Feds vs. Trolls

Beyond Saving
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Feds vs. Trolls

 reason.com/blog/2015/06/19/government-stifles-speech

The government subpoenas Reason.com for information on six of their commenters, then rushes to get a gag order in a failed attempt to prevent Reason from notifying the commenters that their information was being subpoenad, perhaps giving them a chance to get a lawyer and object. The comments at issue are your basic internet troll fare "Its judges like these that should be taken out back and shot." "Why waste ammunition? Wood chippers get the message across clearly" "I hope there is a special place in hell reserved for that horrible woman." etc. I doubt a single one of us hasn't had something along those lines said to us over the internet at some point. Why in the hell is our government wasting money pursuing trolls? Probably for the same reason that a man got a life sentence for making a website that arguably reduced violent crime. 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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This is bullshit. I hope

This is bullshit. I hope someone blows up Washington DC, with all three braches of government present. Yeah, I said it. Fuck you NSA, fascist fucks.

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Trying to control the

Trying to control the Internet............that always ends well.

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


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Vastet wrote:This is

Vastet wrote:
This is bullshit. I hope someone blows up Washington DC, with all three braches of government present. Yeah, I said it. Fuck you NSA, fascist fucks.

Oh yes wonderful government. The same group you believe should provide my healthcare, pension, personal security, etc... DIY is irrational.

Maybe now they can provide you with long term living arrangements with wonderful roomates.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


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The government would do a

The government would do a better job with healthcare than private business, as the US has proven by doing it privately for decades and having the worst system in the entire first world. It even sucks more than some third world nations, which is really sad.

No private business can provide security with less bias than a government either. No private business will give you a pension for working for someone else.

You're a fucking idiot. Just because the US government has too much power does not mean your anarchy wet dream would do better. It would be MUCH worse if you got your way.

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Beyond Saving

Beyond Saving wrote:

 reason.com/blog/2015/06/19/government-stifles-speech

The government subpoenas Reason.com for information on six of their commenters, then rushes to get a gag order in a failed attempt to prevent Reason from notifying the commenters that their information was being subpoenad, perhaps giving them a chance to get a lawyer and object. The comments at issue are your basic internet troll fare "Its judges like these that should be taken out back and shot." "Why waste ammunition? Wood chippers get the message across clearly" "I hope there is a special place in hell reserved for that horrible woman." etc. I doubt a single one of us hasn't had something along those lines said to us over the internet at some point. Why in the hell is our government wasting money pursuing trolls? Probably for the same reason that a man got a life sentence for making a website that arguably reduced violent crime. 

They need to focus on the real shits who post crap online then go shoot up churches and schools. So many of these kids today post their crap online before they do it... That's what they should be investigating.


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Vastet wrote: Just because

Vastet wrote:
Just because the US government has too much power does not mean your anarchy wet dream would do better. It would be MUCH worse if you got your way.

You are making the strawman. I don't believe in anarchy. How you can think that someone that believes that government should have the power to mandate birth control is an anarchist?

What I don't believe in is government by the elites. I don't believe in having one class of people that are politicians that decide the laws, everyone should decide equally.

I don't believe in having one class of people that can enforce the laws, everyone should be able to enforce the laws.

I'm anti-elitist, not anti-government.

The reason we have government spying on web sites is because the elites in the government are afraid of the masses getting too much power and them loosing their privledge.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


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EXC wrote:Vastet wrote: Just

EXC wrote:

Vastet wrote:
Just because the US government has too much power does not mean your anarchy wet dream would do better. It would be MUCH worse if you got your way.

You are making the strawman. I don't believe in anarchy. How you can think that someone that believes that government should have the power to mandate birth control is an anarchist?

You never once presented that as your belief. You've presented it as an argument against government. If you've changed your position, ok then.

EXC wrote:

What I don't believe in is government by the elites. I don't believe in having one class of people that are politicians that decide the laws, everyone should decide equally.

We had that, and it became what we have now. Obviously equal representation isn't the answer. It decays and stagnates.

EXC wrote:

I don't believe in having one class of people that can enforce the laws, everyone should be able to enforce the laws.

I'm anti-elitist, not anti-government.

The reason we have government spying on web sites is because the elites in the government are afraid of the masses getting too much power and them loosing their privledge.

The reason we have government fucking things up is because uneducated idiots that let themselves be swayed by idiotic statements are doing most of the voting, and have been for decades. What we need is a basic requirement of education and experience to have the right to vote. And to give everyone an equal shot at that right, education must be free.

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Vastet wrote:You never once

Vastet wrote:

You never once presented that as your belief. You've presented it as an argument against government. If you've changed your position, ok then.

I think I have, but let me be clear. I want there to be a rational social contract(yes, I'm a socialist, not a libertarian or right wing nut). This means individuals are forced to do and not do certain things(obey laws, pay for all services they receive) for the good of society at large.

But for some reason, mandatory family planning just can't be part of the social contract(except in China). Without this, any attempts by government to reduce poverty, crime, pollution, global warming, etc... are doomed to end in failure. So I think you are in fact the anarchist for being a total libertarian in this area. You only want a social contract if it means you get free stuff at others expense, but no social responsibility to go along with this.  I'd rather have no social contract at all if family planning is not part of the deal.

Also I don't believe we need any politicians, public sevices or public employees. Everyone can be a member of the board of directors that hires and fires managers and employees. And everyone pays for the services they use. The reason we have taxes instead of user fees is to subsidize the politically connected and the government beuracracy at others expense.

You got it? So if you argue against me, argue against this.

 

Vastet wrote:

The reason we have government fucking things up is because uneducated idiots that let themselves be swayed by idiotic statements are doing most of the voting, and have been for decades. What we need is a basic requirement of education and experience to have the right to vote. And to give everyone an equal shot at that right, education must be free.

 

The problem is we live in a highly competitive society(thank you overpopulation and uncontrolled immigration). So people will inevietably use government as a tool to gain a competive advantage(including politicians). They'll always vote themselves free stuff at everyone else's expense left and right wing. 

The teachers that teach these classes will of course bias the students in favor of teachers getting generous benefits at taxpayers expense(a leftist agenda) and the importance of teachers being on the public dole with tenure. Things are not going to change until we cultivate a DIY/think for yourself mindset in children. So people realize they don't need teachers or the government to learn.

Only people with a childish mindset think they need government to be their provider daddy.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


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EXC wrote:But for some

EXC wrote:
But for some reason, mandatory family planning just can't be part of the social contract(except in China). Without this, any attempts by government to reduce poverty, crime, pollution, global warming, etc... are doomed to end in failure. So I think you are in fact the anarchist for being a total libertarian in this area. You only want a social contract if it means you get free stuff at others expense, but no social responsibility to go along with this.  I'd rather have no social contract at all if family planning is not part of the deal.

That's a gross misrepresentation. You show me a highly educated society with uncontrolled population growth and I'll back you on government intervention regarding family planning. As of this moment, all evidence exclusively states that an educated population of unsustainable size doesn't grow, it shrinks.

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Vastet wrote:EXC wrote:But

Vastet wrote:
EXC wrote:
But for some reason, mandatory family planning just can't be part of the social contract(except in China). Without this, any attempts by government to reduce poverty, crime, pollution, global warming, etc... are doomed to end in failure. So I think you are in fact the anarchist for being a total libertarian in this area. You only want a social contract if it means you get free stuff at others expense, but no social responsibility to go along with this.  I'd rather have no social contract at all if family planning is not part of the deal.
That's a gross misrepresentation. You show me a highly educated society with uncontrolled population growth and I'll back you on government intervention regarding family planning. As of this moment, all evidence exclusively states that an educated population of unsustainable size doesn't grow, it shrinks.

Again, you are confusing cause and effect. You don't get to the point of being an educated and affluent society unless you first get a low birthrate. The cart can't come before the horse.

The main problem in USA and Europe these days is not the overall birth rate, but too much immigration and too many people that are not capbable of being parents having children.The elites in both parties want cheap slave labor and an ignorate electorate. So they allow all kinds of immigration to keep the wages down and the elites in power.

All I want is cut off immigration to keep wages up and population preasure down. And to stop some people that are incabable from taking care of children from having any more. But appaerntly this is too much to ask of the governent, so fuck them all.

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


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EXC wrote:Again, you are

EXC wrote:
Again, you are confusing cause and effect.

Again you deny the painfully obvious and proven reality.

EXC wrote:
You don't get to the point of being an educated and affluent society unless you first get a low birthrate.

Bullshit. If that were true you could provide data to back you up. But you can't, because it's bullshit.

EXC wrote:
The cart can't come before the horse.

Says the guy putting the cart before the horse.

EXC wrote:
The main problem in USA and Europe these days is not the overall birth rate, but too much immigration and too many people that are not capbable of being parents having children.The elites in both parties want cheap slave labor and an ignorate electorate. So they allow all kinds of immigration to keep the wages down and the elites in power.

The main problem in the US is that you sent the majority of skilled labour overseas, and your education system has deteriorated to shit in the process, and now you need immigrants to run things you no longer are capable of running yourselves. Fix education first, rebuild your industry second. The US doesn't have a significant immigration problem, it shouldn't even be on the top ten priority list.
Europe will take care of itself. Not your problem.

EXC wrote:
All I want is cut off immigration to keep wages up and population preasure down. And to stop some people that are incabable from taking care of children from having any more. But appaerntly this is too much to ask of the governent, so fuck them all.

As I said, improve your education system and you won't need to import skilled labour. Americans are too stupid to do the big jobs now. Cutting immigration will simply reduce quality of life and increase costs simultaneously.

And installing a bureaucracy to control sex is just pissing money away that could be better used for almost anything else. There's no way in hell such a bureaucracy could be effective anyway. What are you going to do when girls don't reveal they're pregnant until a baby pops out? Kill babies by the millions? Lock up an even greater percentage of the population than you already do? Isn't it enough that the US has more criminals per capita than any other nation on Earth right now?

Proud Canadian, Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.