George W. Bush claims Atheists aren't Citizens and can't be Patriots

wackadoo
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George W. Bush claims Atheists aren't Citizens and can't be Patriots

don't know if it's old news, but it's news for me. So I apologize if it's nothing new to you guys.

 

http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/ghwbush.htm

 


wackadoo
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By the way, this isn't the

By the way, this isn't the current president. I still thought it was outrageous though.


Bigg
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I read that before

I read that before too,sickening isnt it?


MattShizzle
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Supposedly he says he never

Supposedly he says he never said that.


BenfromCanada
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There isn't actual evidence

There isn't actual evidence he did say that. It was supposedly said in front of a bunch of people, but only one reporter caught it. No one else who was there actually attests to having heard it. Please, stop circulating this. 


Arletta
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So if I shouldn't be

So if I shouldn't be considered a citizen then I shouldn't have to pay taxes then right?


ShaunPhilly
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In response to this issue,

In response to this issue, I thought it would be important to include the following information. It is part of an email correspondence between myself and some other atheists about this issue.

The following was written by Janice Rael, who is the president of the Delaware Valley chapter of AU (dvau.org), and a personal friend.

---

In regards to the file uploaded today, the documents from the Bush
library in regards to the claim that Rob Sherman heard the elder Bush
say "No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens,
nor should they be considered as patriots. This is one nation under God"?

No one knows but Rob Sherman and George H W Bush if this was really
said. Bush won't admit it, and Sherman has changed his story repeatedly.

I posted about this on the Internet Infidels board, and a long
discussion ensued, in which I tried to explain that I had inside
information that I was not going to repeat in public where some lawyer
with a Napoleon complex might see it and sue me.

The thread is here: http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=189743

Excerpts:

"I used to be one of those people who repeated the Rob Sherman story
about the alleged Bush quote. Then I became deeply involved in the
inner circles of the freethought movement. When I sent a message to my
new group, referring to the Sherman story, I was immediately corrected
by people who have been heavily involved in these people who have been
involved in atheist activism for 20, 30, 40 years. They explained
things to me that I can't even repeat in public. Let's just say that I
was shown evidence which has caused me to believe that I was mistaken
for the past few years about the veracity of the alleged Bush quote."

"Let's just say that only Rob Sherman and George H W Bush know the
truth. Bush won't comment, Sherman has changed his story throughout
the years, and contrary to what Sherman claims on his website, it does
\nhave to trust me when I say that we should all stop repeating Rob\u003cbr\>\nSherman's story about the alleged George H W Bush anti-atheist quote."\u003cbr\>\n\u003cbr\>\n"This quote is all over the internet. Sources that are otherwise\u003cbr\>\nreliable, such as Positive Atheism and even The Secular Web restate\u003cbr\>\nthis alleged quotation with all the fervor of true believers. I did\u003cbr\>\nthe same, for over 4 years, and didn't stop until 2 months ago, when I\u003cbr\>\nresearched the story and surrounding circumstances in depth. The\u003cbr\>\nresults of my personal investigation led me to believe that I had no\u003cbr\>\nreason to think that Bush really said these words.\u003cbr\>\n\u003cbr\>\nI can't share all the details here, but I'm hoping that you can take\u003cbr\>\nmy word for it. I am concerned about the truth, and there's no way to\u003cbr\>\nprove that the elder Bush ever made the anti-atheist statement that is\u003cbr\>\nattributed to him. There is a story about it, but no evidence to\u003cbr\>\nsupport the story."\u003cbr\>\n\u003cbr\>\n"I didn't say that the story was not true, I only said that I have no\u003cbr\>\nevidence to prove that the story is true. Therefore, the story is\u003cbr\>\nhearsay, until someone provides proof that the events occurred as\u003cbr\>\ndescribed.\u003cbr\>\n\u003cbr\>\nThose who have followed Sherman's website closely might have noticed\u003cbr\>\nthat certain details about the story have been changed or removed over\u003cbr\>\ntime. For example, for several years, the name of a possible witness\u003cbr\>\nto the event was on the site. The alleged witness was said to be a CNN\u003cbr\>\nreporter named Greg Lefevre. When asked directly in 2003, Greg Lefevre\u003cbr\>\ndenied hearing Bush say the words that were attributed to him. The\u003cbr\>\nreporter's name was eventually removed from the webpages that\u003cbr\>\ndescribed the story.\u003cbr\>\n\u003cbr\>\nAlso, Sherman claimed on his site that the Bush Library withheld the\u003cbr\>\ndocuments for two years. However, two other people, who I know,\u003cbr\>\ncontacted the Bush Library and received the documents immediately. It",1] ); //--> not take 2 years to obtain documents from the Bush Library. You'll
have to trust me when I say that we should all stop repeating Rob
Sherman's story about the alleged George H W Bush anti-atheist quote."

"This quote is all over the internet. Sources that are otherwise
reliable, such as Positive Atheism and even The Secular Web restate
this alleged quotation with all the fervor of true believers. I did
the same, for over 4 years, and didn't stop until 2 months ago, when I
researched the story and surrounding circumstances in depth. The
results of my personal investigation led me to believe that I had no
reason to think that Bush really said these words.

I can't share all the details here, but I'm hoping that you can take
my word for it. I am concerned about the truth, and there's no way to prove that the elder Bush ever made the anti-atheist statement that is attributed to him. There is a story about it, but no evidence to support the story."

"I didn't say that the story was not true, I only said that I have no
evidence to prove that the story is true. Therefore, the story is
hearsay, until someone provides proof that the events occurred as
described.

Those who have followed Sherman's website closely might have noticed that certain details about the story have been changed or removed over time. For example, for several years, the name of a possible witness to the event was on the site. The alleged witness was said to be a CNN reporter named Greg Lefevre. When asked directly in 2003, Greg Lefevre denied hearing Bush say the words that were attributed to him. The reporter's name was eventually removed from the webpages that described the story.

Also, Sherman claimed on his site that the Bush Library withheld the
documents for two years. However, two other people, who I know,
contacted the Bush Library and received the documents immediately. It does not take 2 years for such a request to be fulfilled."

I read all of the faxed documents that came from the Bush library.
They do not contain proof of anything other than American Atheists'
correspondence with the White House trying to get an apology for
something that one troubled man claimed he heard Bush say.

"The point is that we should not repeat the alleged Bush quote as
"evidence" of discrimination against atheists. And furthermore, when
we see other people repeating it, we should correct them, and tell
them that there is other evidence of anti-atheist sentiment that are
better, more reliable indicators of public feeling toward nonbelievers."

I'll fight for a person's right to speak so long as that person will, in return, fight to allow me to challenge their opinions and ridicule them as the content of their ideas merit.


Dave_G
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that wasnt george w. that

that wasnt george w. that was his father georrge HW.


Raki
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George HW Bush should shut

George HW Bush should shut his fucking mouth. He should have his citizenship revoked for his family's involvement with Nazi Germany.

Nero(in response to a Youth pastor) wrote:

You are afraid and should be thus.  We look to eradicate your god from everything but history books.  We bring rationality and clear thought to those who choose lives of ignorance.  We are the blazing, incandescent brand that will leave an "A" so livid, so scarlet on your mind that you will not go an hour without reflecting on reality.


Cpt_pineapple
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Raki wrote: George HW Bush

Raki wrote:
George HW Bush should shut his fucking mouth. He should have his citizenship revoked for his family's involvement with Nazi Germany.

 

HW served in World War Two. I believe he was a navy pilot.