Books about the (non) existence of Jesus

Sarah247
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Books about the (non) existence of Jesus

Hey everyone,

I hope I am posting this in the right place (I'm a brand new user). I'm searching for GOOD books to read about the (non) existence of Jesus. Any insight or recommendations would be more than welcome.

I did find a book called "The Jesus Puzzle: Did Christianity Begin with a Mythical Christ? Challenging the Existence of a Historical Jesus" has anyone read that book? The reviews on amazon are pretty good...

Thanks again for your time!

 

 

- Sarah

"I’m a polyatheist - there are many gods I don’t believe in." - Dan Fouts


Hambydammit
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 Rook is the expert here,

 Rook is the expert here, but I've heard good thing about Deconstructing Jesus, by Robert Price.  Generally, anything you can find by Price or Richard Carrier is going to be pretty good.

 

 

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MattShizzle
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When does Rook's book come

When does Rook's book come out?


Sarah247
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Thanks for the feedback. I

Thanks for the feedback. I wrote down the authors and am currently looking up their collected works. It seems to me that there is very little said about the potential non existence of a historical figure named Jesus from the Bible. I'm not exactly sure why. Maybe I have been doing my research in all the wrong places Smiling This interests me a lot, though. I am very excited to read books by people who have looked into the issue in depth.

- Sarah

"I’m a polyatheist - there are many gods I don’t believe in." - Dan Fouts


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 Quote:It seems to me that

 

Quote:
It seems to me that there is very little said about the potential non existence of a historical figure named Jesus from the Bible. I'm not exactly sure why.

It's a relatively new idea, and for some puzzling reason, there aren't a lot of grants available for people who want to write about how the second largest religion in the world is based on a historical inaccuracy.

Seriously, though, Jesus' historicity has just been assumed through most of history.  Modern advances in science, archaeology, and textual analysis and criticism have made a few people question the legitimacy of the assumption, but understandably, there's a lot of resistance.  There simply aren't very many scholars who like seeing their entire body of work tossed under the bus.

 

 

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I can understand how

I can understand how scholars could have a hard time with the idea, and I do understand about grants. I just don't understand why it's a new idea. There seems to be precious little more than assumptions regarding the potential life of Jesus. To me it seems like, at best, "Jesus" existed as fragments of myths throughout time (ex: Krishna etc) that someone just put together  to make some moral of some story cooler and more culturally accurate or some such nonsense. Most of the books and articles I have read have argued Christianity without taking into account even once arguing Jesus, whom the whole religion is "based" on. It seems to me that if one is to argue Christianity, all aspects of it should be argued STARTING with the figure of Jesus. I guess in my search to fully educate myself I am starting on a quest to understand the roots of this mythical man.

I have heard that there isn't one shred of archeological proof existing to even remotely prove that this man ever graced the planet. My mother-in-law, a born again who never ceases to amaze me with her beliefs, says that there are "footprints" somewhere in Israel that "prove" that Jesus walked on that ground. 

Uh huh. That sure is enough to sway me (sarcasm intended).

 

- Sarah

"I’m a polyatheist - there are many gods I don’t believe in." - Dan Fouts


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 Quote:I just don't

 

Quote:
I just don't understand why it's a new idea. There seems to be precious little more than assumptions regarding the potential life of Jesus

Witness the power of faith to blind people to the obvious.

Quote:
I have heard that there isn't one shred of archeological proof existing to even remotely prove that this man ever graced the planet.

That's true.

Quote:
My mother-in-law, a born again who never ceases to amaze me with her beliefs, says that there are "footprints" somewhere in Israel that "prove" that Jesus walked on that ground.

Too much CBN will do that to you.

 

 

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Thanks for your insight. I

Thanks for your insight. I looked up the book "Deconstructing Jesus" and it looks fantastic. I can't wait to read it!

- Sarah

"I’m a polyatheist - there are many gods I don’t believe in." - Dan Fouts


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Before I'll be sure about

Before I'll be sure about Jesus' non-existence, I have to find an answer on a certain question.
If Jesus never existed, who the hell is that guy who often accompanies Maitreya on his journeys around the world? Smiling
I don't mean that hip-hop singer, btw.

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 Quote:If Jesus never

 

Quote:
If Jesus never existed, who the hell is that guy who often accompanies Maitreya on his journeys around the world? Smiling

You mean the dragon from "Neverending Story"?

...

 

Oh... Maitreya!!!.... right.... I thought you meant Atreyu, that devilishly clever boy who saved the world from something or other while bad 80s music kept playing in the background...

 

 

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Luminon wrote:Before I'll be

Luminon wrote:

Before I'll be sure about Jesus' non-existence, I have to find an answer on a certain question.
If Jesus never existed, who the hell is that guy who often accompanies Maitreya on his journeys around the world? Smiling
I don't mean that hip-hop singer, btw.

If it is Jesus then that would probably mean that Jesus is mythical, to best be the companion of a character who definitely is mythical himself...

 

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Sarah247 wrote:Hey

Sarah247 wrote:
Hey everyone,

I hope I am posting this in the right place (I'm a brand new user). I'm searching for GOOD books to read about the (non) existence of Jesus. Any insight or recommendations would be more than welcome.

I did find a book called "The Jesus Puzzle: Did Christianity Begin with a Mythical Christ? Challenging the Existence of a Historical Jesus" has anyone read that book? The reviews on amazon are pretty good...

Thanks again for your time!

There are conspiracy theorists everywhere, even in atheism.  It's rather unfortunate but it does put a large (warranted) dent on our stance, and a lot of misinformation out there especially when it comes to jesus mythicism.  When reading anything, try to keep an open mind and not just believe everything you're told because it's on paper.  Think for yourself as you're reading, "Does this make sense?"  Just because two things have similarities, it does not mean that one spawned from another. 

One good example I like to use is xmas.  As an atheist/non-christian/whatever do you yourself celebrate xmas?  Do you decorate your house?  Do you put up a tree?  Do you put up tinsel and lights?  Do you have big meals with your direct and extended families?  Do you hand out presents?  Seeing as I don't have time to wait for a response to these questions, I'm going to assume you do so I can continue with my point.  Why?  I am willing to bet the answer is that the answer to "why?" is something along the lines of it being family tradition.  It's what you've always done, it's what you enjoy, so you keep doing it.  Nothing more, nothing less.

Conspiracy theorist jesus mythicists and conspiracy theorist atheists (as seen in the movie Zeitgeist, Acharaya S books, and the book you mentioned) see the link between pagan rituals and the things christians did and they think that was a contributing factor in the spawning of christiantiy.  It's much more likely that Dionisians, Pagans, and people of other religions converted to christianity (whether forced or at their own will, it doesn't matter) but continued doing these celebrations at the same time every year in the same method, for the EXACT same reason you still celebrate xmas.  No conspiracy theory, nothing was stolen, it's just what the people always did in the past, so it's what they want to do going forward, and it got adopted in that way.  Nothing to do with the formation of the religion at all.

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From what I've read, the

From what I've read, the Catholic church back in the day noticed newer converts to Christianity were still celebrating Pagan traditions and knew it would be hard to get them to stop altogether, so they integrated it into Christian teachings (Xmas from Winter Solstice, Easter from Spring Equinox, etc. )

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 Just to weigh in with my

 Just to weigh in with my own very tepid opinion, I don't know if there was a historical Jesus.  Personally, I don't think it matters too much because if there was, he wasn't particularly important.  I mean, nobody mentioned him for twenty years.

My best guess is the Gospels are 99% fiction, if not 100%.  That's not to say they weren't based on somebody who really lived, but for crying out loud, Wonder Woman was a character based on somebody who really lived.

The Achyara crowd are looking for a grand conspiracy.  I just don't think there was one.  I think there was just a Jewish writer trained in Greek who thought up a pretty neat story incorporating a bunch of legends he'd read or heard.

 

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BobSpence1 wrote:If it is

BobSpence1 wrote:
If it is Jesus then that would probably mean that Jesus is mythical, to best be the companion of a character who definitely is mythical himself...
For a mythical character there is too many photos and personal encounters. Like that moment when he (not Jesus) appeared in front of 6 000 people in Nairobi (1988). That's not fake, there's multiple photos taken by a journalist, and the people there were Mary Sinaida Akatsa's crowd, not a hired actors or a photomontage.
Who's that man? I mean, some interviews in TV would be great, he seems to share similar opinions on the problems of the world. It's like whatever he says, people already knows it, and welcomes him to say it in better words and aloud.


 

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Luminon wrote:BobSpence1

Luminon wrote:

BobSpence1 wrote:
If it is Jesus then that would probably mean that Jesus is mythical, to best be the companion of a character who definitely is mythical himself...
For a mythical character there is too many photos and personal encounters. Like that moment when he (not Jesus) appeared in front of 6 000 people in Nairobi (1988). That's not fake, there's multiple photos taken by a journalist, and the people there were Mary Sinaida Akatsa's crowd, not a hired actors or a photomontage.
Who's that man? I mean, some interviews in TV would be great, he seems to share similar opinions on the problems of the world. It's like whatever he says, people already knows it, and welcomes him to say it in better words and aloud.

Those events in no way demonstrate thet the person involved was actually The Matreiya as imagined in the Myth.

 

Favorite oxymorons: Gospel Truth, Rational Supernaturalist, Business Ethics, Christian Morality

"Theology is now little more than a branch of human ignorance. Indeed, it is ignorance with wings." - Sam Harris

The path to Truth lies via careful study of reality, not the dreams of our fallible minds - me

From the sublime to the ridiculous: Science -> Philosophy -> Theology