Do Bad Things Happen to Bad People?

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Do Bad Things Happen to Bad People?

Hey guys! I haven't posted on here in a long time, but this is something that I was pondering, and I thought it would be interesting to hear some others' opinions on this. We always hear stories of bad things that happen to good people, and for many of us, this may contribute to our disbelief - but do bad things happen to bad people?

Personally, I don't believe in karma as a literal spiritual force, but I do kind of believe that "the universe unfolds as it should," to quote Harold and Kumar. Most of the people who have been bad from my perspective, either to me personally or just in general, have eventually met with what they, in my estimation, deserved. Do others agree with this mantra, or does your personal experience or knowledge say otherwise?


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When bad things happen to

When bad things happen to the people that were bad to you, was this the result of punishment from others. As in they were bad as a kid, they then ended up in prison, because that is just social justice. Or was it more like random stuff?

Because the people that I knew that were bad either ended up in prison or in bad relationships, bad jobs because they did not get along with people. This is just social justice at work.

Some ended up in car accidents or became crime victims because of their wild ways.

The rest of the "bad karma" like getting a disease was kind of random, it happened to 'good' and 'bad'. So I don't think there is any mystery force at work here. And no science to back up any of this karma stuff. Humans look for patterns in chaos even when there is none.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


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"Define bad"...

"Define bad"...


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Good and bad things happen

Good and bad things happen to both good and bad people. Sometimes good things don't happen to good people, and sometimes bad things don't happen to bad people. We perceive the latter two cases as unfair. Good things and bad things can be random (winning the lottery, getting run over by a bus) or the result of situations people have gotten themselves into.

 

Hitler was a bad person. And he ended up in a ditch, covered in petrol, on fire...

 

 

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 As a generality, yes.  I

 As a generality, yes.  I think bad things do happen to bad people, but I don't believe they necessarily create any kind of balance.  That is, I don't know if I believe that the degree of "bad" that happens to bad people negates the gains they get from being bad in most cases.  Consider that most politicians are "bad" people, in that they knowingly and willingly bilk lots and lots of money from lots of people while catering to the interests of lobby groups.  And most of them retire very wealthy.  They may have a lot of people that hate them, but that much money can still buy a lot of happiness.

 

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That's simple. There is the

That's simple. There is the law of action and reaction, extended by the law of rebirth. For example, if I was someone rich, powerful and careless in my past life, I might have sent many people to death, slavery or harem. These people will be angry, but they won't do anything, because in this life I have power and money and they have nothing.
But when I die, my soul will evaluate that being so rich and powerful wasn't a good choice, so it will try to incarnate me as a normal guy, preferably poor and weak. And similarly, the souls of oppressed people will try the opposite experience, because being poor and oppressed didn't work out very well for them.
And so I might get born as a normal guy, go to school, and have a lot of people bullying me at school for no reason at all. This is how they will return the favor.

And so people stagger from incarnation to incarnation, from extreme to extreme. The true purpose is to be free from extremes and develop the golden middle way, that is narrow like knife's edge and crooked like intestines. Here I used the example of self-preservation, the virtue is to preserve myself, but not on the detriment of others, to not let myself be oppressed but not harm other people. There are also other disciplines of life than self-preservation, but that's the most basic discipline.

So basically, bad things happen to people who were bad in the past but not necessarily now. They may also happen out of some dick's free will. For example, there's no way how whole Indian peninsula full of poor people could earn that for being bad in past life. That is karma (action and reaction) of Indian government and what economical decisions it made.


Someone might say that I see karma as a spiritual force or heavenly account of sins, but that is not correct. I see karma as a force, a momentum contained within objects. It can be measured, manipulated to some degree, transferred, and even diminished by specific counteractions. It can be personal, heredital, collective, global and so on, just like momentum can be. We seemingly don't move, but Earth rotates with us, orbits with us, solar system moves and even galaxy itself moves. Similarly it is with karma, it's not a direct action and result, it's a content of momentums and relationships with various vectors within a system that is within even more complex system. In a complex system, effects can be preserved for a long time, until they show up visibly on the surface at some moment.

It's interesting that for lesser "sinners" karma works much faster than for the greater. Obviously, lesser burden of karmic momentum makes the reaction faster. A system that is clogged with karmic tasks to carry out will move very slowly, just like a ball that is pressed on from several directions will be slow, because opposite vectors less or more negate each other.

I wonder if anyone understood me. Imagine it as a billiards ball.

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Luminon wrote: It's

Luminon wrote:

 

It's interesting that for lesser "sinners" karma works much faster than for the greater. Obviously, lesser burden of karmic momentum makes the reaction faster. A system that is clogged with karmic tasks to carry out will move very slowly, just like a ball that is pressed on from several directions will be slow, because opposite vectors less or more negate each other.

I wonder if anyone understood me. Imagine it as a billiards ball.

I imagine it more like a giant turd that just can't be flushed because it is too big to fit in the toilet drain. It's a soul that just lingers in this world because it's so full of shit. No amount of plunging can get that thing to move.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


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AKA

Luminon wrote:

It's interesting that for lesser "sinners" karma works much faster than for the greater. Obviously, lesser burden of karmic momentum makes the reaction faster. A system that is clogged with karmic tasks to carry out will move very slowly, just like a ball that is pressed on from several directions will be slow, because opposite vectors less or more negate each other.

"Let no good deed go unpunished"

“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)


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greek goddess wrote:Does Bad Things Happen to Bad People

   Sure !!!,they're more likely to have bad things happen to them and not because of Karma or Harold and Kumar,but because life is very complex.Some people are dealt a bad hand in life,some people are socio-paths and some people are just F<>KED UP. And then you got you good persons who just can't catch a break.Life is so complex that's why we have problems.  Life is like a box of chocolate

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I'm assuming your question

I'm assuming your question is, do bad things happen more to bad people than they do to good people? I'm not sure, but if it does, I think it would have to do with the way individuals and their societies function.

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


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It depends on the use of the

It depends on the use of the term "Bad"...

There are many "bad" people... those whoa have been born into wealth and have no regard for their fellow human being and who make decisions at the expense of the population for their own profit , .... They are probably not due any Karmic retribution, because they live in their own bubble... What can we say to make ourselves feel better about such scumbags?... That they'll never know the joys of a  greasy, 3AM burger, or doing jell-o shots off a strippers stomach? Well that may be true, But i am sure they are consoling themselves by Yachting in the medataranian and having their servants performing fellatio at their whimsy... If we wait for Ken Lewis to "get his"... then I am afraid we better hope that he is re-incarnated as a crack whore, otherwise dwelling on such things will surely drive one insane...

The other definition of "Bad" people... Moreover those who enact violence will most probably get their due...simply because they wioll eventually be on the receiving end of what they sow...and then there is always Jail...delightful place, but a step up from Newark... Which is why TV News offers us robbers 7 muggers on the evening news... its like Pro Wrestling... we get to see the "Good Guys" win...

But fear not...No matter how few of these contemptable, feckless, blue Blooded elitists even have a concience to bother...Human nature prevents any of us from being "happy" all the time...


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EXC wrote:When bad things

EXC wrote:

When bad things happen to the people that were bad to you, was this the result of punishment from others. As in they were bad as a kid, they then ended up in prison, because that is just social justice. Or was it more like random stuff?

Because the people that I knew that were bad either ended up in prison or in bad relationships, bad jobs because they did not get along with people. This is just social justice at work.

Some ended up in car accidents or became crime victims because of their wild ways.

The rest of the "bad karma" like getting a disease was kind of random, it happened to 'good' and 'bad'. So I don't think there is any mystery force at work here. And no science to back up any of this karma stuff. Humans look for patterns in chaos even when there is none.

 

Oh I wasn't saying that there is any actual karma or mysterious force. And I know that it's really random. I guess my theory is closer to the social justice you were mentioning (I didn't realize there was a name for it). Those that do things that are a detriment to other individuals or society, are likely to reap what they sow.

I think that people that behave a certain way can get away with it for awhile, but eventually people learn to see through it and so that person is no longer able to benefit from trying to "cheat" at life. Like for an example, someone who doesn't respect people is unlikely to gain respect back after awhile. Someone who mooches off their friends is likely to lose those friends. Someone who makes a habit of robbing houses is likely to get caught and pay the price.

 

 


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Kapkao wrote:"Define

Kapkao wrote:

"Define bad"...

 

"Bad" as a concept will differ from person to person. For me, it can be any of a number of qualities in people I hate. For instance, I loathe people that are overly cocky or full of themselves. I suppose this isn't exactly "bad" in every context, but it still is satisfying to see people like this run into some kind of difficulty.

 

 


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Luminon wrote:Someone might

Luminon wrote:


Someone might say that I see karma as a spiritual force or heavenly account of sins, but that is not correct. I see karma as a force, a momentum contained within objects. It can be measured, manipulated to some degree, transferred, and even diminished by specific counteractions. It can be personal, heredital, collective, global and so on, just like momentum can be. We seemingly don't move, but Earth rotates with us, orbits with us, solar system moves and even galaxy itself moves. Similarly it is with karma, it's not a direct action and result, it's a content of momentums and relationships with various vectors within a system that is within even more complex system. In a complex system, effects can be preserved for a long time, until they show up visibly on the surface at some moment.

It's interesting that for lesser "sinners" karma works much faster than for the greater. Obviously, lesser burden of karmic momentum makes the reaction faster. A system that is clogged with karmic tasks to carry out will move very slowly, just like a ball that is pressed on from several directions will be slow, because opposite vectors less or more negate each other.

I wonder if anyone understood me. Imagine it as a billiards ball.

 

Aw I understand you Luminon! Yes, I think you're on to something with the "action and reaction" that you were talking about. Unlike you, I don't believe that there is an actual karmic force, and I don't believe in reincarnation. But I do think that, for instance, people who disregard the feelings of others, are bound to have that blow up in their face. Soon, other people won't want to be around someone like that. They will lose friends, and maybe even jobs.

I also agree with you that "lesser sinners" tend to see a reaction much faster than "greater sinners." Right now, there are a couple people who I don't consider to be good people, because of things that they've done, but I have yet to see anything "bad" enough to make up for those things happen to them. If you're allowed to, maybe you can use your psychic powers to send a little bad karma their way?

 

 


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greek goddess wrote:I think

greek goddess wrote:

I think that people that behave a certain way can get away with it for awhile, but eventually people learn to see through it and so that person is no longer able to benefit from trying to "cheat" at life. Like for an example, someone who doesn't respect people is unlikely to gain respect back after awhile. Someone who mooches off their friends is likely to lose those friends. Someone who makes a habit of robbing houses is likely to get caught and pay the price.

 

I guess that depends on how you look at it. You said that someone who makes a habit of robbing houses is likely to get caught. This is a bad thing that is only going to happen to a "bad" person. This will never happen to a person who is not "bad" because such a person does not rob houses and has nothing to get caught for.

 

However, this is a rather naive way of looking at it. This is because every time a person succesfully robs a house, that person reaps benefits from the success of the robbery such as the gain in money and property. A person who is not "bad" will not experience the same benefits. I think the correct way of looking at this is to evaluate whether or not the expected value of the action leans more towards the positive outcome or the negative outcome. This will obviously vary wildly on a case by case basis. I think that more often than not, the possible benefits of the actions "bad" people commit outweigh the possible consequences. This is because in most cases they will weigh their options before acting and act in the way they perceive benefits them the most.

 In other words, I think that in some cases "bad" people are worse off for their actions, but in most cases, they are better off. Otherwise, they would act differently.

 

I don't understand why the Christians I meet find it so confusing that I care about the fact that they are wasting huge amounts of time and resources playing with their imaginary friend. Even non-confrontational religion hurts atheists because we live in a society which is constantly wasting resources and rejecting rational thinking.


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I would characterize a

I would characterize a person who treated their friends badly as "bad", but I wouldn't necessarily say that losing those friends constituted something bad happening to them. It would be bad if they could behave in such a way and continue to have friends. Losing the friends is actually a positive development.

Burglary however, from my experience is usually committed for good reasons (like needing money). I wouldn't say that someone is a bad person just because they are a burglar. It goes without saying that it's bad for the person being burgled, but the burglars are not the miscreants who foisted stupid fucking neo-liberal policies on everyone to mow down any civic institutions that constitute the welfare state or social safety net, criminalizing social problems. The mother fuckers who do that are bad and nothing bad ever seems to happen to them. They shit in solid gold toilet bowls. So to answer your question... maybe.

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Hambydammit wrote: As a

Hambydammit wrote:

 As a generality, yes.  I think bad things do happen to bad people, but I don't believe they necessarily create any kind of balance.  That is, I don't know if I believe that the degree of "bad" that happens to bad people negates the gains they get from being bad in most cases.  Consider that most politicians are "bad" people, in that they knowingly and willingly bilk lots and lots of money from lots of people while catering to the interests of lobby groups.  And most of them retire very wealthy.  They may have a lot of people that hate them, but that much money can still buy a lot of happiness.

 

 

 

 

This is an interesting point. I guess it depends on the individual-in-question's priorities. For instance, a politician who emphasizes financial gain might not care that he loses citizens' respect. But a decline in reputation might bother other politicians more.

Maybe the punished person might view their punishment as adequate retribution, while an outsider would say that it's not enough. Or vice versa. I guess it's tough to make up any rules about balance and justice in this case. I'm really just thinking aloud here, and don't have anything to add to or argue about your post. I just thought that it was an interesting idea.

 

 


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greek goddess wrote:"Bad" as

greek goddess wrote:
"Bad" as a concept will differ from person to person. For me, it can be any of a number of qualities in people I hate. For instance, I loathe people that are overly cocky or full of themselves. I suppose this isn't exactly "bad" in every context, but it still is satisfying to see people like this run into some kind of difficulty.

If it's arrogant, cocky, overconfident, and unduly antagonistic individuals with an overly inflated sense of self-worth (the likes of which often fill the roles of 'villains' in storybooks) that you are referring to,  the concept is relatively simple: narcissism.

American Heritage Dictionary wrote:

nar·cis·sism 
n. 
   1.      Excessive love or admiration of oneself. See Synonyms at conceit.
   2.      A psychological condition characterized by self-preoccupation, lack of empathy, and unconscious deficits in self-esteem.
   3.      Erotic pleasure derived from (blablablablabla irrelevence)
   4.      The attribute of the human psyche charactized by admiration of oneself but within normal limits.

So basically, "full of themselves"=narcissism.

 

Shocker #1: everyone's narcissistic...

...errrr at least to some limited extent or another.   That's right! When ever you or someone else is in pain, under a lot of stress, is horrifically grieved in some way, is incredibly angry/frustrated... it's narcissism in motion, from that point onward.

Narcissism is basically a coping mechanism to allow someone to recover from psychological trauma.

It's also a mental pattern that is established early in neonatal/fetal developmental stages. A baby can sometimes be quite a selfish little creature, after all.

However, if such a baby grows into a 'less than nurturing' environment, the baby grows  up while retaining that self-absorbed "ME! ME! ME!" attitude for the rest of it's life. It develops a narcissistic personality*. (The link is kind of TL;DR, but still relevant)

Such an individual NEVER sees themselves as "doing wrong" in the world. This is the type of individual does not understand how others see them, they simply understand that they  *WANT* to be perceived in a certain way.


The conundrum of this entire thread is that once a person becomes "bad"... they usually never realizes how their actions affect others. They don't foresee the moral consequences of their behavior. This is because there wasn't anyone around to give them a solid understanding of "right" and "wrong".

And an even more mind boggling conundrum is supported by modern psychology:

Bad things cause bad people.

Case example: Aileen Wuornos

 

“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)


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in many ways goddess I guess

in many ways goddess I guess that's kinda the concept of Karma, you do bad you receive bad, you do good you receive good. Of course I know you don't mean some mysterious force or anything, but more like what luminon was saying about action/reaction. I guess in many ways they get what they dish out due to the fact that their behavior gives an appropriate response for that action/behavior.

A few folks that I have dealt with in the past, were what we call bad guys, drug dealers, gangbangers, killers, thugs, thieves etc, etc, etc. Some viewed themselves that way others (mainly the thieves) didn't view themselves as bad, however their actions got a reaction that basically in many ways, some would say is the karmic effect of their actions/behaviors. For example, I have had the unpleasant fortune to have had to deal with some murderers, all of them thankfully are now in jail serving long sentences, but one that always sticks out was this russian guy, he had killed 5 people in russia, 1 in the states, he was at one point a big time heroin dealer, imported millions to the US and abroad. yet got addicted to heroin, and got caught stealing a 20 dollar item....later to die in a car accident when he arrived in Russia. Some would say this is Karmic justice. To me its just circumstances, yet those circumstances lead to his death, if he hadn't got hooked on heroin who knows where he might be now.

Same goes for bullies, just wanna be bad asses, etc, etc, etc. Their behavior/action get them a response that many would consider to be bad, be it jail time, some time of permanent injury, death or whatever else happens that we as individuals and as a society view as bad.

However, this of course doesn't always happen, some people get to live their lives and die at an old age, such as Stalin or Lenin, Mao, or various other people, that nothing really bad happens to them, at least not to the scale the one could say, oh yeah that's some karmic justice for ya.

Bad happens to good and bad people, I personally believe however that the more of a "bad" person you are, the more chances are that bad things will happen because people that you hurt will make it happen.


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greek goddess wrote:Aw I

greek goddess wrote:



Aw I understand you Luminon! Yes, I think you're on to something with the "action and reaction" that you were talking about. Unlike you, I don't believe that there is an actual karmic force, and I don't believe in reincarnation. But I do think that, for instance, people who disregard the feelings of others, are bound to have that blow up in their face. Soon, other people won't want to be around someone like that. They will lose friends, and maybe even jobs.


I also believe that, but the question is when. People often never change. As a beginner astrologer and son of an astrologer I see psychologic qualities that are either exaggerated, or subdued. People stagger from extreme to extreme, for example in one lifetime they never care about feelings of others and in another they slave for everyone's whims. Rarely the character trait is balanced. Why is that so, that can't be explained only by genetics or upbringing.



I was actually inspired by Paul Kammerer's mathemathical work Law of Seriality. (Das gesetz de serie) He formulated some revolutionary statements, like that system put into chaos by external force tends to eventually regain a new state similar to the previous form. Lower systems don't disappear, but are integrated into greater systems, and influence them. He practically gave a mathemathical basis for reincarnation, astrology and higher dimensions, a.k.a. esoteric higher realms.



greek goddess wrote:
I also agree with you that "lesser sinners" tend to see a reaction much faster than "greater sinners." Right now, there are a couple people who I don't consider to be good people, because of things that they've done, but I have yet to see anything "bad" enough to make up for those things happen to them. If you're allowed to, maybe you can use your psychic powers to send a little bad karma their way?


We can use our psychic powers to support balance. I don't know if it's my karma (if I harmed that person in some past life) or if that person is just a jackass. So the psychic powers should be used for balance, in any form. The source of this power is an ability to cooperate with one's own soul, which is a way of personal development to perfection.



My mom had a problem at work with one person. She empowered the balance, and the result was a highly improbable accident with electricity that involved the person's son. Later events showed that my mom's work was correct and that person's work was faulty.


But there is a lot of ifs. I did what I could, but the best on this technique is, that it's done from soul's perspective. The soul is aware of all karmic relationships and does what is in the true best interest of everyone, i.e. including nothing if my request is not justified. (it seems my intuition says the permission was not given) If anything happens, you can let me know.

Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.


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Kapkao wrote:And an even

Kapkao wrote:

And an even more mind boggling conundrum is supported by modern psychology:

Bad things cause bad people.

Case example: Aileen Wuornos

 

 

Another interesting perspective! I never thought of it from the other way round.

 

I googled Aileen Wuornos, as I had not heard of her before. What a sad, but interesting story. This definitely gives me food for thought.

 

 


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latincanuck wrote:in many

latincanuck wrote:

in many ways goddess I guess that's kinda the concept of Karma, you do bad you receive bad, you do good you receive good. Of course I know you don't mean some mysterious force or anything, but more like what luminon was saying about action/reaction. I guess in many ways they get what they dish out due to the fact that their behavior gives an appropriate response for that action/behavior.

A few folks that I have dealt with in the past, were what we call bad guys, drug dealers, gangbangers, killers, thugs, thieves etc, etc, etc. Some viewed themselves that way others (mainly the thieves) didn't view themselves as bad, however their actions got a reaction that basically in many ways, some would say is the karmic effect of their actions/behaviors. For example, I have had the unpleasant fortune to have had to deal with some murderers, all of them thankfully are now in jail serving long sentences, but one that always sticks out was this russian guy, he had killed 5 people in russia, 1 in the states, he was at one point a big time heroin dealer, imported millions to the US and abroad. yet got addicted to heroin, and got caught stealing a 20 dollar item....later to die in a car accident when he arrived in Russia. Some would say this is Karmic justice. To me its just circumstances, yet those circumstances lead to his death, if he hadn't got hooked on heroin who knows where he might be now.

Same goes for bullies, just wanna be bad asses, etc, etc, etc. Their behavior/action get them a response that many would consider to be bad, be it jail time, some time of permanent injury, death or whatever else happens that we as individuals and as a society view as bad.

However, this of course doesn't always happen, some people get to live their lives and die at an old age, such as Stalin or Lenin, Mao, or various other people, that nothing really bad happens to them, at least not to the scale the one could say, oh yeah that's some karmic justice for ya.

Bad happens to good and bad people, I personally believe however that the more of a "bad" person you are, the more chances are that bad things will happen because people that you hurt will make it happen.

 

Just wanted to say that I pretty much agree with you. Thanks for your thoughts!

 

 


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Well, speaking personally, I

Well, speaking personally, I have a problem with the idea of defining people as inherently good or bad. It seem to me that people are not so easy to categorize. Then too, stuff is not always going to fall into easy categories either.

 

We all have our own ideas of what is good and what is bad. We do not automatically agree with each other on the specifics.

 

On people: Is a sadist a bad person? Most people would say yes. Except of course for masochists. In fact, many years ago, I knew someone who absolutely lived to fuck with people whom he saw as vulnerable. He would never act against anyone who had a more “alpha” personality than he did but he would mess with people whom he could make feel bad.

 

Well, eventually, he ended up in a situation where a bunch of his victims ganged up on him. I was present to witness this but I sat it out myself. However, the “sadist” went down way to early. Almost instantly in fact. Once he was on the ground, people were kicking him like a dog. For a short time anyway.

 

The people who were ganking him quickly realized that he was actually enjoying the beating. Apparently, he was a closeted masochist and the whole messing with weaker people thing was what he did because he liked to get the crap kicked out of him. Once that became clear, his attackers fell away.

 

So was this sadist guy a bad person for what he did to deserve a beating? Were the people who eventually ganked him bad for beating him? Were the same people bad because once the knew the score, they refused to beat him further?

 

Similarly, I could come up with other examples where the whole good/bad dichotomy really doesn't come up clearly.

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Answers in Gene Simmons

Answers in Gene Simmons wrote:

Well, speaking personally, I have a problem with the idea of defining people as inherently good or bad. It seem to me that people are not so easy to categorize. Then too, stuff is not always going to fall into easy categories either.

 

We all have our own ideas of what is good and what is bad. We do not automatically agree with each other on the specifics.

 

On people: Is a sadist a bad person? Most people would say yes. Except of course for masochists. In fact, many years ago, I knew someone who absolutely lived to fuck with people whom he saw as vulnerable. He would never act against anyone who had a more “alpha” personality than he did but he would mess with people whom he could make feel bad.

 

Well, eventually, he ended up in a situation where a bunch of his victims ganged up on him. I was present to witness this but I sat it out myself. However, the “sadist” went down way to early. Almost instantly in fact. Once he was on the ground, people were kicking him like a dog. For a short time anyway.

 

The people who were ganking him quickly realized that he was actually enjoying the beating. Apparently, he was a closeted masochist and the whole messing with weaker people thing was what he did because he liked to get the crap kicked out of him. Once that became clear, his attackers fell away.

 

So was this sadist guy a bad person for what he did to deserve a beating? Were the people who eventually ganked him bad for beating him? Were the same people bad because once the knew the score, they refused to beat him further?

 

Similarly, I could come up with other examples where the whole good/bad dichotomy really doesn't come up clearly.

 

Good/Bad is a moral dichotomy, and it's difficult to apply all that effectively when a person (like yourself) is capable of critically thinking about the concepts being discussed. HOWEVER:

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Then too, stuff is not always going to fall into easy categories either.

Well, sorry to disagree staunchly, but brain scans (MRI, I think) have been done to illustrate that a specific region of the brain is responsible for "right or wrong; consequences of my actions".

In sociopaths, the region is COMPLETELY inert. Nothing... not even a 'twilight glimmer' of radioglucose usage is present. These individuals have no understanding of right/wrong. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Nil.

They do understand aggression, threat assessment, and predatory behavior quite well.

“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)


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must resist temptation........

Can't resist.

 

Answers in Gene Simmons wrote:

So was this sadist guy a bad person for what he did to deserve a beating? Were the people who eventually ganked him bad for beating him? Were the same people bad because once the knew the score, they refused to beat him further?

 

 

The masochist says, "hurt me! hurt me!"

 

The sadist says, "no."

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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 Two words off the top of

 Two words off the top of my head:

Jerry. Falwell.

 

The man died happier than a vagrant from Detroit getting a lapdance on the house. 

 

What about Henry Kissinger? William Jefferson Clinton? Richard Cheney? Pat Robertson? Joseph Ratzinger? Ioseb Vissarionovich? Ronald & Nancy Reagan? Richard Nixon? 

 

I'm sorry, but no, I don't think bad people often receive the ends they ought to. We reward crooks & murderers so long as they're out robbing from the most vulnerable & killing the right people, and they live in fine company, fine housing & enjoy fine dining until they expire - leaving their grins behind to mock us & our delusions of 'justice'. 

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"Natasha has just come up to the window from the courtyard and opened it wider so that the air may enter more freely into my room. I can see the bright green strip of grass beneath the wall, and the clear blue sky above the wall, and sunlight everywhere. Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression and violence, and enjoy it to the full."

- Leon Trotsky, Last Will & Testament
February 27, 1940


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The recognition that 'this'

The recognition that 'this' world can be so manifestly 'unfair' is a major motivation for people to believe in some form of life beyond this one, whether on some other plane, or in some kind of re-incarnation as in Buddhism, in which some form of redress can be achieved, something done to restore the balance.

The sense of fairness/unfairness has been shown by many species, especially ones that live in groups or packs, from wolves and dogs, to many primates.

It is one the first feelings manifested by young children in their dealings with other kids.

 

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology