The reasons I Believe in God! Part 1

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The reasons I Believe in God! Part 1

 Okay, okay simmer down you atheistic wolves. I know your salivating at the mouth to tear me a new one...but hey It ain't like I've been reamed before....so any responses you make to dissect my stories will not contain a response from me because I need not justify my experiences...either you believe or you don't...and I'm not looking for compassion, sympathy or even some sort of analyzation of my stories. Just read if you want or don't but you'll never be able to justify your answer as luck or coincidence....

 

Why I believe in God

Let me start off by admitting my limitations as a writer or knowledge of certain subjects but bear with me as I try to the best of my ability or lack there of to explain why I believe in a God that I can't see, touch or describe yet I do but it isn't the way you would suspect. It is beyond human comprehension to grasp something without substance which is clearly why most atheists and agnostics think the way they do.

 

My whole life has been one of constant turmoil, a continual whirlwind of bovine fertilizer swirling about since before I was even born.

My name is an anagram for the reason I can't seem to hold a job! True! My name is John Kevin Badwey. Rearrange the letters and you have a question. Why A Job End Kevin? At 42 yrs of age I have been unable to sustain a job nolonger than four years and within my 42 years of societal nonexistence, I have held over 30 some odd jobs .

I lost a brother 2 years prior to my unfortunate entry into this spherical cesspool we call mother Earth. My sperm slinging dad if you want to call him that decided I was nolonger wanted as a son early on, so me and my mother moved to Texas from the idyllic land of ruby red slippers and yellow brick roads.

At a very early age, I was forced to commit oral sex on a neighbor in front of my friends. Could this have been the window to explore bisexuality as I got older or my eventual crossdressing that began around when I was nine? Possibly, however clothing has nothing to do with ones orientation but I do see how it could lead to other things. Like smoking a cigarette might lead into smoking reefers or experimenting with other addicting substances.

I had a couple of step dads that really had no interest in raising me to be a man. So I'm still learning.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-

In 6th grade I was the most picked on kid in school. Even the teachers hated me. I made straight F's and still was promoted to the 7th grade of where I spent the next 3 years. I know, insert your own, "Well that explains his stupidity" comments. Feel better bout yourselves...good! Glad I could be of service!

Through out the years, jobs coming and going. I dropped out of the 12th grade to get out of my obligation to join the Marine Corps (Semper Fi) because I wanted to pursue my music. During that summer of 87 my mother had her first asthmatic attack, as a result of having C.O.P.D., Asthma, Chronic Bronchitis and emphysema. If I hadn't have been there she would have died then while I was away at bootcamp but, because I was there, she survived 10 more long agonizing years!

During my life since 6th grade,I became an outcast among my own family because I befriended black people. In turn, I was the proverbial black sheep of the family, almost literally! My great grand daddy was in the clan and raised his family as bigots. My mother would not enforce that on me but rather let me discover on my own on whether I would want to associate with black people. As time progressed throughout my high school years I became part of the hip hop culture because I could relate to it's message like kids of the 50's could relate to rock n roll.

November 4th, 3am 1997 I made the decision to have the life support pulled and by 5am she was flat lined, mind you, that ,was the lonliest time I ever felt.  I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy, not even on the Devil himself!

Since then I have held many jobs, and since 1999 respectively I have lived either in a car, van, truck, on the street,  with  friends, etc. I have slept in front of a Dumpster, on a park bench, in a concrete ditch, in a stairwell, an elevator presently but still I believe in God because He has sustained me. Without begging for handouts, people have provided food, laundry, etc. and I didn't ask for it.

Just recently my storage was 2 months behind and my lock had been cut. Everything I owned, my clothes, family pictures, artwork, songs, collectibles etc. would be going up for auction. (Listen) Just a little over a week ago...realizing I was going to lose everything, I began cutting my ties here. I was letting everyone know that If I lose my stuff I'd be leaving and starting my life anew somewhere else. Maybe live next to you Thomathy....haha that would be fun! Interesting, but fun. Maybe not so much for you though..haha.

 A gentleman from a 12 step program I was attending only as a guest came to visit me at Starbucks with his wife. He gave me 38 dollars for food or whatever and even though I tried to refuse they insisted. I thought to myself I can goto the Chinese restauraunt I normally patronize and pay for the meal they let me eat for free just a few days earlier. 

It was then I met a lady of color named Sharmyn. We had exchanged a casual glance but nothing more however it was enough for her to notice me I guess. As I sat looking out the window lost in thought, she appeared at my table and inquired if I was okay. Small talk here but the result was I told her for what its worth I'm okay for the situation I'm in. I was expecting to spend at least 14 dollars right off the bat for this lunch and the one prior which was 6.98 for a buffet. She took my ticket and paid for it. I told her she didn't have to do that but instead she insisted. I could of just walked out but I went ahead and paid what I owed for the previous meal. I thought that was kind of cool...now lets' fast forward.

When I found out from an email that my storage was up for auction I knew my life here was over and the only one to blame for it is me. I had been out of work for 9 months and now I'm going to lose everything. While I'm on the phone trying to get in touch with the storage lady guess who happens to show up out of the blue...you guessed it, Sharmyn! When she came in she asked me what's going on like what's up you know...and I told her I'm about to lose my storage and to make this long story short she paid it today. 135 dollars, she paid and this was strange to me because we are not close we just met and just a few days earlier at the 12 step class I told the people there..I'm not asking for handouts or sympathy ...I just want you to pray for a miracle that my storage is some how paid. . . . . .think about that and let the imagry of this sink in before you try to explain it away as luck, or subliminal begging or whatever...just think about it.

9 months, at least 5 different people have paid for my storage and I paying for one. No job, yet during these 9 months I have not starved, hungry but not starved. And my storage is still there, I would suggest to you something greater than I is taking care of me. And i have not begged for or asked people to do what they have done....is that ontomolocosmoloestimology... or whatever you call these things or perhaps my faith is sustaining me? Curious to your thought not oyur jump to atheistic or agnostic presumptions but actual silent pondering of what i just mentioned.

Why me you may ask and not some destitute starving child in Ethiopia. Don't they deserve mercy. Yes! far more than me I assure you but the difference may be I truly Believe, or that I pray or maybe others closer in their relationship to God prayed on my behalf but nonetheless I am blessed and and no man can fault me for believing in something that came to pass.

This is one story and although it may not be to your liking again I am only explaining why I continue to believe in something so complex that no man nor his science can explain and may never be able to. God is Love without Prejudice, the Subconscious causing the conscious to without thought provide a humane service to the world or feel the twist of guilt for not doing so. On the service you may justify it by saying that is human emotion and try to rationalize it but I submit to you that that my friend is God in you and you are fighting a battle that in the end you cannot win. I try but I lose every time.

I waited to share this story because I wasn't sure if my storage would be paid...yes I too lack faith sometimes and again God showed me I need to stop doing that....W O W   

 

 

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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 I don't mean to belittle

 I don't mean to belittle your story.  It's sad and traumatic and heartbreaking.  But... why do you believe in God?

 

Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin

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You had lots of bad shit

You had lots of bad shit happen. That is part of life.

There are 6 billion people on this planet. There have been billions prior. Do you think your survival of your strife is unique or magical? If someone who believes in a god you don't believe in survives something traumatic does that make their god real? Is Allah real because an American bomb barely missed their outpost?

Other humans of other beliefs, past and present, have suffered far worse than you or I physically. But that does not constitute a magical being saving them anymore than it would a magical being causing their death.

All it means is that humans fear suffering.

 

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That is just so

That is just so self-obsessed, to see that as 'proof' of God.

Do you not consider the vast number of people around the world, in far worse circumstances than you, many of whom would have been fervent believers, who nevertheless suffered far more serious fates, including their death and/or that of their loved ones? Do you imagine that none of them prayed, at least as strongly and as sincerely as you did, if not more so? As the Tsunami rushed toward them, or the buildings collapsed around them as the earthquake struck...

And your stroke of luck is proof of God????

Are you truly that selfish, to imagine that an all-powerful benevolent God would find time to listen to and help you, and ignore all those others???

 

 

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Wow!  WOW!!!  I was trying

Wow!  WOW!!!  I was trying to be open minded at first and listen your story, as you told it i began to get very annoyed by your self loathing.  My father physically/mentally abused me and my sister, my other sister died of leukemia when she was 3, she was downsyndrom and lived her 3 years in and out of the hospital.  I could go on im only at age 3 but that would be self loathing.   I look at my story and think to myself, all the hardships i went thru other people are going thru them to and much much worse, i would consider myself certainly amung the lucky ones to have lived so far with only the average amount of terrible things that have happen to me.  I kjnow people with worse.

 

I moved out of the house when i was 15.  and I GOT A JOB!!!!  i went to school and worked, ive never lived on the street since the first 2 months i ran away from home.  I learned a trade, i hate work, i go, and im damn good at what i do.  I started my own construction company, its not yet exactly what i want to do with my life, but it pays the bills for now.  I play the piano well and want to be a successful musician aswell, but dont sleep in front of dumpsters unnemployed.  I can keep going but this would be self gratification.  You sir are a self loathing looser.  Im sorry theirs just no other way to say, you've spent your entire life pourposely pathetic.  Honestly i cant stand people like you who loath and wine and loaaaath while thousands of children are dying of starvation around the world.  You self-loathers make me sick, give you head a shake, we all have problems.  

 

How you found god at all in the story of your life amazes me.  You don understand the general mass will very extremely annoyed by your self loathing.

 

Waa-waaa

 

      


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man i keep pressin the wrong button n quoting myself by mistake, duhhh!


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The reason I believe in God

 I didn't want to respond to any one's dissection of my story but it is clearly obvious how people twist things or take things the wrong way to validate their own point which in my opinion is selfish.

 To Hamby...I Believe in God because He believes in Me and sustains me when I can't sustain myself.

To Brian...I never said I was special..just sharing a little of my life and that's not even a tenth of it ...but my faith is why I'm still here..and nothing more..not by my brain power,,,or physical activity...I haven't worked for 9 months and spend all day from open to close in my little corner here at starbucks but I'm still provided for..sorry you can't understand that...

To bob..when the Tsunami struck,,,to which nation do you refer...one that believes in Buddha, Vishnu, A head of lettuce ..I doubt they would have intervened on their part..and to go one step further...the Tsunami's and Earthquakes usually happen so fast that the unsuspecting may have not had a chance to pray for Divine intervention., like a drunk driver that rams into a family of 6 head on and survives but the family doesn't .They didn't have time to repent or pray or ask forgiveness...but I would suggest that the Lord thy God takes everything into consideration and is not this maniacal ,"I am going to get you" deity that some christians unfortunately and most atheists as well as agnostics would like to believe...He is a Loving and caring God. But even if they did..so...Some things..good or bad just happen..I've said that...God is not in the whirlwinds of destruction....These are effects of nature...

Stroke of luck...where, tell me where my life was lucky...were not talking rolling dice here...tell me was I lucky to be forced in giving oral sex to my neighbor...what about being homeless off and on since 1999....constantly losing jobs...losing a mother by my own hand...let me know when my life gets lucky....what about having a dad disowning me....having no mentor in my life to educate me about life...The events I mentioned were not lucky which clearly shows your arrogant ignorance. Oh maybe you refer to my story of having a lady pay my storage..how is that lucky ..can you explain the dynamics of this one....How a lady I don't know want's to pay my storage...read my next story and see if you can apply the luck streak there too..I suggest you will just to support "YOUR" belief as long as it conflicts with mine.

God doesn't ignore others and He doesn't always answer my prayers either...go figure...however...it's according to His will not mine that I am still here for whatever reason...maybe my purpose in life is to share with others and that's all I'm trying to do...

 

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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The reason I believe in God

 okay no,more crazy dog holding dude! I believe in the beginning of my story I said I wasn't looking for Sympathy.

People were asking me in my other forum I posted, Why I believe in God, not why you don't, so obviously the story would relate to me..

Not to mention I stated you don't have to read it so go back to reading you comic books or watching Jeff Foxworthy or whatever...I'm the kind of guy because I am not perfect but if you bash me I don't turn the other cheek so readily! I'm working on that part of my self!

I am a work in progress...and you know what I am special..but guess what..so are you..Bob..Brian..and everyone else here and across the globe...

So get used to it because I'm here until I'm banned from this site

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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BADWAY wrote:9 months, at

BADWAY wrote:

9 months, at least 5 different people have paid for my storage and I paying for one. No job, yet during these 9 months I have not starved, hungry but not starved. And my storage is still there, I would suggest to you something greater than I is taking care of me.

Wait. Let me get this straight. A whole bunch of PEOPLE helped you out. Therefore there must be a GOD taking care of you. I hate to be so blunt, but: PEOPLE are taking care of you! PEOPLE, PEOPLE, PEOPLE. Are you blind?!

Sharmyn: "Here, John, here's some money for your food and storage." <smiles>

John: <looks up to the sky> "Thank you for this money, God. If it wasn't for you, God, I don't know how I could possibly survive. Look, Sharmyn, just look at this money that God gave to me, no thanks to you."

Sharmyn: "Yeah, you're welcome, I guess. Jerk."

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The reason I believe in God

 cute a moron from southpark...

funny though I get it...heehee.

Your right! absolutely 100 percent right....but why did they help me...without me asking but praying to God..and thoughout history God has used people for different reasons even if they weren't believers to still be useful in His overall plan whatever that plan maybe...Yes he can use people..work through people..after all He is God...and if Sharmyn was talking to you she would tell you God told her to do it, Mr. Wilson, because of his faith, everyone who helped me are believers even when i on many occasions challenged them for their beliefs as well..

Yes ,I too as a Christian have questions...doubts and reservations but then God does what He does and I am reminded of His greatness.

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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all i have to say is you

From your self loathing to you creepy passionate eyes picture lerking at me, all i have to say is you just creep me out dude!!! Your that guy!!!

Really!!!


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 touche bro..it was either

 touche bro..it was either this pic or the one of me dressed up like girl which would you prefer

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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as long as your not looking

as long as your not looking at me creepily like your peaking behind the bushes in my backyard.  If your trying to presume i am homophobic in anyway please read my other recent posted topic about hermaphrodites.   


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 no that's my evil twin ....

 no that's my evil twin ....


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Greetings

Greetings John

Sounds like you've had a very "interesting" and sad life. You write very well for someone that had such a hard time in school. Despite your having served as a Marine you seem intelligent enough to not believe in fairy tales.

Respectfully,
Lenny

"The righteous rise, With burning eyes, Of hatred and ill-will
Madmen fed on fear and lies, To beat and burn and kill"
Witch Hunt from the album Moving Pictures. Neal Pert, Rush


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 I'm sorry I hope I didn't

 I'm sorry I hope I didn't mislead anyone into thinking I was in the Marin Corps..I was supposed to go in but they wouldn't work with me so I dropped out of school in the 12th grade to make me ineligible for induction. So I received a general discharge for not fulfilling my educational requirements that were essential for becoming a United States Marine.(Semper Fi) Always Faithful

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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BADWAY wrote: To Hamby...I

BADWAY wrote:
To Hamby...I Believe in God because He believes in Me and sustains me when I can't sustain myself.

How do you know it's God that sustains you and not your own resiliency and the natural empathy and compassion of those around you?

 

Reality is the graveyard of the gods.


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Glory be

You don't sound like a bad person, Badway, but if you take ownership of the christian doctrine you will see that for your pleasant fantasy to be true

everyone who disagrees must die badly. I don't think you deserve eternal damnation and could never, would never, worship a deity who points a

gun in anyone's face and says 'love me or you're dead'. Do me the favour of reciprocation, won't you?

Reading your life missive I couldn't suppress the feeling all you need to exercise is a little self belief. Keep going down the path you're on and you'll write a

disappointing future with god or without him.

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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 Quote: To Hamby...I

 

Quote:
 To Hamby...I Believe in God because He believes in Me and sustains me when I can't sustain myself.

Did he tell you this over dinner?  Do you have it on video?  How do you know it isn't the evil pixie dust fairie sustaining you for its own evil purpose?

 

Atheism isn't a lot like religion at all. Unless by "religion" you mean "not religion". --Ciarin

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Quick observations on your diatribe

1. No one here salivates at the mouth at the prospect of tearing you a new one. Exactly how into yourself are you? WOW!

2. Isn't it amazing how the religious can spot an easy mark?

3. Do you realize that while god was fixing your life many, many people were killed by cancer, accidents, suicide etc? But that's cos you REALLY believe.....unlike them. WOW!

4. You believe in god because you're weak and need an invisible friend to make you feel better.

5. Other people have gone through far worse than you and didn't turn into the douche you are. WOW!

 

Keep posting, you make me laugh.

How can not believing in something that is backed up with no empirical evidence be less scientific than believing in something that not only has no empirical evidence but actually goes against the laws of the universe and in many cases actually contradicts itself? - Ricky Gervais


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BADWAY wrote:So get used to

BADWAY wrote:

So get used to it because I'm here until I'm banned from this site

Glad you're here... sort of.  I hope you take something positive away from your experience on our site.  Sorry to hear about your rough life, but I've known quite a few people who've had it rougher than you.  It might be worth noting that some of these people have still managed to adapt to the concept of believing in things only after actual proof exists for those beliefs.  Further, most people would say that such negative experiences lend credence to the notion that there is not some loving being up there looking out for you. 

 I once had a girl on our show who believed in god because she was addicted to crack and was on the verge of killing herself and somehow overcame it after going to rehab where they pushed god belief on her.  Her pitch was that God made her better.  My pitch: God got her addicted to crack and almost killed her, she chose to go to rehab and heal herself because she wanted to live.  It's all in how you look at it.  You can look at it in a manner which you have proof for, or you can look at it like an invisible man in the sky fucked you over and then fixed you.  Either way is fine by me, but only one of those ways we have proof for. 

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BADWAY wrote: I didn't want

BADWAY wrote:

 I didn't want to respond to any one's dissection of my story but it is clearly obvious how people twist things or take things the wrong way to validate their own point which in my opinion is selfish.

 <...>

To bob..when the Tsunami struck,,,to which nation do you refer...one that believes in Buddha, Vishnu, A head of lettuce ..I doubt they would have intervened on their part..and to go one step further...the Tsunami's and Earthquakes usually happen so fast that the unsuspecting may have not had a chance to pray for Divine intervention., like a drunk driver that rams into a family of 6 head on and survives but the family doesn't .They didn't have time to repent or pray or ask forgiveness...but I would suggest that the Lord thy God takes everything into consideration and is not this maniacal ,"I am going to get you" deity that some christians unfortunately and most atheists as well as agnostics would like to believe...He is a Loving and caring God. But even if they did..so...Some things..good or bad just happen..I've said that...God is not in the whirlwinds of destruction....These are effects of nature...

Stroke of luck...where, tell me where my life was lucky...were not talking rolling dice here...tell me was I lucky to be forced in giving oral sex to my neighbor...what about being homeless off and on since 1999....constantly losing jobs...losing a mother by my own hand...let me know when my life gets lucky....what about having a dad disowning me....having no mentor in my life to educate me about life...The events I mentioned were not lucky which clearly shows your arrogant ignorance. Oh maybe you refer to my story of having a lady pay my storage..how is that lucky ..can you explain the dynamics of this one....How a lady I don't know want's to pay my storage...read my next story and see if you can apply the luck streak there too..I suggest you will just to support "YOUR" belief as long as it conflicts with mine.

God doesn't ignore others and He doesn't always answer my prayers either...go figure...however...it's according to His will not mine that I am still here for whatever reason...maybe my purpose in life is to share with others and that's all I'm trying to do...

Actually, with Tsunamis, may people have a significant amount of time, maybe minutes, even on the first wave. Once the first one comes in, you realize there are likely to be more. So it isn't typically anything like car accident. Apologies if I described an overly dramatic scenario.

The most recent one was in Samoa, virtually 100% Christian, for what its worth.

The most dramatic one in recent years hit Aceh in Indonesia, mostly Moslem, so I guess you still believe that doesn't count, although I am pretty sure they believe in prayer to what they would claim is the same God.

Or does a 'natural' disaster not count, it has to be the result of the actions of other people?

So if was not 'luck', why did the lady pay for your storage? Did she tell you why? Did she claim God spoke to her? Remember, God is not supposed to simply compel people to do things, He is supposed to respect our 'free will'. Sounds like you were lucky enough to come across some kind-hearted and generous individuals who took pity on your situation.

There is no way can discount luck and insist it must have been God just because you prayed a few days before.

I'm sorry for your situation, but honestly that is one of the lamest argument for God I have heard. You really don't seem like you really think too deeply about these things, and are just reacting emotionally. Which is entirely understandable in what you are experiencing as a stressful situation.

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

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BADWAY wrote: I didn't want

BADWAY wrote:

 I didn't want to respond to any one's dissection of my story but it is clearly obvious how people twist things or take things the wrong way to validate their own point which in my opinion is selfish. 

Not only is it not "clearly obvious", as you put it, but there isn't even the slightest indication that any of the posters here have done this.

The point trying to be made to you is that it is often the most destructive part of the self that wants to believe they have been singled out by some divine force for deliverance, insight or special treatment.  This is what convinces the believer that his conversion experience was unique and enables him to so easily discount a thousand "former christians"....

They clearly did not understand as I did or receive the special insight I received.  I am special.

This is a part of normal human response that wants to give in to the ego.  But giving into the ego is at its best "self centered" and at its worst, the most destructive part of humankind's history.  

The devout christian NFL quarterback is certain that it was god that led him to victory over his foes.  He was singled out.  He was special and never once did his ego allow him to consider why god refused to answer the prayers of the opposing quarterback or waterboy (who most certainly are  just as devout followers of jesus but not like him.... 

or why jesus took the time to guide his throws, while simultaneously ignoring the prayers of thousands of children dying of hunger in a foreign country at the very same time.  It's a known fact that god loves his football and can't be bothered w/ tragedy when the Raiders play.

It might actually be funny if it weren't all so incredibly absurd and such a shining example of the worst part of our human nature.  

 

I'm sorry you had a hard life and glad you've survived it thus far, but it doesn't lend the slightest credibility to a divine force no matter what name you give it.  That divine force watching out for you is certainly a romantic notion, but in the end it is utimately ego-centric and always seems to bring out the very worst in humanity. 

Good luck reckoning the cross-dressing with your open-minded christian friends. 

 

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act."
George Orwell


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:o

BADWAY wrote:

 To Hamby...I Believe in God because He believes in Me and sustains me when I can't sustain myself.

 

 

How do you know this god believes in you?

 

How does this god sustain you? What exactly do you even mean by this?

Theism is why we can't have nice things.


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 To Bob..just for the

 To Bob..just for the record, there is video proof that tsunamis have hit unsuspecting people at the beach...so, yes, people can know, but I'm referring to the people who don't.  

I never claimed that my life was worse than others and this is only a microcosm of my life.

This story isn't about me, it's about how God has carried me through my darkest times..

Great, I'm glad some of you guys have it all together and it wasn't God who did it for you, but, there in lies the paradox of ignorance.

How can you prove God didn't take care of you or brought you through your turbulent trials....you can't deny that, although, you may not except it because you don't believe.

If God is truly omnipotent and omniscient as we as Christians believe...do you really believe it would be easy to describe or explain in just a few words or mathematical context.....I doubt any scientist would disagree that something that has the power to do all the things God can could be summed up by simple logic since the thought of God is so illogical according to your philosophy.

God is Thought. He is your conscious. Evolution is not contradicted by the bible in fact I beleive there may be other books from the bible that explain the prehistoric era that haven't been discovered yet.

The Bible is a historical Document. FACT

It contains actual places, peoples, structures and well documented evidence of events and battles that took place as supported by archaelogical finds. FACT

It determined before Cristobal sailed the ocean blue that the Earth was round..Isaiah 40:22. Even before Galileo or Copernicus the bible described star constellations, seasons, when to harvest etc. FACT

4 gospels written well after Jesus died by 4 separate men all relate the same account of the Messiah and His time here on Earth almost exactly. Fact

First book to be printed...FACT

A book that has predicted certain events that came to pass which only corroborates the text as being something of divine origin..FACT

You want me to provide evidence God exists...All I want to know is can you prove without scientific theoretical rhetoric that He doesn't. 

 

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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BADWAY wrote:How can you

BADWAY wrote:
How can you prove God didn't take care of you or brought you through your turbulent trials....you can't deny that, although, you may not except it because you don't believe.

You've got things backwards.  Why should someone believe that it was God?  What evidence is there to support the claim that it was God who helped?

 

BADWAY wrote:
If God is truly omnipotent and omniscient as we as Christians believe...do you really believe it would be easy to describe or explain in just a few words or mathematical context.....I doubt any scientist would disagree that something that has the power to do all the things God can could be summed up by simple logic since the thought of God is so illogical according to your philosophy.

You're telling us that an omnipotent God couldn't figure out how to explain himself coherently to people who value rational thought.  That's interesting.

 

BADWAY wrote:
God is Thought. He is your conscious.

Evidence?  No?  I didn't think so.

 

BADWAY wrote:
Evolution is not contradicted by the bible in fact I beleive there may be other books from the bible that explain the prehistoric era that haven't been discovered yet.

Genesis chapter 1 has plants (verse 11) coming into being before the sun is in the sky (verse 16).  It has seed-bearing and fruiting plants (verse 11 again) coming into existence before there are insects to act as pollinators (moving creatures come into existence in verse 20).

 

BADWAY wrote:
The Bible is a historical Document. FACT

Incorrect.  For example, the Noahic flood as described in Genesis chapters 6 - 9 simply did not happen and there is no evidence to support the story of Israel's captivity in Egypt and the subsequent story of Moses leading Israel out of Egypt.

 

BADWAY wrote:
It contains actual places, peoples, structures and well documented evidence of events and battles that took place as supported by archaelogical finds. FACT

Historical novels also contain place names and some actual historical events in order to lend an air of authenticity to the fictional elements of the story.

 

BADWAY wrote:
It determined before Cristobal sailed the ocean blue that the Earth was round..Isaiah 40:22.

Incorrect.  Isaiah 40:22 refers to a circle, not a globe.  A circle is a flat two-dimensional figure.

 

BADWAY wrote:
Even before Galileo or Copernicus the bible described star constellations, seasons, when to harvest etc. FACT

Even if that is true, it is hardly startling.  It would be truly amazing if any culture that dabbled even a little in agriculture had failed to notice constellations, seasons, and the best times to plant and harvest.

 

BADWAY wrote:
4 gospels written well after Jesus died by 4 separate men all relate the same account of the Messiah and His time here on Earth almost exactly. Fact

The fact is that the Gospels contradict one another frequently.  For example, are you familiar with Dan Barker's Easter Challenge?  Here, try it for yourself: http://www.ffrf.org/books/lfif/?t=stone

 

BADWAY wrote:
First book to be printed...FACT

That proves that theocracy was powerful in the 15th century, nothing more.

 

BADWAY wrote:
A book that has predicted certain events that came to pass which only corroborates the text as being something of divine origin..FACT

Please provide a specific example so that we can point out your error.

 

BADWAY wrote:
You want me to provide evidence God exists...All I want to know is can you prove without scientific theoretical rhetoric that He doesn't.

Gee...  Without using science and reason, can we show that there is no God.  Golly, I guess you've stumped us!

 

Oh, wait.  My mistake.  You're the one who claims that he does exist, meaning that the burden of proof is on you, and all the "evidence" you've provided is seriously flawed. 

 

Seriously, all you've done here is to reinforce my perception that those who claim to have rational reasons to believe in God are being intellectually dishonest.  Why don't you simply admit the truth, which is that you believe in God by faith and by preference, not because of reason and evidence.

 

Reality is the graveyard of the gods.


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BADWAY wrote: touche

BADWAY wrote:

 touche bro..it was either this pic or the one of me dressed up like girl which would you prefer

  Actually, out of curiosity, I would like to see a picture of you dressed as a transvestite. I mean big f**king deal. Besides, as an atheist my "world view" doesn't compel me to judge you as being "bad" for doing that and apparently neither do these Christians:    

 

             http://whosoever.org/index.shtml

 

  ( coincidentally, when I was much younger and still a Bible-believing Christian I had a Christian friend who was married and also had a young son who actually did come out to me as a TV.  As a Christian he viewed it as a "sin" even though he still continued to do it from time to time.  At the time I didn't really care.  What really made me revile him was that one of our friends had recently came out as being gay and my Christian TV friend was telling him about how evil he was for being a practicing homosexual blah, blah... )

Patrick is an edgy edgelord.


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 There you go that's one

 There you go that's one pic...I don't know how to put my pics in the forum but oh well let the insults begin!

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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BADWAY wrote: There you go

BADWAY wrote:

 There you go that's one pic...I don't know how to put my pics in the forum but oh well let the insults begin!

   I could be misjudging the majority of my fellow atheists... we as non-believers have every conceivable viewpoint, but I doubt many here really consider cross-dressing much of a controversial topic.  Your belief in and support of the Christian God would be much more likely to put you at odds with this crowd.  Interesting pic, though.

Patrick is an edgy edgelord.


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no diety guy

 okay here we go

In order

1. You no more couldn't prove that God has helped you through turbulent times in your life than I could prove that He did!

2. I was saying that something so complex as God would be hard for any man to explain even by science.

3. God is Thought. He spoke things into existence. He said Let it be and it became. Words stem from thought. When writing words one must have a thought for the words to convey the imagry on paper.

4. Verses 3-5 Gen 1- Then God said let there be light;and there was light. and God saw the light, that it was good;and God divided the light from the darkness. God called the Light DAY, and the Darkness He called NIGHT. So the evening and the morning were the FIRST DAY!

Verse 14 Then God said let there be lights in the firmaments of the heavens to divide the day from the night;and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years;

Verse 16  to the scripture you refer this was to help signify or constitute or put into perspective what shall be considered a day and night by placing a larger light in the day-(Sun) and a lesser one at night-(moon) and made the stars also!

He already had light in dark in place to aid in the creation process and then filled the two separate parts with the appropriate entities to sustain,support and continue in the developements here for us and abroad the vast expanse!

5. Because the bible contains factual information, it, plus its antiquity, classifies it as a historical document albeit a highly debated one.

6. The challenge is without merit. It's based on a you have to defend it this way or explain it this way by said information that leaves you unable to answer the question accurately....I will show that later but here's a tease,  Emmaus in question was more likely a place called Coloniya which was 7 miles from Jeruselem. which coincides with the other accounts that the 2 men were 7 miles away from Jeruselem.

For example. I tell you a story that requires an answer but you can only answer it by using the information I provide you can't change or alter the story to fit your answer.

3 business men go to a hotel for the night and share a room. The desk clerk says the room is 30 dollars. So, each man pays 10.

After they get their keys they adjourn to their room.

Moments later the Desk clerk remembers they have a special going on and it's 5 dollars off the room.

The desk clerk tells the bell boy to take the 5 dollars and give ti back to the men.

As the bellboy is making his way to the room he realizes he is having a hard time tring to figure out hoe to divide 5 dollars equally 3 ways.

So he takes 2 dollars for himself as a tip. (Thief)!haha Anyway, when he arrives he informs the men they get 3 dollars off the room and give each man back 1 dollar. 

Each man paid 10 originally, now they each got a dollar back so they only paid 9. 9 dollars times 3 men is 27 dollars.

The bellboy pocketed 2 dollars the 28th and 29th dollar. What happened to the 30th dollar..and you can only answer the question as it is worded.

That is why it would be hard to answer that question you proposed because Dan Barker has to handicap the one providing the answer that could show he is wrong...That's why he said I only got one thing you have to answer based on what was written as opposed to being able to answer by showing translations, how one reads a text may supplicate ones theory while the same text read or interpreted differently supplicates or supplants another.

7. You miss the point Nodietyguy... You can't prove He doesn't . Thanks for playing

oops i missed one other thing. The certain predictions that came to pass...I'll save that tidbit for later once I take care of Barking Dan ruff ruff! 

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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 for Abu Lahab,It's lahab

 for Abu Lahab,

It's lahab the arab or are you from india sir ,would you like hair to go with your slushee and hotdog...(in the tone of Apu from the simpsons)

Listen you juvenile dimwitted twit! I don't appreciate as nice and cordial as I have been that some insignificant internet sheep herder feels that is okay to bash me. I would expect that from Crying Brian or Mountain man Bob because of the bantering and I hope btw it was all in fun. But you you degenerate dog sniffer, take it from this Camel jockey himself.....I'll Kill you...to borrow a line from Jeff Dunham and Achmed the Dead terrorist..

Okay I feel better now,,,but thanks for the douche comment that reminds me ,I need to get some massengill later or maybe summers eve...

I'll worry bout that later crater head.

Laugh at that

 

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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BADWAY wrote:It's lahab the

BADWAY wrote:
It's lahab the arab or are you from india sir ,would you like hair to go with your slushee and hotdog...(in the tone of Apu from the simpsons). Listen you juvenile dimwitted twit! I don't appreciate as nice and cordial as I have been that some insignificant internet sheep herder feels that is okay to bash me. I would expect that from Crying Brian or Mountain man Bob because of the bantering and I hope btw it was all in fun. But you you degenerate dog sniffer, take it from this Camel jockey himself.....I'll Kill you...to borrow a line from Jeff Dunham and Achmed the Dead terrorist..

Abu Lahab ibn 'Abdul Muttalib, to give his correct name, was the first Arab to refute mohammed and islam because he knew a scam when he saw one. That's why I use that screen name. I'm actually an Anglo-Saxon, ex-Army, ex-football hooligan, ex-Brit living in California. No slushee for you!

Jeff Dunham just isn't funny. Cool that you think I'm juvenile, that was exactly the 'look' I was going for, being nearly 50.

BADWAY wrote:
Okay I feel better now,,,but thanks for the douche comment that reminds me ,I need to get some massengill later or maybe summers eve...

I'll worry bout that later crater head.

Laugh at that

Please think about this very seriously, god has done nothing for you, you've been the recipient of some charitable acts by kind but delusional people. Pay them back by helping them out of the mental shackles of religion, ok?

And stop cross-dressing. You, sir, are no Eddie Izzard!

 

 

How can not believing in something that is backed up with no empirical evidence be less scientific than believing in something that not only has no empirical evidence but actually goes against the laws of the universe and in many cases actually contradicts itself? - Ricky Gervais


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Hey you changed your pick.

There you go, better, but your eyes are still lerkeng very luciously though, but at someone to your right now, are you posing? 


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I can't

BADWAY wrote:

You want me to provide evidence God exists...All I want to know is can you prove without scientific theoretical rhetoric that He doesn't. 

 

Actually, proving a negative is pert near impossible. I can't prove to you that big foot, santa claus or the tooth fairy don't exist either. It's easy to just say since you're making the claim that you must provide the evidence. I'm hoping you'll understand why the burden is on you. If you step back from your holy book and really look, you'll see there is no verifiable proof for any god much less the christian version.

Respectfully,
Lenny

"The righteous rise, With burning eyes, Of hatred and ill-will
Madmen fed on fear and lies, To beat and burn and kill"
Witch Hunt from the album Moving Pictures. Neal Pert, Rush


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While

BADWAY wrote:

 There you go that's one pic...I don't know how to put my pics in the forum but oh well let the insults begin!

While we aren't immune from a little immaturity on occasion, the vast majority of us could really care less about how you dress and enjoy yourself. Enough with the invitations to insult you. Posting your silly religious theories is all the invitation needed. Stay on point. Smiling

Respectfully,
Lenny

"The righteous rise, With burning eyes, Of hatred and ill-will
Madmen fed on fear and lies, To beat and burn and kill"
Witch Hunt from the album Moving Pictures. Neal Pert, Rush


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nomorecrazypeople

 haha I can't seem to win with you on the eye thing but I am posing just taking a pic of myself.

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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 To Rehab the Arab....Jeff

 To Rehab the Arab....Jeff isn't funny but the dummies are hiwarious...hardy har har!

secondly your right, I'm much better looking than Eddie Lizzard...oy mate.

Btw I am scotch, irish, french, and syrian so I can offend on all counts.....

Get it through your helmet, hooligan me thinks you got kicked in the head too many times.

Read my other story and explain that one toilet turd..just kidding your not a toilet!

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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BADWAY wrote:1. You no more

BADWAY wrote:
1. You no more couldn't prove that God has helped you through turbulent times in your life than I could prove that He did!

Why is it so hard for so many theists to understand the concept of burden of proof as it relates to positive claims?

 

BADWAY wrote:
4. Verses 3-5 Gen 1- Then God said let there be light;and there was light. and God saw the light, that it was good;and God divided the light from the darkness. God called the Light DAY, and the Darkness He called NIGHT. So the evening and the morning were the FIRST DAY!

That only makes it funnier.  Apparently, there was day and night before there was a sun.

 

BADWAY wrote:
5. Because the bible contains factual information, it, plus its antiquity, classifies it as a historical document albeit a highly debated one.

The Bible also makes historical claims that are demonstrably false. 

BADWAY wrote:
6. The challenge is without merit.

Not at all.  It demonstrates quite clearly that the gospels contradict one another.

 

BADWAY wrote:
7. You miss the point Nodietyguy... You can't prove He doesn't . Thanks for playing

Why is it so hard for so many theists to understand the concept of burden of proof as it relates to positive claims?

Reality is the graveyard of the gods.


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BADWAY wrote:7. You miss the

BADWAY wrote:
7. You miss the point Nodietyguy... You can't prove He doesn't . Thanks for playing

The point that you are missing here is a pretty important one: for those who value evidence and rational thought, one needs a reason to think a claim is true.  If you make a positive claim (eg. God helped you through such and such) and, when asked how you know it was God who helped you, you only response is that doubters can't prove that it wasn't God, you are essentially admitting that you have no good reason to think that it was God. 

You need to either provide a rational basis for your conclusion that it was God or admit that you're believing it simply because you want to believe it.

Reality is the graveyard of the gods.


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BADWAY wrote: I didn't want

BADWAY wrote:

 I didn't want to respond to any one's dissection of my story but it is clearly obvious how people twist things or take things the wrong way to validate their own point which in my opinion is selfish.

You have more wisdom then most here.


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Badway, I don't know how

Badway, I don't know how much time you have spent with atheists, especially fundamentalists atheists such as frequent this forum, but you will find that such atheists believe there is no truth outside their immediate five senses. Similar to a young child who believes the only world that exists is his immediate family and environment. You have to realize this is a fundamental presupposition they hold. Now anyone who is willing to genuinely consider all the evidence knows this is clearly not the case, but this does not stop them from demeaning anyone who thinks otherwise. 

 Your belief is well founded. Personal experience and testimony is a valid and justified basis for belief. God does work in personal ways in our life.    Psalms 51:17  The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: A broken and contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise. 

 


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no diety guy you no more!

  I think you have been standing to close to the amp....Please step away from the Amp...thank you

can you hear me now.

I pointed out your errors in quoting scripture and like anymouth your attempts to be cute, ...trust me it ain't working!

I noticed you conveniently left out my other quotes of scripture to explain that but hey you got to hold to your concept of taking things out of context to support your belief so do us all a favor..before you try at using scripture to support your bias attitude please make sure that there aren't any other scriptures to dispute your meager attempts at disputing the Word of God! thanks!

Your basing the claims like I stated earlier on a premise that can't work . His challenge is an attempt to shackle the Theist from colloborating the texts of the gospels like my little riddle that you failed to mention. The 4 gospels were written by men and it is highly likely possible for them to be off in thier recollection a little but the overall gospels reinforce each others accounts especially the ones that matter. The crucifixion, resurrection, and so on. Little idiosyncrasies, like when a rock was rolled is not important it has no significance except that it was moved and all gospels report that. But later I will go into more detail why his argument is without merit.

And again sheep cud, YOU CAN'T PROVE HE DOESN'T EXIST we have gone over and over on this and your just being redundant.

When you can explain the origin of the molecule without rhetoric or theory that can do away with any and all POSSIBILITY of a metaphysical presence then I will stand down but until then you may please sit, watch and learn.

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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NoDeity wrote:You're telling

NoDeity wrote:

You're telling us that an omnipotent God couldn't figure out how to explain himself coherently to people who value rational thought.  That's interesting.

What evidence do you have that you value rational thought?


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  I'm beginning to think

  I'm beginning to think OrdinaryClay is developing a siege mentality.  Obviously this is a forum where theists and atheists consistently disagree.  Sometimes the arguments become vigorous.  If you view yourself as a victim then the solution is for you to withdraw.  Nevertheless the door is always open for you to come and go at your whim.

Patrick is an edgy edgelord.


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NoDeity wrote:The point that

NoDeity wrote:

The point that you are missing here is a pretty important one: for those who value evidence and rational thought, one needs a reason to think a claim is true. 

If you make a positive claim (eg. God helped you through such and such) and, when asked how you know it was God who helped you,

Given there is rational grounds for believing in God, and personal testimony is a valid form of evidence he is justified in believing God helped him through his trials.

 

Quote:

...you only response is that doubters can't prove that it wasn't God, you are essentially admitting that you have no good reason to think that it was God. 

Well it is true that atheists have the bogus belief that they hold no burden of evidence. 

 


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ProzacDeathWish wrote:  I'm

ProzacDeathWish wrote:

  I'm beginning to think OrdinaryClay is developing a siege mentality.  Obviously this is a forum where theists and atheists consistently disagree.  Sometimes the arguments become vigorous.  If you view yourself as a victim then the solution is for you to withdraw.  Nevertheless the door is always open for you to come and go at your whim.

I wasn't complaining. I was merely pointing out fact. 


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Ordinary Clay

 Thank you for your kind words it is refreshing, even though I do not take there jabs against me seriously or even personally. I am blessed and i will continue to share my experiences in hopes they will consider our position more respectively and without bias. please feel free to comment on my other posts it would be interesting to hear your feedback. Thank you and God bless all here!

"They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions...I must be going to Heaven because I don't have any good intentions.".BADWAY


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BADWAY wrote: Thank you for

BADWAY wrote:

 Thank you for your kind words it is refreshing, even though I do not take there jabs against me seriously or even personally. I am blessed and i will continue to share my experiences in hopes they will consider our position more respectively and without bias. please feel free to comment on my other posts it would be interesting to hear your feedback. Thank you and God bless all here!

 

God bless!

I've been reading. Actually your responses are darn good. (You're pretty funny too) If you have good internet access I would strongly suggest listening to the podcasts of William Lane Craig. His insight is incredible. He debates all the top atheists and makes them look silly with their trivial reasoning. Dr Gary Habermas is another good one.

http://www.garyhabermas.com/

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/site/PageServer

btw - I forgot to mention they will try and swamp you with responses too. They all think they're genuises. In a strange sort of way atheism is a mind cult. Eye-wink

 

 


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BADWAY wrote: Thank you for

BADWAY wrote:

 Thank you for your kind words it is refreshing, even though I do not take there jabs against me seriously or even personally. I am blessed and i will continue to share my experiences in hopes they will consider our position more respectively and without bias. 

    I commend you for not letting yourself become too defensive during this exchange. The use of sarcasm and occasional insults just seems to be par for the course.  After all we are discussing a highly contentious subject that frequently arouses strong emotions on both sides of the issue. 

Patrick is an edgy edgelord.


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OrdinaryClay wrote:I would

OrdinaryClay wrote:
I would strongly suggest listening to the podcasts of William Lane Craig. His insight is incredible. He debates all the top atheists and makes them look silly with their trivial reasoning.

That sounds like fun. Who does he debate on those podcasts ?

OrdinaryClay wrote:
btw - I forgot to mention they will try and swamp you with responses too.

Uhm.....it's an atheist forum. They do tend to respond..... Sorry ?

Still, if he wants, he can just pick someone he wants to talk to, and ask the others to wait their turn, no problem.

OrdinaryClay wrote:
They all think they're genuises.

Oh noes ! He read my mind ! My secret's out !

OrdinaryClay wrote:
In a strange sort of way atheism is a mind cult. Eye-wink

In a very, very, VERY strange way, sure.

 

 


 


OrdinaryClay
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Joined: 2009-04-19
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 Anonymouse

 

Anonymouse wrote:

OrdinaryClay wrote:
I would strongly suggest listening to the podcasts of William Lane Craig. His insight is incredible. He debates all the top atheists and makes them look silly with their trivial reasoning.

That sounds like fun. Who does he debate on those podcasts ?

Here is a starter. 

http://manawatu.christian-apologetics.org/apologetics-resources/william-lane-craig-comprehensive-debate-list/

 

Quote:

OrdinaryClay wrote:
In a strange sort of way atheism is a mind cult. Eye-wink

In a very, very, VERY strange way, sure.

Agreed, strange.