Life, a disappointment

julio
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Life, a disappointment

In broad terms, human life on Earth is a great disappointment.
Perpetual war, perpetual disease.
Overpopulation.
Famine.
Premature death.
Religion.
Loneliness.
Is life really to be this way?
Millennia of attempts to improve life for very little.
What’s life’s worth?


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It's about making money for

It's about making money for the Man.

It's about making babies who will grow up and be unhappy.

It's about being recognized as great only after you're dead.

 

But mostly it's about who or what you love.  For me, when I wonder what the hell is worth living for, I think about the people who would miss me.  I'm sure it's not many, but I'd do anything to keep them from being hurt.


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julio wrote:In broad terms,

julio wrote:
In broad terms, human life on Earth is a great disappointment.
From where came the expectation?

julio wrote:
Perpetual war,
Same token, perpetual peace. Just interleaved.

julio wrote:
perpetual disease.
Perpetual cures and treatments, too.

julio wrote:
Overpopulation. Famine. Premature death. Religion. Loneliness.
Yeah, shit happens, man.

julio wrote:
Is life really to be this way?
By what standard?

julio wrote:
Millennia of attempts to improve life for very little.
Guh. Are you joking? We've made great strides in making life better - I'm in a heated house rather than a cave, with a fridge full of food I didn't have to hunt or gather ( well, if you consider shopping "gathering" ), enjoying the benefits of modern medicine having survived illness that would have been lethal otherwise... Not perfect but hardly "very little".

julio wrote:
What’s life’s worth?
Whatever you put into it, I suspect.

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cheer up emo kid :)

Stop focusing on the negatives and start looking at all of the wonders of life.

Also, I think we are making progress as far as social maturity is concerned. A long way from perfect but a definite improvement over 100 or even 50 years ago.

Zen-atheist wielding Occam's katana.

Jesus said, "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division." - Luke 12:51


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I try to be positive [in a

I try to be positive [in a world with so much disappointment].
Your dog dies and you cry;
thousands of children are killed and/or mutilated in adults’ wars and you cry nothing.
An Indian farmer has his crop destroyed by hail and he cannot pay the bank the loan;
he kills himself leaving 4 children behind.
The bank manager cries nothing.
Life is a disappointment, if not a disaster.


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julio wrote:In broad terms,

julio wrote:
In broad terms, human life on Earth is a great disappointment. Perpetual war, perpetual disease. Overpopulation. Famine. Premature death. Religion. Loneliness. Is life really to be this way? Millennia of attempts to improve life for very little. What’s life’s worth?

Why? That is the same pessimistic attitude that causes the theistic morons to create invisible friends that they fight over in hopes that they will die now and find a utopia in an after life.

Stating the obvious that life sucks and there is no magical reason to our existence does not mean we have to, as individuals always see the bad and only the bad.

"Is life really to be this way" YES, DUH AND SO WHAT? You can dwell on it, and drive yourself nuts, or work to find the positive in your own life amidst all the kaos. Yes, this is all there is, but it is not always all bad.

In cosmic time we are meaningless, but in the moment we create our own meaning as individuals. Facing harsh reality doesn't mean that all aspects of life are bad. The ride ends and accepting that reality can help you cope and get through the bad to possibly extend the finite ride we have.

We should recognize the bad, which theism teaches believers to avoid by making up fictional utopias.

I accept that a billion years ago I didn't exist and a billion years from now I wont. But that does not mean NOW at this point, I cant enjoy my family, my cat and dog, the beauty of a flower, a night time starry sky. I could get hit by a car tomorrow, I could get cancer, I could get murdered. But that does not take away from the positive I can find in the here and now.

 

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julio wrote:I try to be

julio wrote:
I try to be positive [in a world with so much disappointment]. Your dog dies and you cry; thousands of children are killed and/or mutilated in adults’ wars and you cry nothing. An Indian farmer has his crop destroyed by hail and he cannot pay the bank the loan; he kills himself leaving 4 children behind. The bank manager cries nothing. Life is a disappointment, if not a disaster.

Woe is you. Oh, woe. Oh, woe.

There are meds for that, you know. They are effective.

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julio
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"Life's good & life sucks"

"Life's good & life sucks" philosophy. It's still disappointing. A child is born blind; a mother dies giving birth!

or, a mother dies giving birth; the child is born blind!


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julio wrote:I try to be

julio wrote:
I try to be positive [in a world with so much disappointment]. Your dog dies and you cry; thousands of children are killed and/or mutilated in adults’ wars and you cry nothing. An Indian farmer has his crop destroyed by hail and he cannot pay the bank the loan; he kills himself leaving 4 children behind. The bank manager cries nothing. Life is a disappointment, if not a disaster.

IT HAPPENS AND IT SUCKS, but what would you have me do? I am not going to kill myself or give up JUST because bad things happen.

In the evolution of carbon based life, much less the human species, IT IS A DISASTER. Most attempts at life FAIL! The majority of acorns that fall of a tree ROT! For every sperm that gets to the egg there are millions more PER LOAD that die! Multiply that by all the attempts of all the men in our species history and that would equal hundreds of trillions of attempts at life that FAIL!

What do you want? You want say you are special? To what, to who? Not life, not our evolution. YOU SHOULD BE SPECIAL TO YOURSELF. I don't think you have to be depressed about being part of a harsh reality. Nor do you have to dwell on it to survive.

I am not special. My death would not hault any tomorrow but my own. But the same thing that drives me is the same reason trees continue to germinate and grow from acorns. I am lucky enough to be part of life and just because bad happens doesn't deter me from valuing my luck. My luck might run out just like the farmer, but I am not him nor does life cease to continue when bad things happen. EVENTUALLY all life will die when our planet dies. But I think it is reasonable to want to continue even in the face of this harsh reality.

If you are depressed about the state of the world, THAT IS NORMAL, but if that is the case, get help. Maybe if this guy you speak of had enough family support and emotional support he may not have done what he did. You certainly don't have to let any depression you might have lead to that same result.

I have suffered from depression myself. But it always seems that the more days I stick around I find that any gloom I might have is NOT forever, and something else eventually comes along that cheers me up.

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Your missive makes sense, of

Your missive makes sense, of course.

I'm not depressed.

I am sad.

You used the term "reasonable".

It means nothing to people drowning in their emotional desperation.

It's not my case, please understand.

But I've seen much misery in my lifetime.

A friend is dying in hospital with multiple cancers, after smoking cigarettes for 40 years, despising the gentle warning we offered.

A lady near my house gave birth to her second child and two months later died from some kidney failure.

Life is a disappointment.

Is it not?


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Eh, life is great from my

Eh, life is great from my view, nice house, good friends, great family, beautiful daughter, sure shit happens, but in my life time I have made sure that the happier times out weight the sad times, with the exception of deaths, which I cannot control (gotta accept that fact, not just merely know about it). But sure life sucks for some people, but even the poor have happy times, it's really a matter of perception. 

 


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julio wrote:Your missive

julio wrote:

Your missive makes sense, of course.

I'm not depressed.

I am sad.

You used the term "reasonable".

It means nothing to people drowning in their emotional desperation.

It's not my case, please understand.

But I've seen much misery in my lifetime.

A friend is dying in hospital with multiple cancers, after smoking cigarettes for 40 years, despising the gentle warning we offered.

A lady near my house gave birth to her second child and two months later died from some kidney failure.

Life is a disappointment.

Is it not?

I smoke myself. I could very well kill me as it does lots of people. But I wouldn't want anyone remembering me solely for that. I would want people to remember my bad jokes and my love of pets. When I die, I won't have the ability to care what happens after that. BUT what I would want is for those who know me and survive me to remember the good and smile about the fun things and silly things I did.

That lady's child died. But how many family members or friends do you have that have had healthy babies? Even if we survive child birth we all die and we could die from a variety of things. We could die from old age, or bad health decisions or even murder. Those certainly are a part of a harsh reality.

We are all going to die eventually even if we are luck enough to reach old age. Life has sad points but it is not always a "dissapointment" nor do you have to look at it that way simply because you recoginze bad as a reality too.

If I had killed myself in my deepest depressions never would have grown closer to my mother, whom is the most important person in my life.I never would have met my current co- workers and we are more like a family.  I never would have had my current cat, who ran up to me and hugged my leg in a sea of cats I had to chose from. I None of those things would have happened if I chose to check out early.

My marriage ended and it hurt. But now I can look back at it, with fond memories instead of bitter anger because I faced reality and took both the good and the bad along with it. I still talk with my x-wife and it was because I was not deluded in thinking "everything lasts forever" that I was able to cope with the ending.

Any bad that happens should be recognized, we should not gloss over life, true. But just because we face that bad happens doesn't mean that good doesn't happen.

Quite often we get from theists, "If life has no meaning, then why do you stick around"?

Bob Spence here on these boards has answered this many times and quite well and I am paraphrasing here.

He will respond with something like, "Why do people go to sporting events? They know the game will end. They go because it gives them an opportunity for pleasure despite the finality of the game ending".

We live because we can and do find good despite our finite existence no matter how it might end. Life is an opportunity, it is not a guarantee and at any point, for any reason it can end. Most of the time IN REALITY life never starts so when we are lucky enough to exist we tend to appreciate it even in the face of harsh reality.

 

 

 

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 Julio, you have a habit of

 Julio, you have a habit of assuming premises and perspectives.  That is, many of your questions have an unspoken assumption that perhaps seems obvious to you, but in reality, is not demonstrated.  This makes many of your questions impossible to answer.  If I had to make a guess, I'd say that you're suffering from human-centricity.  In other words, you think of things in anthropomorphic terms and from human perspectives, without taking into account that these perspectives are only meaningful within their own context.

Anyway:

Quote:
In broad terms, human life on Earth is a great disappointment. 

Perpetual war, perpetual disease. 
Overpopulation. 
Famine. 
Premature death. 
Religion. 
Loneliness.

Julio, I'd strongly suggest that you do some in-depth reading about natural selection, and think about what that implies for humans.  

*  War is intraspecies competition.  Competition is one of the primary forces in natural selection.  It is not unique to humans.  We see it in most other colonial and pack animals.  It's simply the "Selfish Gene" expressing itself by attempting to protect "My Tribe" by preventing "Your Tribe" from either killing us or taking our resources or females.  Where there is natural selection, there will be war.

* Disease is other species trying to survive.  (At least where pathogens are the cause.)  From the perspective of a non-human, humans have committed genocide thousands of times, since we've pretty much wiped out thousands of strains of bacteria since the invention of penicillin.  Bacteria are life forms, and like all other life forms, they must take from others to live.   Where genetic diversity is the cause, that's just an effect of natural selection.  Diversity is the key to survival, but diversity also ensures that there will be some losers in the DNA lottery.

* Overpopulation is a result of natural selection.  Please read this article in its entirety to understand the mechanisms behind it:  Conspicuous Consumption

* Famine is a result of both environmental change and overconsumption.

* "Premature death" is kind of nonsense.  You're relying on your own expectations for other people and yourself, which are entirely arbitrary.  By comparison to the past, almost all humans live well beyond their "average lifespan," and the vast majority live long enough to have children (whether they succeed or not).  So from the point of view of natural selection, there's no significant problem with premature death.  It's only a pain in the ass to us humans because we get attached to our own lives and those of others, and selfishly want them to continue.

* Yes.  Life is really to be this way.  There is no other possibility.  

Quote:
Millennia of attempts to improve life for very little.

What’s life’s worth?

As usual, you've ended with a question that includes a hidden assumption.  Life isn't worth anything if nobody's buying it.  I can't answer your question unless you give me more information.

 

Here's another article for you to read concerning value and meaning in life:

For New Atheists: Is This Really All There Is?

 

 

Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin

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latincanuck wrote:Eh, life

latincanuck wrote:

Eh, life is great from my view, nice house, good friends, great family, beautiful daughter, sure shit happens, but in my life time I have made sure that the happier times out weight the sad times, with the exception of deaths, which I cannot control (gotta accept that fact, not just merely know about it). But sure life sucks for some people, but even the poor have happy times, it's really a matter of perception. 

 

THANK YOU! It really is a matter of perception. I am dirt poor and only make a couple dollars over minumum wage. But I wouldn't trade my house or the balance in my life to work 24/7 to own a mansion I couldn't enjoy because I was too busy trying to keep a title and impress people. People from 3rd world countries look at my house and my job and would consider me lucky by comparison.

If you think you have it bad try living in a mud shack with no pluming with trash surrounding your house in Tijuana. I've seen it. You can stand downtown on the main strip where the tourists go and look uphill at the garbage dump people live in. I find that people who escape these conditions to come and live here are less jaded and more apprciative than say some middle class jackass like Rush who got lucky with his connections who thinks anyone outside his class is a loser.

BACK TO THE OP, you wont get any sympathy from us. I saw my grandmother dead when I was 7. My adoptive father died when I was 13. My mother was raped when I was 16. I have buried two biological grandparents since. ALL OF IT SUCKED! But what I do have are all the good things as well. I had time with those people.

Life can suck, DUH! But it can also bring joy too. So if you are looking for a sympathy card you wont find it here.

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Now now!  Let's be a little

Now now!  Let's be a little less aggressive here, shall we? 

 

I'm pretty sure the worst thing to tell somebody who's depressed is that "well yeah, life sucks GET OVER IT". 

 

Do see a counsellor, though, julio.  You may or may not need medication but when you're that far down you need professional help.  I know because I've been there and I'm pretty confident that at least a few of the other posters here know it just as well.


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Gallowsbait wrote:Now now! 

Gallowsbait wrote:

Now now!  Let's be a little less aggressive here, shall we? 

 

I'm pretty sure the worst thing to tell somebody who's depressed is that "well yeah, life sucks GET OVER IT". 

 

Do see a counsellor, though, julio.  You may or may not need medication but when you're that far down you need professional help.  I know because I've been there and I'm pretty confident that at least a few of the other posters here know it just as well.

AGREED. I didn't mean to sound so harsh in my response, but just being bluntly honest. Sometimes you can't "just get over it". In my "you wont get sympathy" response, I don't want Jilio or anyone for that matter thinking they shouldn't do anything about their sadness. It is ok to need to talk to people. It is ok and ONE SHOULD seek out support from others when sad. We'd all kill ourselves if we didn't do that.

THERE IS NO SHAME OR STIGMA IN NEEDING HELP.  I was just saying that life sucks and if you don't seek out the help to cope with it what would you suggest we offer you?

I have been there too.

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Life is not a

Life is not a disappointment, not at all. The law of action and reaction works. Life is what we make it. If we do bad things, life is bad, and if we do good things, life is good. That is 100% true, if you see humanity as one species, indivisibly bonded with environment, over historical periods. There is relatively few of disasters,  that wouldn't be caused by human activity.  The world behaves exactly as expected.
But there is a greater truth. Just as we can screw the world up, so we can make it good and create a golden age of civilization. There were ancient civilizations, that lasted continually for thousands of years! It's actually quite simple and well within our possibilities. We have the resources, technology, theoretic basis, willing public and a deadline ahead of us. The only thing remaining is a political (and commercial) will. This is, activism on all levels, from lowest to highest.

Let me ask you one small question. Do you want life to be good? Do you want to be happy? Do you want to solve your problems? it seems you forgot to be specific about it. Because, if you enjoy your depression, if you don't want to get rid of it, if you like to complain, then you have no problem that can be helped. My dad tells such a people, "go to your doctor, go to your psychologist, go to your lawyer."

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julio wrote:In broad terms,

julio wrote:
In broad terms, human life on Earth is a great disappointment. Perpetual war, perpetual disease. Overpopulation. Famine. Premature death. Religion. Loneliness. Is life really to be this way? Millennia of attempts to improve life for very little. What’s life’s worth?

Meh, the more we have tried to improve our lives over the millennia the more we see it probably isn't worth it. Well whatever lets all go get drunk and get laid. Thats the dream....

 

Whatever goes upon two legs is an enemy.
Whatever goes upon four legs, or has wings, is a friend.
No animal shall wear clothes.
No animal shall sleep in a bed.
No animal shall drink alcohol.
No animal shall kill any other animal.
All animals are equal.


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Hi, Brian37. Of course I

Hi, Brian37.
Of course I agree with you.
Yet, you have but illustrated what is my objective impression of life.
Life is a disappointment.
There is no equality in matters of happiness.
You might be happy in your dejection, but that serves to illustrate my observation that life is a disappointment.
Life could be better, and should be better, and would be better under different conditions.
That’s my observation.
You are entitled to yours.
It doesn’t depend on me to restructure life, but if it were in my hands, I would find a better balance, more equity and more happiness.
No child would be raped, or filmed being raped to post it on the Internet.
Nobody would go unemployed and have a family living in poverty.
No mother would die giving birth.
Things like that.


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julio wrote:Hi, Brian37. Of

julio wrote:
Hi, Brian37. Of course I agree with you. Yet, you have but illustrated what is my objective impression of life. Life is a disappointment. There is no equality in matters of happiness. You might be happy in your dejection, but that serves to illustrate my observation that life is a disappointment. Life could be better, and should be better, and would be better under different conditions. That’s my observation. You are entitled to yours. It doesn’t depend on me to restructure life, but if it were in my hands, I would find a better balance, more equity and more happiness. No child would be raped, or filmed being raped to post it on the Internet. Nobody would go unemployed and have a family living in poverty. No mother would die giving birth. Things like that.

~You state that 'there is no equality in matters of happiness' ~ with this assertion of happiness not being held in equal regard to all, can't it be said that someone that is unemployed and living in poverty could be happy? Your observations of life seem to be all-encompassing ~ are you speaking of the entire world?

 

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Well, life is "worth"

Well, life is "worth" whatever price you put on it.  Your life is yours to live and make what you want of it.

 

And to touch on humanity being a disappointment, that's what it was from the moment we became smarter than every other animal.  We're told from the day we're born that humanity is this beautiful, special thing.  But it's all bullshit.  That's just what we want to believe because we humans generally are egocentric and think it's all about us.  But it's not.  It's not about anything, least of all US.

Liberate your mind. Fuck religion.


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julio wrote:Hi, Brian37. Of

julio wrote:
Hi, Brian37. Of course I agree with you. Yet, you have but illustrated what is my objective impression of life. Life is a disappointment. There is no equality in matters of happiness. You might be happy in your dejection, but that serves to illustrate my observation that life is a disappointment. Life could be better, and should be better, and would be better under different conditions. That’s my observation. You are entitled to yours. It doesn’t depend on me to restructure life, but if it were in my hands, I would find a better balance, more equity and more happiness. No child would be raped, or filmed being raped to post it on the Internet. Nobody would go unemployed and have a family living in poverty. No mother would die giving birth. Things like that.

I agree I would have those things for humanity if I could do that, most people would. But since that is not the case and will not be the case, it is better to accept reality and deal with it in reality. If that means getting help when thought like this make you sad, then get help, talk to someone. Like others have said here, there is no shame in talking to others when feeling down. What you should not do is let it fester and do nothing about it.

But the world and life and even the cosmos is not sympathetic to life. It is not our planet, we live on it. It is not our universe, we live in it. We are merely part of very violent universe, but we are not the center of the universe. But that doesn't mean that all of what we see in life is bad or that we have to dwell on our finite existence.

In all seriousness, if this is getting you down, talk to someone, get some professional help.

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Of course all those things

Of course all those things happen.

But there are positive moments, or can be, for all but those in the most dire of circumstances.

To completely ignore any moment of joy or pleasure, just because it doesn't last forever, just because bad things also happen, and may outweigh the good, in your judgement, is really going way overboard in obsessing over the negatives.

A word of appreciation from a friend or colleague that you have helped in some way can make all the difference to a day, if you let it, and don't let the gloomy outlook for humanity as  a whole consume your life.

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It is a dangerous planet,

It is a dangerous planet, where happiness was not part of the original "design".
We get tsunamis where thousands perish and many others get hurt.
Well, we help the hurt and bury the dead.
We have to!
To protect ourselves from more danger.
It is a disappointing life, for sure.
Happiness is but a flimsy moment; the rest is desperation.


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everyone is getting so

everyone is getting so worked up, either aggressively or sympathetically.  am i the only one who has a hard time taking julio seriously because i think he tries to fire up debates on purpose?

i think his overall posting behavior supports my hypothesis: he's probably one of the people on here who starts the most new threads, usually beginning with some extreme position stated in a blunt way; he doggedly sticks to that position once everybody rushes at him, though seldom changes his phrasing or offers any new evidence (sometimes he offers no evidence to begin with); he often ends his posts, especially his OPs, with open-ended questions.

i believe will once called such people "shit-disturbers."

what do you think?

(see how i did that?)

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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Debbie downer

Slowly building a blog at ~

http://obsidianwords.wordpress.com/


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BobSpence1 wrote:Of course

BobSpence1 wrote:

Of course all those things happen.

But there are positive moments, or can be, for all but those in the most dire of circumstances.

To completely ignore any moment of joy or pleasure, just because it doesn't last forever, just because bad things also happen, and may outweigh the good, in your judgement, is really going way overboard in obsessing over the negatives.

A word of appreciation from a friend or colleague that you have helped in some way can make all the difference to a day, if you let it, and don't let the gloomy outlook for humanity as  a whole consume your life.

Ok, you act like I get joy torturing you with the plight of my beloved (all be it sucky Redskins) week after week. You act as if life is Candy Land. I don't need friends like you. (Note to self: Did I think that, or type it?)

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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julio wrote: Happiness is

julio wrote:
Happiness is but a flimsy moment; the rest is desperation.

Do you know how much you are reflecting the thoughts of Shakespeare?

Shakespeare wrote:
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player, that struts and frets his hour upon the stage, and then is heard no more; it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
William Shakespeare

OUR POINT, which you seem to miss, and Shakespeare would agree with us is "SO WHAT" do the best you can and try to enjoy yourself while you can BECAUSE this is it.

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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Value is not found in

Value is not found in utopias. Value is not magical. Value is what we make for ourselves. The ride will end, but that does not mean we have to default to doom and gloom in the face of reality.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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Luminon wrote: If we do bad

Luminon wrote:

 If we do bad things, life is bad, and if we do good things, life is good. 

 

 

I hate to disagree with you, Luminon, because there are plenty of people that I can think of who are good, strong, loving people to whom LOTS of bad things have happened.  They don't deserve to lose their home.  They don't deserve for the ones they love to abandon them.  They don't deserve to have cancer/aids/(insert other debliltating illness). But it happens.

I don't believe in karma.


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Gallowsbait wrote:Luminon

Gallowsbait wrote:

Luminon wrote:

 If we do bad things, life is bad, and if we do good things, life is good. 

 

 

I hate to disagree with you, Luminon, because there are plenty of people that I can think of who are good, strong, loving people to whom LOTS of bad things have happened.  They don't deserve to lose their home.  They don't deserve for the ones they love to abandon them.  They don't deserve to have cancer/aids/(insert other debliltating illness). But it happens.

I don't believe in karma.

I agree "Karma" is a superstition. REALITY is that good people do bad things and bad people do good things and our existence is not dependent on good luck beating bad luck. Our existence is luck and any good we can make out of that is a plus, not a given.

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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Hang in their Julio

julio wrote:
It is a dangerous planet, where happiness was not part of the original "design". We get tsunamis where thousands perish and many others get hurt. Well, we help the hurt and bury the dead. We have to! To protect ourselves from more danger. It is a disappointing life, for sure. Happiness is but a flimsy moment; the rest is desperation.

 

It sounds to me like you need a date with 3 close friends and 6 bottles of red wine.

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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Atheistextremist wrote:It

Atheistextremist wrote:
It sounds to me like you need a date with 3 close friends and 6 bottles of red wine.

Or, he could join a religion! It produces a similar effect, lol.

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


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julio wrote:In broad terms,

julio wrote:
In broad terms, human life on Earth is a great disappointment.

That's nice.

julio wrote:
Perpetual war, perpetual disease.

Also nice.

julio wrote:
Overpopulation.

Hey, that has potential to be good.

julio wrote:
Famine.

...Or not.

julio wrote:
Premature death.

What are you talking about? People living to their 40s is nothing short of a miracle by 3rd world standards.

julio wrote:
Religion.

Again, has potential to be good.

julio wrote:
Loneliness.

...Or not... again...

julio wrote:
Is life really to be this way?

Yeah, it's our destiny, God loves us doesn't he?

julio wrote:
Millennia of attempts to improve life for very little.

From axes to muskets to flying contraptions to lasers. They all improved life a lot didn't they?

julio wrote:
What’s life’s worth?

How much you got?


"I do not think it is necessary to believe that the same God who has given us our senses, reason, and intelligence wished us to abandon their use, giving us by some other means the information that we could gain through them." ~Galileo Galilei


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julio wrote:It is a

julio wrote:
It is a dangerous planet, where happiness was not part of the original "design".

Bloody hell, where have I been?

julio wrote:
We get tsunamis where thousands perish and many others get hurt.

We also get earthquakes, volcano eruptions and terrorist attacks; I personally favor volcanoes.

julio wrote:
Well, we help the hurt and bury the dead.

Y'see? Hope!

julio wrote:
We have to!

Indeed we do! Go get 'em sport.

julio wrote:
To protect ourselves from more danger.

Since when did flies learn to speak?

julio wrote:
It is a disappointing life, for sure.

If you think of it that way... I'm going to kill myself now

julio wrote:
Happiness is but a flimsy moment; the rest is desperation.

You sir need to get laid.


"I do not think it is necessary to believe that the same God who has given us our senses, reason, and intelligence wished us to abandon their use, giving us by some other means the information that we could gain through them." ~Galileo Galilei


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Alright enough snappy

Alright enough snappy remarks. What the deuce do you think humans are? Little bunnies in a mine field? We're not THAT frail m'boy; people die, people live, it's life, now get laid and make the best of it instead of moping over spilled milk. Earth isn't paradise after all, I'm sure there are more stable planets somewhere with the same conditions of Earth. Buy a telescope, explore, do something better with your life than telling people on a forum things they already know.

 

Edit:

And excuse me for the spam.


"I do not think it is necessary to believe that the same God who has given us our senses, reason, and intelligence wished us to abandon their use, giving us by some other means the information that we could gain through them." ~Galileo Galilei


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:3


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     Suicide is Man's

     Suicide is Man's way of telling God "You can't fire me...I QUIT !!!"

Patrick is an edgy edgelord.


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Best wishes

 I'm sorry that you are on hard times and I hope you feel better.

 

I think it is best for all of us to be mindful of the science behind our existence and correlating that with the future of our offspring.  The future is uncertain, our race may even be extinct one day, but life in the grand scheme of things will go on!  Think about it: the universe is the creator of life and it is anti-intellectual and illogical to think we are the only life that will ever exist.

 

Where does this life come from?  Evolution of the universe.  (Please be mindful of the meaning of the word evolution instead of the theory of the evolution of our species from other life.)  

Matter, which is perceived to be absolutely void of consciousness, gave birth to consciousness.  Consciousness, which in a sense seems to be void of the greatness of our species, gave birth to the beauty that we can currently be.  Even if all of us die, there is the certainty in the numbers that a species like ours will develop in the universe again, flourish, and make another yet another jump reality that are just like the ones I described.

 

This is something I've been thinking of lately really: "What is the full potential of the fact that evolution is a central theme to the universe?"  Could it be an evolution of our biological makeup?  Could it be our intellect inventing something like a wonderous artificial intelligence?  Not only is the potential future something unimaginably magnificent to us:  it is a part of the makeup of the reality of the universe.

 

It's just like the (usually circular) argument that persists in our human thought: "Nobody can truly disprove either God or persisting consciousness after we die."  Take that into mind, but also notion that there are possibilities we do not perceive as of yet.  I can't disprove that we will live on forever, but I can think of rational possibilities for either that being true or untrue. The ones that atheists and agnostics usually center on is that it is not true, and (western) theists the opposite.  But think about it: life can go on through science.  Examples I think of that are the most possible in my mind center around invention rather than biological evolution.  

 

Example: One day we may be able to invent a machine that stores our entirety of consciousness and/or artificial intelligence we create can live on forever.  To take it in a different direction, perhaps something one day this will be coupled with the invention of a hyperdrive that enables possibilities like time travel or the ability to see through time.  Combine both and you have the possibility that they could be combined and all the intellectual being that will ever exist could be preserved through something like recreation.  (Feel free to argue my logic and science, in fact please do it if you can.)

 

It's rather odd and against our primal nature to think of such things and still be centered in non delusion.  But if you think about it, the evolution of existence has already given us (a makeup of the universe) the ability to have its feet on the ground and its head in the sky.  In the end, it's just considering the numbers and the grand scheme of things.

 

Sorry for the ramble and I should have organized my thoughts better but I think everyone can get the gist of what I've said.

I never thought there were corners in my mind until I was told to stand in one.

I have learned so much, thanks for keeping it real RRS.


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Brian37 wrote: Value is not

Brian37 wrote:

Value is not found in utopias. Value is not magical. Value is what we make for ourselves. The ride will end, but that does not mean we have to default to doom and gloom in the face of reality.

You're right.
However, the "ride" is the harsh reality that makes life a big disappointment, is it not?
If there was no "ride", life would be better, I guess.


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disappointment in what

disappointment in what sense? how so? compared to what? Life is great, there are moments of sadness and moments that suck ass, but reality it's how your perceive it all, so disappointment in what sense? because from where I am, it's great, I am enjoying every moment of every day, even the crappy days I am still doing phenomenal. Why because I am still alive, I am still doing things, even when friends or family die I still get to live my life how I wish to. This disappointment is according to what standard?


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Gallowsbait wrote:Luminon

Gallowsbait wrote:

Luminon wrote:

 If we do bad things, life is bad, and if we do good things, life is good. 

I hate to disagree with you, Luminon, because there are plenty of people that I can think of who are good, strong, loving people to whom LOTS of bad things have happened.  They don't deserve to lose their home.  They don't deserve for the ones they love to abandon them.  They don't deserve to have cancer/aids/(insert other debliltating illness). But it happens.

I don't believe in karma.

Thank you for your attention, but not so much for quote mining. If you'd read a sentence more, you would see that I mean it for humanity as the whole species, on Earth as one place. If we see ourselves all separated from each other, then bad things seemingly come from nowhere. But if whole humanity sees itself as one, then there is no reason to harm various parts of itself (including the environment), and ratio of the bad things will dramatically decrease.
I'm not that dumb to try any karma-mongering here and now Smiling It's simply an eastern name for the law of action and reaction. It seems to me that western view of coincidence is much closer to good or bad luck than karma.


Actually, my information is that ratio of good things happening is much higher. People complain about bad stuff, because good things are their standard, they take it as granted. If it would be opposite, we would be grateful for every good moment.

Beings who deserve worship don't demand it. Beings who demand worship don't deserve it.


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julio wrote:Brian37 wrote:

julio wrote:

Brian37 wrote:

Value is not found in utopias. Value is not magical. Value is what we make for ourselves. The ride will end, but that does not mean we have to default to doom and gloom in the face of reality.

You're right. However, the "ride" is the harsh reality that makes life a big disappointment, is it not? If there was no "ride", life would be better, I guess.

Huh?

"The ride" in Brian's post is a metaphor for life. Do you mean that it is disappointing that there will be an end to the ride?

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


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It's great that you're

It's great that you're enjoying your life. Keep going.
One day life will strike a hard blow at you, and your opinion will change [rhetorically said; no desire that that would happen to you at all].
A little girl is raped. Her life will never be the same for the next 70 years.
A child is born blind. No beauty ever to observe.
AIDS.
Slavery.
Conflict; famine; natural disasters.
Any time, you can become a victim.
Compare with what your life would be if cancer didn't strike your body.
In that fashion.


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:3

julio wrote:
It's great that you're enjoying your life. Keep going. One day life will strike a hard blow at you, and your opinion will change [rhetorically said; no desire that that would happen to you at all]. A little girl is raped. Her life will never be the same for the next 70 years. A child is born blind. No beauty ever to observe. AIDS. Slavery. Conflict; famine; natural disasters. Any time, you can become a victim. Compare with what your life would be if cancer didn't strike your body. In that fashion.

Theism is why we can't have nice things.


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:3

Terrible things.


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julio wrote:
It's great that you're enjoying your life. Keep going. One day life will strike a hard blow at you, and your opinion will change [rhetorically said; no desire that that would happen to you at all]. A little girl is raped. Her life will never be the same for the next 70 years. A child is born blind. No beauty ever to observe. AIDS. Slavery. Conflict; famine; natural disasters. Any time, you can become a victim. Compare with what your life would be if cancer didn't strike your body. In that fashion.

 

 

Seriously, living with cancer, aids, as a slave, starving, blind, etc is fine. You are still alive. You only get one life, what you make out of it is yours. 

 

It's not like any other animal expects more than that. What do you want?

 

A lot of people have hard blows in life and are fine. Often they are better for it, in my opinion.

 

You have to appreciate what you have not what you don't. Greener pastures aren't the way to live unless you are building a bridge across to them.

Theism is why we can't have nice things.


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 I'll put it this way: the less you have, the more often you treasure what it is you DO have.

 

It is very easy to take things for granted and look down on the world. It is also pointless to do.

Theism is why we can't have nice things.


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julio wrote:Brian37 wrote:

julio wrote:

Brian37 wrote:

Value is not found in utopias. Value is not magical. Value is what we make for ourselves. The ride will end, but that does not mean we have to default to doom and gloom in the face of reality.

You're right. However, the "ride" is the harsh reality that makes life a big disappointment, is it not? If there was no "ride", life would be better, I guess.

I don't know what you want from us here. You have said what you have to say. We have explained to you that you do not have to focus on the bad all the time. We are not professional councilors.

You say, "Life is a dissapointment"

We say, "It can be, but not always. Life is harsh, but so what".

Now what? If this is bothering you that much all we can do is urge you to seek out professional help. I don't know what else to tell you other than get help if it is bothering you that much.

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


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julio wrote:It's great that

julio wrote:
It's great that you're enjoying your life. Keep going. One day life will strike a hard blow at you, and your opinion will change [rhetorically said; no desire that that would happen to you at all]. A little girl is raped. Her life will never be the same for the next 70 years. A child is born blind. No beauty ever to observe. AIDS. Slavery. Conflict; famine; natural disasters. Any time, you can become a victim. Compare with what your life would be if cancer didn't strike your body. In that fashion.

...

...

Down the road, not across the street.

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Why, yes, I am!


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That balloon video was

That balloon video was disturbing at first, then hilarious.

 

Thank you, ClockCat.  Thank you.