George Takei causes shit storm on facebook

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George Takei causes shit storm on facebook

Basically, he posted this as a photo obviously intended for humour.

 

 

 

then got a slew of comments.  Found here:

 

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=637864889576301&set=a.223098324386295.105971.205344452828349&type=1&relevant_count=1

 

then he posted this update:

 

http://www.facebook.com/georgehtakei/posts/638036502892473

 

George Takei wrote:

Well, I stepped in it with my pole-dancer meme, didn't I? I appreciate the thoughtful responses to my post, and I left it up so that the dialogue could continue. It was certainly not my intent to shame anyone. My point, rather, is that we live in a society that objectifies women, and there is something sad, in my view, when women make money--even good money--by buying into that system, using their bodies rather than their minds, and quite often (but not always) becoming the victims of a degrading system. My aim was to encourage parents to do a better job teaching young girls to value themselves and aim higher, and to make that point with levity. Few parents actually hope that their children turn out to be pole dancers, though some fairly can say it wouldn't bother them as long as they were happy. And so, I have gained some insight. Thanks, fans, for your excellent points on both sides.

 

 

 

So...ummm.... discuss

 

 

 


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 Hmmmmm.......So all

 Hmmmmm.......So all strippers had bad parents? It's so easy to blame parents for everything. I'm a fan of Mr. Sulu but he's so immature to actually believe there are parents who just can't wait for their darling little girl to grow up wearing stilettos and wrap their legs around a pole in front of salivating onlookers. What are his views on those clean sewers or shovel manure? Must have been bad parenting. Oh to think that those individuals made a choice in deciding those professions. Sulu needs to go after the rally sicko parents like Adam Lanza's mother who let him have several semi-automatic weapons.


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 I think it is sad that so

 I think it is sad that so many people get upset over an actor's facebook post. Must be a shitload of bad parents out there that people get so offended over unimportant shit. 

And yeah, the majority of strippers come from dysfunctional families. It is a career that the majority of Americans look down on; someone raised in a great family is more likely to go be a doctor, lawyer or some other job that is given high prestige. It would be nice if Americans got past their morality hang ups, but that isn't going to happen anytime soon. People who go into stripping are going to remain the outcasts of society, therefore the job is likely to attract people from messed up families. It isn't Takei's fault.  

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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All I gotta say is this:1 -

All I gotta say is this:

1 - I dated a stripper and she was fucked in the head. I didn't know it at the time, but she was damaged goods. Fucking awesome in bed and slightly freaky, but terrible in the relationship beyond the sex.

So what was her problem? She was raped and forced to have sex with family members (uncles and the such). The family was terrible, which I met several times. She could have been so much more, but she quit school and went on to make some local porn videos and got involved in meth. Bad shit that meth.

2 - Check out the Bio's from several famous porn stars. You'll get the same story. Rape, molestations at an early age. Lack of education. Very smart women who know how to manipulate and use their bodies to get what they need.

3 - Only the smart ones get out of the lime light while they still can; too many get addicted to drugs or the sex. They ended up being washed up hags in the end and blow all their money on cocaine.

The smart ones who get out of the business while they can still have fucked up issues. Several of them tried to make it in to the mainstream, legit businesses, but really the only thing for them was to manage other porn stars or to slip away in to obscurity.

 


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Poor George. This is far too

Poor George. This is far too complex a subject for an internet meme.

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Since when

Since when does anyone really give a shit what Takei thinks anyway ? I sure in the fuck don't. I don't give a shit what any of those actors/actresses think.

The way I look at it, they are no different than pole dancers. They get paid to entertain, not enlighten, discuss or sway my political/social views.

I  watch movies, shows, or whatever else for the sole purpose of entertainment, unless it is a documentary or the news. Not because I care anything about the people in them or what they do in real life.  

Same goes for singers/songwriters/bands and all of the rest of them.

Most of the strippers that I know wouldn't care about an Internet meme either.

I mean really, with the exception of the Grumpy Cat memes, I think all of those memes are horseshit anyway and scroll past every one of them on Facebook without even reading them.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
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Well said

Well said

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 I too, agree with harley.

 I too, agree with harley.

 

  edit: When I was younger and sometimes went to titty bars with my friends I never really got turned on by the topless dancers up on stage.  It seemed so f**king corny and cheap.   Funny, but I considered the nude female models in my college drawing classes to be more of a turn on, and that wasn't even their intent.

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harleysportster wrote: Same

harleysportster wrote:

 

Same goes for singers/songwriters/bands and all of the rest of them.

lol  that's one reason i love bob dylan.  i've read so many interviews with him where someone asks him something about the meaning of life or some shit and he's like, "why are you asking me this?  i'm the last person you should ask about this."

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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it was more of "slut

it was more of "slut shaming" that caused the comment storm.

 

 


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Cpt_pineapple wrote:it was

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

it was more of "slut shaming" that caused the comment storm.

 

 

I can see why it happened, but when it comes to these actors and their soapboxes, I always want to ask them : "Shouldn't you people be like, acting or something ?""

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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Bad Form Takei, Bad Form

I think part of the reason this attracted so much attention is because George Takei has been a very outspoken advocate of Gay Marriage Rights and other similar Issues, and has done so with a good sense of humour and all around cool guy-ness; His response to some piece of Marijuana Use Legislation and Gay Marriage Legislation passing on the same day was to say "Now we really know what the Bible Meant when it said 'any Man who Layeth with another Man must be Stoned.'"

I Imagine finding out that even generally cool guys like Takei can have malformed and bigoted opinions on subjects they aren't qualified to talk about came as a bit of a shock, which was only exacerbated when, after being called out on the problems of his views, he chose to double-down and deliver a backhanded apology, rather than accepting he was wrong.

 

And to digitalbeachbum in particular; Part of the reason Strippers (and Prostitutes and Porn Stars and other Sex-Workers) get stuck in the job is because of idiotic beliefs like yours which denigrate the job from "Just a Job" to something 'terrible' and 'shameful' which, due to the continuing prevalence of the Virgin-Whore Dichotomy, means that any woman who has at any point partaken of such a job is forever sullied and no longer fit for normal life.  I mean, how is someone supposed to Leave behind a Porn Career taken out of financial desperation when they get fired from their new "better" job after this half a decade old career comes to light?

 

When you say it like that you make it sound so Sinister...


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Very good points. I've never

Very good points. I've never liked how sex follows people everywhere. I don't give a fuck if a teacher or scientist or politician or anyone else had sex for money or paid money for sex. That has no bearing on their capability to do the job they are doing.

Personally I think George thought it was a cute pic everyone would have to agree with. He's never been the type to start something like this. When it bit him, he was so shocked he had nowhere to step back to, because he doesn't do shit like this he doesn't know how to react properly, and he made the wrong choice. I seriously doubt he had any incling that this would go where it did.

Jim Carrey knows exactly what he did and is responding properly, so the shitstorm he started is doing him good. But George is out of his element.

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Sinphanius wrote:I think

Sinphanius wrote:

I think part of the reason this attracted so much attention is because George Takei has been a very outspoken advocate of Gay Marriage Rights and other similar Issues, and has done so with a good sense of humour and all around cool guy-ness; His response to some piece of Marijuana Use Legislation and Gay Marriage Legislation passing on the same day was to say "Now we really know what the Bible Meant when it said 'any Man who Layeth with another Man must be Stoned.'"

I Imagine finding out that even generally cool guys like Takei can have malformed and bigoted opinions on subjects they aren't qualified to talk about came as a bit of a shock, which was only exacerbated when, after being called out on the problems of his views, he chose to double-down and deliver a backhanded apology, rather than accepting he was wrong.

 

And to digitalbeachbum in particular; Part of the reason Strippers (and Prostitutes and Porn Stars and other Sex-Workers) get stuck in the job is because of idiotic beliefs like yours which denigrate the job from "Just a Job" to something 'terrible' and 'shameful' which, due to the continuing prevalence of the Virgin-Whore Dichotomy, means that any woman who has at any point partaken of such a job is forever sullied and no longer fit for normal life.  I mean, how is someone supposed to Leave behind a Porn Career taken out of financial desperation when they get fired from their new "better" job after this half a decade old career comes to light?

 

I must say that you summed up ALL of my feelings on this subject quite well.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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Vastet wrote:Very good

Vastet wrote:
Very good points. I've never liked how sex follows people everywhere. I don't give a fuck if a teacher or scientist or politician or anyone else had sex for money or paid money for sex. That has no bearing on their capability to do the job they are doing.

EXACTLY !

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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Pun so Totally Intended

Yeah, Modern Humanity still has some pretty fucked up 'principles' regarding Sex.  Plus they still tend to have fucked up ideas about women in general, but especially female sexuality, women having jobs, independence, and in general women doing anything that they receive any personal benefit from whatsoever no matter how small it is.

And Sex Workers are like all of those put together.

When you say it like that you make it sound so Sinister...


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Sinphanius wrote:Yeah,

Sinphanius wrote:

Yeah, Modern Humanity still has some pretty fucked up 'principles' regarding Sex.  Plus they still tend to have fucked up ideas about women in general, but especially female sexuality, women having jobs, independence, and in general women doing anything that they receive any personal benefit from whatsoever no matter how small it is.

And Sex Workers are like all of those put together.

I agree.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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if i were george, i would

if i were george, i would just say, "it's a fucking joke, people, remember those?" and let it go at that.

i think george could have a lesson from louis c.k. here.  i love that guy.

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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Har Har Har

Hey yeah, it's

"Just a Joke"

Right?


Hey, I got a joke myself;
How do you kill a bunch of Black People?
Glue a Leg o' Fried Chicken to the bottom of a Pool amirite?

Whoa why's everyone so offended, it's
"Just a Joke"

grow some thicker skin.


I mean it's not like this "Joke" continues to propagate and reinforce a set of hurtful negative stereotypes that are part of a massive society wide system of victimization and oppression which actively denies the members of this group the opportunities and rights of the majority while systematically attempting to erase them from the popular consciousness in any meaningful presence to make it easier to further segregate them outside of 'proper' society and keep them locked into an impoverished downtrodden lifestyle.

That would just be silly.


I find that orphan, in cases like this, there is a constant refrain of "If you don't want to be offended, don't listen to my jokes" which I have always found kind of funny. I'll add my own refrain to it; "If you don't want me to heckle and criticize you, don't get up on stage to tell stupid crappy insulting jokes."

Takei has the freedom to make his "Joke", and I have the freedom to point out how stupid and insulting it is, and how it carries real world effects by continuing to propagate a negative stereotype which causes actual harm to actual people, and how it makes Takei more than just a little Sexist, just like if I had seriously made the "Joke" above you would have every right to label me as More than a little Racist.

But hey, it's
"Just a Joke"

Right?
 

When you say it like that you make it sound so Sinister...


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Sinphanius wrote:Hey yeah,

Sinphanius wrote:

Hey yeah, it's

"Just a Joke"

Right?


Hey, I got a joke myself;
How do you kill a bunch of Black People?
Glue a Leg o' Fried Chicken to the bottom of a Pool amirite?

Whoa why's everyone so offended, it's
"Just a Joke"

grow some thicker skin.


I mean it's not like this "Joke" continues to propagate and reinforce a set of hurtful negative stereotypes that are part of a massive society wide system of victimization and oppression which actively denies the members of this group the opportunities and rights of the majority while systematically attempting to erase them from the popular consciousness in any meaningful presence to make it easier to further segregate them outside of 'proper' society and keep them locked into an impoverished downtrodden lifestyle.

That would just be silly.


I find that orphan, in cases like this, there is a constant refrain of "If you don't want to be offended, don't listen to my jokes" which I have always found kind of funny. I'll add my own refrain to it; "If you don't want me to heckle and criticize you, don't get up on stage to tell stupid crappy insulting jokes."

Takei has the freedom to make his "Joke", and I have the freedom to point out how stupid and insulting it is, and how it carries real world effects by continuing to propagate a negative stereotype which causes actual harm to actual people, and how it makes Takei more than just a little Sexist, just like if I had seriously made the "Joke" above you would have every right to label me as More than a little Racist.

But hey, it's
"Just a Joke"

Right?
 

 

yep, fuckin' right it's just a joke.  i wish you and everybody else would keep your fuckin' hands off comedy.

i am a firm believer that NOTHING should be off-limits in comedy.  N-O-T-H-I-N-G.  to paraphrase joan rivers, humor is how we talk about and work through all the pain, all the degradation, all the stupidity that is humanity.  if a joke is bad, it's because the writing is bad, not because the subject matter is "politically incorrect" or "taboo."  if you think people make jokes about stereotypes only to perpetuate them, then that says more about your rotten perception than the comedian.

if people like you had their way, there would be no lenny bruce, no joan rivers, no richard pryor, no chris rock, no louis c.k., no billy connolly, no paul mooney, no dave chapelle.  we would all just have to listen to motherfuckin' hacks like paul reiser and rita rudner bitch about airline peanuts and their spouses' toilet habits.

fuck you and your mincing, thin fuckin' skin.

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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iwbiek wrote:i think george

iwbiek wrote:

i think george could have a lesson from louis c.k. here.  i love that guy.

I don't believe I have heard of Louis C.K.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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He's pretty awesome. He had

He's pretty awesome. He had a show for awhile that I didn't enjoy much, but that was a taste thing. He's done writing for pretty much everyone, and does a lot of standup.

My favourite comedian right now is Ricky Gervais though. Listening to him tear the bible apart was just crazy awesome.

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Vastet wrote:He's pretty

Vastet wrote:
He's pretty awesome. He had a show for awhile that I didn't enjoy much, but that was a taste thing. He's done writing for pretty much everyone, and does a lot of standup. My favourite comedian right now is Ricky Gervais though. Listening to him tear the bible apart was just crazy awesome.

which show?  he's had two.  one was "lucky louie," which was supposed to be a send-up of the traditional working-class family sitcom.  the problem was, it imitated the sitcom so perfectly that it was just as corny and unfunny.

the one he has now is just called "louie" and i think it's pure gold.  it's basically a series of vignettes that are sort of autobtographical interspersed with scenes from his stand-up.  it's had a lot of great guest-stars from the comedy world: leno, seinfeld, ricky gervais, sarah silverman, joan rivers, even david lynch (director of "eraserhead" ) guested a couple shows.

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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iwbiek wrote:yep, fuckin'

iwbiek wrote:

yep, fuckin' right it's just a joke.  i wish you and everybody else would keep your fuckin' hands off comedy.

i am a firm believer that NOTHING should be off-limits in comedy.  N-O-T-H-I-N-G.  to paraphrase joan rivers, humor is how we talk about and work through all the pain, all the degradation, all the stupidity that is humanity.  if a joke is bad, it's because the writing is bad, not because the subject matter is "politically incorrect" or "taboo."  if you think people make jokes about stereotypes only to perpetuate them, then that says more about your rotten perception than the comedian.

if people like you had their way, there would be no lenny bruce, no joan rivers, no richard pryor, no chris rock, no louis c.k., no billy connolly, no paul mooney, no dave chapelle.  we would all just have to listen to motherfuckin' hacks like paul reiser and rita rudner bitch about airline peanuts and their spouses' toilet habits.

fuck you and your mincing, thin fuckin' skin.

I agree. I have always been of the opinion that if a joke isn't offensive to someone, it probably isn't very funny and if you can't laugh at yourself or your own group, then you aren't very funny.  

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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Why So Serious?

Whoa, Defensive Much?  What's the matter, why are you getting so offended?  Did I say something you didn't like?  Man, you need to grow a thicker skin, after all,

"It's Just a Joke"
 

It's also nice that you clearly didn't actually read anything I wrote too closely, or you would have noticed the lil' paragraph I dedicated to pointing out that I'm not actually trying to stop anyone from making their offensively idiotic and damaging jokes, I'm just holding them accountable for what they say.  Comedy doesn't exist in some perfectly pure vacuum divorced from reality, nor is it some impossibly sacred thing that grants it absolute freedom from criticism.  Whether you like it or not, what you say has an actual effect in reality, and demanding that you be aware of that effect in no way impedes your ability to make the Joke.

Unless you feel some semblance of remorse over what you were joking about, in which case it sounds more like your conscience is the one preventing you from making the joke, not the person pointing out how damaging your "Jokes" can be.

But hey, what do I care, after all,

"It's Just a Joke"

When you say it like that you make it sound so Sinister...


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  Racist? Or Funny? Gift

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Sinphanius wrote:Whoa,

Sinphanius wrote:

Whoa, Defensive Much?  What's the matter, why are you getting so offended?  Did I say something you didn't like?  Man, you need to grow a thicker skin, after all,

"It's Just a Joke"
 

It's also nice that you clearly didn't actually read anything I wrote too closely, or you would have noticed the lil' paragraph I dedicated to pointing out that I'm not actually trying to stop anyone from making their offensively idiotic and damaging jokes, I'm just holding them accountable for what they say.  Comedy doesn't exist in some perfectly pure vacuum divorced from reality, nor is it some impossibly sacred thing that grants it absolute freedom from criticism.  Whether you like it or not, what you say has an actual effect in reality, and demanding that you be aware of that effect in no way impedes your ability to make the Joke.

Unless you feel some semblance of remorse over what you were joking about, in which case it sounds more like your conscience is the one preventing you from making the joke, not the person pointing out how damaging your "Jokes" can be.

But hey, what do I care, after all,

"It's Just a Joke"

don't flatter yourself.  i'm not offended at you as an individual, i'm offended at your whole smarmy ilk and the fact your kind has turned my country of birth into a place where nobody can say shit without being made a pariah.  thank god i live in europe now, where if somebody asks me "who's jim?" i can just cut to the chase and say "the black guy" without spending five minutes tip-toeing around the issue.

so i suppose we shouldn't make fun of religions because it might offend someone or "perpetuate stereotypes"?  because that's exactly the reasoning theists use.  what constitutes a "stereotype" and the perpetuation thereof is purely subjective, and i'm tired of pricks like you trying to take your subjective views and project them on objective reality.

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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Vastet wrote:He's pretty

Vastet wrote:
He's pretty awesome. He had a show for awhile that I didn't enjoy much, but that was a taste thing. He's done writing for pretty much everyone, and does a lot of standup. My favourite comedian right now is Ricky Gervais though. Listening to him tear the bible apart was just crazy awesome.

I like Ricky Gervais.

I am not usually big into comedy, but the few skits that I have caught of him are pretty good.

 

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


cj
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Racist and Funny

Uh, yeah - 'bout pee'd my pants. 

 

The difference is context.  The dude is at a comedy club - you are supposed to be offended.  And just about pee in your pants. 

Also notice, he doesn't spare his own ethnicity, either.  Couple of cans of Tecate, please, to go with the burritos for me.  Gracias.

 

PS - I'm white bread, but grew up in Southern Arizona, some of it rubbed off.  And I grew up with guys very like that dude.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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iwbiek wrote:which show? 

iwbiek wrote:
which show?  he's had two.  one was "lucky louie," which was supposed to be a send-up of the traditional working-class family sitcom.  the problem was, it imitated the sitcom so perfectly that it was just as corny and unfunny.

the one he has now is just called "louie" and i think it's pure gold.  it's basically a series of vignettes that are sort of autobtographical interspersed with scenes from his stand-up.  it's had a lot of great guest-stars from the comedy world: leno, seinfeld, ricky gervais, sarah silverman, joan rivers, even david lynch (director of "eraserhead" ) guested a couple shows.

Lucky Louie was the one. I didn't know he had a new show, I'll have to track some episodes down.

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I Found what I was looking for. YAY ME!

You're offended by my ilk turning comedians into Pariahs? Well I'm offended by your ilk (and your elk, seriously, fuck elk, coming in and taking the forest from the hard working deers, Go back where you came from, Elks!) coddling comics and trying to shield them from criticism. It is orphan suggested that people who can't take being offended shouldn't go to a stand up comedy show. I contend that that's fine, but if the comic can't handle criticism then what the fuck are they doing going up on stage in the first place?

Seriously though, are you even capable of reading at all?  No Post I've made has been calling for these comedians to stop making their jokes; I have only ever been pointing out that what one says influences the people who hear it and thus translates to actual real world effects, some of which may not be desirable or pleasant. This is not a difficult concept.  If the comic decides that they feel bad about their old joke and so stop making it, well that's their decision.  If they decide to double down, then they need to be prepared for the fire, and if that fire gets too much for them, well that's still a point where they need to make a decision.  If everyone turns against them, then maybe they were making a bad joke?  Maybe?  As much as I would like it, I'm not capable of controlling people's minds, If a bunch of people don't like a comic or their joke, I don't think I'm really the problem.

You can make fun of any group you want, but don't be surprised if that group starts fighting back. Comics, and you apparently, need to realize that the same freedom of speech that lets them make their jokes also lets me and mine criticize them for these jokes. You can say something, and if I don't like it, I'll tell you why I don't like it. If I think it is legitimately damaging, say by supporting the societal tendencies and thought patterns which lead to large groups of under-privileged individuals being regularly victimized and oppressed on a daily basis, I'll explain how and why, and ask you to stop.

FOR INSTANCE!

Did you know that exposure to sexist humour has been observed directly correlating with an increased willingness to tolerate sexist events? Because it totally has. Now to be perfectly fair, the study also suggests that exposure to sexist humour cannot, or at least does not significantly, instill sexist tendencies in the audience, it can only magnify the tendencies that are already there. For added fun, Here's another study testing and confirming the above and Here's a study concerning sexist humour and it's effect on Men's willingness to tolerate rape specifically. Funnily enough, the studies also showed that when the joke was critically examined, either willingly or after prompting or direct instruction, the audience was no longer so inclined to tolerate these events.

But hey

"It's Just a Joke"



P.S. Ah yes, you live in the gloriously enlightened Czech Republic (Königreich Böhmen for the cool kids who were fans of it before it sold out and went mainstream) right?  The Fabled land where Racism and Bigotry is completely exterminated!  Tell me, How are the Romani being treated these days? 

When you say it like that you make it sound so Sinister...


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cj wrote: The difference is

cj wrote:

 

The difference is context.  The dude is at a comedy club - you are supposed to be offended.  And just about pee in your pants. 

Also notice, he doesn't spare his own ethnicity, either.  Couple of cans of Tecate, please, to go with the burritos for me.  Gracias.

 

PS - I'm white bread, but grew up in Southern Arizona, some of it rubbed off.  And I grew up with guys very like that dude.

 

I mostly just smirked and chuckled. No peed pants.

“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)


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Quote:(and your elk,

Sinphanius wrote:
(and your elk, seriously, fuck elk, coming in and taking the forest from the hard working deers, Go back where you came from, Elks!)

Excellent, you have foresaken the evil moose and it's dark kin, and are ready to step into the light of the Great Panda.

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bah vastet, it will be the

bah vastet, it will be the mighty beaver that rules, it will drown the great panda and the elk, with the flooding of the lands!!!!!!!! Hail the mighty FURRY BEAVER!!!


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Foolish heretic, the Great

Foolish heretic, the Great Panda floats. Your schemes will not avail you a victory.

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Sinphanius wrote: I mean

Sinphanius wrote:
Yeah, Modern Humanity still has some pretty fucked up 'principles' regarding Sex.  Plus they still tend to have fucked up ideas about women in general, but especially female sexuality, women having jobs, independence, and in general women doing anything that they receive any personal benefit from whatsoever no matter how small it is.
And Sex Workers are like all of those put together.


We’re aware of politically and economically repressive systems that are maintained by physical force but we’re less aware of psychological repression which is maintained by verbal manipulation and coercion.  Being in the process of crossing the threshold from a belief in Power Over (dominance) to a belief in Personal Power (empowering others, mutuality and co-operation) it’s good to bring the subject into the open.


Sinphanius wrote:
… I have the freedom to point out how stupid and insulting it is, and how it carries real world effects by continuing to propagate a negative stereotype which causes actual harm to actual people, and how it makes Takei more than just a little Sexist..

Verbal Abuse:- ‘Words that attack or injure, that cause one to believe the false, or that speak falsely of one.  Verbal abuse constitutes psychological violence.’

Verbal abuse may be overt, usually angry outbursts and name calling or covert and very subtle. Overt verbal abuse is usually blaming and accusatory, covert verbal abuse is hidden aggression and its aim is to control without he other person knowing it.

In general verbal abuse is a means of maintaining control and Power Over an individual or group.  Verbal abuse prevents real relationships because aggression, whether open or subtle, destroys communication.

Sinphanius wrote:
I Imagine finding out that even generally cool guys like Takei can have malformed and bigoted opinions on subjects they aren't qualified to talk about came as a bit of a shock, which was only exacerbated when, after being called out on the problems of his views, he chose to double-down and deliver a backhanded apology, rather than accepting he was wrong.


‘Verbal Abuse as Jokes – abuse disguised as a joke is a type of verbal abuse which most abusers use. It takes a quick mind to come up with ways of disparaging another individual either crassly or with wit and style.  This kind of abuse is not done in jest.  It cuts to the quick, touches the most sensitive areas and leaves the abuser with a look of triumph.  The joke never seems funny (if it’s intended for you) because it isn’t funny.  It may also be obvious that the perpetrator's jokes don’t demonstrate good will or any interest in the other person other than to assert dominance and end any communication.’
‘The Verbally Abusive Relationship – How to Recognize it and how to Respond’ Patricia Evans

 

Oh, but Peggotty, you haven't given Mr. Barkis his proper answer, you know.
Charles Dickens


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iwbiek wrote:.... and i'm

iwbiek wrote:
.... and i'm tired of pricks like you trying to take your subjective views and project them on objective reality.

All of us take our subjective views and project them onto reality. The only ‘objective’ thing about reality is that it is different for everyone.

Nu 176 http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/32691?page=3

 

I quote no 'authorities'. I speak in my own words. I bring everything to the bar of my own judgment.


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Mr C O Jones wrote:iwbiek

Mr C O Jones wrote:

iwbiek wrote:
.... and i'm tired of pricks like you trying to take your subjective views and project them on objective reality.

All of us take our subjective views and project them onto reality. The only ‘objective’ thing about reality is that it is different for everyone.

Nu 176 http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/32691?page=3

 

i agree with you 100%.  i used "objective" for symmetry's sake, i confess.  a better term would be "empirical."  i don't really believe in "objective" reality at all, and the older i get the closer i get to rejecting ontology completely.

application: the lack of a truly (popperian) falsifiable ontology is just one more very good reason not to be a self-righteous prick.

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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The more I learn about

The more I learn about quantum physics the more I wonder if objective reality is even possible.

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latincanuck wrote:bah

latincanuck wrote:

bah vastet, it will be the mighty beaver that rules, it will drown the great panda and the elk, with the flooding of the lands!!!!!!!! Hail the mighty FURRY BEAVER!!!

Talking of furry beavers in a thread about strippers and offensive comedy, there is a punchline somewhere in there. 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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you got it.

Beyond Saving wrote:

latincanuck wrote:

bah vastet, it will be the mighty beaver that rules, it will drown the great panda and the elk, with the flooding of the lands!!!!!!!! Hail the mighty FURRY BEAVER!!!

Talking of furry beavers in a thread about strippers and offensive comedy, there is a punchline somewhere in there. 

 

 

                    Ahhhhh Beyond,  Vastet, Latin and myself; no doubt us Canadians love playing with beaver,   and the animals not bad eather.

 

 

 

"Very funny Scotty; now beam down our clothes."

VEGETARIAN: Ancient Hindu word for "lousy hunter"

If man was formed from dirt, why is there still dirt?


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Jeffrick

Jeffrick wrote:

 

 

                    Ahhhhh Beyond,  Vastet, Latin and myself; no doubt us Canadians love playing with beaver,   and the animals not bad eather.

 

 

 

 

Off topic here, but it seems like every good sci-fi show that I enjoy comes out of Canada.

Continuum, First Wave, Lost Girl, Being Human, The Dresden Files, and quite a few others.

Not saying that I watch all of those series and keep up with them.

BUT, when Continuum is on, NOBODY had better bother me or call me on the phone Smiling

Same thing with The Americans and Justified. Although both of those are made in USA.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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