Time names 'The Protester' as Person of the Year
Offline "The Protester" has been named Time's Person of the Year for 2011.
The selection was announced on NBC's The Today Show.
The magazine cited dissent across the Middle East that has spread to Europe and the United States and said these protesters are reshaping global politics.
Time said it is recognizing protesters because they are "redefining people power" around the world.
Last year, Facebook founder and CEO Mark Zuckerberg got the honour, which goes to the person the magazine believes most influenced events of the past year.
U.S. Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke received the honour in 2009.
The 2008 winner was then president-elect Barack Obama.
Other previous winners have included Bono, President George W. Bush and Amazon.com CEO and founder Jeff Bezos.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/12/14/time-person-year.html
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
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Sold to us by a private company. Now, maybe the people on top buy into corporate greed, but you cant say the people who work there do.
I totally agree with the protesters being the "people of the year". This is going on all over the world and it should send a message that you cannot get away with monopolies and expect the rest of us to take it.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Protestors in general; Libya, Egypt and now America with the The Occupy Movement. As long as the financial system remains the way it has been since Woodrow Wilson was in office, all the protesting in the world will only accomplish notoriety with very limited results. What needs to follow is action and if that doesn't happen, this protesting will become dead in the water. The "rebels" in those other countries had the right idea; sometimes violence produces results because, whether we like it or not, the very corruption they're fighting has more manpower and has known this kind of shit would happen eventually. It's only a matter of time before things get REALLY ugly. This pepper spray shit or that pregnant teen that was mildly beaten before being driven off? That's child's play compared to what may happen next.
Sometimes yes. But we are not living in Libya and we are not run by dictators in the west. And we have also had non violent movements in the west that have and do work. Don't underestimate that.
I think we do have the monopoly mindset on the run and we DO have plenty in the free press that agree with us.
I will say this. As much as I hate Beyond's mindset, I'd be the first to jump in front of him to protect him. He is a human first. I simply think he buys into a bad script. But he still has loved ones, he still would feel physical pain like me if harmed. And I still think, no matter how wrong he is, he still wants the best for this country as much as I do.
I am not willing to get violent with people we are not even close to even needing it. Our atheist movement outside global finances has worked and continues to grow and we haven't burned down one church or killed one theist. I don't think we need to treat economic issues any differently.
What we are doing here, and what people in the press and on the net whom agree with us is GROWING and continues to grow. There will be a point where they will have to give up and I don't think one ounce of blood has to be shed to achieve that.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Yeah, I noticed Beyond has this archaic-type of thinking in regards to health care, economics and the working class in general. Both my parents are like that. My dad is the smartest person I know and he still thinks dangerously close to the ideas that Beyond has. It's not his or my dad's fault, though; they grew up thinking that was the only way to go about being prosperous and useful in society just like the millions of others on this planet because any other deviation from that thinking meant starvation, suffering, sickness, being homeless and thought of as worthless. Of course, it's still like that today, but since technology and what not is more broad, a lot more of us have altered how we see our world, what we need to do to sustain life, etc. It's also not like a lot of people are given a choice to be in a position of privilege, either. My dad was screwed big time in that way and had to decide pretty damn quick what to do; either do nothing or join the army. Until that societal shift happens for the better of everyone, that mindset will remain and flourish unfortunately. I'm not willing to kill anyone to get my point across because that's not only primitive and meaningless, it's the last resort of a desperate man and also reflects that I would have learned nothing. Although I believe in non-violent ways to pander to every walk of life, the essence of the human race still depends heavily on the sword. I do hope these protests do work out with every fiber of my being. Since I signed on with The Zeitgeist Movement, we've been trying to encourage these guys to keep it up no matter how much the 1% gives them shit; in the long run, they will prevail if they stick to their guns and we will give them whatever support they need.
I agree. My own mom thinks like Beyond but lately she has become more relaxed with that attitude, especially now when she doesn't keep up with the price of everything. She keeps her books good, but I mean outside her retirement home she has no clue how everything has exploded.
And to Vaset, we both agree with your view of how things have gotten fucked up. But if we are to grow as species we need to continue to do what civil governments do, settle disputes through debate and through law. We learn nothing as a species if we continue the cycle of once the abused become the abuser.
Freud said it best "The first person to hurl an insult instead of a stone, started civilization".
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
Your morality will only hold you back so far. Then there will be blood.
War is the nature of the universe. Of life.
I'd be happy to be proven wrong, but I'm not holding my breath. As soon as the majority, or even a sufficiently powerful minority, has had enough, things will change violently and quickly. The rich are watching the sand fall through the hour glass and blaming the victims. From my view, time's pretty close to running out.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
How is this revolution supposed work? People that are too poor to pay their bills, where are they going to get the money for effective weapons? People that can't or won't train for jobs are going to train themselves to be soldiers? I don't think so. One of the privledges of wealth is that they can hire an army and police force to quickly squash any rebellion.
Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen
It doesn't take any money or skill to get and use a gun, especially in your country.
If your hypothesis had any validity you'd still be bowing to the queen of England, and Antoinette wouldn't be so famous for losing her head.
But the rich always make the same mistakes irrationally believing they're different somehow.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
But these were anti-tax revolutions. So it was people who worked hard that didn't want to get taxed any more(like the tea party). Whereas in this OWS revolution, you want higher taxes on producers to give to non-producers. I'm just saying how are people that are losing economically going to be winners militarily?
Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen
Unless you can show the Americans and the French revolutionaries had equal resources to their oppressors, my point stands.
And explain how this is different. The people are effectively having their wages taxed by corporations which don't pay them what they're worth. Effectively the same thing as both revolutions. The rich get greedy, the poor kill them. End of story.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Just in "People" won person of the year. Saying person of the year one would think that general terms would be excluded but whatever.
Whatever goes upon two legs is an enemy.
Whatever goes upon four legs, or has wings, is a friend.
No animal shall wear clothes.
No animal shall sleep in a bed.
No animal shall drink alcohol.
No animal shall kill any other animal.
All animals are equal.
You think money stopped Bolsheviks during the Russian Revolution? How about the Vietcong? What about the Cubans during Fidel Castro's rise to power? That term "soldier" is multi-facetted; a serf during the feudal age could grab a sword and instantly become a soldier given the right circumstances and a farmer during the Revolutionary War could be tossed a musket and shoot a red coat and be categorized as a minuteman or "soldier." It's all in the context in which you define it. A soldier that's trained or a person that grabs a weapon and happens to kill a trained soldier makes no difference to me. We're all capable of killing if circumstances permit and are present. Of course, murder or killing isn't in the equation I don't think for anyone on this board, but to rule it out completely is futile and a tad bit wishy-washy.
So, to downplay the populace just because they aren't well-funded is underestimating how resourceful a true "soldier" is.
I am NOT denying that reality. No matter what overthrow of whatever system has been set up is a result of a monopoly being created. But merely defeating that monopoly wont insure that abuse wont happen by the people who accomplish that defeat of that monopoly. Don't falsely use the "virtue of the oppressed". There is no such thing when dealing with a species that has always been capable of abuse and will always be capable of abuse.
I simply hope it does not have to get to that point. I think there are far too many people in the streets right now for those who robbed us to be ignored now. It is my hope that they wake up.
The only thing I can see happening is complacency hurting us. We have had bubbles for the past 30 years and recoveries that have constantly lulled us back into that false sense of security. I think the problem is far to big now to allow that to happen.
And again, while violence is part of our evolution, it is not the only aspect of our evolution. In fact violence world wide, despite what the media sells constantly, as strictly a per capita ratio, has been going down. That says to me we are more and more becoming aware that we can control our violent side.
I think the internet is allowing the people who got screwed all over the world to pool together. And it is allowing us to see more and more that basic needs and not labels matter more. And it also allows us to protest non-violently more and more.
I'd lean towards more of a verbal Malcolm X and a physical Martin Luther king. I know the history of this country and all the horrible things it has done to minorities and the poor. But it has also allowed the trend to get away from those abuses. Rome wasn't built in a day. And no matter what you do, even when you win, there will still never be such a thing as a utopia.
Right now I am not that fearful that I need to pick up a weapon. But don't worry, as much as I love this country, if it gets that bad, I would leave. Just like Mexicans get desperate enough to come here to find work. I think they should be protesting their government as well too.
And even if it got to that point, I still dont know if I could bring myself to kill another human. Life is a fight over resources which will always be a part of evolution. But at the same time we also have the capability of compassion, and that too is part of our evolution. I'd like to think that we can do better than what was done to us, and the only way to do that is to remember the abuses of the past.
Forgot who said it, "Those who fail to remember history are doomed to repeat it".
I just see too much tribalism and division in humanity and I simply don't want to add to it. People want different things and people want money to different degrees, anything you set up is going to have to take that into account. I'd be for a mandatory gap ratio via law, where if the top makes more they automatically have to pay the bottom more. I am for less of a pay gap and free health care and free education. But I don't want to see the end of the open market because of the abuse we currently suffer. It hasn't always been this bad and we can fix the problems without scrapping the entire system.
Even our more socialistic friends in Europe have private industry. I think what we do is take the best of both and keep checks and balances on both government and the private sector.
But we do need to get the goons who caused this mess put on trial. And we do need to get rid of the politicians who allow themselves to get bought by money. I would be for a ban on private money funding politics an for public funding on politics. I do want us to get to a more balanced system where the vote of the middle class and poor count equally, which right now, it does not.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
My post was to EXC, not you.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
When the last Investment banker is hung with the guts of the last CEO... it will be over.
LC >;-}>
Christianity: A disgusting middle eastern blood cult, based in human sacrifice, with sacraments of cannibalism and vampirism, whose highest icon is of a near naked man hanging in torment from a device of torture.
Sorry.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog
No worries
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
As far as the American revolution, it was producers fed up with being taxed too much and getting nothing in return. It was middle class as well as wealthy that supported it. Those that favored the British were those that benefited off the unfair system of taxation and special 'rights' granted by the king. The British gave up when the war was costing them more than they could collect in taxes.
You apparently want to go back to the British system high taxation.
Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen
Thank you Brian for proving my point. People are in the position they are in because they have been complacent procrastinators their whole lives. So how they suddenly going to change their nature when it comes to fighting a rebellion?
Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen
Which is the problem today. Only difference is that instead of an obvious tax, they've simply shaved the top off of wages to begin with.
And it is the attempted destruction of the middle class that will support it now. As well as many wealthy who recognise the situation for what it is.
Which is hopefully what will happen to the rich. Once profits are sufficiently diminished, they'll give up on screwing the little guy.
The alternative is their violent replacement.
Taxes aren't a problem as long as they are spent productively, for the benefit of the society which pays them; and as long as they do not exceed the ability of the society to pay.
I pay about as much tax as you do (less in some ways, more in others), but I get a hell of a lot more from my taxes.
Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.
Stop it. Blame the middle class and blame the poor is a fucking bullshit argument.
The only thing we are guilty of is being conned by a monopolized government and a monopolized consumption extraction market lead by corporate goons.
Sorry, if you don't like the uppity peasants getting wise to the scam, but we have and we are. I am simply warning us not to allow those at the top throw us crumbs and get lulled into another corporate bubble that will blow up in our face in the future and get dumped on us again.
If you seriously think poor people are lazy go into a Micky Ds or tell a trash collector TO THEIR FACE they are lazy. You cant and you wont because you know that someone will react to the point you wouldn't like. The protesters at least right now are being civil. I'd suggest YOU change your attitude before it goes beyond words.
We outnumber you and we are NOT buying your bullshit argument any more.
NOW, you can listen to us now, or listen to us later when we win, it is up to you how this goes. But what you will not get away with demonizing those who dont have what you have.
You, "MOMMY MOMMY THERE ARE OTHER PEOPLE WITH OTHER THOUGHTS AND THEY AREN'T FOLLOWING MY SCRIPT TO LIFE" Sorry, life doesn't work that way, welcome to reality.
Your projectionist garbage is as bad as "you deserve to burn in hell because you don't believe in Jesus."
Same dogmatism different topic.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under Brian James Rational Poet, @Brianrrs37 on Twitter and my blog at www.brianjamesrationalpoet.blog