Do Jewish People Believe in God?

Ig
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Do Jewish People Believe in God?

I've had a few conversations with Jews over the net and discovered that my preconceived notion of what Jewish means are not entirely accurate.

I presumed that when someone referred to themselves as Jewish that it meant they were of the Jewish faith. It turns out that is not necessarily the case. It's more about tradition and not actually a belief in Yahweh.

I've only gotten a small sampling of this so am not sure how widespread this is. From my current understanding you have religious Jews(the ones with the facial hair decorations) and regular Jews.

If anyone has a better grasp of this, I would appreciate your input.

One thing that is interesting is if my presumptions are correct, there are more atheists than the numbers may show. Someone is going to identify themselves as Jewish and be placed in the theist column.


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No. I'm Jewish and I do not

No.

I'm Jewish and I do not believe in God. Judaism is an ethnicity not a religion. Anyone with Ashkenazic or Sephardic blood is automatically considered Jewish.

One thing that is interesting is if my presumptions are correct, there are more atheists than the numbers may show. Someone is going to identify themselves as Jewish and be placed in the theist column.

LOL. There are 1.1 billion non religious people and 12 million Jews. They will not swell our numbers. 

"Physical reality” isn’t some arbitrary demarcation. It is defined in terms of what we can systematically investigate, directly or not, by means of our senses. It is preposterous to assert that the process of systematic scientific reasoning arbitrarily excludes “non-physical explanations” because the very notion of “non-physical explanation” is contradictory.

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Just for curiousities sake,

Just for curiousities sake, can you hazard a guess on what percentage are religious?

Another thing that is interesting, if the numbers are real low,  is that Christianity is based on a faith that has been abandoned by it's creators...an empty foundation on which to build a religion. I guess this applies to Islam also since it's has it's roots in Judiasm.


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Just for curiousities sake,

Just for curiousities sake, can you hazard a guess on what percentage are religious?

I would imagine that very few Jews believe in God. This guess is very shaky, but only the Orthodox Jews are still devout, and they are a small minority.

Another thing that is interesting, if the numbers are real low,  is that Christianity is based on a faith that has been abandoned by it's creators...an empty foundation on which to build a religion. I guess this applies to Islam also since it's has it's roots in Judiasm.

Christianity all but destroyed the religion to which it owes it's own spiritual heritage. So yes, you're right. 

"Physical reality” isn’t some arbitrary demarcation. It is defined in terms of what we can systematically investigate, directly or not, by means of our senses. It is preposterous to assert that the process of systematic scientific reasoning arbitrarily excludes “non-physical explanations” because the very notion of “non-physical explanation” is contradictory.

-Me

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Different Beliefs

A Jew is a Jew by ethnicity and/or religion.  In Israel for example, it is estimated that 25% of Jews are Atheist and up to another 25% are Agnostic.

Even many believers are very secular.  Slightly less than 50% of Jews in Israel go to synagogue at least once a year on Saturdays. 

We even have our share of Young Earthers, unfortunately, and a those who deny evolution as fact.  The more religious one is, the more likely they are not to accept evolution. 

 


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Thanks guys. I feel less

Thanks guys. I feel less ignorant now. Smiling


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What's funny about atheist

What's funny about atheist jews is that it shows what Nietzsche said about God's Life expectency... That after a certain amount of time a religion decays and you have to create a new god for people to believe in him. Judaism is one of the oldest religion out there, and jews were among the first very prominent atheist (such as marxists for instance, "religion is people's opiate&quotEye-wink.

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jesus is king of the jews..

jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout


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son of god wrote:jesus is

son of god wrote:
jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

Did they let the retarded class out early? No Jews believe Jesus to be the son of God - otherwise they'd be Christians not Jews. And there are plenty of Christian thugs.

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Jews

MattShizzle wrote:

son of god wrote:
jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

Did they let the retarded class out early? No Jews believe Jesus to be the son of God - otherwise they'd be Christians not Jews. And there are plenty of Christian thugs.

    Romans called Jesus  King of the Jews not Jews.  MattShizzle have you ever heard of a group called "Jews for Jesus"?  Here in Toronto the head man is a Rabbi. Seems rediculous to me but it is true.

 

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I forgot about them. Wasn't

I forgot about them. Wasn't it actually started by evangelists to convert Jews though? Isn't that kind of like Christians for Mohammed or Moslems for the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

 

And to SOG (isn't using that name blasphemy?)

 

And as to asking how someone can be Jewish and not believe in Jesus....

 

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Greetings

Yes, the Messianic Jews, they are Jewish in their festivities and other qualities but also believe that Jesus is the one Jews have been waiting for.

They are very much prosecuted by normal Jews especially.

It is said the great ones catch teardrops in their hands.


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Religious_Rebel wrote:Yes,

Religious_Rebel wrote:

Yes, the Messianic Jews, they are Jewish in their festivities and other qualities but also believe that Jesus is the one Jews have been waiting for.

They are very much prosecuted by normal Jews especially.

Many Apocalypse freaks believe than when there are 144,000 Jewish converts to Christianity, these Jews will be raptured, then the Apocalypse/Armageddon will start for the rest of us. I don't know if they've reach that number yet.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


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It's obviously way, way more

It's obviously way, way more than that throughout history.


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This new fellow is like a

This new fellow is like a caricature. I at first did not believe that such people existed, but now...tell me, sir. do you drink industrial pollutants, or are you simply naturally retarded?

Quote:

jesus is king of the jews

Well, you see, you obviously have a misunderstanding of what a "jew" is. The "Jews" are Semitic ethnicity, as an ethnic bloodline, it is considered passed through the mother. Ergo, if one has a Jewish mother, they are, themselves, Jewish, regardless of what they believe. They might believe the moon is made of green cheese. It really makes no difference.

Quote:

''im a thug, but im also a christian"

This phrase makes perfect sense to me.

Quote:

its not freakin possible!!!

Of course it is. See above, sir. The considerations are ethnic based, not belief-based.

Quote:

you people that claim your jewish

Actually, I can correct you theologically here too. The Jews, ie those that follow the religion which is concomitant with Judaism, the Jewish ethnicity, do not believe that Christ was their Messiah. The religion we now call "Christianity" began as a small cult that was originally Jewish. However, it is now, of course, a separate religion. My correction to you is merely out of the fact that I'm enjoying humiliating you. It makes no personal difference to me since I don't believe in God, let alone his offspring.

Quote:

but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help

Actually, with respect to people who need help, you may wish to take a hard look in the mirror. Your prose indicates you are inflicted with a tragic, albeit staggeringly prevalent disease known as "idiocy".

Quote:

cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

Alright. That's it. Nobody is that stupid. Nobody. For fuck's sake, you aren't at a bar. Anyone who uses "y'all" (and not even with correct apostrophes) is pure, distilled idiocy.

"Physical reality” isn’t some arbitrary demarcation. It is defined in terms of what we can systematically investigate, directly or not, by means of our senses. It is preposterous to assert that the process of systematic scientific reasoning arbitrarily excludes “non-physical explanations” because the very notion of “non-physical explanation” is contradictory.

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son of god wrote:jesus is

son of god wrote:
jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

I sincerely want to thank you SoB, I mean "G", truly, I thank you from the bottom of my metaphorical heart. The reason being, your post made me laugh so damn hard that after the first two minutes of non-stop laughter I could hardly breath. So I took a breather, returned to my screen, re-read your brain droppings, and guess what? I laughed some more!!

"not freaking possible" eh? Well here, educate yourself

But you might say: "When I say thug, I don't necessarily use it to say gang member", and I'll grant you that, so, let's say thug can be equivalent to the word "criminal", if that's the case, then check this list of christian fellows so devoted and morally committed, they probably have their chests and backs filled with tattoos of the king of Jews.

*starts having a giggle that escalates to yet another laughter episode*

(a couple of minutes latter, no really) *Pant, Pant* Phew, thanks again SoG.

EXC wrote:
Many Apocalypse freaks believe than when there are 144,000 Jewish converts to Christianity, these Jews will be raptured, then the Apocalypse/Armageddon will start for the rest of us. I don't know if they've reach that number yet.

Mmm, does forcefully converted count? If so, you can subtract the 40,000 conversos  of the Spanish Inquisition from the tally

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Quote:Many Apocalypse freaks

Quote:
Many Apocalypse freaks believe than when there are 144,000 Jewish converts to Christianity, these Jews will be raptured, then the Apocalypse/Armageddon will start for the rest of us.

...The Hell? So, are they - even as we speak - locked away in their basement, sifting through old newspapers, and taking a manual head count as best they can?

How are they supposed to keep track of something so ambiguous?

Quote:
"Natasha has just come up to the window from the courtyard and opened it wider so that the air may enter more freely into my room. I can see the bright green strip of grass beneath the wall, and the clear blue sky above the wall, and sunlight everywhere. Life is beautiful. Let the future generations cleanse it of all evil, oppression and violence, and enjoy it to the full."

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EXC wrote:Many Apocalypse

EXC wrote:

Many Apocalypse freaks believe than when there are 144,000 Jewish converts to Christianity, these Jews will be raptured, then the Apocalypse/Armageddon will start for the rest of us. I don't know if they've reach that number yet.

 

So... what your saying is... if we wish to preserve our human race... we must... kill all the jews...

 

>.>

 

<.<

 

Hehehe

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the only way to solve the

the only way to solve the problems is using you brains...what is the god who create the god figure in your brain?i know you all thinking about it but even makin the discussion about it claims that you all aprove it... so do not even talk about it...cause it is only a THING in your brain


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deludedgod wrote:Alright.

deludedgod wrote:

Alright. That's it. Nobody is that stupid. Nobody. For fuck's sake, you aren't at a bar. Anyone who uses "y'all" (and not even with correct apostrophes) is pure, distilled idiocy.

Now, DG, that's not quite fair. I know quite a number of people who use "y'all" in the course of their normal speech patterns who are very far from being idiots. It's a colloquialism, nothing more. As a Noo Yawker, it's one that always makes me twitch a little, but yaknow, whatchagonnado eh? Fuggeddaboudit.

Just a colloquialism. We've all got 'em.

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albedo_00 wrote:I sincerely

albedo_00 wrote:

I sincerely want to thank you SoB, I mean "G", truly, I thank you from the bottom of my metaphorical heart. The reason being, your post made me laugh so damn hard that after the first two minutes of non-stop laughter I could hardly breath. So I took a breather, returned to my screen, re-read your brain droppings, and guess what? I laughed some more!!

"not freaking possible" eh? Well here, educate yourself

But you might say: "When I say thug, I don't necessarily use it to say gang member", and I'll grant you that, so, let's say thug can be equivalent to the word "criminal", if that's the case, then check this list of christian fellows so devoted and morally committed, they probably have their chests and backs filled with tattoos of the king of Jews.

*starts having a giggle that escalates to yet another laughter episode*

(a couple of minutes latter, no really) *Pant, Pant* Phew, thanks again SoG.

Wait.. maybe he means 'thug' as in the 'Thugee' cults of Victorian India?

"You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know... morons." - The Waco Kid


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I guess I could also call

I guess I could also call myself an atheist Jew. 6 Years ago I underwent an orthodox conversion to Judaism and the rabbis were very blunt about one thing - this is for life, even if I one day stop being observant. So yes, there are plenty of atheist Jews out there and it is not an oxymoron.

And don't even get me started on the so called "Jews for Jesus". Those guys are fraud within the fraud. They are simply Christians in disguise (some Jewish some not) who apply trickery and use the ignorance of secular and volnurable Jews to lure & trap them into Christianity. Their methods are despicaple and fortunately, despite disproportional publicity, they are rather few in numbers.

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son of god wrote:jesus is

son of god wrote:
jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

I quite agree. I think Jews who claim to be atheists are betraying their own people. Woe unto them.

I'm an agnostic atheist who thinks you should love your neughbour.


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Atheist Smatheist

I am Jewish - very Jewish.  When I am ready to marry I want to make sure my husband is Jewish and that my kids are raised Jewish.  I am gay and can get married in a Reconstructionist, Conservative, Reform, humanist, and alternative synagogues.  I love Judaism and I think it is great to be Jewish.  It is not a race as there are Black Jews, Arab Jews, Latin American Jews, White Jews, etc.  It is also not an ethnicity since one can be adopted into the Jewish Community (via conversion - but it is really hard).  It is also not necessarily a religion.  There are of course many Jews who believe in G-d.  However, to be Jewish one does not have to believe in G-d.  More than 50% of Israelis do not believe in G-d.  I imagine that if Jews my age (around 21) were polled we'd not believe in G-d by an overwhelming percentage.  Part of that is probably because we put so much emphasis on education and on questioning the status quo of thought.  In fact, as Jewish as I am I do not believe in G-d - only in the traditions which I feel hold some intrinsic value to them.  My grandparents were Orthodox Jews.  The Shoah (holocaust) changed that.  Are you telling me that my grandparents - Jews who survived the holocaust - are not ACTUALLY Jewish because they cannot believe in G-d after something that horrible?  That would be crazy.  I am on the board of my campus Hillel.  Of the 5 board members not even one of us believe in G-d.  Of our 40 members all together only 10 of us believe in G-d.  On campus there are 300 Jews.  I have a feeling the stats would be relatively the same.  Again, I am a devout Jew.  I fast on Yom Kippur, go to synagogue and don't work on Shabbat, I keep relatively kosher (even for Pesach (Passover)), etc.  Yet, I do not believe in G-d.  So, there you are.


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Some things I don't

Some things I don't understand about Judism. Can anyone answer:

Do religious Jews believe in an afterlife of heaven and hell? Do some people just die and that's it?

Who gets in to heaven and why? Who goes to hell and why?

The reason I ask is the Old Testament doesn't say much about an afterlife. Just says everyone goes to the grave(sheol). Why would anyone be part of a religion that doesn't promise an afterlife for it's adherents?

 

 

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Don't like the religion

Don't like the religion judaism but nor do I like the culture. It represents the real source of all the worlds problems not religion which is merely a symptom of the root cause

The true source of all evil is tradition, defining who and what you are based on what your parents, grandparents etc were.

I will not hate or kill because my parents did, I will not choose to associate on that basis either.

Parents were jewish I am not, their definition of judaism was hating arabs.

 

 

 


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Ig wrote:I've had a few

Ig wrote:
I've had a few conversations with Jews over the net and discovered that my preconceived notion of what Jewish means are not entirely accurate.

I presumed that when someone referred to themselves as Jewish that it meant they were of the Jewish faith. It turns out that is not necessarily the case. It's more about tradition and not actually a belief in Yahweh.

I've only gotten a small sampling of this so am not sure how widespread this is. From my current understanding you have religious Jews(the ones with the facial hair decorations) and regular Jews.

If anyone has a better grasp of this, I would appreciate your input.

One thing that is interesting is if my presumptions are correct, there are more atheists than the numbers may show. Someone is going to identify themselves as Jewish and be placed in the theist column.

Essentially you've got it right. Although it depends what Jew you ask. If you ask a right-winger, especially an Israeli one, your almost certainly going to get the must believe in B.S. answer.

On the other hand, there are tens of thousands of Atheist Jews. (That really kills the religious Jews.)

You ever heard the expression "A bad Jew!"? (Now you have.)

It's not uncommon to find Jews that are almost entirely unobservant of every tradition, excepting perhaps 1 or 2 days a year, just in their own minds to satisfy themselves and to show everyone they're around that they're part of the
Jewish bunch.

You're likely to find much disagreement on this, since you'll also find that large groups of Jews hate other large groups of Jews. It's not uncommon.

It's not much different than the Christian that simply stopped going to Church, but happens to believe in "God".


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mrjonno wrote:Don't like the

mrjonno wrote:

Don't like the religion judaism but nor do I like the culture. It represents the real source of all the worlds problems not religion which is merely a symptom of the root cause...

Lay off the crack for a while.

Read that first sentence VERY carefully, and you'll find about 4 contradictions.

(I know what you said, but crack-heads won't get it.)


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The root cause of the worlds

The root cause of the worlds problems is tradition, judiasm (religion + culture) is just one example and I did not mean to imply it was the only one


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LoveThyNeighbour wrote:son

LoveThyNeighbour wrote:

son of god wrote:
jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

I quite agree. I think Jews who claim to be atheists are betraying their own people. Woe unto them.

I think Christians who don't acknowledge their  polytheism or the Canaanite deities they pray to are betraying their own sanity.  Woe unto them.

(Couldn't help myself Smiling)

 

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mrjonno wrote:The root cause

mrjonno wrote:

The root cause of the worlds problems is tradition, judiasm (religion + culture) is just one example and I did not mean to imply it was the only one

Your post above the quoted post above "implied" anything.
It was quite specific.

I take it you would like to extend and revise your post.
Personally, I think everyone should be entitled to do so.

Despite the subsequent "clarification", I do NOT take it that you are NOT an anti-Semite.

I can't find anything else within the post quoted above that's worth responding to.


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Ig wrote:I've had a few

Ig wrote:
I've had a few conversations with Jews over the net and discovered that my preconceived notion of what Jewish means are not entirely accurate.

I presumed that when someone referred to themselves as Jewish that it meant they were of the Jewish faith. It turns out that is not necessarily the case. It's more about tradition and not actually a belief in Yahweh.

I've only gotten a small sampling of this so am not sure how widespread this is. From my current understanding you have religious Jews(the ones with the facial hair decorations) and regular Jews.

If anyone has a better grasp of this, I would appreciate your input.

One thing that is interesting is if my presumptions are correct, there are more atheists than the numbers may show. Someone is going to identify themselves as Jewish and be placed in the theist column.

It's another Zionist plot to confuse you and take over the world!

Oh yeah... I'd appreciate you input because I'm an idiot and I'm waiting for some Jew to answer my thread. I like to piss them off, too!


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God will still save you

 

 

In the Bible it states in Revelation that the world would come to this.  That more and more Jewish people would be deceived by science, and false prophets.  The very fact that (most of you) just say that Christians are ignorant and stupid makes the Bible become even more convincing to me and everyone else as God predicted this would happen.  Soon, God will give Jews a second opportunity when he presents himself.  You are all very lucky that you are in fact, whether you like it or not "Gods Chosen People".  If you were to go to Jerusalum however and claim you were Jewish and try to become a member of  a Jewish church, you would not be allowed unless you believed in God.  I am sad for all of you that are hurting inside. And, yes I know you will bash me and say I'm hurting or whatever.  You will say I am ignorant (even with 2 Masters Degrees, and a teacher and great father and husband), but lets really stop and take a look inside yourselves and really see whats going on instead of reacting out of anger because my words have touched a soft spot in your heart.  I will pray that God comes into your heart and reveals himself to you.  Whether you like it or not, if you truly are Jewish, you should know than that you came from Jacob and Abraham and what is now called Israel.  They, ironcially were firm believers in Christ.

 

 

 

 


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Anonymous2 wrote:  In the

Anonymous2 wrote:

 

 

In the Bible it states in Revelation that the world would come to this.  That more and more Jewish people would be deceived by science, and false prophets.  The very fact that (most of you) just say that Christians are ignorant and stupid makes the Bible become even more convincing to me and everyone else as God predicted this would happen.  Soon, God will give Jews a second opportunity when he presents himself.  You are all very lucky that you are in fact, whether you like it or not "Gods Chosen People".  If you were to go to Jerusalum however and claim you were Jewish and try to become a member of  a Jewish church, you would not be allowed unless you believed in God.  I am sad for all of you that are hurting inside. And, yes I know you will bash me and say I'm hurting or whatever.  You will say I am ignorant (even with 2 Masters Degrees, and a teacher and great father and husband), but lets really stop and take a look inside yourselves and really see whats going on instead of reacting out of anger because my words have touched a soft spot in your heart.  I will pray that God comes into your heart and reveals himself to you.  Whether you like it or not, if you truly are Jewish, you should know than that you came from Jacob and Abraham and what is now called Israel.  They, ironcially were firm believers in Christ.

 

 

 

 

 

What a crock of complete shit. In the context of this sprawling, odious supposition, your misspelling of ironic is ironic.

 

 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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 one, god is an entity but

 one, god is an entity but people think of him as a man because its easier to picture and or understand


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Ig wrote:I've had a few

Ig wrote:
I've had a few conversations with Jews over the net and discovered that my preconceived notion of what Jewish means are not entirely accurate.

I presumed that when someone referred to themselves as Jewish that it meant they were of the Jewish faith. It turns out that is not necessarily the case. It's more about tradition and not actually a belief in Yahweh.

I've only gotten a small sampling of this so am not sure how widespread this is. From my current understanding you have religious Jews(the ones with the facial hair decorations) and regular Jews.

If anyone has a better grasp of this, I would appreciate your input.

One thing that is interesting is if my presumptions are correct, there are more atheists than the numbers may show. Someone is going to identify themselves as Jewish and be placed in the theist column.

---

According to the collective body of Jewish religious law, including biblical law (the 613 mitzvot) and later Talmudic and rabbinic law, as well as customs and traditions, the oldest definition used by Jews for self-identification is:  A person who is either born of a Jewish mother or a person who converts to Judaism.  This definition has been challenged over the years.

As far as belief in God, being a Jew doesn't translate into belief.  Even within Jewish (Judaism) Orthodoxy, there are different levels ranging from Orthodoxy (accepting the Torah and the 613 mitzvot), Reformed Judaism who do not believe the Torah was written by God; however, they accept the critical theory of Biblical authorship and do not believe in observance of commandments as such, but they retain much of the values and ethics of Judaism; Conservative Judaism that maintains that the truths found in Jewish scriptures and other Jewish writings come from God, but were transmitted by humans and contain a human component. Conservative Judaism generally accepts the binding nature of the collective body of Jewish religious law (like Orthodoxy); however, believes that the Law should change and adapt, absorbing aspects of the predominant culture while remaining true to Judaism's values, and then there is Reconstructionist Judaism that is theoretically an outgrowth of Conservative Judaism.  Recontructionists believe that Judaism is an evolving religious civilization.  They do not believe in a personified deity that is active in history, and they do not believe the Jews are God's chosen people.

I do not have any statistics on numbers of Jews that consider themselves Orthodox or atheistic.  Just like most religions today, the human element makes choices based on belief and therefore a disparity appears within the group.  Christianity is a good example.

Clear as mud?

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I think Jews, at least in

I think Jews, at least in the secular west, were certainly ahead of the curve in promoting the idea that it was ok to be into the tradition without literally believing in the god.

I wouldn't get stuck on labels. It is possible for atheists to celebrate Christmas without believing in a zombie god.

You can  partake in a tradition without believing in the superstition. How many of us here will celebrate Christmas without believing that Santa is real or that God tapped Barry White on the shoulder to play music to put Mary in the mood to get knocked up?

So yes, Jews, and any other label of religion, CAN and do partake in social traditions without literally believing in the magical superstitions.

When I visited Japan I took part in a harvest festival, does that mean because I enjoyed it I have the same politics or gods or superstitions they do?

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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reggnar wrote: one, god is

reggnar wrote:

 one, god is an entity but people think of him as a man because its easier to picture and or understand

or he was created by men who tend to make deities that are like them.

"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin


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jcgadfly wrote:reggnar

jcgadfly wrote:

reggnar wrote:

 one, god is an entity but people think of him as a man because its easier to picture and or understand

or he was created by men who tend to make deities that are like them.

How quickly adults dismiss the invisible friends of others, yet all humans would dismiss their kid claiming their invisible friend whom they play with in the sandbox.

The only difference between the invisible friends of adults and the invisible friends of children are money and politics.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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son of god wrote:jesus is

son of god wrote:
jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

Are you serious? A christian friend of mine recently told me you are only a son of god if you are baptized (can't believe that friend of mine just told that to someone who is Jewish). If Jesus was Jewish then how was he "baptized"? - If he is the son of god. . .


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Anonymous!!!

Anonymous. wrote:

son of god wrote:
jesus is king of the jews.. how the heck are you not to believe in your father, and your king? its like saying, ''im a thug, but im also a christian" its not freakin possible!!! and doesnt make sense!!! you people that claim your jewish, but doesnt believe in jesus.. need help, cause yall dont know what the heck yall talkin bout

Are you serious? A christian friend of mine recently told me you are only a son of god if you are baptized (can't believe that friend of mine just told that to someone who is Jewish). If Jesus was Jewish then how was he "baptized"? - If he is the son of god. . .

 

 

               First off pick a name and join us.   Secondly  Jesus was baptised by John the Baptist;  that's if you buy into any of that bible stuff. I don't buy into all of it. John the B was probably real whereas J.C. or Joshua bar Joseph was NOT real.  Thirdly if we are all god's children then what's so effing special about Jesus H. Christ anyways.

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Jeffrick wrote:John the B

Jeffrick wrote:

John the B was probably real whereas J.C. or Joshua bar Joseph was NOT real.  Thirdly if we are all god's children then what's so effing special about Jesus H. Christ anyways.

what on earth makes you make that distinction?  we have even less literary evidence for him than jesus.

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


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Hi iwbiek

 

 

 

                I DID use the words "probably real.."  only because I think he was.  For several reasons, yet I know I could be wrong.  In the bible  John the B was human, he was never credited with magical woo woo at any time.  When I toured Israel a decade ago My group was taken to a cave near the Jordan river where  SOMEBODY was performing ritual bathing [baptising] in the first century, the tour guide and my own eyes said that the grotto was in use long before and long after John's time,  but John gets the credit for it.

 

 

                All the Herods and Pontius Pilate and several other charactors in the bible where real historical persons which proves only that the bible is not TOTAL B.S.  just a LOT of B.S.  A rabal  rousing preacher called John the baptiser was exicuted by Herod Antipas at the prompting of his wife [ not step-daughter] because of his preachings against their wedding.

 

 

               Josephus wrote about the incident, scholers consider it credible, what Josephus wrote about Jesus scholers consider non-credible [added in later].  Ritual bathing still takes place in Orthdox Synagogs today,  meaning John did not invent the practice [ no one said he did] he was just carrying on an old tradition with his new - anti-Herod  -  preachings.

 

 

               A modern sect called Mandaeans still follow the teachings of John the B with heavy emphsis on daily clensing. They live mostly in Iraq, Iran and Syria today. They do not  consider John has anything other then a human prophet.  One way to describe the Mandaeans is they evolved from Judaisim but did not involve christianity. 

 

 

               The proviso here is that ritual bathing was common, and the name John was also common. Based on his preachings John the B was one of the sources {one of meny} for the Jesus charactor.  So I believe John the baptist was probably real  and that does not make Jesus real nor does it make me less an atheist.

 

 

                Jim

"Very funny Scotty; now beam down our clothes."

VEGETARIAN: Ancient Hindu word for "lousy hunter"

If man was formed from dirt, why is there still dirt?