The Constitution of the United States of America

Dissident1
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The Constitution of the United States of America

It has become extremely popular among the Christian factions here in the U.S. to proclaim that this country was founded as a Christian nation. They boldly state that the Constitution of the United States of America is a Christian document that was taken nearly word for word from their sacred scriptures.

Let's get a few things straight. Thomas Jefferson, who penned the document, was not a Christian. In fact, he considered Christians to be inferior to him, and was very vocal about his distaste for Christianity.

Furthermore, the "new testament" authors detested the idea of a republic. They held an equal hatred of democracy. There is no way that they would pose to create a constitutional republic with a representative democracy!

Moreover, George Washington, the first President of the Union, declared in no uncertain terms to the people of Tripoli that the government of the United States was in no way founded on the Christian religion!

These people need to be shown up as the liars and thieves that they are.

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LeftofLarry
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Re: The Constitution of the United States of America

Dissident1 wrote:
It has become extremely popular among the Christian factions here in the U.S. to proclaim that this country was founded as a Christian nation. They boldly state that the Constitution of the United States of America is a Christian document that was taken nearly word for word from their sacred scriptures.

Let's get a few things straight. Thomas Jefferson, who penned the document, was not a Christian. In fact, he considered Christians to be inferior to him, and was very vocal about his distaste for Christianity.

Furthermore, the "new testament" authors detested the idea of a republic. They held an equal hatred of democracy. There is no way that they would pose to create a constitutional republic with a representative democracy!

Moreover, George Washington, the first President of the u_nion, declared in no uncertain terms to the people of Tripoli that the government of the United States was in no way founded on the Christian religion!

These people need to be shown up as the liars and thieves that they are.

Not only that, but why were pilgrims first coming to this land in the first place? TO ESCAPE RELIGIOUS PERSECUTION FROM THEIR GOVERNMENT. The founding fathers kept this in mind and SPECIFICALLY left out god from the constitution because they did not want to become what they had escaped in the first place. this little aspect is what most fucking piece of shit xtians fail to recognize. now they are trying to impose their fairy tale fascist fucking views on everyone else. Sorry, you got me a bit riled up here.

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Re: The Constitution of the United States of America

Dissident1 wrote:

Moreover, George Washington, the first President of the u_nion, declared in no uncertain terms to the people of Tripoli that the government of the United States was in no way founded on the Christian religion!

Here is the actual declaration in writing:

The quotation often given is in fact from Article XI of the Treaty of Tripoli (8 Stat 154, Treaty Series 358):

Article 11

As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion, -- as it has in itself no character or enmity against the laws, religion or tranquility of Musselmen, -- and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

Here is the link where I got this and it is not to say this is the only one:
http://www.infidels.org/news/atheism/arguments.html#usanot


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Re: The Constitution of the United States of America

LeftofLarry wrote:

Not only that, but why were pilgrims first coming to this land in the first place? TO ESCAPE RELIGIOUS PERSECUTION FROM THEIR GOVERNMENT. The founding fathers kept this in mind and SPECIFICALLY left out god from the constitution because they did not want to become what they had escaped in the first place. this little aspect is what most fucking piece of shit xtians fail to recognize. now they are trying to impose their fairy tale fascist fucking views on everyone else. Sorry, you got me a bit riled up here.

LeftofLarry,
It is interesting to note that upon becoming the established government in Mass., the pilgrims became as intollerant as the Anglicans were. This was the reason for founding the state of Rhode Island.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhode_Island

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


Yellow_Number_Five
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The Constitution of the United States of America

This a paticular point that simply enrages me. There is a part of me that wants to leave the assholes who claim this is a nation for Christians by Christians to wallow and fade away into their own backward intellectually devoid fundamentalist third world hell. Thankfully the pissed off side of me simply refuses to give up and let them win. Spite is a wonderful thing at times.

So, yes, let?s take a look at what people like uber-Christian Thomas Jefferson thought of Christianity:

Thomas Jefferson wrote:
I have examined all the known superstitions of the world, and I do not find in our particular superstition of Christianity one redeeming feature. They are all alike founded on fables and mythology. Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned. What has been the effect of this coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites; to support roguery and error all over the earth.
- "Notes on the State of Virginia" (1781-85), and often included in the Jefferson Bible

Jefferson wrote:
Christianity...(has become) the most perverted system that ever shone on man. ...Rogueries, absurdities and untruths were perpetrated upon the teachings of Jesus by a large band of dupes and importers led by Paul, the first great corrupter of the teaching of Jesus.
- "Toward the Mystery"

Jefferson wrote:
The clergy converted the simple teachings of Jesus into an engine for enslaving mankind and adulterated by artificial constructions into a contrivance to filch wealth and power to themselves...these clergy, in fact, constitute the real Anti-Christ.
- also "Notes on the State of Virginia"

In the end it doesn't matter if our founding fathers were Christian or not, the fact remains that regardless of religious affiliation they were wise enough not to establish this nation as a Christian nation.

To the extent that our founders were religious at all, it was a tacit acceptance of Deism. The framers of the Constitution especially, Jefferson, Madison, Paine, Franklin, were certainly NOT orthodox Christians ? they were all probably best described as Deists.

It is fundamentalist Christians who are rewriting history through rose colored Christian glasses. Wipe away all the preconcieved historical inaccuracies and propaganda, and you are left with two simple and very revealing documents: The Constitution and the Declaration of Independence.

The documents upon which this country was founded contain NO references to Christianity, the Bible, the Ten Commandments, or Jesus Christ. There is no mention of Heaven or Hell, no mention of honoring thy Father, no mention of tithes to the church, nothing pertaining to Christianity whatsoever. It isn't as it there weren't people who wanted such things included in those documents either; there was pressure from the church and clergy to found this nation as a Christian one, but every time our founders were wise enough to refuse that pressure.

"...they are endowed by their Creator..." is a reference not to the Christian God, but the Deist Creator.

One could also break out the Treaty of Tripoli ratified by Washington and Adams and approved unanimously by Congress that states in no uncertain terms that "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."

People came to the ?New World? to escape religious persecution and exclusion - it seems just a little far fetched to think such people would willing recreate the exact situation they fled.

For every quote one can find stating that a founding father was a Christian, another can be found to counter it ? so what? So what if our founders were Christian ? they could have been deists, atheists, Raelieans or Rastafarians for all it really matters, In the end it DOES NOT matter what religion they were, if any. What matters is they were wise enough to avoid establishing this as a Christian nation. Something most people choose to ignore for very obvious reasons.

I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world. - Richard Dawkins

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