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A little Wiki help

Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 12:26am
spin
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A little Wiki help

Some time ago I did some work on the "nativity of Jesus" entry on Wiki, using the BCE/CE dating system in preference to BC/AD with its errors and bias. Someone decided to change them "for uniformity" to BC/AD, so I changed all the dates in the entry to BCE/CE for scholarly uniformity. For the last several days I've been involved in an edit war and I'm being asked to come to a consensus, meaning give in to those who want BC/AD.

Does anyone have the time and inclination to correct the entry a few times so that I'm not the only person actively advocating BCE/CE? Yeah, I know that it's a little thing, but it's one of those little things that reflect christian hegemony in our society.

All that needs changing is BC -> BCE and AD x -> x CE.

I'd appreciate the help.

 

spin

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Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 12:33am #1
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Initials

For those that don't know:

BCE = Before Common Era

and naturally

CE = Common Era

This removes the inappropriate reference to christ in BC. (Christ was born in 4 Before Christ.)

A.D. = Anno Domini (the year of our lord)

This is placed before the year, while CE is placed after the year.

 

spin

Trust the evidence, Luke


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 1:13am #2
Laughing_Man_d8D
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Nothing like having a dating

Nothing like having a dating system based on mystical figures.


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 3:59am #3
Visual_Paradox
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I have added my support on

I have added my support on the Talk page.

Quote:
Arguments from convention — Wikipedia convention, scholarly convention, etc.—and allowability seem unfruitful because, regardless of the popularity or unpopularity of a particular dating system and regardless of the allowability of several throughout Wikipedia, the arguments from convention and allowability do not address the core issue of accuracy and neutrality, which I consider as the main characteristics of high encyclopedic quality. All pertinent Wikipedia and scholarly articles on the subject of the birth of Jesus results in a conclusion that the year Mary gave birth to Jesus remains historically unverifiable. Thus, people can hold many views about the specific year that Mary gave birth to Jesus or that, in the case of Jesus Mythicism, Jesus did not exist and therefore Mary did not give birth to Jesus at all. The BC/AD dating system, especially on an article about the birth of Jesus, inherently and implicitly violates NPOV by specifying Jesus as a historical person and a particular year as the date that Mary gave birth to him. In contrast, the BCE/CE dating system does not make such claims and does not violate NPOV. Therefore, we should prefer the use of the BCE/CE dating system over the BC/AD dating system. --megamanXplosion (talk) 07:54, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

I will periodically check the article and revert if needed. The article already used the BCE/CE dating convention when I looked at it.

Stultior stulto fuisti, qui tabellis crederes!


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 4:23am #4
Kevin R Brown
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That discussion highlights

That discussion highlights everything that is wrong with Wikipedia.

"CONSENSUS! CONSENSUS! YOU CAN ONLY GIVE FACTS IF THEY'RE THE MOST POPULAR!"

 

Yeah. Because that's how you get good data. Sticking out tongue

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"Natasha has just come up to the window from the courtyard and opened it wider so that the air may enter more freely into my room. I can see the bright green strip of grass beneath the wall, and the clear blue sky above the wall, and sunlight everywhere. Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression and violence, and enjoy it to the full."

- Leon Trotsky, Last Will & Testament
February 27, 1940


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 4:54am #5
Visual_Paradox
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Revert!

Revert!


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 9:19am #6
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Great guns. The edit is

Great guns. The edit is sticking at the moment, though, as AD is before the year, a search and replace puts CE before the year, so I had to move the "CE" after the year. Computer

 

spin

Trust the evidence, Luke


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 9:31am #7
Visual_Paradox
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Yep. I realized, about an

Yep. I realized, about an hour after publishing the edit, that I did not place CE in its proper location. I thought about editing it again to fix it, but I figured that someone would simply revert my changes anyway and I could fix it on my second time through. Thanks for fixing it, though. 

Stultior stulto fuisti, qui tabellis crederes!


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 2:01pm #8
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I checked the article and

I checked the article and its still BCE/CE but i'll check back again from time to time and edit if need be.

 

I'd just like to add that I actually prefer BC/AD (sorry I'm a sucker for tradition) but I do agree that BCE/CE should be used at all times. Would posting something like this in the disussion section of Wikipedia, although more elaborate, help with the debate? I'm not really familiar with how Wikipedia works.


Posted on: January 5, 2009 - 8:46pm #9
Visual_Paradox
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BCE/CE has a long venerable

BCE/CE has a long venerable tradition, too, Stosis Smiling

As for posting on the Talk page, please do so.  As of now, people are demanding consensus. How they intend to recognize the establishment of a consensus... I have no idea.

Stultior stulto fuisti, qui tabellis crederes!


Posted on: January 6, 2009 - 11:17pm #10
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RfC

The situation is now "entrenchment rather than consensus", so a request for comment has been put in! Sombrero

 

 

spin

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Posted on: January 6, 2009 - 11:20pm #11
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Also wondering...

How would one get the page about the emperor Julian to remove the pejorative "Apostate" from the title? There have been attempts to rename the page, but so far all failed. Convention and ancestral bitterness outweighs decorum.

 

 

spin

Trust the evidence, Luke


Posted on: January 7, 2009 - 2:02am #12
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Quote:How would one get the

Quote:
How would one get the page about the emperor Julian to remove the pejorative "Apostate" from the title?

Go the route of Tycho and set-up your own Wiki. Sticking out tongue

Quote:
"Natasha has just come up to the window from the courtyard and opened it wider so that the air may enter more freely into my room. I can see the bright green strip of grass beneath the wall, and the clear blue sky above the wall, and sunlight everywhere. Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression and violence, and enjoy it to the full."

- Leon Trotsky, Last Will & Testament
February 27, 1940