Noah's Ark on Discovery Channel

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Noah's Ark on Discovery Channel

I'm watching Discovery channel right now, and they're having a show on Noah's Ark.  They're recreating the story as if it was true I guess.  They're going to try to recreate what Noah looked like (I'm guessing very, very wrinkled seeing as he was like, 800 years old).  Anyway, if you're in the eastern time zone, check it out.  It just started. 

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So far, after changing how

So far, after changing how many animals were on the ark, they've shown how it would be impossible.


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CrimsonEdge wrote: So far,

CrimsonEdge wrote:
So far, after changing how many animals were on the ark, they've shown how it would be impossible.
Expect Christians to get angry about the program. They always do.

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Wow. I'm proud of the

Wow. I'm proud of the Discovery channel. They do tend to be more rational than the History Channel, which often includes a lot of Psuedoscience - and not debunking it, promoting it.

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MattShizzle wrote: Wow. I'm

MattShizzle wrote:
Wow. I'm proud of the Discovery channel. They do tend to be more rational than the History Channel, which often includes a lot of Psuedoscience - and not debunking it, promoting it.

 

I've noticed that.  The national geographic channel is really bad about promoting psuedoscience.  It seems everytime I flip past they have a show on UFOs 

"It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan


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  That is an awesome

 

That is an awesome video. It's like every debate I've ever had with a theist. =D 


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I've got a book called

I've got a book called "Noah's Flood".  It explains that we would need 10 times the amount of water on the planet than we already have to completely flood the earth.

 On top of that it would generate such a thick atmosphere that it would squish any land creatures.  But everything would be super cooked by the time that happened from the increased greenhouse gases. 

It would pretty much generate an environment as conducive to Earth life as Venus would.  Which is not at all.

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Joe Rogan is my new hero.

Joe Rogan is my new hero.


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Raki wrote: Joe Rogan is my

Raki wrote:
Joe Rogan is my new hero.

Yeah, he's a pretty big skeptic when it comes to things. He's got a good head on his shoulders but he's far to into the aztec end of the world shit to use it. 


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Lets not forget that if it

Lets not forget that if it did in fact rain that much (that fast) the entire ocean would be deluded and the salinity would decrease almost to a non existent level, causing every animal in the ocean (fish, mammels, coral, invertebrates, etc...) to instantly die.  So Mr. Noah would have to manage to fit all of those aquatic creatures on his boat in a tank with an adequate amount of saltwater (wow, imagine the size of the 2 blue whales tank!).  Now, if you by chance still think that's possible just try to compute how much you think those tanks would weigh up to, and try to scheme up a possible solution as to how the damn boat didn't sink.  
The list of illogical, irrational errors goes on and on...how can some people be so ignorant.
Sad


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SHLove wrote: ...and try to

SHLove wrote:
...and try to scheme up a possible solution as to how the damn boat didn't sink. 

Never mind that it was a 450-foot long wooden boat, built using 25th Century BCE shipbuilding techniques. I don't think it would have floated EMPTY. Imagine an unseaworthy vessel packed with 2 each of every animal that ever existed and food for the same. It probably would have ended up like this:


 

Good night, funny man, and thanks for the laughter.


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Noahs Flood is continent baptism not christening rain

10x water is not true. It requires no water. Continents having it highest mountains 6 miles high, have 25 miles of crust under them. Oceans which can reach 5 miles deep are only 2 miles deep and have 6 miles of crust under them. The mantle cannot melt enough for continents and oceans to slide around in just one year beit Noahs Flood nor Pelegs life while everyone dies from these earthquakes and required energy. However, an astral impact can melt a mere mile of magma between crust and mantle, and this magma can go into a slow-flow under crust tsunami. The energy and mass pushes the floors up a mile, and the meltdown spreds under the continents which then flow under the ocean floor and collapse the land a mile. This results in 2 miles of existing ocean over the land. It has flow, pushing the ark from the Persian Gulf to Ararat 520 miles and grounding it on the under water peak, then sliding down in 74 days to see both peaks. The 5  month plunge of the continents is a rapid 45 feet every lunar tug and tide for 150 days and takes twice as long to raise land back up. This is NO 6-day 144 hour creation before Adam, this is a process reality that occurred many times to create plates, finally raising land to stay up during Day 3, but has also plunged land in these year-long Floods 12 to 24 times before Adam. And each time if astral impact was strong enough to put matter up 52 miles, it made the water canopy thinner by raining for that brief time (such as 40 days). Thus Noah saw these layers of earth and knew Floods occurred before and will again, and the angels on earth were saying nope God is done, he wouldnt do it again. Plus they laughed because the angels knew the water above (40-60 feet) wasnt enough to required an ark. Though that too is not easy to survive. This is why Genesis promises us not to fear rain because the rainbow proves the rain is not global as it was for every global Flood whose asteroid made it rain when it sunk the continents. It wont rain when we are struck in the south pacific on Jan 19. But the American "city of ZOAR" (the Appalacians for LOT's wife to flee to) being only 6000 feet cannot promise those 13 American east coast mountains will stay above water.


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Just no. There is not enough

Just no. There is not enough water on the planet to cover the planet, period. Plates lift and you get mountains, not higher seas. Learn basic geology. I'm not even going to bother with the rest of that ridiculous post.

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It was more understandable

It was more understandable even 50 years ago when science was not widely available like the internet provides today, that people falsely believed this clearly bullshit myth.

But now there is no excuse for anyone to buy into this bullshit story.

There ARE lots of natural disasters that can even make our species go extinct, WITHOUT an ancient bullshit myth. Yellowstone sits on a mega volcano. A meteor could hit the planet, or a bacteria could grow to be immune to medicine. All those things which have natural explanations could affect humanity.

But the flood of the bible was clearly the result of the conflation of a local flood because humans at the time equated the horizon to being the entire world. There is no scientific justification for a global flood and even logical absurdities of the upkeep of the idea of taking care of some clearly dangerous animals.

Cobras, dart frogs, alligators, hippos. All magically, without being tamed, did not harm Noah(assuming he took two or 7 of every species)The different accounts don't even agree as to the numbers of each species.

And flood motifs existed prior to the OT in stories like the Epic of Gelgamesh.

I cant even stand the more "modern apologists" who try to dodge this with "words don't mean what they mean" or "you're taking it out of context".

No I am not, considering how scientifically ignorant ALL cultures were back then, and that the polytheistic and monotheistic leadership of all cultures back then, attributed both good and bad to god/s, it is quite obvious that Noah, and all the characters in the bible were a reflection of what people wanted to believe at the time.

The bible is a tribal book of myth and nothing more. Noah is nothing more than a wishful thinking reflection of wanting protection from harm and takes that wishful thinking to mythological epic proportions. Much like Star Wars and Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings.

 

 

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"The bible is a tribal book

"The bible is a tribal book of myth and nothing more. Noah is nothing more than a wishful thinking reflection of wanting protection from harm and takes that wishful thinking to mythological epic proportions. Much like Star Wars and Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings."

Difference being that christians left the entertainment factor out.

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Vastet wrote:"The bible is a

Vastet wrote:
"The bible is a tribal book of myth and nothing more. Noah is nothing more than a wishful thinking reflection of wanting protection from harm and takes that wishful thinking to mythological epic proportions. Much like Star Wars and Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings." Difference being that christians left the entertainment factor out.

No they didn't. In modern Hollywood we call them Horror movies. The difference is when Hollywood produces Freddy Kruger, they know it's fiction. And Hollywood has better character and plot developments too boot.

I would say drowning in a flood is horrible. I would say infanticide is horrific and I would say the depiction of the "end times" as a gigantic bloodbath is horrific. It would be laughable if people didn't believe this garbage.

 

 

 

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I so hate you right now.

I so hate you right now. Mostly because there's too much truth in the idea of the bible as a horror novel. I might have to try reading it again in that light.

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Vastet wrote:I so hate you

Vastet wrote:
I so hate you right now. Mostly because there's too much truth in the idea of the bible as a horror novel. I might have to try reading it again in that light.

What is more horrible than the thought of living under, as Hitchens put it, "a cosmic dictator", whom watches you every nanosecond, even when you have sex or use the bathroom,  under which you cannot escape his watch, and any "bargaining" you do with such a being is on his terms and not subject to oversight or consent. Not to mention the horrible home he stuck us on with weapons to kill over him trying to convince him who loves him best.

The book is choc full of violence he watches and or condones and makes a very weak attempt with the middle of it to say "I'm really not a bad guy", but at the end of the book goes back to violence and genocide as his form of conflict resolution all under the concept of and excuse of "I can do what I want".

George Orwell couldn't have written such a horrible character. You cant vote god out of his position and he wasn't elected.

The bible is a horror novel and the villain in it is the fictional god of Abraham.

 

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Longest ever wooden ship

 

Little Roller Up First wrote:

 

SHLove wrote:
...and try to scheme up a possible solution as to how the damn boat didn't sink. 

Never mind that it was a 450-foot long wooden boat, built using 25th Century BCE shipbuilding techniques. I don't think it would have floated EMPTY. Imagine an unseaworthy vessel packed with 2 each of every animal that ever existed and food for the same.

was Wyoming - only 329 feet long (LWL) as opposed to 450 feet of the ark. Wyoming was a total shitbox and spent all her time sinking. Being so long, her hull was twisted and bowed constantly by the action of swells and she leaked furiously.

Eventually one stormy night she was lost with all hands, no doubt after her seams opened and she took water faster than the pumps could throw it out.

Of particular interest is her cargo capacity - about 6000 tonnes. That's a lot for a wooden ship but it's not enough to house life on earth. 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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Atheistextremist

Atheistextremist wrote:

 

Little Roller Up First wrote:

 

SHLove wrote:
...and try to scheme up a possible solution as to how the damn boat didn't sink. 

Never mind that it was a 450-foot long wooden boat, built using 25th Century BCE shipbuilding techniques. I don't think it would have floated EMPTY. Imagine an unseaworthy vessel packed with 2 each of every animal that ever existed and food for the same.

was Wyoming - only 329 feet long (LWL) as opposed to 450 feet of the ark. Wyoming was a total shitbox and spent all her time sinking. Being so long, her hull was twisted and bowed constantly by the action of swells and she leaked furiously.

Eventually one stormy night she was lost with all hands, no doubt after her seams opened and she took water faster than the pumps could throw it out.

Of particular interest is her cargo capacity - about 6000 tonnes. That's a lot for a wooden ship but it's not enough to house life on earth. 

 

 

Sheeze -- you know that is why there aren't any dinosaurs - well, only birds which can fly, natch - left on earth.  They all drowned because they couldn't fit!!!  Them and the unicorns.  It was all god/s/dess' plan.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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Snicker

cj wrote:

Atheistextremist wrote:

 

Little Roller Up First wrote:

 

SHLove wrote:
...and try to scheme up a possible solution as to how the damn boat didn't sink. 

Never mind that it was a 450-foot long wooden boat, built using 25th Century BCE shipbuilding techniques. I don't think it would have floated EMPTY. Imagine an unseaworthy vessel packed with 2 each of every animal that ever existed and food for the same.

was Wyoming - only 329 feet long (LWL) as opposed to 450 feet of the ark. Wyoming was a total shitbox and spent all her time sinking. Being so long, her hull was twisted and bowed constantly by the action of swells and she leaked furiously.

Eventually one stormy night she was lost with all hands, no doubt after her seams opened and she took water faster than the pumps could throw it out.

Of particular interest is her cargo capacity - about 6000 tonnes. That's a lot for a wooden ship but it's not enough to house life on earth. 

 

 

Sheeze -- you know that is why there aren't any dinosaurs - well, only birds which can fly, natch - left on earth.  They all drowned because they couldn't fit!!!  Them and the unicorns.  It was all god/s/dess' plan.

 

 

Yes......and none of this raises the issues of the necessary biospheres required for each individual species.

Anyone else an aquarist? How many innocent lives have you taken trying to emulate the rivers of the Amazon? The corals of the Maldives? The chilly currents of Galapagos?

I've slaughtered tens of dozens of goldfish - the wretched things nattily draped in fungus, covered in black spots, turned turtle by over-buoyant swim bladders. Naming them is a death sentence.  

Imagine trying to keep 8.7 million species alive...

Oh, sorry. God dunnit. How did I forget?

 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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Nah, double that and you'll

Nah, double that and you'll be closer to the species count. Remember there's approximately 8.7m species now, but noah was a thousand years ago, or something (I'm not going to pretend to care enough to find out exactly). And we've been wiping them out all that time. There might have been 30m species then.

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Vastet wrote:Plates lift and

Vastet wrote:
Plates lift and you get mountains, not higher seas. Learn basic geology. I'm not even going to bother with the rest of that ridiculous post.

K, ignoring bullshit creationism/genesis stories for a second, disregarding the likelihood or feasibility of such a scenario, how much of the world would be flooded if the ocean floor (including trenches, seas, and continental shelves) were to rise to sea level?

 

Everest wouldn't completely submerge, nor would 13 other 8km+ summits submerge, or so I imagine.


 

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If the ocean floor entire

If the ocean floor entire were to raise up, land would collapse down elsewhere, and the water would drain into those low lying areas to form new seas. Much like there is a finite amount of water, there is a finite amount of Earth. As gravity and pressure will not allow a vacuum to form within the Earth, any new land "rising" is accompanied by old land "falling".

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p { margin-bottom: 0.08in; }

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Atheistextremist wrote:
Anyone else an aquarist? How many innocent lives have you taken trying to emulate the rivers of the Amazon? The corals of the Maldives? The chilly currents of Galapagos?

I've slaughtered tens of dozens of goldfish - the wretched things nattily draped in fungus, covered in black spots, turned turtle by over-buoyant swim bladders. Naming them is a death sentence.


 

Well, I started a tank about a year and a half ago. Never got all that far with it though.


 

First off, the pet store sold me a stand made from particle board. I really don't tend to think that it would have supported the weight that I was intending if it had been bags of sand, let alone splashy water. Big tank too. In metric it would have been 340kg.


 

It took me a couple of months to find a proper bit of furniture to put under it. Then, when I was ready to do the leak test, I found that the glass was cracked in one corner. When I find the time and the cash, I am going to a more reputable place and get acrylic. Mind you, there is a 30 day limit around here to return even clearly defective merchandise.


 

Sure, loosing fish goes with the territory. Even if you keep a perfect tank, many fish just don't have a great life expectancy. When you get big tanks like I prefer, that just means that eventually you will have more fish to die.


 

Nobody keeps a perfect tank. Even if you pay for a service to drop by weekly and do all of the work themselves, there are excursions which simply cannot be controlled. Every time that you open the door to your house, you are introducing algae spoors that could get in the tank and sometimes nasty ones.


 

Around here, we get one called beard algae. Nasty stuff that can infect every surface they can attach to nearly overnight. They look like tiny upside down pine trees. If you use shrimp in your maintenance staff, you can't use very many chemicals to kill the stuff. Your best bet is to wrap the tank in black plastic for several days.

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Au contraire

Vastet wrote:
Nah, double that and you'll be closer to the species count. Remember there's approximately 8.7m species now, but noah was a thousand years ago, or something (I'm not going to pretend to care enough to find out exactly). And we've been wiping them out all that time. There might have been 30m species then.

 

There were only a couple of hundred kinds back then and since that time all the other creatures evolved through a turbo-charged process of micro evolution that in 4000 years lead to the development of all these other creatures which are really just big, colourful versions of the originals. The same time span was also sufficient for the desensitisation of the christian irony meter.

30 million species. I'm surprised at you. 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck