American Atheist - Did Jesus Exist
Offline http://www.atheists.org/Did_Jesus_Exist%3F
Would you say that this is a pretty good article on the existence of Jesus? Or is it sloppy research, etc? My friend tells me I am being naive about not believing Jesus even existed, there really is no conclusive evidence that Jesus did exist that I have read. Am I missing something??
I'm sorry if I am annoying asking you guys all these questions, I'm just new on my journey!
Thanks
Anarchism is the only philosophy which brings to man the consciousness of himself; which maintains that God, the State, and society are non-existent, that their promises are null and void, since they can be fulfilled only through man's subordination. Anarchism is therefore the teacher of the unity of life; not merely in nature, but in man.
Emma Goldman
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I have always been willing to give them their jesus figure. There probably was a guy that ran around saying he was the son of a god. His name probably wasn't jesus though. People still do that to this day, why wouldn't they have done it back then? It seems to hamper their cause more than bolster it imo.
Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin
I'll go with he didn't exist. We do have some of the writings of a contemporary historian, Philo.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philo
He goes on about lots of trivia, but never mentions a messiah named Jesus or someone rising from the dead. Which you think would have been talked about.
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
Christians would probably say that Philo did not live in Jerusalem and might be unaware of Jesus. I would be really interested to find out if there were known historians actually living in Jerusalem during the proposed dead of Jesus. Any clue?
I'd have to go search, and I'm not up for it this evening. But, consider this, the Romans had a lot of other writings about Jerusalem and other parts of the Middle East. Some of it real niggling details. Who could miss an event like someone rising from the dead?
-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.
"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken
"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.
I hate sounding like a broken record.
"Did a man named Jesus exist?"
DOESN'T MATTER EITHER WAY.
We know George Washington existed. We know Obama exists. We know Bush exists.
But how many sane people would claim that any of them could fart a Lamborghini out of their asses?
I can prove that the city of New York exists, but that doesn't mean I can prove a man called Superman existed because some people liked the movie series so much they wanted to believe it so badly they wouldn't accept that it was just a movie.
Jesus was a common name back then, like Jim and Jane are today. The idea of a hero or "Kristos" was also common back then. I have no doubt that a group of people who decided to start a new cult rallied around a soothsayer that promised the world to everyone.
Christianity exists today, not because of a man, but because of the human desire to want to belong, and back then to stand out and make your way, you needed effective marketing, no different than humans today. And marketing is not interested in truth, it is interested in spreading.
Christianity, just like Coke and Pepsi, have nothing to do with pragmatism and everything to do with emotionalism and marketing.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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There is questionable evidence on this, which I think is shocking to most people given Jesus' stature as a historical figure, not just a religious one. If you're really looking into this, check into the controversy surrounding the references to Jesus in the historian Josephus, who was a historian writing in the first century AD. It seems as though the references are add-ons, they do not follow the appropriate flow/style of Josephus' writing. There are also only two or three (if I remember this correctly) references total; but again, if Jesus did any of the things the Bible records him as doing, one would think there would be entire historical volumes written about the man. Raising the dead would be a pretty big deal right?
In the documentary Religulous, they briefly flash on the screen the remarkable (and I do mean remarkable) similarities between the myths about Jesus and myths of earlier pagan deities, including Apollo and Bacchus. Earlier deities - ones that were venerated hundreds and thousands of years before Jesus - turned water into wine, were baptized in a river, raised the dead, etc., etc. That's awfully revealing about the myths surrounding Jesus, although it leaves open the question of whether there was a historical figure. There are some fascinating books on this - I've read through The Jesus Mysteries by Timothy Freke and Paul Gandy and would definitely recommend it.
Had I a time machine, I think that we would have found someone named Jesus about the same time period that is the basis for the legends that grew around him. That said, while we'll never know for sure, I think it's at least reasonable to conclude that Jesus didn't even exist from the lack of the contemporaries of him noting the fact that god was running around Jerusalem.