs are based from the bible and every post I use biblical references. How is that not backing them up with facts. Our "brick wall" is with the proof of proving God exists. Outside the "gnome challenge" (I'm calling it that since the nightline debate - thanks Brian) posts on this forum have been in regard to questioning what the bible states. My attempts to make biblical references understandable within the context of the bible are usually met with "delusional" and brushed off without debate. Until that changes, until I see valid question and rebuttals, it's hard not to use what cards I must.

Hambydammit wrote:
That's just it, razor. Our mind is not made up. Yours is. All we ask is logical, factual evidence that you're right. If you provide it, we will accept what you say. We have demonstrated repeatedly that your beliefs are not logical, and rather than try to learn, you immediately retreat behind your special little god-shield and tell us that despite everything you haven't heard us say, that you are still right.... just because.

Hence the "gnome challenge". I admit my mind is made up on my faith and that is why I came here; again not to force anyone to believe as I do but rather explain why I believe as I do. I'm not asking you to accept it, just understand it.

Hambydammit wrote:
Listening with a promise of not accepting is closed minded. If you are open minded, there is a possibility that upon learning about evolution, you will accept it as true. I know you well enough, though, razor. Your words are empty because you already know you're right. I'm open to the possibility of being wrong, though. Maybe you will actually do your own homework and become a more rational person because of it. Why don't you prove me wrong, and I'll be the first to line up and say I was wrong.

And I could say the exact same thing about you towards theists. Learning what it says does not mean you have to accept it, just understand it. To me, that isn't being closed minded since you are willing to attempt to understand but it not changing your beliefs simply says you have principles. I would never say that you are closed minded for sticking to that. I would call you closed minded if you aren't even willing to listen and understand.

Does this mean we have different definitions of what being "closed minded" is?

What is faith? Is it to believe that which is evident? No. It is perfectly evident to my mind that there exists a necessary, eternal, supreme, and intelligent being. This is no matter of faith, but of reason. - Voltaire


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razorphreak wrote: My

razorphreak wrote:

My beliefs are based from the bible and every post I use biblical references. How is that not backing them up with facts.

Because you have not demonstrated that the bible is a credible reference.  Its contradictions and factual innaccuracies have been indicated many times over.  You fail to show how referencing the bible is any different than the practicioner of any religion referencing their own religious texts.  Until you can objectively distinguish between using biblical references and using qu'ranic, vedic or dianetic references, you cannot claim to be backing up your claims with facts.

In another thread (which you abruptly abandoned for some reason), you were last heard claiming that the "truth" was revealed by god from above.  If this is the only way to receive "the truth", it is useless for you to be here debating "the truth". 

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razorphreak
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zarathustra wrote: Because

zarathustra wrote:
Because you have not demonstrated that the bible is a credible reference. Its contradictions and factual innaccuracies have been indicated many times over. You fail to show how referencing the bible is any different than the practicioner of any religion referencing their own religious texts. Until you can objectively distinguish between using biblical references and using qu'ranic, vedic or dianetic references, you cannot claim to be backing up your claims with facts.

In another thread (which you abruptly abandoned for some reason), you were last heard claiming that the "truth" was revealed by god from above. If this is the only way to receive "the truth", it is useless for you to be here debating "the truth".

Is not a credible reference to what? God? God's word? Faith? MY faith?  I'm wondering what you don't consider it to be a credible reference to exactly.

I reference the bible because that is what I use to describe my faith in God.  It's not meant to be proof to you that God exists, only proof of explanation to what I believe. 

As to comparing the bible to other "holy texts", I don't think we've ever had a thread like that.  It would definitely be interesting but would take a ton of research that geez would take a while.

Which other thread?  What did I miss?  I might be going senile in my older age now haha... 

What is faith? Is it to believe that which is evident? No. It is perfectly evident to my mind that there exists a necessary, eternal, supreme, and intelligent being. This is no matter of faith, but of reason. - Voltaire


zarathustra
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razorphreak wrote: Is not

razorphreak wrote:

Is not a credible reference to what? God? God's word? Faith? MY faith? I'm wondering what you don't consider it to be a credible reference to exactly.

Well, razorphreak, you told hamby that by referring to the bible, you were backing your claims up with facts.  If this is the case, you do have to demonstrate that the bible is a credible source for facts.  If it is only factual within the boundaries of your personal faith, then it is pointless to cite it in debate with those who do no reside within those same boundaries.

razorphreak wrote:

As to comparing the bible to other "holy texts", I don't think we've ever had a thread like that. It would definitely be interesting but would take a ton of research that geez would take a while.

Go for it.

razorphreak wrote:

Which other thread? What did I miss? I might be going senile in my older age now haha...

This one.

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razorphreak
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zarathustra wrote: Well,

zarathustra wrote:
Well, razorphreak, you told hamby that by referring to the bible, you were backing your claims up with facts. If this is the case, you do have to demonstrate that the bible is a credible source for facts. If it is only factual within the boundaries of your personal faith, then it is pointless to cite it in debate with those who do no reside within those same boundaries.

The bible is credible for all who God granted them faith.  A good number of people would agree with me so while it might not apply within your definition it should apply as a reference of facts.  I don't accept The Origin of the Species' conclusions but I accept it as a reference to facts. 

zarathustra wrote:
This one.

totally forgot about that one...away I go to it. 

What is faith? Is it to believe that which is evident? No. It is perfectly evident to my mind that there exists a necessary, eternal, supreme, and intelligent being. This is no matter of faith, but of reason. - Voltaire


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My family seems to be the

My family seems to be the same way as far as it seems they can't handle my different views and they are freaking out now because I said when I have kids they aren't setting foot inside a church and my mother had the nerve to say to me if they come to my house for a weekend i'm taking them and I said over my dead body.

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heh. I had three female

heh.

I had three female cousins get kicked out of their parents' houses when they got pregnant. Where do you think they went to stay while they were getting their lives in order? That's right. My place. I've had a baby-proofed house since 1992.

We even had the law called to my apartment in my hometown to try to find a reason to take the kids away from one of my cousins. I pressed charges against my own aunt for false accusations. Grandma-ma begged me to drop it and I did, but not before I let EVERYONE in the family know what led up to it.

Now, 15 years later, the only time I hear from the catholics is money time for a dead one. They quit asking after a while.

The cousins are doing okay. One of them is going through a divorce, but the others are happy as can be. One of my 'little' second cousins is graduating this year in the top 20 of his class.

Freethinking makes one less dependent upon everything. When you don't have that need for co-dependency, the whole world opens up and you have real friends instead of 'providers of company and solace'. 

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