TESTIMONY OF A FRIEND

JesusLovesYou
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TESTIMONY OF A FRIEND

My friend brandon,
This man has went through quite a storm. It started with ultimate financial difficulties, he cannot hold a job for the life of him because nobody will allow him to work in his church schedule with a full time job, then his fiance left him just last week cuz she felt that she wasn't ready for marriage (she left the church as well), their wedding was supposed to be next week.

Ill let him testify for you:
The Day My Heart Broke in Two

08/Jan/07

Yesterday I was hurt beyond imagination, a pain that I would wish upon no enemy great or small. The love of my heart walked out and left me in the dark with no visible cause, I wondered and speculated on the reason for this atrocity only to find myself plummeting into an endless black-hole of imaginations. As I take counsel from my pastor and peers I find myself with a death grip on God, trusting in His absolute control of things. The pain continues but a certain mercy and grace flow round about me only given by the Lord God Almighty. I only pray that He will guide me through this enormous storm, but as Peter walked on his storm that God was in, I know He will bid me to walk upon this storm as well.

10/Jan/07

As the Lord guides me through this life altering experience He shows me through His eyes, how every time I sin, this is the pain He goes through , a complete broken heart. With this new revelation my walk with God has come all to real and personal to me, knowing that every time I fall or turn from Him, his heart wrenches for me. Jesus loved us enough to be nailed to a cross and surrender His life so that we might be saved from the penalty of sin, which is death. I need to examine myself daily, and not take for granted the grace and mercy bestowed upon me, for every drop of His blood was given in pain and in a broken heart He gave His life for the ones who broke His heart, which is everyone of US…..Forgive me Lord this day I pray!…Glory and Honor to the Hand of God which guides, strengthens, and keeps me. Amen.

As children of God we need to love as God loves, never holding charges against one another , but showing love, grace, and mercy , for without holiness no man can see the Lord…. We are the body of Christ Jesus, and need to carry and minister as He ministered, showing love and mercy and grace in abundance no matter the pain, for His love is greater!……..God is seen by the world through us , so we need to portray Him as he is……

Jan 11, 2007

As God continuously guides me through this experience, I look back on my life and realize that God has skillfully used this heartbreaking experience to cleanse and develop my ministry even more than I could imagine. Not only has He shown me His pain but He has given me new zeal for Him, a certain driving force to get closer to Him every day and to continually walk in His presence. I seek the Lord my God daily, He is the breath in my lungs and the blood coursing through my veins. He gave his life for me, so I give my life to him. I will set the Lord always before me, every idle moment will I seek His face.

Glory and Honor to the Hand of God which guides, strengthens, and keeps me. Amen.

I was given in prayer when the Lord gave me a scripture, that I thought I new, but as God opened my understanding I once again realized His infinite power and wisdom. The scripture is found in "Psalms119:105 Thy word is a lamp unto my feet and a light unto my path." (KJV) I thought in my mind this scripture doesn't fit my situation Lord…He said that there three things need ed for a lamp to operate and anyone of them missing the lamp is useless, one the lamp itself, two the oil or fuel, three the fire. Then He proceeded to further prove He was smarter than me. Ha Ha . So, as He continues to explain many people think they don't have to read the Bible or pray except on church nights or when they need guidance, don't get me wrong the Bible and prayer is the best solution for any problem but, this scripture refers to the word of God already hidden and planted in your heart as being a lamp to your feet and a light to your path. And the oil or fuel is the spirit of God dwelling within you, and when they are mixed together it becomes vary volatile or flammable. So now we have the Word hidden in our hearts and the spirit of God dwelling in the midst of it, the only component left is the fire, and how do we ignite the fire which is fueled by the spirit? We ignite it with worship and praise to the Lord God Almighty. So when your in a dark place and you can't see past your own nose, when the storm is raging and you don't know where or which way to turn, just tap into the spirit of God with praise and worship and that spirit within you will start to spark up into a blazing fire, and lead you according to the will of God in your life…

Jan 12 2007

Awaking this morning with a fresh take on Life given by God, just being in the presence of God is a beautiful thing. The miracle He has done in me is a testimony in itself. God not only comforted me through this storm so far, He has completely healed me from the pain and sorrow. Blessed is the name of Jesus for He is worthy of all my praise, glory, and honor. Now taking hold on my new found testimony I hold even tighter to the unchanging hand of God. Waiting upon the Lord, dwelling confidently that God is in control and nothing can come about without Him allowing it so. Thank you Jesus for your divine protection in my life! Help me to never drift from your mercy and grace so lovingly bestowed upon me. Always lead and guide me down the paths of righteousness for thy names sake. For I am persuaded, that neither death nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall separate me from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord!…

In Psalms 134 it say "Behold, bless ye the Lord all servants of the Lord, which by night stand in the house of the Lord. Lift up your heads the sanctuary, and bless the Lord. The Lord that made heaven and earth bless thee out of Zion." If your going through a storm in your life and the pain and sorrow are overwhelming you . Then you need to spend those dark and midnight times in the presence of the Almighty God, life up your head and wipe the tears away and bless the Lord Christ Jesus. "He is more than enough, He can supply all your needs, He is your El Shaddai, He always looks out for you, He is your Jehovah Jireh!"

The Master Potter

I truly love the Lord that made the heavens and earth, for "He hath made us and not we ourselves", as the Psalmist writes. "My desire is your eternal presence in my life and continual guidance in my steps." It is such a comforting thought that our God loves us so much that He would allow pain, pressure, and even a little brokenness in our lives so that we may be made more perfect in His sight. He sometimes allows a little discomfort and pain for the moment to save us from a world of despair further down the road of life. He truly is the Master Potter that orchestrates every moment of our lives, molding and shaping us into the beautiful and precious vessels that only God can create. Even the most beautiful and precious vessels have to go through the pressures of molding and shaping and even go through the fire before they can be used of the Master Potter

My Daily Devotion

The Psalmist writes in the book of Psalms 34:1-8 I WILL bless the Lord at all times: His praise shall continually be in my mouth. My soul shall make her boast in the Lord: the humble shall hear thereof, and be glad. O Magnify the Lord with me, and let us exalt his name together. I sought the Lord, and he heard me, and delivered me from all my fears. They looked unto him, and were lightened: and their faces were not ashamed. This poor man cried, and the Lord heard him, and saved him out of all his troubles. The angel of the Lord encampeth round about them that fear him, and delivereth them. O taste and see that the Lord is good: blessed is the man that trusteth in the Lord.

Just as the Psalmist has written here, I have tasted and seen that the Lord is good, and His mercy endureth for all time. I WILL daily seek His face, and at all times will I entertain His presence in my life. I refuse to be silent or be still while in the presence of the Almighty God. For He created me for worship and in worship will I overcome every obstacle in my path, for the battle is the Lord's and not mine. Thank you Jesus for all of your wisdom and mercy in my life and continually leading and guiding me throughout every trial and obstacle in my path. For you are truly worthy of all the praise, glory, and honor. Lord this is my daily devotion to you. Amen.

The Unchanging Hand of God

Isaiah 54:7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee. In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the Lord thy Redeemer. For this is as the waters of Noah unto me: for as I have sworn that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth; so have I sworn that I would not be wroth with thee, nor rebuke thee. For the mountains shall part and the hills be removed; but my kindness shall not depart from thee, neither shall the covenant of my peace be removed, saith the Lord that hath mercy on thee.

This scripture was given of the Lord, He opened my eyes while sitting down to write of my great desire to seek His face. The Lord gave this to me as a promise and I give Him all the glory, honor, and praise. Thank you Jesus for your everlasting Love and mercy on my life, and I give all praise to your unchanging hands that mold and shape me into the man of God you want me to be. Amen.

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


Yellow_Number_Five
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Another emotion laden

Another emotion laden anecdote with nothing of substance. You may as well have related a story of a fried who swears BigFoot cured his cancer.

 

Your friend could have just as easily believed in Thor or the Flying Spaghetti Moster or Vishnu in this case. It's false hope, and simply putting off and refusing to deal with reality.

 

Better yet, they could have simply recognized what caused the relationship to fail then stepped back and realized their own personal worth and strength and moved on, without ever having the need to bring the ridiculous into the equation. That's what I did. They could have realized that there was a reason they were in financial difficulty and that if such a thing could strain the relationship, that the relationship wasn't all that strong in the first place.

 

When my last long term relationship ended, I didn't blame myself, I didn't blame her, and I didn't blame god.

 

I simply finally realized that I had faults, and so did the women I had been dating. However, when I realized that the ONLY common theme in ALL my failed relationships was myself, I finally reasoned that there was something I was doing that usually eventually fucked things up - and from what I can tell, that assessment was correct, and it's completely changed the way I approach commitments and personal relationships.

 

God won't get you the girl or fix your finances, YOU WILL or YOU WON'T. God won't free you from regret either - that's something only you can do for yourself.

I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world. - Richard Dawkins

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Reading this makes me so

Reading this makes me so happy I've never been a christian. The mind games you have to play with yourself to thank an imaginary entity for putting you through hell.


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There is no evidence to

There is no evidence to support that which you tells us about ever happened. But let's consider the actual events (not causes or explanations) as legitimate...

A couple of things some Christians don't get (nice and bold for them to grasp the concept)

1. Correlation does NOT imply causation.

It's not a tip, a recommendation, or a hint, cum hoc ergo propter hoc is a LOGICAL FALLACY. In a nutshell: Praying and occurences in the real world have as much connection as sacrificing a goat every friday and raining. (I believe it to be true so it MUST be true!)

It's been tested (quite a few times I think): prayer has no effect on the world WHATSOEVER other than the placebo effect. Which is not really an exclusive effect of prayer, it's a psychological thing.

2. "I believe God was the cause, I know in my heart my personal saviour our LORD Jesus Christ did it!" is NOT evidence. I can just as well claim "But I believe my purple snarfwidget (borrowing concept thank you) is responsible! I know it with all my heart and soul!".

 

I'm usually pissed off at some people's attitudes regarding religion. But to attribute all good in your life to Our Invisible Sky Daddy instead of recongizing the good in other people and/or yourself, or sheer luck at other times, is truly sad.

Christianity denigrates human nature, with this notion that everyone is born dirty, and no good can come from us (only from God), and aaaaaaaaaaall evil in the world is due to our great great great [...] great-grandmother who lived as a naked chick in a garden and took a fruit from a tree because a snake told her to. The fact people believe this shyte without questioning it for 2 seconds is disturbing.


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Isn't it just darling the

Isn't it just darling the way theists in general (and christians in particular) want us to accept these "friend of a friend who knows a friend of mine" type of anecdotes as evidence?

Poor guy can't force any possible employer to change their work schedules to fit little old him? Sounds like most of the christians I know - they want the world to revolve around them.

Sorry, I can't but the propaganda as evidence. Or truth, for that matter.

"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
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JesusLovesYou
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QuadrivialMind

QuadrivialMind wrote:

There is no evidence to support that which you tells us about ever happened. But let's consider the actual events (not causes or explanations) as legitimate...

A couple of things some Christians don't get (nice and bold for them to grasp the concept)

1. Correlation does NOT imply causation.

It's not a tip, a recommendation, or a hint, cum hoc ergo propter hoc is a LOGICAL FALLACY. In a nutshell: Praying and occurences in the real world have as much connection as sacrificing a goat every friday and raining. (I believe it to be true so it MUST be true!)

It's been tested (quite a few times I think): prayer has no effect on the world WHATSOEVER other than the placebo effect. Which is not really an exclusive effect of prayer, it's a psychological thing.

2. "I believe God was the cause, I know in my heart my personal saviour our LORD Jesus Christ did it!" is NOT evidence. I can just as well claim "But I believe my purple snarfwidget (borrowing concept thank you) is responsible! I know it with all my heart and soul!".

 

I'm usually pissed off at some people's attitudes regarding religion. But to attribute all good in your life to Our Invisible Sky Daddy instead of recongizing the good in other people and/or yourself, or sheer luck at other times, is truly sad.

Christianity denigrates human nature, with this notion that everyone is born dirty, and no good can come from us (only from God), and aaaaaaaaaaall evil in the world is due to our great great great [...] great-grandmother who lived as a naked chick in a garden and took a fruit from a tree because a snake told her to. The fact people believe this shyte without questioning it for 2 seconds is disturbing.

you have no concept of the process of time, you have the "microwave mentality" about prayer.

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


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JesusLovesYou wrote: you

JesusLovesYou wrote:
you have no concept of the process of time, you have the "microwave mentality" about prayer.

 You have the "it actually works mentality" about prayer, so I guess we're all even.

Do you get what you prayed for right after you pray? Then God answers prayer!

Do you get what you prayed for some time after you pray? Then God answers prayer, but sometimes he chooses to wait!

Do you never get what you prayed for? Then God heard your prayer but it was not in his plan!

All the possible contingencies are covered! If it happens, it was God's work that you get it, if it doesn't happen, it was God's plan that you didn't get it. It's like praying to the Sun, or Joe Pesci, or a jug of milk. If I pray to Joe Pesci to give me a raise, three things can happen:

I get the raise when I go back to work on Monday. All hail Pesci, who answers prayer!

I get the raise a few months from now. All hail Pesci, who answers prayer but on his own time!

I never get a raise. All hail Pesci, whose plan for my life is more perfect than my own plan! 

Götter sind für Arten, die sich selbst verraten -- in den Glauben flüchten um sich hinzurichten. Menschen brauchen Götter um sich zu verletzen, um sich zu vernichten -- das sind wir.


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JesusLovesYou wrote: you

JesusLovesYou wrote:

you have no concept of the process of time, you have the "microwave mentality" about prayer.

Way to go! You ignored EVERYTHING I said.

"The process of time". Gee! That sounds so scientific and complicated. Let me ask you something. What do YOU know about the process of time? What does the Bible tell you about the process of time? I am quite familiar with the "microwave mentality" but I'd like you to make your own points and explain things yourself, rather than make naked assertions and ignore everything I pointed out. Please educate me about prayer, and BACK IT UP. I expect you to back up this microwave bullshit with the Bible, not the preacher.

Here I have some reminders for ya:

1. Correlation does not imply causation

2. Prayer has been scientifically tested and proven to have no effect on the real world whatsoever, other than the placebo effect.

 

Mkay, I'll be waiting.


JesusLovesYou
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QuadrivialMind

QuadrivialMind wrote:
JesusLovesYou wrote:

you have no concept of the process of time, you have the "microwave mentality" about prayer.

Way to go! You ignored EVERYTHING I said.

"The process of time". Gee! That sounds so scientific and complicated. Let me ask you something. What do YOU know about the process of time? What does the Bible tell you about the process of time? I am quite familiar with the "microwave mentality" but I'd like you to make your own points and explain things yourself, rather than make naked assertions and ignore everything I pointed out. Please educate me about prayer, and BACK IT UP. I expect you to back up this microwave bullshit with the Bible, not the preacher.

Here I have some reminders for ya:

1. Correlation does not imply causation

2. Prayer has been scientifically tested and proven to have no effect on the real world whatsoever, other than the placebo effect.

 

Mkay, I'll be waiting.

first off prayer CANNOT be laboratorily tested. If it could, was this prayer true, in the name of Jesus, shout unto the Lord with a voice of triumph prayer?

Im going to go to the book of Acts chapter 16 for this, accounting for the time when Paul and Silas were imprissoned.

Act 16:22 And the multitude rose up together against them: and the magistrates rent off their clothes, and commanded to beat them.

Act 16:23 And when they had laid many stripes upon them, they cast them into prison, charging the jailor to keep them safely:

Act 16:24 Who, having received such a charge, thrust them into the inner prison, and made their feet fast in the stocks.

Act 16:25 And at midnight Paul and Silas prayed, and sang praises unto God: and the prisoners heard them.

Notice what they did, they sang praises unto God.  The english words, sang praises, is actually the greek word Humneo, which means the singing of a hymn, specifically psalms 113-118, 136.

Now if you read on the next couple verses of Acts 16, you will find that there was a great earthquake and bands were loosed.  Now if you go to that group of psalms:

Psalm 114:7 says: "Tremble, thou earth, at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the God of Jacob."

Psalm 116:16 says: "Oh Lord, truely I am thy servant; I am thy servant and the son of thine handmaid: THOU HAST LOOSED MY BONDS"

Ok getting to the process of time:

Throughout Genesis 1, God speaks everything into existance BUT when God gets to creating man, everything changed, God didn't do it the same way, God was demonstrating a principle to show how He deals with us most of the time. God didn't speak man into existance, God said let us make man, and God created, God FORMED man.  It was a process that took a period of time. We are temporal people serving an eternal God.  You can't force eternity into temporal mind sets.

You don't take a lump of clay and have a finished vessel in an instant. It has to be molded.

This is another reason why prayer can't be laboratory tested, because you cannot pinpoint when a prayer will be answered.  

 

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


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How would you know, that

How would you know, that prayers answered are fromYOUR god, and not some other god going "Fine, I'll help if you shut up!" ?

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Ophios wrote: How would you

Ophios wrote:
How would you know, that prayers answered are fromYOUR god, and not some other god going "Fine, I'll help if you shut up!" ?

 

perhaps Satan is answering the prayers as part of his devious plan.  we can't prove that isn't the case. 

“The greatest tragedy in mankind's entire history may be the hijacking of morality by religion.”

“It may be that our role on this planet is not to worship God, but to create him.”

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JesusLovesYou wrote: first

JesusLovesYou wrote:

first off prayer CANNOT be laboratorily tested. If it could, was this prayer true, in the name of Jesus, shout unto the Lord with a voice of triumph prayer?

Oh, does the Bible say prayer can't be tested too? How did you arrive to that conclusion? Or is it that when science is observing God refuses to act? Shout unto the Lord? What? I don't hear people doing what you described in Churches, yet I'm pretty convinced they are praying...

JesusLovesYou wrote:

Ok getting to the process of time:

Throughout Genesis 1, God speaks everything into existance BUT when God gets to creating man, everything changed, God didn't do it the same way, God was demonstrating a principle to show how He deals with us most of the time. God didn't speak man into existance, God said let us make man, and God created, God FORMED man. It was a process that took a period of time. We are temporal people serving an eternal God. You can't force eternity into temporal mind sets.

How do you back up that "God was demonstrating a principle to show how He deals with us most of the time"? Does the Bible say that? Can you please show me where?

You still talk about this crazy notion that God is somehow "late" in "answering" our prayers because he's outside time or something... completely naked assertions! Even if they were somehow proven to be true (I'd like you to try, God clearly speaks to people in the OT), why would a timeless being have problems answering our prayers? He is an omnimax PERFECT being.

JesusLovesYou wrote:

You don't take a lump of clay and have a finished vessel in an instant. It has to be molded.

You don't have to mold anything if you're God. God can take a lump of clay and turn it into a particle accelerator if he wills so.

JesusLovesYou wrote:

This is another reason why prayer can't be laboratory tested, because you cannot pinpoint when a prayer will be answered.

If you test it on dying patients, you'll know that when they die, what you ask for hasn't been given, and the prayer has been ineffective.


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QuadrivialMind wrote: You

QuadrivialMind wrote:

You don't have to mold anything if you're God. God can take a lump of clay and turn it into a particle accelerator if he wills so.

 Ok, I say again.  In Genesis 1, you find with each step of creation God speaking things into existance, until it came to man, where God molded, created man.  Man was not instantly spoke into existance, man was molded.  You cannot say GOD IS X, SO IN TURN X MUST HAPPEN. I forget the exact scripture where it says this, or the exact wording, but it states "no man can know the mind of God".  God does not have to fit a man made omni-whatever definition.

Quote:

If you test it on dying patients, you'll know that when they die, what you ask for hasn't been given, and the prayer has been ineffective.

test on dying patients? my friend, let me remind you of something, or perhaps maybe this is the first time you will see this:

Mat 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Mat 4:7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

what you are trying to do in your "experiment" my friend, is trying to tempt God.from what i read, you have only tested/experienced "silent prayer".  In the Bible, my friend, what about prayer was silent?  Biblically praise usually accompaines prayer, and if you break down the hebrew and greek definitions of praise you get words such as dance, shout, lifting of hands, etc.

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


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QuadrivialMind wrote:

[MOD EDIT -duplicate post deleted]


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JesusLovesYou

JesusLovesYou wrote:

QuadrivialMind wrote:

You don't have to mold anything if you're God. God can take a lump of clay and turn it into a particle accelerator if he wills so.

 Ok, I say again.  In Genesis 1, you find with each step of creation God speaking things into existance, until it came to man, where God molded, created man.  Man was not instantly spoke into existance, man was molded.  You cannot say GOD IS X, SO IN TURN X MUST HAPPEN. I forget the exact scripture where it says this, or the exact wording, but it states "no man can know the mind of God".  God does not have to fit a man made omni-whatever definition.

Quote:

If you test it on dying patients, you'll know that when they die, what you ask for hasn't been given, and the prayer has been ineffective.

test on dying patients? my friend, let me remind you of something, or perhaps maybe this is the first time you will see this:

Mat 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Mat 4:7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

what you are trying to do in your "experiment" my friend, is trying to tempt God.from what i read, you have only tested/experienced "silent prayer".  In the Bible, my friend, what about prayer was silent?  Biblically praise usually accompaines prayer, and if you break down the hebrew and greek definitions of praise you get words such as dance, shout, lifting of hands, etc.

Well, it seems that the ancient Jews were extremely intelligent, yet very unscientifical, thinking such defenisve mechanisms for their beliefs. When God wants, miracles happen. When humans want to see them, and they prey for them, they are merely tempting God. Good logic.

JesusLovesYou, let me tell you just what I think about your Genesis: Day 3: God creates grass, plants that do seeds, etc. And it was evening and then morning. Day 4: God creates the two big lights in the sky: the Sun, and the Moon (the moon has no light of its own). How was there evening and morning, without Sun? How did the plants do their photosynthesis without the light the Sun gives them? I guess these will just remain good questions.

About your funky definition of non-silent prayer, JesusLovesYou, I would only like to remind you of the passage from Matthew 6:7.

(note to self: stop laughing at hypocrites, it's bad for health)

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January 7 - fiance walks

January 7 - fiance walks out

January 12 - "He has completely healed me from the pain and sorrow."

Either the gal just wasn't worth it or your friend didn't love her in the first place. Just five days and he's over it? This was the love of his life? If you say "goddidit" - just think, your friend will be in great shape if he has loved ones pass away. Give him five days and he'll be good as new.

Quote:
he cannot hold a job for the life of him because nobody will allow him to work in his church schedule with a full time job

"Cannot hold a job" - sounds like he keeps getting fired?

Nobody will ALLOW him to work in his church schedule?

If he is, in fact, getting jobs, he's apparently not being up front with the new employer about when he will grace the new employer with his presence. (Or perhaps he's getting caught doing church stuff during working hours?) Your friend might have an attendance problem.

I would suspect that his employers have been up front about how many hours he is expected to work and when he is expected to work.

Most folks don't get fired these days on a whim. There is usually a warning or two prior to being let go.

Since he obviously feels a need to spend so much time on religious activities, it's time he took matters into his own hands and finds something he can do on his own schedule.

An employer has every right to expect a prerequisite amount of time, attendance and the employee getting the job done. Most employers also dictate working hours as they have the right to do.

His fiance left him AND the church and he can't hold a job. That speaks volumes.

Not a very impressive "testimony" because if your friend wasn't a hard-core theist, he'd have a job and he'd be getting married next week to the love of his life.

 

 

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JesusLovesYou wrote: Ok,

JesusLovesYou wrote:

Ok, I say again. In Genesis 1, you find with each step of creation God speaking things into existance, until it came to man, where God molded, created man. Man was not instantly spoke into existance, man was molded.

And? Is there any difference? Why, and where does it say so?

JesusLovesYou wrote:

You cannot say GOD IS X, SO IN TURN X MUST HAPPEN. I forget the exact scripture where it says this, or the exact wording, but it states "no man can know the mind of God". God does not have to fit a man made omni-whatever definition.

Then stop defining him. Don't claim your daddy is all-knowing, all-powerful, all-loving and just, and then when I point out the consequences of that you go "Oh but no no no we can't know God!". That's bullshit, either you know him or you don't. I'm not discussing his mind, I'm discussing his nature. Right, because when you can't explain something, "God works in mysterious ways!" which means "stop using your brain". No special pleads please. If you claim you don't know him, how can you worship something you don't know? Maybe he's evil.

JesusLovesYou wrote:

test on dying patients?

what you are trying to do in your "experiment" my friend, is trying to tempt God.from what i read, you have only tested/experienced "silent prayer". In the Bible, my friend, what about prayer was silent? Biblically praise usually accompaines prayer, and if you break down the hebrew and greek definitions of praise you get words such as dance, shout, lifting of hands, etc.

I'm not trying to tempt something that doesn't exist. About silent prayer: Are you saying silent prayer doesn't work? If it doesn't work, then why do millions pray silently? If it works, then why can't it be tested?

You still fail to address the following issues:

- The notion God was making a point when he molded us. Evidence, please.

- The notion God is somehow outside time, yet in the OT he is not.

- The justification for the supposed "late" answered prayers regarding an omnimax being.

- Scientists have found prayer has no effect on the real world.

- The idea that maybe other deities "answer" your prayers. What about a demon, or Satan? Maybe he's your best friend.

- The idea God would give a shit about your insignificant life while entire contines like Africa go down in flames without divine help.