Great Seal of the United States

Randalllord
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Great Seal of the United States

I recenlty found this disturbing information at the U.S Treasury's website:
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/portraits.shtml

"Question - What is the significance of the symbols on the back of the one-dollar bill? I'm particularly interested in the eye and the pyramid.

Answer - The eye and the pyramid shown on the reverse side of the one-dollar bill are in the Great Seal of the United States. The Great Seal was first used on the reverse of the one-dollar Federal Reserve note in 1935. The Department of State is the official keeper of the Seal. They believe that the most accurate explanation of a pyramid on the Great Seal is that it symbolizes strength and durability. The unfinished pyramid means that the United States will always grow, improve and build. In addition, the "All-Seeing Eye" located above the pyramid suggests the importance of divine guidance in favor of the American cause. The inscription ANNUIT COEPTIS translates as "He (God) has favored our undertakings," and refers to the many instances of Divine Providence during our Government's formation. In addition, the inscription NOVUS ORDO SECLORUM translates as "A new order of the ages," and signifies a new American era."

Can anyone give me any references that support the idea that God assisted in the formation of the U.S? If no, why are we allowing this myth to have the backing of our govenment. Doesn't the preputation of this myth violate the 1st admendment - i.e. our government is promoting a religious belief?


The Great Seal

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


Randalllord
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Great Seal of the United States

While researching the above article I also found this:
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/portraits.shtml

History of 'In God We Trust'

The motto IN GOD WE TRUST was placed on United States coins largely because of the increased religious sentiment existing during the Civil War. Secretary of the Treasury Salmon P. Chase received many appeals from devout persons throughout the country, urging that the United States recognize the Deity on United States coins. From Treasury Department records, it appears that the first such appeal came in a letter dated November 13, 1861. It was written to Secretary Chase by Rev. M. R. Watkinson, Minister of the Gospel from Ridleyville, Pennsylvania, and read:
Dear Sir: You are about to submit your annual report to the Congress respecting the affairs of the national finances.

One fact touching our currency has hitherto been seriously overlooked. I mean the recognition of the Almighty God in some form on our coins.

You are probably a Christian. What if our Republic were not shattered beyond reconstruction? Would not the antiquaries of succeeding centuries rightly reason from our past that we were a heathen nation? What I propose is that instead of the goddess of liberty we shall have next inside the 13 stars a ring inscribed with the words PERPETUAL UNION; within the ring the allseeing eye, crowned with a halo; beneath this eye the American flag, bearing in its field stars equal to the number of the States united; in the folds of the bars the words GOD, LIBERTY, LAW.

This would make a beautiful coin, to which no possible citizen could object. This would relieve us from the ignominy of heathenism. This would place us openly under the Divine protection we have personally claimed. From my hearth I have felt our national shame in disowning God as not the least of our present national disasters.

To you first I address a subject that must be agitated.
As a result, Secretary Chase instructed James Pollock, Director of the Mint at Philadelphia, to prepare a motto, in a letter dated November 20, 1861:
Dear Sir: No nation can be strong except in the strength of God, or safe except in His defense. The trust of our people in God should be declared on our national coins.

You will cause a device to be prepared without unnecessary delay with a motto expressing in the fewest and tersest words possible this national recognition.
It was found that the Act of Congress dated January 18, 1837, prescribed the mottoes and devices that should be placed upon the coins of the United States. This meant that the mint could make no changes without the enactment of additional legislation by the Congress. In December 1863, the Director of the Mint submitted designs for new one-cent coin, two-cent coin, and three-cent coin to Secretary Chase for approval. He proposed that upon the designs either OUR COUNTRY; OUR GOD or GOD, OUR TRUST should appear as a motto on the coins. In a letter to the Mint Director on December 9, 1863, Secretary Chase stated:
I approve your mottoes, only suggesting that on that with the Washington obverse the motto should begin with the word OUR, so as to read OUR GOD AND OUR COUNTRY. And on that with the shield, it should be changed so as to read: IN GOD WE TRUST.

The Congress passed the Act of April 22, 1864. This legislation changed the composition of the one-cent coin and authorized the minting of the two-cent coin. The Mint Director was directed to develop the designs for these coins for final approval of the Secretary. IN GOD WE TRUST first appeared on the 1864 two-cent coin.

Another Act of Congress passed on March 3, 1865. It allowed the Mint Director, with the Secretary's approval, to place the motto on all gold and silver coins that "shall admit the inscription thereon." Under the Act, the motto was placed on the gold double-eagle coin, the gold eagle coin, and the gold half-eagle coin. It was also placed on the silver dollar coin, the half-dollar coin and the quarter-dollar coin, and on the nickel three-cent coin beginning in 1866. Later, Congress passed the Coinage Act of February 12, 1873. It also said that the Secretary "may cause the motto IN GOD WE TRUST to be inscribed on such coins as shall admit of such motto."

The use of IN GOD WE TRUST has not been uninterrupted. The motto disappeared from the five-cent coin in 1883, and did not reappear until production of the Jefferson nickel began in 1938. Since 1938, all United States coins bear the inscription. Later, the motto was found missing from the new design of the double-eagle gold coin and the eagle gold coin shortly after they appeared in 1907. In response to a general demand, Congress ordered it restored, and the Act of May 18, 1908, made it mandatory on all coins upon which it had previously appeared. IN GOD WE TRUST was not mandatory on the one-cent coin and five-cent coin. It could be placed on them by the Secretary or the Mint Director with the Secretary's approval.

The motto has been in continuous use on the one-cent coin since 1909, and on the ten-cent coin since 1916. It also has appeared on all gold coins and silver dollar coins, half-dollar coins, and quarter-dollar coins struck since July 1, 1908.

A law passed by the 84th Congress (P.L. 84-140) and approved by the President on July 30, 1956, the President approved a Joint Resolution of the 84th Congress, declaring IN GOD WE TRUST the national motto of the United States. IN GOD WE TRUST was first used on paper money in 1957, when it appeared on the one-dollar silver certificate. The first paper currency bearing the motto entered circulation on October 1, 1957. The Bureau of Engraving and Printing (BEP) was converting to the dry intaglio printing process. During this conversion, it gradually included IN GOD WE TRUST in the back design of all classes and denominations of currency.

As a part of a comprehensive modernization program the BEP successfully developed and installed new high-speed rotary intaglio printing presses in 1957. These allowed BEP to print currency by the dry intaglio process, 32 notes to the sheet. One-dollar silver certificates were the first denomination printed on the new high-speed presses. They included IN GOD WE TRUST as part of the reverse design as BEP adopted new dies according to the law. The motto also appeared on one-dollar silver certificates of the 1957-A and 1957-B series.

BEP prints United States paper currency by an intaglio process from engraved plates. It was necessary, therefore, to engrave the motto into the printing plates as a part of the basic engraved design to give it the prominence it deserved.

One-dollar silver certificates series 1935, 1935-A, 1935-B, 1935-C, 1935-D, 1935-E, 1935-F, 1935-G, and 1935-H were all printed on the older flat-bed presses by the wet intaglio process. P.L. 84-140 recognized that an enormous expense would be associated with immediately replacing the costly printing plates. The law allowed BEP to gradually convert to the inclusion of IN GOD WE TRUST on the currency. Accordingly, the motto is not found on series 1935-E and 1935-F one-dollar notes. By September 1961, IN GOD WE TRUST had been added to the back design of the Series 1935-G notes. Some early printings of this series do not bear the motto. IN GOD WE TRUST appears on all series 1935-H one-dollar silver certificates.

Below is a listing by denomination of the first production and delivery dates for currency bearing IN GOD WE TRUST:
DENOMINATION PRODUCTION DELIVERY
$1 Federal Reserve Note February 12, 1964 March 11, 1964
$5 United States Note January 23, 1964 March 2, 1964
$5 Federal Reserve Note July 31, 1964 September 16, 1964
$10 Federal Reserve Note February 24, 1964 April 24, 1964
$20 Federal Reserve Note October 7, 1964 October 7, 1964
$50 Federal Reserve Note August 24, 1966 September 28, 1966
$100 Federal Reserve Note August 18, 1966 September 27, 1966

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


Randalllord
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Great Seal of the United States

From http://www.atheists.org/flash.line/igwt1.htm

"IN GOD WE TRUST" -- STAMPING OUT RELIGION ON NATIONAL CURRENCY

Is it a futile form of protest? A symptom of frustration? Some Atheists and separationists are crossing out the national motto on paper money. Whatever your opinion, the history of how "In God We Trust" ended up on currency shows that the motto is religious, not secular, in its origin and function today.

Web Posted: March 15, 1999

cross the country, there is a movement afoot.

It isn't using picket signs, or a flood of letters to congress, or even a lawsuit -- that's already been tried. Instead, some Atheists and separationists are taking pen in hand, and obliterating the "In God We Trust" motto from the national currency. Others are using rubber stamps, or inserting their own messages like "In Reason We Trust," or "Keep Church and State Separate." Mention religious slogans in an internet newsgroup or at a meeting and eyebrows are suddenly raised. Opinions are expressed. And there's a tame call to action, even if does only use the nearest ball-point or magic marker.

Indeed, religious graffiti on currency is one of the issues which sooner or later all of us will sound off about. It's also one of the periodic topics that ends up being vented, dissected and discussed on news groups and mailing lists. Simply put, most Atheists don't like the "In God We Trust" slogan staring at us every time we pull out our wallets or purses. It has to go. But how?

One of the first legal actions to challenge religious sloganeering of this type was made in 1978 by American Atheists founder Madalyn Murray O'Hair. In the case of MADALYN MURRAY O'HAIR et al. v. W. MICHAEL BLUMENTHAL, SECRETARY OF THE TREASURY, et al. (462 F. Supp. 19 -- W.D. Tex 1978), the court opined: "Its use is of a patriotic or ceremonial character and bears no true resemblance to a governmental sponsorship of religious exercise." The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit reached a similar conclusion in the 1970 case ARONOW v. UNITED STATES. Subsequent cases also fell short, even though they argued that the motto clearly encouraged religion and made a statement about god and theology. On September 14, 1988, then-President of American Atheists Jon Murray addressed the Subcommittee on Consumer Affairs and Coinage concerning proposals to redesign the nation's currency. At that time, Murray expressed concern about including "In God We Trust" on the national currency, suggesting instead a return to the secular "E Pluribus Unum" ("One from many"Eye-wink that was used earlier in the nation's history.

Where did "In God We Trust" originate? Many mistakenly believe that it has been the national motto since revolutionary days; but the phraseology is strictly religious in origin.

The national motto adopted by the Founders was inscribed next to the Great Seal of the United States, a decoration devised under the supervision of Franklin, Adams and Jefferson. It was Jefferson who suggested "E Pluribus Unum," and that slogan was adopted in 1782, five years before the Constitutional convention of 1787.

It wasn't until nearly a century later, though, that "In God We Trust" was seriously proposed as a motto. Writing in her book "Freedom Under Siege," (J.P.Tarcher, Los Angeles, 1974), Madalyn O'Hair delineated the historical background for readers:

"In 1861, the Reverend M.R. Watkinson persuaded the secretary of the Treasury to try to introduce 'In God We Trust' as a motto on the coins of the land, arguing on the theological premise that in a Judeo-Christian nation, 'There is but one God.' Congress, then beginning to be responsive to the religious community and the votes that it was presumed to control, passed the Coinage Act of April 22, 1864, which designated that 'In God We Trust' be put on coins 'when and where sufficient space in the balance of the design' would permit it."

Rev. Watkinson's missive was directed to Secretary of the Treasury Samuel P. Chase. It read:

"Dear Sir: You are about to submit your annual report to the Congress respecting the affairs of the national finances.

One fact touching our currency has hitherto been seriously overlooked. I mean the recognition of the Almighty God in some form on our coins.

You are probably a Christian. What if our Republic were not shattered beyond reconstruction? Would not the antiquaries of succeeding centuries rightly reason from our past that we were a heathen nation? What I propose is that instead of the goddess of liberty we shall next inside the 13 stars a ring inscribed with the words PERPETUAL UNION; within the allseeing eye, crowned with a halo; beneath this eye the American flag bearing in its field stars equal to the number of the States united; in the folds of the bars the words GOD, LIBERTY, LAW..."

Seven days after the transmittal of Watkinson's letter, Secretary Chase, on November 20, 1861, wrote to James Pollock, Director of the Mint at Philadelphia. He instructed Pollock to prepare a motto, declaring "No nation can be strong except in the strength of God, or safe except in His defense. The trust of our people in God should be declared on our national coins..." A design was submitted in December, 1863 proposing OUR GOD AND OUR COUNTRY, or the alternative of GOD, OUR TRUST. On December 9, 1863, Chase formally approved a third slogan in a letter to the Mint Director.

"I approve your mottoes (sic), only suggesting that on that with the Washington obverse the motto should begin with the word OUR, so as to read OUR GOD AND OUR COUNTRY. And on that with the shield, it should be changed so as to read: IN GOD WE TRUST."

"In God We Trust" thus appeared on the short-lived 1864 two-cent coin. It has been used continuously on the one-cent coin since 1909, and on dimes since 1916. Since July 1, 1908,"In God We Trust" has also been stamped on gold coins, silver dollars, quarters and half-dollar coins

Watkinson's effort to religionize the coinage was part of a larger campaign waged by a coalition of eleven Protestant denominations under the umbrella of the National Reform Association. Disenchanted with the secularism of documents such as the Constitution, the NRA sought to amend that instrument to "indicate that this is a Christian nation." Petitions were raised and formally presented to Congress. They proposed a new preamble to the Constitution which read:

"We, the people of the United States, humbly acknowledging Almighty God as the source of all authority and power in civil government, the Lord Jesus Christ as the Ruler among the nations, His revealed will as the supreme law of the land, in order to constitute a Christian government..."

Fortunately, the petition failed despite the membership of powerful and wealthy men in the National Reform Association. They included Supreme Court Justice William Strong, a handful of governors and prominent businessmen.

IS IT LEGAL?
What about crossing out "In God We trust" on paper money? Is it legal? There appears to be confusion over the legality of stamping out or erasing the motto, or writing a message on US currency. We noted that Title 18 Section 333 of the U.S. Code prohibits defacement of currency if it is done with the intent to defraud, i.e. changing the face value.

We also received a fax which apparently comes from the same code or a similar regulation. It is listed at the top as "Ch. 25, COUNTERFEITING AND FORGERY 18-476. Section 475 reads as follows:

"Imitating obligations or securities; advertisements. Whoever designs, engraves, prints, makes or executes, or utters, issues, distributes, circulates; or uses any business or professional card, notice, placard, circular, handbill, or advertisement in the likeness or similitude of any obligation or security of the United States issued under or authorized by any Act of Congress, or writes, prints, or otherwise impresses upon or attaches to any such instrument, obligation, or security, or any coin of the United States, any business or professional card, notice, or advisement, or any notice or advertisement whatever, shall be fined not more than $500."

A citation below this reads "June 25, 1948, c 645. 62 Stat.706; July 16, 1951, c.226. 2. 65 Stat. 22."

A recent television program included a segment on "traveling money," where people wrote down phone numbers or addresses on currency, only to have the bill returned, or somebody call them. There was no mention of FBI or BATF swat teams storming their houses for this offense. On the other hand, should hundreds, then thousands of Atheists and separationists start crossing out "In God We Trust," there just might be a prosecution under the above mentioned statute.

The point of this article, which originally appeared in AANEWS, was not to encourage readers to empty their wallets and purses and develop a new form of carpal tunnel disorder by crossing out IGWT on millions of bills. We wanted to provide the historical background on how this clearly religious slogan found its way onto our nation's money supply; we likewise suggested that crossing out "In God We Trust" betrays the frustration which many people admittedly feel at a legal system which chooses when, and under what circumstances, it will truly recognize the full separation of church and state. The idea that "In God We Trust" or incantations to a deity at public gatherings serve a "secular function" and do not advance religious belief is something we still find incredible.

So, what about crossing out "In God We Trust" or writing a message on money? Should you do it? At least consider the potential consequences; and realize money passes through our hands quite rapidly. We usually glance to check whether it's a $1 bill, a sawbuck, or something bigger. One alternative to spending your time obliterating IGWT is to put the same effort into a letter-to-the-editor of your local paper, or even your representative in Foggy Bottom. Either way, the choice is yours.
The next step in the process of religionizing the national currency had to wait nearly a century, when on July 11.1955, President Dwight D. Eisenhower signed Public Law 140 making it mandatory that all coinage and paper currency display the motto "In God We Trust." The following year, Public Law 851 was enacted and signed, which officially replaced the national motto "E Pluribus Unum" with "In God We Trust" All of this occurred at the height of cold war tension, when political divisions between the Soviet and western block was simplistically portrayed as a confrontation between Judeo-Christian civilization and the "godless" menace of communism. Indeed, the new national motto was only part of a broader effort to effectively religionize civic ritual and symbols. On June 14, 1954, Congress unanimously ordered the inclusion of the words "Under God" into the nation's Pledge of Allegiance. By this time, other laws mandating public religiosity had also been enacted, including a statute for all federal justices and judges to swear an oath concluding with "So help me God."

All paper currency issued after October 1, 1957 included the IN GOD WE TRUST national motto.

OTHER RELIGIOUS ORIGINS

The phrase "In God We Trust" does not appear in the Bible. Nevertheless Biblical passages such as 1 Timothy: 4-10 ("Trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men..."Eye-wink and 2 Corinthians 1:9 ("But we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God which raiseth the dead..."Eye-wink are cited as scriptural inspiration. And just as the pleas of Rev. Watkinson and the National Reform Association had led to the inclusion of "In God We Trust" on coinage, similar religious sentiments were used to justify the mottos addition to the nation's paper currency. Evidence of this comes from an examination of the Congressional Record. On June 7, 1955 for instance, Congressman Bennett of Florida rose in support of H.R..619, a bill "Providing for the inscription of 'In God We Trust' on all United States Currency and Coins." Bennett declared:

"I sincerely hope that the Senate will give its prompt approval to this proposal. In these days when imperialistic and materialistic communism seeks to attack and destroy freedom, we should continuously look for ways to strengthen the foundations of our freedom. At the base of our freedom is our faith in God and the desire of Americans to live by His will and His guidance. As long as this country trust in God, it will prevail. To serve as a constant reminder of this truth, it is highly desirable that our currency and coins should bear these inspiring words 'In God We Trust.'"

CHALLENGING THE MOTTO: O'HAIR v. BLUEMENTHAL

The 1978 MADALYN MURRAY O'HAIR v. W. MICHAEL BLUMENTHAL case was decided at the U.S Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit. There, the court invoked the notion of "secular purpose," suggesting that like prayer at government meetings or other displays of religiosity in government, the motto was "really" no religious. The court declared with regard to the motto "In God We Trust," that "Its use is of a patriotic or ceremonial character and bears no true resemblance to a governmental sponsorship of a religious exercise. " The Ninth Circuit had reached a similar conclusion in the ARONOW v. UNITED STATES case in 1970.

DEFACING FEDERAL CURRENCY?

So, what about those folks who are launching a civil protest by crossing out the "In God We Trust" motto, or stamping an alternative slogan on the currency. What about frustrated separationists who instead write "Atheist Money" or something similar in the thin margins of every dollar bill? Are they breaking the law? Reproduction or alteration of currency with an intent to defraud does violate federal statutes; but using the greenback as a bulletin board for social protest does not. Article 331, Title 18 of the U.S. Code prohibits defacement of currency only if it is performed with such deceptive intent, or the depicted face value of the currency is altered in a significant way. How effective the tactic is remains to be seen. Would government suddenly take notice if hundreds of thousands or millions of bills were altered with the motto crossed out?

Ironically, religious groups and courts often use the same evidence to argue vastly different conclusions. Money and the "In God We Trust" motto is a case in point. While researching this story we discovered that the religious motto was often cited by religious groups as "proof" of the melding of government and faith, or in support of the notion that America is founded upon Christian religious principles. Other evidence included the opening of congressional sessions with prayer, the display of a Ten Commandments bas relief at the U.S. Supreme Court building, or the fact that the President of the United States takes the oath of office while swearing on a bible. The same sort of evidence, though, often appears in court rulings which decide establishment clause cases. Justices will cite the "In God We Trust" motto, for example, as evidence of a "civic religion," or maintain that it has a secular intent.

One thing remains certain. Despite the convincing evidence that "In God We Trust" has a strong origin in religious sensibilities, it is doubtful that courts today would care to revisit O'HAIR v. BLUMENTHAL, or any other case which proposes to take up this controversial issue. Scratching out "In God We Trust," or stamping separationist slogans on the currency displays the frustration that many Atheists have in dealing with a legal system which rarely holds to a stern and strict interpretation of the establishment clause. The wall of separation goes only so far.

You can bet your money on it.

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


Randalllord
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Great Seal of the United States

It appears that the xian's are winning on this issue.
http://www.afa.net/igwt/

In God We Trust" - Every Classroom In America
It is our hope that this poster will be a reminder of the historical centrality of God in the life of our republic.

Click Here to order your "In God We Trust" Posters today!

American Family Association has launched a national campaign to place before our children a copy of the official motto of the United States. It is our hope that this poster will be a reminder of the historical centrality of God in the life of our republic.

In a time when many are working to remove any acknowledgement of God from our public life, these words are legally sound, since they were officially adopted by Congress in 1956.

The Mississippi legislature recently passed a law requiring each public school classroom, auditorium and cafeteria to display a copy of our national motto. Many thanks to Mississippi Senator Allen Nunnelee for his good leadership in introducing this legislation. The governor signed the bill into law, and it becomes effective July 1, 2001.

The legislature did not provide any funding for the bill, leaving it up to private citizens and groups to provide the posters. Mr. Kenneth Briggs, a printer from Pearl, Mississippi, volunteered to print the posters for the 32,000 classrooms, auditoriums and cafeterias without cost. AFA is serving as the coordinator of the project, asking local civic and church groups to sponsor a school by providing framed copies of the poster free of cost to a local school in their community. By the way, Mr. Briggs has graciously offered to print for free all the bordering states to Mississippi who pass the legislation.

As was expected, the ACLU threatened to sue if a school displayed the poster. They hoped that by threatening to sue, they could get the bill defeated. They did not. The public officials stood up to them! It was not the first time the ACLU has entered into this fray. Last year they sued county treasurer Rita Cline of Kansas after Cline displayed a poster with the national motto in her office.

U.S. District Judge Sam A. Crow threw out the ACLU suit, and he did so with some stinging words for the group which wants to deny freedom of speech to those with whom they disagree. He called the ACLU suit "patently frivolous without any basis in law." You can't get much plainer than that.

What is it that the ACLU finds offensive? The national motto simply says: "In God We Trust." It is printed on every piece of currency produced in this country. One wonders if the ACLU would threaten to sue should someone post a framed dollar bill in a classroom?

Other states are considering passing a similar law requiring a posting of the national motto in classrooms in their states (Click here to see if your state already has a law). I urge you to encourage your state officials to do so. Would it not be a great thing to have our national motto in every classroom of every public school in America?

I'm sure that AFA supporters in every state would be thrilled to work together and provide framed copies of the national motto to schools in their communities. Let me suggest that you contact your state officials and get the ball rolling. Such a movement would cause the ACLU to go bananas! I'm sure there are printing companies in every state that would be happy to print the posters for free. And AFA would be happy to provide the local printers with artwork to make the posters uniform across the nation.

Worried about lawsuits? The courts have always upheld the display of the national motto in public places. And should the ACLU want to sue, your AFA Center for Law and Policy will be happy to defend without cost. I'm really not worried about the ACLU suing. Why? Because they know they will lose.

Hey, get busy! Let's place a copy of our motto "In God We Trust" in every classroom in the country!

Donald E. Wildmon
AFA President

ACTION NEEDED
Contact your state officials and urge them to take the lead on this important campaign.

To order "In God We Trust": {Actual size 11 in. x 14 in.}
Credit card order: 662-844-5036, Ext. 4
Mail order: AFA Poster, P.O. Drawer 2440, Tupelo, MS 38803
Order Online (100% secure server)

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


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Even if the courts have mistakenly allowed this to occur, their decisions should not allow the U.S. Mint to spread grossly religious ideas like "...He (God) has favored our undertakings," and refers to the many instances of Divine Providence during our Government's formation."

With the above history referenced, it should be clear that the god they are referring to is no other than the christian god. Not Krishna, Apollo, Zesus, Osiris, etc. This clearly violates the 1st admendment to me. We may not get them to remove "In God We Trust" from our currency given the current political climate but we should be able to get the above reference off the U.S. Mint's website.

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


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Re: Great Seal of the United States

Randalllord wrote:

The unfinished pyramid means that the United States will always grow, improve and build. In addition, the "All-Seeing Eye" located above the pyramid suggests the importance of divine guidance in favor of the American cause.

The "All-Seeing Eye" is the eye of the Egyptian God, Ra. Not too sure that's the god they were hoping to endorse when they put it there.

Ra Bless America!

- Brian Sapient


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Randalllord
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Christianity has a long history of incorporating other religions symbols and ideas and claiming them as christian e.g.- Easter, the fish symbol, the cross, life after death, etc. I'm sure they'd say that the all seeing eye is the Christian God and not the pagan god RA without blinking an eye.

Isn't it interesting that the Egyptians (and many others) had a sun god. In the OT, we are told that you could not look at god as he'd blind you because he was as bright as the sun.


The eye of Horus.

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


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Stop it guys, I saw this movie, and it sucked.


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Yellow_Number_Five wrote:
Stop it guys, I saw this movie, and it sucked.

That actually loooked like it sucked. I haven't seen it, but I'm pretty sure I would have the same reaction to it as Yellow.

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yellow_number_five,
I was not talking about the influence of the Masons on the early U.S. government, rather I was concerned about how a branch of our current government is endorsing a myth/religious notion that the christian god influenced and helped establish our country.

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca


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I suppose that the person responsible for website of the US Treasury was confused and got his information from the preamble of the Confederate Constitution instead of the US Constitution:
http://www.usconstitution.net/csa.html#Preamble

Constitution of the Confederate States of America
Preamble

We, the people of the Confederate States, each State acting in its sovereign and independent character, in order to form a permanent federal government, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity -- invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God -- do ordain and establish this Constitution for the Confederate States of America.

Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca