Open letter to Christians against gay marriage

Sapient's picture

 I recently had an exchange with a Christian friend who was "disgusted" at the states that approved gay marriage.  He believes the people who voted for it are "disgraceful." Christian disapproval of gay marriage was the impetus behind this open letter that will hopefully open the eyes of a few of my Christian readers.

Marriage was initially created by men many years ago to control women, at a time much more archaic than the time we live in now.  It was created at a time that we would stone someone for being gay as well as for cursing at their parents.  Many things have changed in society since marriage was first created.  We now are able to traverse the planet to find a mate and no longer need to claim one within walking distance as our property.  Today marriage is viewed much differently… so is stoning.   In fact we are so far away from the original reasons behind the creation of marriage that nowadays it can feel like marriage is a means for women to control men.  

Marriage today is considered a formal legal agreement.  An agreement that governments have decided warrants some special privileges.   Sure, I get that your religion defines marriage as between a man and a woman but governments founded on principles of equality realize they must define it as an agreement or contract between two people to live as a married couple.  This contract allows two people that are in love to unite in a lifelong bond that affords them certain rights they would not otherwise be afforded.  Governments throughout history have slowly moved away from biblical interpretation of the law as it is outdated and irrelevant.  We no longer allow slavery, we recognize it as inhumane… the men who created your silly bible story apparently didn’t.  Your argument that we should embrace the definition of marriage that religion has set forth is a poor one considering how far we've moved away from religious law, it's time to grow in this area too.  We choose to live in a world governed by sanity and fairness, not a 2000 year old book that condones slavery and violence. Do you want peace and equality or not?

When you complain about gay marriage, even consider it "disgraceful" you are taking a stance against a couple that wants to proclaim their love for life and wants the same benefits that married couples receive.  They receive certain health care benefits, tax benefits, and the ability to visit their partner’s deathbed. 

Your stance is uniquely anti-human if you aren’t willing to afford gay couples the same rights that you receive as a heterosexual couple.  Your discrimination and hate is defended by using a book written by ignorant drugged up lunatics in an attempt to monopolize power and profit over the even more illiterate masses. 

Your god is supposed to be all knowing and all powerful.  He knew this day would come.  He knew a time would come where decent people would be forced to take a stance that allows this "sin" or be forced to face the fact that they have an indecent opinion.  Your anti-gay stance is indecent, it is shameful and sad that it is based on a book full of contradictions and mistakes; a book that any reasonable intelligent person who is honest with themselves must admit is nonsense.  You might as well base your opinions on Peter Cottontail. 

As a straight man that loves women and couldn't possibly ever envision myself with another man I have a hard time relating to someone who would.  Frankly it’s not my thing.  But a homosexual person may feel the same way about my heterosexual preferences.  I understand that as a decent citizen of this planet I am no more entitled to the legal advantages of love as someone who falls in love with someone of the same sex.  And you might say you think being gay is a choice, but we do have scientific reasons for believing people are born gay.  The science leads us to believe that homosexuals don't make a choice to be gay.  There are countless examples of gay acts in the animal kingdom, did they have peer pressure or learn it on TV?  One further scientific reason to believe that people are born gay: ask gay people all over the globe if they chose it! I should not be granted rights that I would discriminate away from someone else.  You don't deserve the special rights you are afforded through marriage if you are unwilling to accept others who want the same.   

Let’s pretend for a moment that the inconceivably ridiculous god concept you believe in is true, then we must admit that God created people knowing full well that they would be biologically predisposed to attraction to people of the same sex.  He knew full well before he created a single atom that he would bring people into existence that was biologically born gay and therefore born with the purpose of “letting him down.”  He knew he had the power to stop it and was supposedly all loving.  He didn't change his plan nor did he stop this injustice before it happened.  He created people in such a way that he knew they couldn't possibly fulfill his plan and would serve an eternity in the hell that he allowed to exist.  And don't say that stopping this "disgraceful" gay person from being born this way would have taken away free will.  It wouldn't have removed free will any less than him not granting you certain other biological traits have.  Do you have the ability to shoot laser beams out of your eyes or jump 50 feet high?  No.  Apparently god has limited your ability biologically.  Why didn’t he limit us (and all the other animals) biologically to be heterosexual?  Why did he let gays exist even though he considers it "sin?"  Why?  I know why, BECAUSE YOUR GOD DOESN'T EXIST.  It's time for you to leave the bronze ages and accept gay marriage.  And if my arguments didn’t persuade you, keep in mind that if you don’t accept gay marriage gay men will marry your girlfriends.

Luke 17:34-35 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 

- Brian Sapient


Buy popular atheist books and support the Rational Response Squad at the same time on Amazon.

harleysportster's picture

I ought to

I ought to send that to every church in my city. They have flooded my local newspaper with letters, whining about gay marriage. I think there are far more pressing concerns within the government than whether or not a gay person wants to marry or not.

I just don't get the big deal about it and I am straight.

What really freaks me out, is when you tell some of these Christians on the local news forums that you don't have a problem with gay people marrying, they either accuse me of being gay or having a family member that is gay.

I guess it never occurred to them, that there are straight people like me out there that really just think it should be a non-issue and people should be allowed to marry whom they want.

But, I get rebuttals like : "So I guess your for people marrying animals ?" or "So I guess you want little children subjected to flamboyant parades ?."

Who said anything about flamboyant parades ?

Who said anything about marrying animals ?

People can be such morons.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno

ksskidude's picture

Open Letter to Christian against gay marriage

 Brian,

 

As usual your letter was spot on!  I am so fed up with Christians and republicans pushing their beliefs on every one else.  We get it, your against gay marriage.  But what I don't get is, why?  Yes I know what the stupid book says, but that book says a lot of stupid shit that they don't follow.  So it's not really about the book, it's simply about two men having sex.  They just can't stop seeing Adam go down on Steve.  It's always about sex with them.  Why can't they simply just look at it, as two people who are in love and care about each other and want to spend their lives together, and get the few breaks that come along with it?  I read a book called, "The Walking Wounded" by Beverly Barbo in college and it changed my whole outlook on gay people.  "Can you change your sexual preference". 'No I can't.' " Well either can I!" For some reason, that simple question hit me like a ton of bricks.  

 

So Brian I agree with what you wrote and hope to see the day when Christians pull their head out of their ass and start realizing that we can't alter who we want to fall in love with.  Oh and I hope they wake the fuck up  and now their god doesn't exist!!!

digitalbeachbum's picture

Christians don't want gay

Christians don't want gay marriage because it makes gays equals.

 

 

Sapient's picture

 In my opening post I

 In my opening post I linked to the gay men will marry your girlfriends video.  Now the ladies have one...

 

- Brian Sapient


Buy popular atheist books and support the Rational Response Squad at the same time on Amazon.

Cpt_pineapple's picture

(No subject)

 Very well said. I just

 Very well said Sapient. I just want to add two things. 

1. Good old Hitch quote: Homosexuality is not just a form of sex, it's a form of love, and it deserves our respect for that reason.

2. My own work: For anyone who has a problem with people marrying someone of the same sex marriage, I always hear the same thing. "I think that these two people madly in love with each other shouldn't be afforded the right to get married, because I personally disagree with the combination of genitals between the two". If you think that's an absurd position worded that way, I challenge you to point out where my wording is inconsistent with your position.

Theists - If your god is omnipotent, remember the following: He (or she) has the cure for cancer, but won't tell us what it is.

EXC's picture

Sapient wrote:Marriage today

Sapient wrote:

Marriage today is considered a formal legal agreement.  An agreement that governments have decided warrants some special privileges.

Isn't that the problem in the first place. Why does anyone in our society get "special privileges"? Why do we discriminate against singles for the benefit of couples? What special privilege is there that should not be available to a single person? Why do single people have to subsidize the healthcare and taxes of couples and families?

The government doesn't need to give anyone a magic piece of paper to anyone so they can feel they are married. If people want to have contracts for things like joint property, they can have separate legal agreements.

Government has turned into nothing more that a tool for sub-groups to have special rights and subsidies at the expense of the rest of society.

“Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful.” Seneca

Sapient's picture

EXC wrote:Sapient

EXC wrote:

Sapient wrote:

Marriage today is considered a formal legal agreement.  An agreement that governments have decided warrants some special privileges.

Isn't that the problem in the first place. Why does anyone in our society get "special privileges"? Why do we discriminate against singles for the benefit of couples? What special privilege is there that should not be available to a single person? Why do single people have to subsidize the healthcare and taxes of couples and families?

The government doesn't need to give anyone a magic piece of paper to anyone so they can feel they are married. If people want to have contracts for things like joint property, they can have separate legal agreements.

Agreed.

- Brian Sapient


Buy popular atheist books and support the Rational Response Squad at the same time on Amazon.

marriage

Quote-

Marriage was initially created by men many years ago to control women, at a time much more archaic than the time we live in now. 

 

 

Genesis 2:22-24

Then the LORD God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.  The man said, "This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called 'woman, ' for she was taken out of man."  For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one fleshthis passage says it all. God made marriage to be a connection between man and woman. Marriage is a union meant to be the strongest relationship on earth. (exept that with God)

 

ex-minister's picture

bencool, do you think it is

bencool, do you think it is ok for a man to rape a virgin and then if caught pay her father about three hundred dollars and by marry the woman and never divorce her ?

Religion Kills !!!

Numbers 31:17-18 - Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

http://jesus-needs-money.blogspot.com/

bencool1000 wrote: Genesis

bencool1000 wrote:

 

Genesis 2:22-24

Then the LORD God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man.  The man said, "This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called 'woman, ' for she was taken out of man."  For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and they will become one fleshthis passage says it all. God made marriage to be a connection between man and woman. Marriage is a union meant to be the strongest relationship on earth. (exept that with God)

 

Just two verses later (Genesis 3:1): 

Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman

 

A snake talked. You believe this book is true. We don't. Until you explain how a snake talked, how the passage you actually quoted could have actually happened, given what we know about the age of the earth and our species, why we're supposed to stone disobedient children to death, or eat barley cakes made with human poo (in view of the people from whom you acquired the poo), then I think it's safe for everybody on earth to deny the authority of that book. 

Theists - If your god is omnipotent, remember the following: He (or she) has the cure for cancer, but won't tell us what it is.

Atheistextremist's picture

Meanwhile, down in the Lucky Country

  

'Sinners' put on notice: anti-gay rights to stay

Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard has assured religious groups they will have the 'freedom' under a new rights bill to discriminate against homosexuals and others, according to the Australian Christian Lobby. 

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/antigay-rights-to-stay-20130115-2crma.html

 

 

 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck

It Cheers Me to Write against Atheism

About a week ago I posted that if you believe that the Universe is eternal, then the Universe is God, and you are a pantheist, not an atheist, not to mention the fact that atheists tend to worship themselves. When you worship yourself, that is called sin, and we all (except for Jesus) do it by nature.

What atheist, or pantheist, has ever produced anything as good as the music of Johann Sebastian Bach? J. S. Bach was as ardent a believer in Jesus Christ as has ever walked this planet Bach affixed "Soli Deo Gloria" (To God alone the glory!) to his works of music, and sometimes even added "Jesus, Help!" But Bach did not just write religious music; his toccatas and fugues are brilliant as well. So Bach wrote secular music, but you atheists cannot write religious music. And you think Bach is the one with a limited world view! You tend to find the most bigoted theists in existence and then tarnish the reputation of all theists. But God is ahead of you. Read Romans. God wills strong-willed, bigoted people to exist for the sanctification of His elect through suffering. Why? We don't fully know, but real love involves suffering.....

I do not like the State supporting 'gay marriage,' because it does not exist. It is a fantasy of demented minds and depraved individuals. Let the State support equal rights for unicorns! We need a unicorn President! When will discrimination against unicorns cease? Increase everyone's taxes until all unicorns are free!

Professor wrote:J. S. Bach

Professor wrote:
J. S. Bach was as ardent a believer in Jesus Christ

Oh ? And that "ardent belief" somehow produced beautiful music ? Okay, let's test that : Write me a concerto.  

Professor wrote:

  I do not like the State supporting 'gay marriage,' because it does not exist. 

?

You're a theist ! You like things that don't exist !

Professor wrote:
It is a fantasy of demented minds and depraved individuals

What's "demented" or "depraved" about it ? 

Professor wrote:
Let the State support equal rights for unicorns!

Yeah, sorry, unicorns don't exists.

Unless you take the bible seriously, that is. 

 

 

 

 

 


 

harleysportster's picture

Professor wrote:About a week

Professor wrote:

About a week ago I posted that if you believe that the Universe is eternal, then the Universe is God, and you are a pantheist, not an atheist, not to mention the fact that atheists tend to worship themselves.

You probably actually believe that.

Professor wrote:

When you worship yourself, that is called sin, and we all (except for Jesus) do it by nature. What atheist, or pantheist, has ever produced anything as good as the music of Johann Sebastian Bach? J. S. Bach was as ardent a believer in Jesus Christ as has ever walked this planet Bach affixed "Soli Deo Gloria" (To God alone the glory!) to his works of music, and sometimes even added "Jesus, Help!" But Bach did not just write religious music; his toccatas and fugues are brilliant as well. So Bach wrote secular music, but you atheists cannot write religious music.

I am not even going to dignify that drivel with an explanation.

Professor wrote:

And you think Bach is the one with a limited world view! You tend to find the most bigoted theists in existence and then tarnish the reputation of all theists. But God is ahead of you. Read Romans. God wills strong-willed, bigoted people to exist for the sanctification of His elect through suffering. Why? We don't fully know, but real love involves suffering..... I do not like the State supporting 'gay marriage,' because it does not exist. It is a fantasy of demented minds and depraved individuals. Let the State support equal rights for unicorns! We need a unicorn President! When will discrimination against unicorns cease? Increase everyone's taxes until all unicorns are free!

Actually the archaic institution of marriage is a byproduct of primitive civilizations and should probably be done away with IMO.

However, I would accept the reality of gays/straights seeking partners for long term committment before I would buy into the notion that some cosmic bearded tyrant is floating on the clouds and sending people to "hell" for sinning.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno

GodsUseForAMosquito's picture

Professor wrote:What

Professor wrote:

What atheist, or pantheist, has ever produced anything as good as the music of Johann Sebastian Bach? J. S. Bach was as ardent a believer in Jesus Christ as has ever walked this planet Bach affixed "Soli Deo Gloria" (To God alone the glory!) to his works of music, and sometimes even added "Jesus, Help!" But Bach did not just write religious music; his toccatas and fugues are brilliant as well. So Bach wrote secular music, but you atheists cannot write religious music.

 

Johannes Brahms

Composed A German Requiem by taking text from the Lutheran Bible.

Atheist.

 

Doh, try again.