My rant on school prayer and the pledge.

MattShizzle
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My rant on school prayer and the pledge.

I'm really tired of hearing Christians whine about not having prayer in school and that we want "under God" taken out of the pledge. "Under God" has only been there since 1954 - so we manage to win 2 world wars and get through the Great Depression without becoming communist or a dictorship without God's help, so there's no reason to have it now. How would you feel if it was "Under Allah" and there were readings from the Koran, or "Under Vishnu" and redings from Hindu texts, or "Under the Flying Spaghetti Monster" and reading pasta recipes? Not mentioning any god or having any prayer is neutrality, not promoting atheism. Promoting atheism would be "One nation intelligent enough to not believe in any gods" and reading from Atheist Univers or Losing Faith in Faith. Seems plenty of Christians are only happy when they can force their nonsense down everyone else's throat. Just like something out of 1984 - you say we oppress you when we don't let you oppress everyone else. We need to start following the constitution. You have plenty of time to kiss up to your invisible sky daddy at home and in church. Just leave the rest of us out of it!

Matt Shizzle has been banned from the Rational Response Squad website. This event shall provide an atmosphere more conducive to social growth. - Majority of the mod team


magelisk
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I concur with what you just

I concur with what you just said. I was actually having a discussion with a rather religious friend of mine the other day about Prayer in school particularly because she's in school for Elementry Ed.

 

In all schools that I have attended (excluding college of course) there has been a moment of silence before or after the pledge. This is obviously the last step before actual prayer in school. My friend's opinion was that organize prayer should not be halted but no one should be forced into anything. With that I asked if time should then be alloted for Muslims to do their daily prayers and her answer was that yes, it should be allowed, but maybe not halt everyone's learning for it. I could accept this because at least she was allowing for the 'equal opportunty', even if I disagree generally. 

 

Perhaps my biggest problem with the concept of organized religion isn't that I'm afraid of people being forced into doing omething they don't want to, but its actually the higher likely hood of feeling of exclusion of children who arn't raised to pray (athiest, another religion, etc). And so these children (particularly in younger grades) would be outcasts and possibly mocked much in the same way kids will torture others by calling them "gay" and such. Silly things to some,  but it would be another thing that would socially seperate children of 'faith' and children of 'other/no faith'. This almost more than 'indoctrination' is what concerns me. 

 Hopefully the above made sense.. I'm a little tired. But in short, I'm more concerned with how something like this might exclude some children and create more social problems then religious ones!


D-cubed
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I understand the school

I understand the school prayer issue.  If kids go too long without a dose of brainwashing then some knowledge might sink in.  Since study after study shows the more intelligent a person is the less religious they'll be.  Usually a good blow to the head with a thick hardcover bible will knock that knowledge loose.


Thomathy
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Let's begin hitting

Let's begin hitting children!

I was under the impression that secular had a different meaning than some Christians attribute to it.  Perhaps the concept of secular is difficult to understan or is simply inconvenient to 'spreading to word'.  Whatever it is, secular is the public school system and secular it should be.

I would very much like to have the lyrics of O Canada changed, but as I can barely recall them in total and I am reasonably sure that most Canadians take them as seriously as they take... well it's hard to be clever there.  There's no stereotypical Canadian 'thing' that fits.  Well, still, I'm sure the lyrics aren't taken seriously, but I'd like to have them changed anyhow.  They're much more recent than the 'Under God' America has.  Actually, the Oath of Allegiance in Canada mentions something about God in it (I just looked it up, having never seen it before).  I'd like to change that and the bit about the Queen, though that's not a topic for this forum.

Anyhow, pooh on prayer in public school and on mention of God within a pledge (or oath) in a secular country.

BigUniverse wrote,

"Well the things that happen less often are more likely to be the result of the supper natural. A thing like loosing my keys in the morning is not likely supper natural, but finding a thousand dollars or meeting a celebrity might be."


Rev_Devilin
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Thomathy wrote:

Thomathy wrote:

 and the bit about the Queen, though that's not a topic for this forum.

? She is head of the church of Englund, God Bless her Majesty, the old parasite


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The one thing I did do at

The one thing I did do at my school was get rid of the daily 'moment of silence'. It was absolute rubbish and did nothing but take 3 minutes out of the shortest period of the day.

The way I did it was pretty funny too. Everytime the moment of silence happened I would get up and dance silently. I told them that it was my way of meditative prayer. When I was told not to do it any more I went to my dad who called up the school and threatened to pull me out (this is a big thing for a school that's under budget... especially when military students bring in bookoo cash) unless they allowed equality. Two weeks later it stopped.

One thing I really wanted to do was to get rid of the 'no pagan jewelry' policy... which was crap. The 'no pagan' policy expanded to the Star of David, any form of bones or fangs, and no black (at all). I didn't know jewish symbols were pagan.


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rev_devilin wrote: She is

rev_devilin wrote:

She is head of the church of Englund, God Bless her Majesty, the old parasite

 

Man that's funny.  I didn't know Freddy Krueger had his own church.  That Queen definitely gets around. 

Religion is the ultimate con-job. It cons the conned, and it cons the conner.

Mr.T : "I ain't gettin' on no damn plane [sic]" - environmentalism at it's best


triften
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CrimsonEdge wrote: The way

CrimsonEdge wrote:

The way I did it was pretty funny too. Everytime the moment of silence happened I would get up and dance silently. I told them that it was my way of meditative prayer. When I was told not to do it any more I went to my dad who called up the school and threatened to pull me out (this is a big thing for a school that's under budget... especially when military students bring in bookoo cash) unless they allowed equality. Two weeks later it stopped.

You just won major bonus points with me (which can't be redeemed for prizes, btw). That was awesome!

-Triften 


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They just added "under God"

They just added "under God" into the Texas pledge (we have to say it every morning), in addition to a "moment of silence" and now a "religious discussion", which we are required to have by the state.

 I say both pledges normally, that is without "under god", and sit down before everyone else because of it. Then, during the moment of silence I take out my physics homework and a calculator and begin punching away. When somone asked me what I was doing I said I was having a "moment of science".