I wish I had not been so scared of science in highschool.

Brian37
atheistSuperfan
Brian37's picture
Posts: 15607
Joined: 2006-02-14
User is offlineOffline
I wish I had not been so scared of science in highschool.

 Having been bullied, being uber sensitive, dorky, pimple faced and caring too much about fitting in, I didn't do well in math and science in highschool. I think our society really still can't grasp the importance of knowing that kids process information differently. Some respond well to the pressures of being graded, while, like me, were negitively impacted by that.

Anyway, last night I got bord with all the bad news and junk TV, watched some NDT(Neil Degrees Tyson) videos on science, and said "fuck it, I am going to look up a periodic table and see if I can figure it out". With the help of Bob Spence, I did just that, and holy crap, it was alot easier than what had scared me in high school.

I can now calculate the number of neutrons in an atom, I know what the atomic weight is, and what isotops are. I also know the difference between a covalent bond and ionic bond. 

Yea I know, basic 8th grader should know. No that does not make me a full fleged chemist, but most certainly I am not intimidated by it anymore. I think most of learning is to look at it like a language you are learning. Words are placecards for parts of something, just like they are for a car.

No you do not have to know how to build a car to understand the basics of how it works. I am just really happy and thankful to Bob for doing in one night I couldn't figure out as a teen. Thank you Bob, you really should know how much that means to me. 

 

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


digitalbeachbum
atheistRational VIP!
digitalbeachbum's picture
Posts: 4889
Joined: 2007-10-15
User is offlineOffline
I didn't learn chemistry

I didn't learn chemistry until high school, around 17 years. My daughter is in the 2nd grade and already knows that hydrogren is the most common element in the Universe.


Brian37
atheistSuperfan
Brian37's picture
Posts: 15607
Joined: 2006-02-14
User is offlineOffline
digitalbeachbum wrote:I

digitalbeachbum wrote:

I didn't learn chemistry until high school, around 17 years. My daughter is in the 2nd grade and already knows that hydrogren is the most common element in the Universe.

It makes me feel really stupid. It is like I couldn't even do well on an old Atari and see 5 year olds play X box games today.

But still, I am so glad I got over that fear, and I think I did it because I wasn't under any pressure, pluss Bob is a friend and not an athoritarian like a teacher so I was able to stop him when I was confused and ask qustions to clarify. 

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


digitalbeachbum
atheistRational VIP!
digitalbeachbum's picture
Posts: 4889
Joined: 2007-10-15
User is offlineOffline
Brian37

Brian37 wrote:

digitalbeachbum wrote:

I didn't learn chemistry until high school, around 17 years. My daughter is in the 2nd grade and already knows that hydrogren is the most common element in the Universe.

It makes me feel really stupid. It is like I couldn't even do well on an old Atari and see 5 year olds play X box games today.

But still, I am so glad I got over that fear, and I think I did it because I wasn't under any pressure, pluss Bob is a friend and not an athoritarian like a teacher so I was able to stop him when I was confused and ask qustions to clarify. 

 

Every one has a point and time when their mind is filled with clarity or muddle.


Brian37
atheistSuperfan
Brian37's picture
Posts: 15607
Joined: 2006-02-14
User is offlineOffline
digitalbeachbum

digitalbeachbum wrote:

Brian37 wrote:

digitalbeachbum wrote:

I didn't learn chemistry until high school, around 17 years. My daughter is in the 2nd grade and already knows that hydrogren is the most common element in the Universe.

It makes me feel really stupid. It is like I couldn't even do well on an old Atari and see 5 year olds play X box games today.

But still, I am so glad I got over that fear, and I think I did it because I wasn't under any pressure, pluss Bob is a friend and not an athoritarian like a teacher so I was able to stop him when I was confused and ask qustions to clarify. 

 

Every one has a point and time when their mind is filled with clarity or muddle.

It really is a big deal for me emotionally. I spent far too much time as a kid worrying about what others think I should do or how I should do it and never understood myself at that age to the point of knowing that it is ok to be different and that it simply amounted to environment and processing information differently. Since last night I have had a couple of moments of crying because I finally understood something I thought I never would understand.

I knew the molecules of DNA prior, but now those things have more clarity because I know the parts of the car. It is an awesome feeling.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


Vastet
atheistBloggerHigh Level ModeratorSuperfan
Vastet's picture
Posts: 13070
Joined: 2006-12-25
User is offlineOffline
I wouldn't worry about it to

I wouldn't worry about it to be honest. Unless someone uses the knowledge gained in school fairly regularly, they forget it pretty quickly. I'd bet at least half the kids who memorised the periodic table would fail a test on it 5 years after getting out of school.

Proud Canadian, Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.


Brian37
atheistSuperfan
Brian37's picture
Posts: 15607
Joined: 2006-02-14
User is offlineOffline
Vastet wrote:I wouldn't

Vastet wrote:
I wouldn't worry about it to be honest. Unless someone uses the knowledge gained in school fairly regularly, they forget it pretty quickly. I'd bet at least half the kids who memorised the periodic table would fail a test on it 5 years after getting out of school.

I get that part, I don't remember even most of whatwa I learned in college, but science however was the one thing I really was jealous others picked up quickly. I am just thrilled that one of those things that wanted to understand I finally do understand.

It still teaches you time management, deadlines, and research, and even working with others depending on the assignement. Plus you get exposed to more of the world because of subject matter and or the diverse people who come to that college.

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


Beyond Saving
atheist
Beyond Saving's picture
Posts: 5408
Joined: 2007-10-12
User is offlineOffline
 Now if we can just get you

 Now if we can just get you to learn a little about economics. 


iwbiek
atheistSuperfan
iwbiek's picture
Posts: 4196
Joined: 2008-03-23
User is offlineOffline
Beyond Saving wrote: Now if

Beyond Saving wrote:

 Now if we can just get you to learn a little about economics. 




i was going to add philosophy and religious studies, but bob doesn't approve of those disciplines. still, one should know at least a little something about a topic one insists on continuously discussing....

"I have never felt comfortable around people who talk about their feelings for Jesus, or any other deity for that matter, because they are usually none too bright. . . . Or maybe 'stupid' is a better way of saying it; but I have never seen much point in getting heavy with either stupid people or Jesus freaks, just as long as they don't bother me. In a world as weird and cruel as this one we have made for ourselves, I figure anybody who can find peace and personal happiness without ripping off somebody else deserves to be left alone. They will not inherit the earth, but then neither will I. . . . And I have learned to live, as it were, with the idea that I will never find peace and happiness, either. But as long as I know there's a pretty good chance I can get my hands on either one of them every once in a while, I do the best I can between high spots."
--Hunter S. Thompson


Brian37
atheistSuperfan
Brian37's picture
Posts: 15607
Joined: 2006-02-14
User is offlineOffline
Beyond Saving wrote: Now if

Beyond Saving wrote:

 Now if we can just get you to learn a little about economics. 

Your numbers work FOR YOU, not for more people. You are not the job creator as a business owner. Demand creates jobs and the bulk of the buying public are the WORKERS. More money in their pockets, more demand, more demand more workers needed. 

You want less people unempolyed, you want less employed people on food stamps? The big busines has to pay bettser without raising prices. Whatever they lose in a pay raise for workers they will make up from more demand.

Tax breaks for the rich only make them rich, and what they do not pay the rest of us have to make up for.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


Beyond Saving
atheist
Beyond Saving's picture
Posts: 5408
Joined: 2007-10-12
User is offlineOffline
Brian37 wrote:Beyond Saving

Brian37 wrote:

Beyond Saving wrote:

 Now if we can just get you to learn a little about economics. 

Your numbers work FOR YOU, not for more people.

The great thing about numbers is that they are universal. Even more universal than language. 1+1=2 whether you want it to or not, whether you deny it or not, whether you know it or not. 

 

Brian37 wrote:

You are not the job creator as a business owner.

Really? Who is paying the salaries? If it isn't me, then I must have a shitload of money I misplaced and when I find it, I'm headed to VEGAS BABY! A job is nothing more than demand for a type of labor. 

 

Brian37 wrote:

Demand creates jobs and the bulk of the buying public are the WORKERS.

The buying public creates demand for a product or service. Many businesses (most when starting out) consist of a single person fulfilling part of that demand. It is when that person decides they don't want to or can't do a particular part of the work that THEY have demand for someone else to do it. The end user doesn't give a shit if the product was made by one person or a million people, just like you didn't stop to think how many people worked to mislabel that pork. If one person personally raised the pig, slaughtered it, butchered it, carried it to the store and mislabeled it, you would neither know nor care. YOU created demand for pork (well actually probably just meat in general, if you saw a better deal on say beef you probably would have bought that instead) you neither knew nor cared how many employees got jobs to provide it to you. If the grocer raised his own hogs and slaughtered them out back, it wouldn't have changed your purchasing decision.

 

Brian37 wrote:
  

More money in their pockets, more demand, more demand more workers needed. 

A very simplistic approach to a complex economic system, and one that was thouroughly debunked by the failure of GW Bush. That was his theory, hence the tax rebates, low interest rates and stimulus pushed by GW, which has obviously not resulted in a thriving demand. The amount of demand is not solely determined by the amount of money in your pocket. Nor is there a such thing as a vague "demand". Demand is for something specific, eg "I'm hungry I want food". The amount of money in your pocket merely determines how much you are willing to satisfy your demands. "I won the lottery and am hungry, lets try some caviar on a whale bone spoon" or "I only have $5 in my pocket and I'm hungry, Ramen isn't so bad if you cook it right..." Swings in an economy usually occur because demand drops (or was overestimated all along) in a particular industry- most recently housing- so workers who were skilled in that industry and supporting industries have to move to different jobs to satisfy different demands. There is always demand, the question is simply WHAT do people demand. The problem is that often the consumers themselves don't really know what they want (such as you in the meat section didn't know you wanted pork until you saw the deal). The person who can identify and satisfy demands will make money, the one who identifies incorrectly loses money.  

 

Quote:

You want less people unempolyed, you want less employed people on food stamps?

I don't particularly concern myself with unemployment numbers. I want the number of employees I determine I need for my business, what other people choose to do is their business. I can't grasp the concept of being unemployed. I've been without an employer many times in my life, but I have never had a situation where I was unable to find someone willing to pay me for a product or service. A week or two of not having anything else to do is a really long time to find customers. 

 

Quote:

The big busines has to pay bettser without raising prices.

Where are they going to get the money? Businesses don't print money you know, only government does that. If expenses rise, the money has to come from somewhere. Walmart, for example, had $16 billion in net profits last year. If they distributed that equally to their 2.2 million employees, that would be $727 per employee. Of course, that means that they would have $0, which means no investors are going to be interested (why would you invest for $0 return?) and the company will be unable to borrow money, build new Walmarts or even renovate old Walmarts. In short, the company would go the way of Kmart pretty quick. 

And yes, CEO's make a lot, but if you divide their pay into the other employees and pay them $0.00, the other employees get a few pennies a year. Rarely do large corporate CEO's take a sizable percentage of the companies overall salary. Small businesses like me take a much larger percentage, because I can't live on $1 per employee- I don't have that many employees. The CEO of Walmart for example, makes roughly $1.59 per employee per year. So while paying him nothing and distributing it equally among the workers might make you feel all moral, it makes no difference to the employees themselves. Even a Walmart employee would probably recover if they lost $2 in the laundry.  

Go ahead, do the math. It isn't so different from the periodic table. Pretend you owned Walmart and tell me how much of a raise you would give your employees and explain where the money would come from. 

 

Quote:

Whatever they lose in a pay raise for workers they will make up from more demand.

Only if those employees turn around and put their pay raise right back into your company, which most won't. Whatever your company is, there is only so much any person wants to buy from you, and since the vast majority of businesses offer discounts of their products to employees, you are not making any profit even if the employees do spend their extra money in your establishment. 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


Old Seer
Theist
Posts: 1520
Joined: 2011-11-12
User is offlineOffline
over time aptitudes change

With age comes  better ability to understand and learning becomes easier. Um-m, , ,  now I have to look up what aptitude means so I know what da ell I'm talking about.

The only possible thing the world needs saving from are those running it.

https://sites.google.com/site/oldseers

Knowledge trumps faith

Lies are nothing more then falsehoods searching for the truth


Vastet
atheistBloggerHigh Level ModeratorSuperfan
Vastet's picture
Posts: 13070
Joined: 2006-12-25
User is offlineOffline
It really pains me to see

It really pains me to see people call themselves socialists and not have a clue how the system works. It means they don't have a clue how much would change if socialism were broadly instituted. I'm very much a socialist, and it's quite ironic that whenever Beyond and Brian argue, 99% of the time I agree with Beyond. The remaining 1% of the time I disagree with both of them. sigh

Proud Canadian, Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.