Atheists have an interesting imagination
Offline Atheists have a most intriguing imagination when it comes to their creativeness in coming up with new "techniques" to disprove God. In all, that is the very predetermined conclusion most make. Their mind has already being shut to the concept of an Almighty God, even if under the self delusion they are open minded.
Dawkins may not even exist, applying the same "logical" principles he applies to God.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QERyh9YYEis
Archaelogical evidence affirming the Bible:
http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=33168
(Detailing finds made by Karolinska's (same guys who hand out the Nobel Prizes) expedition to the Red Sea.)
A video about the same finds:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2998846736678959139
Either way, even if God does not exist (contrary to archaelogical, scientific and sociological evidence) , it's not my loss, as all would be pointless. Yet if God does exist, and you reject him, woe unto the atheist.
Since I live in Sweden, I've heard most of the arguments toyed around with by atheists (notably at lectures held at Lund University). They just don't bite. And so-far, despite being surrounded by atheists everywhere I look (literally, more atheists than Christians), I've yet to be accused in RL as being a blind believer. I'm quite openheared, although very critical.
"I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is." -Albert Camus
You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! -
Ahem. Pascal's Wager. Been there, done that.
I openly reject god based on the evidence I have been presented. If there is a god then I imagine he would bring forth some kind of definitive proof. I've yet to see any, therefore, the logical conclusion would be that there is no god.
If god takes life he's an indian giver
[MOD EDIT - DOUBLE POST]
If god takes life he's an indian giver
§§That fact that I cannot prove the nonexistence of a thing called god is inconsequential and nugatory because nonexistence cannot be proven of anything.§§
You deal any other drugs besides faith?
Use your head, or somebody else might.
Dawkins is a man not a supernatural deity...
WorldNetDaily? yes the same hardcore reporting that brings you such stories as "How homosexuals hoodwinked Supremes" and "Beauty shot: John Edwards 'world's sexiest woman'?"
BTW the story says, "Curiously, no one can account for the precise whereabouts of that eight-spoked wheel today, though Hassan is on videotape stating his conclusion regarding authenticity."
I'm not even going to get into pascal's wager...
The charge of 'closed mindedness' coming from a faith based, dogmatist is a hollow complaint. I can only read this as a projection of your own flaws.
Those who know the good, do the good. - Socrates
: Operation Spread Eagle, Kent Hovind, Creation Science, Evangelism Ministries, Eric Hovind, Jo Hovind, Liar, Evolution, Copyright, Fraud, Youtube, Fair Use La
What if you die, and don't find out anything? "Finding out" requires an active brain to process the senses, the information, the language and pretty much anything you need to form a thought. Waited all your life for this moment of empty truth... if your brain still worked, I think it'd just regret never living life to its fullest, all the while thinking you'd just save your energy for the "afterlife."
Remember the first bajillion years before you were born? Me neither, death is JUST LIKE THAT. You're lucky enough to have a LIFE on apparently one of the lone specs in the near universe that can support life at all... and you want to live it in self-selected slavery to an imaginary friend on the slim chance that death isn't nothingness forever?
Shame.
I always love pascals wager, but what if, it isn't the christian god in the after life, what if it's an aztec god, a babylonian god, greek god(s), hindu god or one of the millions of gods or deities that man has imagined up over the last 5 or 6 thousand years? We are both fucked then. Then again, it could be just like a blissful sleep, or like the time of Shakespear, personally i have no recollection of it, and i expect death to be the same, just the end of this life. However i will "find" out at my death, oh wait that already happened, clinically dead for 5 minutes....and yeah i don't recall a thing except waking up in the recovery room.
Theists claim to have invisible friends but atheists have the "intriguing imagination"?
It is to laugh.
The journey is often worth more than the destination.
Wow - Dawkins doesn't exist? We must have some really good hologram technology...
Slimm,
Or you simply neglect any and all evidence presented, resulting in your denial being based on a predetermined belief.
Reading through the replies, this would be rather funny had it not been so tragic. Regardless, you guys are the risk takers, irrational as it may be considering the cost of your being wrong.
I'm rather light hearted about this, because I doubt I'll be convincing any of you with recitals of Creationist and other arguments. God will save whom He wills.
Although in a way it eases me to know you guys are around. Had you not been, then God's word would not be true. (Genesis 6:5 amongst many others -this is not meant as evidence in any way, simply a reference to my position)
Oh and I appreciate the lable "Theist" you gave me. I would've liked it in blue, and it saying Christian instead, but I figure you guys don't bother differentiating between the various faiths. Faith in itself seems evil in your eyes.
Thanks for your replies.
"I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is." -Albert Camus
You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! -
Look's like you forgot to-be critical while presenting
These quote's are from the provide link
" extreme caution regarding the unsubstantiated claims.
"All kinds of people are finding coral and calling it chariot parts," says Richard Rives, president of Wyatt Archaeological Research in Tennessee. "It's most likely coral covered with coral. ... Opportunists are combining false things with the true things that are found. These people are making it up as they go to be TV stars. "
"cites Ron's discovery of a wheel hub that he brought to the surface in the late 1970s as proof.
Curiously, no one can account for the precise whereabouts of that eight-spoked wheel today, though Hassan is on videotape stating his conclusion regarding authenticity."
As has already been pointed out, you are also a risk taker for not believing in the many, many other gods. The cost of you being wrong is just as great.
Hi Jacomus7
I believe "Faith in itself" is not evil, I believe religious ideology is evil, and I have historical evidence to back up this believe, ? would you like to see it
Nope, not in denial. I'd be more than willing to believe in god if I thought there was one.
See, this whole risk taking thing is complete Pascal's Wager. You really should read up on it a bit. It's rather silly. After all, as others here have mentioned, you are taking a risk as well. What if you god isn't the true god? Maybe you're worshipping the wrong guy.
I'm glad you're rather 'lighthearted' about all this. It only goes to show the arrogance that so many Christians display towards people who aren't Christian. So you're happy that you think we're going to go hell. Good for you. I suppose you're happy that the Muslims and Hindus are going to go to hell too? How kind and loving of you.
It would be too hectic to have a million different tags. There would have to be Baptist, Pentecostal, Catholic, Jewish, Muslim, Jehovah's, etc. You get the point.
I personally don't care what beliefs you hold, nor do I think all theists are 'evil'. I'm more concerned about your beliefs affecting the rights of myself and others.
If god takes life he's an indian giver
Here, I'll go into detail why pascals wager (the idea that you are ok while others are not because of your belief) does not apply to religion.
There is more than one religion. That's about as much detail that's needed. The fact that there are a plethora of religions proves that your wager is just as risky as ours. In fact, we can plead ignorance while you can not. If you are wrong, you worshipped a false idol, effectively damning you to any hell whatever other religion has proposed.
Both probability and Pascals Wager are against you.
Your faith is based on fear and emotion, as you pointed out.
Rational: having its source in or being guided by the intellect (distinguished from experience or emotion); "a rational analysis"
And we're the irrational ones.
Are you still afraid of the boogie man under the bed? He could be there.. I hope you jump out of bed each morning, clear of arms reach. It's obviously the rational thing to do...
Use your head, or somebody else might.
I have one question, which christian are you?, Catholic? Anglican? pentacostal? Jehova Witness? Christadelphian? baptist? Mormon? Protestant? Lutherian? Evagelist? because depending, well not depending, even if you claim no specific denomentation, according to the rest of the denominations, you are going to hell. Because you are not following the word of god as per their interpretation. So yea you are going to join us in hell apparently, see you there.
(i can also take this with a light heart, because as you can see, your arguement is a silly arguement once you get down to the details of hell and it's specifics)
"I contend we are both atheists, I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."--Stephen F. Roberts
Of course, it's not beneficial for archaeology if people pick up random pieces of things and claim it to be something it's not. That's why there were warnings against that, as it works to detract credibility from the argument at hand.
Selective editing obviously left out the fokllowing:
"Moller says it refers specifically to the Gulf of Aqaba, and while he's not formally affiliated with the Wyatts, he agrees with them that a host of other evidence can be found on the Arabian side of the water, including remains of the golden calf, pillars, altars and the even the rock the Bible says Moses split to bring forth water for the Israelites.
Regarding the items found beneath the waters, Moller believes there are remnants not only of chariots and wheels, but also human and animal skeletons."
Sure, Rev_Devilin, I wouldn't mind seeing it.
To believe in other religions, you have to neglect all the evidence both archaeological and otherwise regarding the Truth of the Bible.
To say that you do not wish to have your rights impeded by religion authorizes me to utilize the concept that I cannot tolerate such willful and propogated sin, as it will in the end wreak the Wrath of God upon the entire nation - just like Sodom and Gommorrah.
Also, my faith has not always been strong. Before, I was practically speaking agnostic (never was atheist, thank God), along with the rest of my family. Then through eschatological and Scriptural research was my fervour in faith kindled.
Emotions do, however, seem to abound in your relentless war of words against religion.
Edit:
latincanuck, officially I'm Lutheran. Practically, I'm Calvinist. Very few denominations within Christianity consider other denominations to go to hell, unless they reject a central tenet of Christianity: such as the Deity of Christ.
"I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is." -Albert Camus
You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! -
Jacomus,
All that your archeological evidence for the Bible (assuming it's not fraudulent) really proves is that the guys who wrote the Bible knew the area in which they lived.
It doesn't do a thing to validate your God.
Spiderman is set in New York City and NYC is a real place - is the Wall-Crawler real?
The journey is often worth more than the destination.
""The wind did not separate the water," says Lennart Moller of the Karolinska Institute in Stockholm. "No person could be in that wind and survive. ... If God has created all the Earth, it's no problem for Him to separate the water for a while.""
"I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is." -Albert Camus
You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! -
Nice evidence.
Damned fine dodge also. Local color in the Bible doesn't make your God real.
Your appeal to authority doesn't help you either.
The journey is often worth more than the destination.
Um, what about the archeological evidence found about the Greek gods? You know, statues, altars, etc.
Sin exists only in religion. If you're talking about morals, well, that's a whole other ball game. And morals are subjective. You don't get to tell me what I can and cannot do if I am not hurt another individual. Likewise, I don't get to tell you what you can and cannot do as long as you aren't hurting another individual. So no, you have no authority over me. It's really as simple as that.
We are both bound by the laws of our countries/states/society etc. If you want to be bound by the laws of religion, that's your perogative. However, you have no right to try to bind me by the laws of your religion.
If god takes life he's an indian giver
Pariahjane, I said sin, not morals. As you said, there's a big difference. At least in terms of dialogue between theist and atheist.
Now, this is changing the subject of discussion somewhat, but I am curious.
What made you guys PERSONALLY accept that atheism is the truth?
I'm here to learn, not convince anyone. It's not up to me to decide what others believe, nor is it up to you.
"I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is." -Albert Camus
You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! -
People don't accept atheism as true, atheism is not being convinced theism is true.
Aside from the complete lack of evidence of God or gods and the ridiculousness of fragmented and multiple organised religions you mean?
Freedom of religious belief is an inalienable right. Stuffing that belief down other people's throats is not.