Anyone experiencing ADD/ADHD?

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Anyone experiencing ADD/ADHD?

A colleague of mine saw a documentary on Canadian TV about Attention Deficit Disorder, and started listing off all the characteristics, and I was like, "Yeah, yep, that's me, yep, that too, uh huh, oh yeah...." etc. Things like: Chronic procrastination, trouble finishing projects, always seeking stimulation (in my case intellectual rather than merely a 'rush'), excessive caffeinism, daydreaming, prone to distraction, excessive worry while being inattentive to real problems, constantly avoids boredom by seeking new things, impulsive, trouble with work/career, trouble with interpersonal relationships, etc.

The one thing I *don't* really have is hyperactivity, which is the one thing that I thought was characteristic of ADD. Apparently, I was mistaken, and hyperactivity is often present, but not always, and in fact ADD without hyperactivity is common.

Another thing that prevented me from noticing sooner is that I thought of kids with ADD were 'scatter-brained' and couldn't focus on anything. But the thing is, I was always able to have an intense focus in certain things, like learning math, science, and computers. So I figured, "ADD? That doesn't sound like me." But I must now admit that assessment was due to ignorance of the actual characteristics of ADD, which can include 'hyperfocus'.

But I've always had trouble with assignments, deadlines, following 'proper' procedures, etc. It affected my job, and eventually I could not focus at all on work and lost a very good job. I assumed my problem was depression and/or anxiety, but never really was able to make all the puzzle pieces fit together.

I'm now reading a book called Driven to Distraction by Edward M. Hallowell, and by page 4 I pretty much knew that my life-long problem of procrastination and under-achievement was really due to ADD.

I haven't had an official diagnosis yet, but I made a Dr's appointment this morning to get assessed. Hopefully this works out and I can get some treatment.

Ring a bell to anyone else here?

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It's my experience that the

It's my experience that the entire species has it, and it therefore doesn't qualify as a disorder at all. Never would I allow a child under my care to take the useless and harmful medication generally prescribed to people with this so-called 'condition'.

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yup every single person in

yup every single person in the world could be squeezed to fit in the defination, then they give the kids that medicine that makes people a boring zombie (witch btw is a big money maker). But there is a better cure

this

To bad its illegal.

 

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Well, I'm the only one in my

Well, I'm the only one in my family that has it, except possibly my mom to a mild extent, so I guess that blows your 'entire planet' hypothesis out of the water. One person I work with has it (the colleague that told me about it), but not the rest. I don't see people everywhere around the world getting fired/laid-off for inability to finish projects. The estimate I read is about 5% of the population has ADD.

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I have to disagree with some

I have to disagree with some of the prior posters. While on the surface the symptoms seem as if they encompass everyone on the planet, the symptoms of those who have true ADD/ADHD are at a level that interferes with their interpersonal relationships, work/school achievement, and affects their behavior tremendously.

Yes, I can say to all of these symptoms I have them... but I have seen first hand two of my siblings who were diagnosed. Our family was extremely skeptical, because we had seen first hand the 'zombie' children that are diagnosed and drugged (who are just normal children). The difference the drugs made with my brothers were night and day... their agressive, antisocial behavior disappeared and they were finally able to make social connections. Also, their grades went from F's to A's and B's. They were able to focus on their work, and their teachers called my mother, amazed at the difference.

 

Also, I take exception to the comment that all children need is discipline. My family is highly structured, and extremely disciplinarian... and it did not help my brothers. Yes... those that are diagnosed as ADD/ADHD and truley aren't may need a good spanking, but that does not mean it does not exist and it is not a true psychological disorder.


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tl;dr  

tl;dr

 

 


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You can actually tell the

You can actually tell the difference between someone with a "normal" brain and someone with an ADHD brain. That can't be used for diagnosis, but it does indicate that it's a neurological disorder, and not simply bad behaviour.



http://www.nimh.nih.gov/science-news/2007/brain-matures-a-few-years-late-in-adhd-but-follows-normal-pattern.shtml


http://www.adhd.org.nz/neuro1.html


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15949998


http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/display/article/10168/53841?verify=0



I've been diagnosed with MDD (major depressive disorder), which has very similar symptoms, and has success with many of the same treatments.

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  Funny thing about ritalin

  Funny thing about ritalin and hyperactivity is that ritalin is actually a stimulant, not a sedative.  My shrink said that this is referred to as a paradoxical effect because it nevertheless helps the ADHD patient to focus their thoughts.  I took it for a few months and it did help my cognition to a degree  but the effect quickly dissipated after taking it.  I've also taken adderall but the effects were also short term.


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natural wrote:Well, I'm the

natural wrote:

Well, I'm the only one in my family that has it, except possibly my mom to a mild extent, so I guess that blows your 'entire planet' hypothesis out of the water. One person I work with has it (the colleague that told me about it), but not the rest. I don't see people everywhere around the world getting fired/laid-off for inability to finish projects. The estimate I read is about 5% of the population has ADD.

The estimate is BS. I've seen dozens if not thousands of children prescribed BS medication because they are kids being kids. Not once have I ever seen someone truly affected by this false condition. Nor have I ever seen a viable test for it.

It's possible that there are a few people who really do fit the conditions description, and perhaps medication can help them, but NINETY NINE PERCENT of the people diagnosed with it are perfectly fine and normal people. It's a load of horse shit.

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Really, that ADD description

Really, that ADD description fits on almost everyone. Me too. I suspect there is no ADD, just the modern society which deprives the people of their greatest need - the self-realization.

Tapey wrote:

To bad its illegal.

 

You need to relocate overseas, then Smiling I admit, violence is necessary with some children. Some are very susceptible to tone of voice, or to verbal evaluation, but some are basically like animals. They think in terms of physical strength and authority. For them, a harsh parent is not a sadistic freak unlike I'd think, but a true leader of the pack. For them, spanking is the only thing that they can react to, and they do react positively, with respect and discipline. But it's quite inconvenient if the parents are devout pacifists and they adopt such a child. And it's even more inconvenient if local offices have no understanding.


 

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Vastet wrote:natural

Vastet wrote:
natural wrote:

Well, I'm the only one in my family that has it, except possibly my mom to a mild extent, so I guess that blows your 'entire planet' hypothesis out of the water. One person I work with has it (the colleague that told me about it), but not the rest. I don't see people everywhere around the world getting fired/laid-off for inability to finish projects. The estimate I read is about 5% of the population has ADD.

The estimate is BS. I've seen dozens if not thousands of children prescribed BS medication because they are kids being kids. Not once have I ever seen someone truly affected by this false condition. Nor have I ever seen a viable test for it. It's possible that there are a few people who really do fit the conditions description, and perhaps medication can help them, but NINETY NINE PERCENT of the people diagnosed with it are perfectly fine and normal people. It's a load of horse shit.

So what you're telling me is that with your sampling of children you have met, that none of them should have been diagnosed? I find that plausible, but how large was this sampling? You want me to believe that you have interviewed and met thousands of children that have been diagnosed with ADD/ADHD? Do you know the actual criteria that psychiatrists use?

While I agree that MANY children are diagnosed incorrectly, I do not think that you're 'experience' is enough to say that 99.99% of people diagnosed incorrectly. I can understand your viewpoint, but it is just conjecture and opinion. I also understand being distrustful of psychologist/psychiatrist due to the fact that many do not properly diagnose, or overly medicate their clients, but this does not mean these psychological disoreders do not exist. Until the American Psychological Association removes this disorder from it's list, it is irrational to think it is just some fantasy disorder, especially in light of the evidence that HisWillness provided.


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"So what you're telling me

"So what you're telling me is that with your sampling of children you have met, that none of them should have been diagnosed? I find that plausible, but how large was this sampling?"

I'll estimate a few hundred. In three provinces of Canada, by direct interaction. Thousands more online and indirectly. You may not be aware that it is considered something to brag about in many circles.

"You want me to believe that you have interviewed and met thousands of children that have been diagnosed with ADD/ADHD? Do you know the actual criteria that psychiatrists use?"

I don't have to interview someone to observe their behaviour. And yes, I do know the criteria. It's rarely a factor. 9 times out of 10 a teacher made the "diagnosis", and refused to allow the child to participate in class until drugged. Many doctors are satisfied with that, and prescriptions are given. They aren't particularly harmful, and the doctor has more important things to do, and it's done.

The rest I covered already.

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I can testify to the

I can testify to the teachers making the diagnosis thing. Tried it with me, my parents said no though.

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Vastet wrote:"So what you're

Vastet wrote:
"So what you're telling me is that with your sampling of children you have met, that none of them should have been diagnosed? I find that plausible, but how large was this sampling?" I'll estimate a few hundred. In three provinces of Canada, by direct interaction. Thousands more online and indirectly. You may not be aware that it is considered something to brag about in many circles.

A woman I know runs a private tutoring school for kids with learning disabilities and other education-related problems. She attests to the effectiveness of proper diagnosis and treatment of ADD/ADHD. She has interacted with far more kids than you have.

The book I'm reading has dozens of case studies of people who are properly diagnosed and their lives dramatically improved by medication.

My anecdotal evidence beats your anecdotal evidence.

Quote:
And yes, I do know the criteria. It's rarely a factor. 9 times out of 10 a teacher made the "diagnosis", and refused to allow the child to participate in class until drugged. Many doctors are satisfied with that, and prescriptions are given. They aren't particularly harmful, and the doctor has more important things to do, and it's done. The rest I covered already.

You are confusing improper diagnosis with the actual syndrome itself. If 1000 doctors improperly prescribe anti-biotics for colds and flus, that doesn't mean that bacterial infections do not exist.

Look at the scientific research, not the medical diagnoses. The research shows that of those who are properly diagnosed and treated, about 85% of them respond positively to medication. If it so happens that doctors/teachers 'diagnose' many normal kids with ADD, that doesn't mean ADD doesn't exist.

Your argument is fallacious. Just because you can have smoke without a fire doesn't mean fire doesn't exist.

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Vastet wrote:Nor have I ever

Vastet wrote:
Nor have I ever seen a viable test for it.

The DSM has clearly stated criteria for diagnosis: http://add.about.com/od/evaluationanddiagnosis/a/dsmcriteria.htm

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Tapey wrote:I can testify to

Tapey wrote:

I can testify to the teachers making the diagnosis thing. Tried it with me, my parents said no though.

 

Teachers cannot make a diagnosis, at least here in the US. They can recommend the child be sent to a psychologist/psychiatrist, and even then, only a psychiatrist or doctor can prescribe the medication.

You may confuse the fact that teachers can recommend/force children into 'special needs' classes.


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"A woman I know runs a

"A woman I know runs a private tutoring school for kids with learning disabilities and other education-related problems. She attests to the effectiveness of proper diagnosis and treatment of ADD/ADHD. She has interacted with far more kids than you have."

No actually, she doesn't. Nor does she have any experience with psychiatric facilities, which I worked in for nearly a decade. And she's wrong. For reasons I already stated.

"The book I'm reading has dozens of case studies of people who are properly diagnosed and their lives dramatically improved by medication.My anecdotal evidence beats your anecdotal evidence."

Outweighed by false diagnosis. My evidence beats yours.

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"You are confusing improper

"You are confusing improper diagnosis with the actual syndrome itself. If 1000 doctors improperly prescribe anti-biotics for colds and flus, that doesn't mean that bacterial infections do not exist. Look at the scientific research, not the medical diagnoses. The research shows that of those who are properly diagnosed and treated, about 85% of them respond positively to medication. If it so happens that doctors/teachers 'diagnose' many normal kids with ADD, that doesn't mean ADD doesn't exist.Your argument is fallacious. Just because you can have smoke without a fire doesn't mean fire doesn't exist."

I'm not confusing anything. I already allowed for the possibility of its reality in a previous post. But when false diagnosis hurts people more than accurate helps, there's a big fucking problem. There's a big fucking problem.

"The DSM has clearly stated criteria..."

And that criteria refers to natural childhood. Literally. Hence, bullshit. Every single factor is vague and subject to interpretation.

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lokipro wrote:Tapey wrote:I

lokipro wrote:

Tapey wrote:

I can testify to the teachers making the diagnosis thing. Tried it with me, my parents said no though.

 

Teachers cannot make a diagnosis, at least here in the US. They can recommend the child be sent to a psychologist/psychiatrist, and even then, only a psychiatrist or doctor can prescribe the medication.

You may confuse the fact that teachers can recommend/force children into 'special needs' classes.

Bullshit. Teachers make this diagnosis daily. And parents and doctors allow it, writing prescriptions based on that testimony.

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Vastet wrote: I'm not

Vastet wrote:
I'm not confusing anything. I already allowed for the possibility of its reality in a previous post. But when false diagnosis hurts people more than accurate helps, there's a big fucking problem. There's a big fucking problem. "The DSM has clearly stated criteria..." And that criteria refers to natural childhood. Literally. Hence, bullshit. Every single factor is vague and subject to interpretation.

Where is your evidence that more people are hurt by the diagnosis than it helps? Are we just supposed to defer to your decades of experience working in a psychiatric ward?  Your careful analysis of thousands of children daignosed with the disorder?

Now, I agree with you that there are many children that are misdiagnosed, but you are completely blowing it out of proportion and making unfounded assertions and pulling statistics out of thin air. If you continue along this line of argument, please find some facts to back it up... and trust me, I will be the first to reconsider my position.

 


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I have no way of

I have no way of transferring my knowledge to you. I'm not aware of any studies done with the question in mind. However, it also goes both ways. I have the education, experience, and dialogue with doctors who've confirmed my views on the matter. You don't. Neither does Natural. If you want me to reverse my position, you'll need a lot more than attacks on my credibility and claims of making things up, when you've provided not one iota of evidence to prove me wrong.

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Vastet wrote:"... She has

Vastet wrote:
"... She has interacted with far more kids than you have." No actually, she doesn't.

Yes, she does. So there.

Quote:
Nor does she have any experience with psychiatric facilities,

What the hell does that have to do with anything? ADHD doesn't send you to the psych ward, it just causes problems in everyday life. Her experience in educational settings outweighs your experience in psychiatric facilities.

Quote:
"My anecdotal evidence beats your anecdotal evidence." .... My evidence beats yours.

Clearly you are irony impaired. Your 'evidence' is merely anecdote. It is not really evidence. Neither is mine, which is why I made the ironic statement that mine beats yours. It's a pissing match. Unless you can point to some studies that support your position, you're talking out your ass.

By the way, one of the biggest groups advocating against ADHD is a front-group for Scientology. You don't really want to be on the side of the Scientologists do you? Arguing their case for them? You're a dupe. Like the climate denialists and the teabaggers and all the other dupes.

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Vastet wrote:But when false

Vastet wrote:
But when false diagnosis hurts people more than accurate helps, there's a big fucking problem. There's a big fucking problem.

Hmph, back-pedaling pretty quick there. First it doesn't exist, it's horse-shit, the entire world has it. Next, oh, okay, maybe it exists, but there's a problem with over-diagnosis.

Irrelevant. My post was not about over-diagnosis. It may very well be a big fucking problem, but that has nothing to do with the real people who really do suffer from a real condition.

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No, she doesn't. "What the

No, she doesn't.

"What the hell does that have to do with anything? ADHD doesn't send you to the psych ward, it just causes problems in everyday life. Her experience in educational settings outweighs your experience in psychiatric facilities."

So you have no experience with psychiatric facilities, let alone those dealing exclusively with children. You are quite wrong. My experience in the health industry far outweighs her meager educational viewpoint.

"Clearly you are irony impaired. Your 'evidence' is merely anecdote. It is not really evidence. Neither is mine, which is why I made the ironic statement that mine beats yours. It's a pissing match. Unless you can point to some studies that support your position, you're talking out your ass."

Cleary you are further impaired than I if my response didn't clue you in to the fact that I was fully aware of what you tried to accomplish. And you are as required to provide evidence as I, and have failed at least as much.

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"By the way, one of the

"By the way, one of the biggest groups advocating against ADHD is a front-group for Scientology. You don't really want to be on the side of the Scientologists do you? Arguing their case for them? You're a dupe. Like the climate denialists and the teabaggers and all the other dupes."

Even Hitler, Stalin, and Bush did some things right. Quite the fallacy you are resorting to here. I'm not impressed.

"Hmph, back-pedaling pretty quick there. First it doesn't exist, it's horse-shit, the entire world has it. Next, oh, okay, maybe it exists, but there's a problem with over-diagnosis."

Quite the failure of reading comprehension you now display. I allowed, in my second post in this topic, when I fleshed out my views further, the possibility of the existence of the condition. Attempting to misconstrue my words fails.

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Did ADD/ADHD exist prior

Did ADD/ADHD exist prior to the invention of television and the 30 second commercial spot?

Free your mind.


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Vastet wrote:I have no way

Vastet wrote:
I have no way of transferring my knowledge to you. I'm not aware of any studies done with the question in mind. However, it also goes both ways. I have the education, experience, and dialogue with doctors who've confirmed my views on the matter. You don't. Neither does Natural. If you want me to reverse my position, you'll need a lot more than attacks on my credibility and claims of making things up, when you've provided not one iota of evidence to prove me wrong.

All we have to go on is your claimed education, experience and dialogue with doctors... pardon my skepticism, but when people begin to use an appeal to authority, I begin to doubt them even more. All I can say for certain is that it exists, I've watched my brothers go from aggressive, antisocial, and completely wild (no matter how much discipline) to social children able to make friends and complete tasks. I've reviewed the documentation the DMS and APA has. Since you are the one making specific claims (i.e. 99.99% don't have it and it hurts more than it helps), the burden of proof is on you... is it too much to ask for evidence about your claims?

It is fine to have an opinion, but make it such.


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lokipro wrote:Vastet wrote:I

lokipro wrote:

Vastet wrote:
I have no way of transferring my knowledge to you. I'm not aware of any studies done with the question in mind. However, it also goes both ways. I have the education, experience, and dialogue with doctors who've confirmed my views on the matter. You don't. Neither does Natural. If you want me to reverse my position, you'll need a lot more than attacks on my credibility and claims of making things up, when you've provided not one iota of evidence to prove me wrong.

Since you are the one making specific claims (i.e. 99.99% don't have it and it hurts more than it helps), the burden of proof is on you... is it too much to ask for evidence about your claims?

It is fine to have an opinion, but make it such.

Lokipro, doncha know that crypto-Scientologists don't need evidence to support their claims? They have LRH's word that psychiatric conditions don't exist. All the other stuff about over-diagnosis is just a red herring, as it is irrelevant to the original post and topic of this thread.

Hey Vastet, if you want to rant about your fringe views, start your own damn thread. Don't shit all over mine.

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Ivon wrote:Did ADD/ADHD

Ivon wrote:

Did ADD/ADHD exist prior to the invention of television and the 30 second commercial spot?

Yes. Mental health professionals have been talking about it since the early 1900s. TV was becoming popular in the 40s and 50s, and Ritalin was invented in 1954 and used to treat ADHD in the 60s. The term ADD was in the 80s, and ADHD is more recent. Before that, it was called things like Minimal Brain Dysfunction, hyperactivity, etc.

The condition now known as ADHD has been with humans forever. It just hasn't been considered a treatable condition until it was directly studied and treated with stimulants such as Ritalin. Like autism, the recent 'increase' in the condition is due to better understanding, and therefore better diagnosis. Just like autism has always been with us, except misunderstood as the 'village idiot', so has ADHD, except misunderstood as the 'incorrigible rascal'.

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:I

 I was prescribed Wellbutrin for depression.

 

I told him I wouldn't feel so down if EVERYONE WASNT SO GODDAMNED STUPID ALL THE DAMNED TIME.

 

At least the psychiatrist found my suffering entertaining.

 

 

I know a lot of people that were told they have ADD, and if they have it so do I. I remember them being put on the pills. The problem is that the effects of STOPPING the medications really do have severe downsides.

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Lokipro, doncha know that

 

Anyway, back to the thread... how are you doing since the diagnosis? Has anything helped you focus more? I was just diagnosed with cyclothymia... has similar focus issues as ADD/ADHD, but is a mild form of bipolar. I've been able to stabilize the mood cycling, but still have some issues with my anger (my poor family Sad ). Before she ups the meds, I'm trying some excercise and meditation regimen. Though it's still difficult to try and sit and focus for that long! (15 minutes that is!)


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Does anyone have a statistic

Does anyone have a statistic on how many people have ADHD per thousand people or whatever. It would be interesting to see.

 

I remember in primary school quite a few of my class mates were on ritalin and got great marks and when they stoped taking it they failed badly. What i do know is they were god damn zombies with no friends. What i find hard to believe is that the same result cannot come about without the drugs, its not like they are not capable of learning and focusing at all. Everyone knows what it is like to not be able to concentrate, stay focused etc, you just force yourself to do what needs to be done. I find it hard to believe that people with ADHD cannot do the same even if they have to do it all/more of the time. I may be wrong as i haven't read anything on the subject but meh we all have differant strengths and weaknesses  turning people into zombies to fix a weakness just sounds like its a bad solution to me.

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Just an interesting report

Just an interesting report that is related

about how people who dont need these drugs take them to do better in university etc.

academic doping is set to rise

http://tinyurl.com/ybhwegl

Quote:
Amphetamines and methylphenidates, marketed as Dexedrine and Ritalin, are time-honoured stimulants used by as many as a quarter of students in some US colleges, especially those with competitive admission standards, according to figures from US research quoted by Cakic

perhaps a question for a differant thread but should this be allowed?

 

 

 

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lokipro wrote:Anyway, back

lokipro wrote:

Anyway, back to the thread... how are you doing since the diagnosis? Has anything helped you focus more?

I haven't been diagnosed yet. I only got a clue about ADD on Wednesday. I'm seeing my doctor on Monday and hopefully get a referral to a psychiatrist who can make a proper assessment.

I'm optimistic, since what I've researched about it and talked to people about it, it seems to fit me so perfectly. I'll post more when it happens. Sorry to hear about the cyclothymia, but glad you've got some help for it.

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I'll stay out of the

I'll stay out of the argument about kids getting diagnosed, since for me, it was like that movie "Awakenings". I've been able to perform what I would have once considered super-human feats of attention like cleaning my entire kitchen in one go. In my case, the difference has been enormous. I've been able to go back to school and do better than I ever could have before (by leaps and bounds). So there's no way for me to really weigh in without having a large bias in favour of diagnosis and treatment. I went from being very nearly unable to function to a very high-functioning person.

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natural wrote:lokipro

natural wrote:

lokipro wrote:

Anyway, back to the thread... how are you doing since the diagnosis? Has anything helped you focus more?

I haven't been diagnosed yet. I only got a clue about ADD on Wednesday. I'm seeing my doctor on Monday and hopefully get a referral to a psychiatrist who can make a proper assessment.

I'm optimistic, since what I've researched about it and talked to people about it, it seems to fit me so perfectly. I'll post more when it happens. Sorry to hear about the cyclothymia, but glad you've got some help for it.

That is exactly how I felt once I researched it... it was as if my whole life made sense! I wish that I had been diagnosed at an earlier age. I'm lucky though, most people with cyclothymia aren't diagnosed. Keep us posted!


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HisWillness wrote:I'll stay

HisWillness wrote:

I'll stay out of the argument about kids getting diagnosed, since for me, it was like that movie "Awakenings". I've been able to perform what I would have once considered super-human feats of attention like cleaning my entire kitchen in one go. In my case, the difference has been enormous. I've been able to go back to school and do better than I ever could have before (by leaps and bounds). So there's no way for me to really weigh in without having a large bias in favour of diagnosis and treatment. I went from being very nearly unable to function to a very high-functioning person.

That is great! I have to say the meds have really helped me. I used to have a compulsion to drink, and since starting the meds have no desire for alcohol like I did. Even when I drink it now, there's no compulsion to continue. I laughed because I thought to myself, "Wow, this is what normal people must feel... no wonder they can control themselves." It would be very interesting to have a study to see if alcoholics may have similar imbalances as bipolar.


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When it comes to

When it comes to psychological disorders, it's very important not to self diagnose. Try not to think about it too much whenever you go to see your doctor, because you may unintentionally present yourself as having ADD. If it's there, he can tell. If you have to bring it up and give specific examples to support it, not so much. It'll just look like you're trying to get the medicine.


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Chatta wrote:When it comes

Chatta wrote:

When it comes to psychological disorders, it's very important not to self diagnose. Try not to think about it too much whenever you go to see your doctor, because you may unintentionally present yourself as having ADD. If it's there, he can tell. If you have to bring it up and give specific examples to support it, not so much. It'll just look like you're trying to get the medicine.

That one's usually not difficult for a specialist to spot. ADHD tests are fairly involved at this point, and also incur a fair cost.

Fair point, though -- welcome to the forums!

 

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Chatta wrote:When it comes

Chatta wrote:

When it comes to psychological disorders, it's very important not to self diagnose. Try not to think about it too much whenever you go to see your doctor, because you may unintentionally present yourself as having ADD. If it's there, he can tell. If you have to bring it up and give specific examples to support it, not so much. It'll just look like you're trying to get the medicine.

I totally agree. My problem is that whenever I find some possible explanation for my issues, I tend to research it to death, and then I can look like a hypochondriac when I go to the doctor.

In fact, I just had my appointment with a GP to get a referral. I started explaining my issues and how I thought it might be ADD, and how I'd been researching it for the last few days, and I could see that he was concerned I was hypochondriacal. That's why I asked to get a referral to a psychiatrist who knows ADD and can make an accurate diagnosis.

I am all too aware that it is inappropriate to diagnose myself. Who knows, maybe I have something else entirely, and it just seems like ADD because that's what's on my mind at the moment. It's too easy to fool oneself. You need a real doc who has real experience and who can accurately identify ADD versus not-ADD.

Now I'm waiting for a call-back on the referral, and hopefully I'll get an actual assessment soon.

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Vastet wrote:"By the way,

Vastet wrote:
"By the way, one of the biggest groups advocating against ADHD is a front-group for Scientology. You don't really want to be on the side of the Scientologists do you? Arguing their case for them? You're a dupe. Like the climate denialists and the teabaggers and all the other dupes." Even Hitler, Stalin, and Bush did some things right. Quite the fallacy you are resorting to here. I'm not impressed. "Hmph, back-pedaling pretty quick there. First it doesn't exist, it's horse-shit, the entire world has it. Next, oh, okay, maybe it exists, but there's a problem with over-diagnosis." Quite the failure of reading comprehension you now display. I allowed, in my second post in this topic, when I fleshed out my views further, the possibility of the existence of the condition. Attempting to misconstrue my words fails.

 

 

You both have anecdotal evidence, but the problem is their anecdotal evidence matches the bulk of current scientific research.  To convince anyone on the fence I am pretty sure the burden of proof is on you in this discussion.  Although I guess you could pull a Tom Cruise and claim it is all lies and conspiracy.

I don't have ADD.  I have trouble finishing tasks, and performed horribly at school, but that is because I am a lazy bastard who gets bored easily.  I can interact with other people without difficulty, I have no problem holding down a job and if I *have* to focus on a task I have no issues.  Is it over-diagnosed?  Maybe, I would have to see actual data.  Is it all a lie or an excuse?  It doesn't seem to be...unless you can provide some convincing empirical data to show otherwise.

We're supposed to be rational right?

Everything makes more sense now that I've stopped believing.


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I have an ADHD child.

I thought along the same lines as you until my second child reached the age of about three and a half/four years old. There is no mistaking ADHD is an illness, but I do think it is severely over-diagnosed, and many people look too much into every-day "symptoms". My daughter is not currently on her medication, and there are severe consequences, but I'd prefer her to stay this way at least for another year or so. She is now ten. She is impulsive to the point of endangering her life, and that is what prompted me to take her to a Psychiatrist in the first place. They did extensive testinig on her, and she also saw a therapist who specializes in ADD/ADHD children. She was so addention deficit, she was off the chart on her final test.

 


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Medication

ADHD medication doesn't make people boring zombies. Do you even know anyone on the medication you speak about? My daughter has ADHD, and her medication makes her tolerable and able to focus and not be so dangerously impulsive. We've had to call 911 twice because of her dangerous behavior, and found out she left our neighborhood on a third occasion on her bicycle to roam around on her own. She has a horribly difficult time at school as well. She partakes in risky behavior that has endangered her life. And it isn't her up-bringing which makes her this way; I have two other children who are "normal".

 


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Update: Just got back from

Update: Just got back from the doctor's. Got a prescription for Dexedrine, low dosage. Just took my first dose. We'll see how it goes. I'm at work now. Hopefully I'll be able to get something done.

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EdwardNortonFan wrote:ADHD

EdwardNortonFan wrote:

ADHD medication doesn't make people boring zombies. Do you even know anyone on the medication you speak about? My daughter has ADHD, and her medication makes her tolerable and able to focus and not be so dangerously impulsive. We've had to call 911 twice because of her dangerous behavior, and found out she left our neighborhood on a third occasion on her bicycle to roam around on her own. She has a horribly difficult time at school as well. She partakes in risky behavior that has endangered her life. And it isn't her up-bringing which makes her this way; I have two other children who are "normal".

 

I must disagree, perhaps peope who actually have ADHD don't turn into zombies I wouldn't know, but the people who were on the drugs at my old schoool sure as hell were (maybe they were misdiagnosed maybe not who knows). Maybe boring zombies is a little harsh though, but they were definatly no fun. I'm not going to say the disease doesn't exist but I do find it hard to believe that duping them up is the best way to go. Sure maybe in the short term if they are going so far as to endanger there own lives (I know I did as a kid, but who didn't do danderous stupid things?) but i don't like the solution. Seems to me to just be avioding the problem as what happens when you stop taking the drugs?  I may have ADHD, i did get diagnosed with it about 10 years back but i never took any drugs and I turned out pretty good i think. (don't think I have it tbh though, some teacher had me take a test with some doctor)

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I think the people you speak

I think the people you speak of must have not taken ADHD medication, because ADHD medications are stimulants that are on the verge of being pure cocaine. My daughter's medication is a controlled substance, considered a schedule 2, which is one step below cocaine. I've known people who have taken their children's medication, it is prevalant among soccer stay-at-home mothers, and they became/become "alert" and "peppy". It helps them focus and clean house better, etc. etc. A far, far cry from being zombie-like. Have you ever known a cocaine user to be a zombie? I doubt it.


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One more thing about the

One more thing about the ADHD medication. The reason it doesn't make ADHD sufferers MORE hyper, because after all, it IS a stimulant, is because people with ADHD lack the ability to focus without medication. There is a part of the brain that cannot focus on one individual task or thought for very long. The medication stimulates the part of the brain and enables it to focus on tasks, rather than having scattered thoughts which cause a person to fidget, not be able to sit still, etc. etc. COMPARED to being fidgety and hyper, for an ADHD sufferer, the medication DOES calm the person down, such as hyperactive children, which is somewhat different than what adults without ADHD experience.


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....well yes cocain users

....well yes cocain users are in many ways like zombies.... just not in the way i imply. Cocain users while on cocain are dicks plain and simple. To much conferdance I tend to avoid them but sometimes they are unavoidable. But in no way is normal ADHD medication like cocain. I am aware that they are stimulants. I agree with alert and even peppy to a slight extent however I maintain no fun. work work work boring. that is what i mean by boring zombies, not that they are boring people but just not once did the people on ADHD medication at my old school say fuck work and go goof off somewhere while on the medication. But i supose that is why they are on the medication so they wouldn't do stuff like that. But that is just my personal experiance, I may be wrong who knows.

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Whatever goes upon four legs, or has wings, is a friend.
No animal shall wear clothes.
No animal shall sleep in a bed.
No animal shall drink alcohol.
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Tapey wrote: I must

Tapey wrote:

 

I must disagree, perhaps peope who actually have ADHD don't turn into zombies I wouldn't know, but the people who were on the drugs at my old schoool sure as hell were (maybe they were misdiagnosed maybe not who knows). Maybe boring zombies is a little harsh though, but they were definatly no fun. I'm not going to say the disease doesn't exist but I do find it hard to believe that duping them up is the best way to go. Sure maybe in the short term if they are going so far as to endanger there own lives (I know I did as a kid, but who didn't do danderous stupid things?) but i don't like the solution. Seems to me to just be avioding the problem as what happens when you stop taking the drugs?  I may have ADHD, i did get diagnosed with it about 10 years back but i never took any drugs and I turned out pretty good i think. (don't think I have it tbh though, some teacher had me take a test with some doctor)

The drugs today no longer create the 'zombie' effect that you describe. They have made advancements in the diagnosis, understanding and treatment of these psychological issues. The zombies you are talking about were mostly on drugs like lithium and the like, which do have those side effects. They now use stimulants (ADHD), mood stabilizers/anticonvulsants (bipolar), and antidepressents (well, you know what this is for) to treat these specifically... it used to be lithium across the board.

If the people you have come into contact with are zombies... they are either misdiagnosed, on the wrong medication or in the process of finding the correct medication/dosage. I just started a regimen and the only side effect I've had is being able to concentrate, leveling out my mood swings, and lowering my aggressive tendencies. I am the exact same person as I was before, sans the crazy.


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I'm going to wait a few

I'm going to wait a few days/weeks before I say for sure what effect the medication is having for me, since I don't want to confuse the drug for the placebo effect. But so far, no zombiness. So far it just seems I have a bit more energy, like being able to write this post (http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/18586) I've been thinking of writing for a long time. We'll see if it helps with focusing on work, though. RRS is inherently fun anyway, so maybe I just have more energy to do what I like, but no help focusing on things that are important but boring. I'm going to give it a couple days.

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