The "omnis"

RobbyPants
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The "omnis"

The standard idea most Christians (actually, most members of the Abrahamic religions) posit a god that is omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, and omnibenevolent. Where do these notions come from? Is this actually biblically supported, or is this just some bit of assumed theology tacked on after the fact? There are plenty of examples in the Bible of God appearing not to have these qualities, so it seems like cherry picking to ignore them, unless maybe you claim God was sandbagging, or something.

 

 

Omnipotent: There is the explicit mention in Judges that says he couldn't defeat an army with iron chariots (although, I've heard defenses that this is a translation issue). There is him not being able to find Adam and Eve in the garden. Also, there's the whole notion of Christ's "sacrifice"; either it was completely unnecessary, or God has some weird limit to his power where he is unable to forgive people without some sort of sacrifice happening.

Omniscient:  Again, looking for Adam and Eve and not finding them. Presumably any time he becomes angry with his followers. If he could see the future, it seems insane to get angry at the time the event comes to pass. Also, it would have been wholly preventable.

Omnipresent:  Yet again, looking for Adam and Eve in the garden; he would have been there and seen them. Also, the rules in Leviticus demanding people move waste out of the camp, because the Lord walks among them. Doesn't he also walk outside of the camp too? I guess he's not everywhere at once.

Omnibenevolent:  Too many to count. You can try to redefine the word in creepy ways that involve going out of your way to drown children, but come on. We might as well redefine "omnibenevolent" to mean "pepperoni pizza" for all sense that makes.

 

 

So, is there any actual biblical support for this view at all?


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RobbyPants wrote:The

RobbyPants wrote:

The standard idea most Christians (actually, most members of the Abrahamic religions) posit a god that is omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, and omnibenevolent. Where do these notions come from? Is this actually biblically supported, or is this just some bit of assumed theology tacked on after the fact? There are plenty of examples in the Bible of God appearing not to have these qualities, so it seems like cherry picking to ignore them, unless maybe you claim God was sandbagging, or something.

 

 

Omnipotent: There is the explicit mention in Judges that says he couldn't defeat an army with iron chariots (although, I've heard defenses that this is a translation issue). There is him not being able to find Adam and Eve in the garden. Also, there's the whole notion of Christ's "sacrifice"; either it was completely unnecessary, or God has some weird limit to his power where he is unable to forgive people without some sort of sacrifice happening.

Omniscient:  Again, looking for Adam and Eve and not finding them. Presumably any time he becomes angry with his followers. If he could see the future, it seems insane to get angry at the time the event comes to pass. Also, it would have been wholly preventable.

Omnipresent:  Yet again, looking for Adam and Eve in the garden; he would have been there and seen them. Also, the rules in Leviticus demanding people move waste out of the camp, because the Lord walks among them. Doesn't he also walk outside of the camp too? I guess he's not everywhere at once.

Omnibenevolent:  Too many to count. You can try to redefine the word in creepy ways that involve going out of your way to drown children, but come on. We might as well redefine "omnibenevolent" to mean "pepperoni pizza" for all sense that makes.

 

 

So, is there any actual biblical support for this view at all?

 

I cant address the history the word usage, as much as I can the evolutionary psychology such myths persist. They simply are a anthropomorphic drive to continue. Evolution drives us to continue, our myths are simply ignorant reflections of our own desires. Resources are what life is all about, the more you have the more opportunity you have to make offspring.

 

They are a reflection of our ego, in ignorant comic book fictional forum. If evolution didn't have the element of self preservation, it wouldn't occur at all. The "omni" concepts are merely born out of human ignorance.

 

It is a reflection of our own narcissism.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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EXC
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It's all marketing. When

It's all marketing. When Judaism and the Christianity came along they had to compete with the established religions of the day. So upselling your god as Omni everything is better for business. Who wants just a sun god when you can have it all?

Then when Mormonism comes along, just having an Omni god as your buddy wasn't good enough. You actually get to become an omni god.

Same as any other business, any new product must be improved over the old ones. No different with Bullshit as the product.

 

Taxation is the price we pay for failing to build a civilized society. The higher the tax level, the greater the failure. A centrally planned totalitarian state represents a complete defeat for the civilized world, while a totally voluntary society represents its ultimate success. --Mark Skousen


Brian37
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EXC wrote:It's all

EXC wrote:

It's all marketing. When Judaism and the Christianity came along they had to compete with the established religions of the day. So upselling your god as Omni everything is better for business. Who wants just a sun god when you can have it all?

Then when Mormonism comes along, just having an Omni god as your buddy wasn't good enough. You actually get to become an omni god.

Same as any other business, any new product must be improved over the old ones. No different with Bullshit as the product.

 

 

You got it. I've given my Coke vs Pepsi argument out before.

 

Coke comes out with a cherry soda. The execs at Pepsi look at it and say "damn, they are beating us with that, we got to come up with our own version"

 

Saying that any religion is original is like claiming Coke was the first beverage since it's can is Red.

 

Religion, even Buddhism and Taoism like the rest, survive, not because they invented biological evolution, or psychology. They all survive through marketing and superstition and ignorance. Present an ignorant person with a utopia, you have a minion for life.

 

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


Brian37
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What lead the name Yahweh,

What lead the name Yahweh, viewed as the storm God of the polytheist Canaanites to become the monotheistic God of the OT? Time, and political rivalry amongst the Canaanite tribes. Maybe even disaster and disease,. There must have been so much  division and fighting over resources to the point that the Yahwehists simply were able to collect enough resources and power to dominate the other tribes. Then after they won, they decided to create one god, so that there would be less division.

The splinter cult of Christianity took the "underdog" approach, very slowly and it was not only a rejection of Jews, but also the Roman Empire.

 

 

 

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
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Atheistextremist
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Hi Robby

 

I think the contradictions and impossibilities of the omni characteristics of god provide a clear sign that 'god' exists solely within the template of human language. Humans simply ascribe more or less real things - feelings; coincidental, beneficial or unexpected events, as well as mysteries; as being the precinct of a label that has no coherent definition. 'God' has no comprehensible characteristics that are not anthropomorphic or terrestrial, and no transcendent qualities that are not inconceivable, irrational and illogical human inventions. 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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Atheistextremist wrote: I

Atheistextremist wrote:

 

I think the contradictions and impossibilities of the omni characteristics of god provide a clear sign that 'god' exists solely within the template of human language. Humans simply ascribe more or less real things - feelings; coincidental, beneficial or unexpected events, as well as mysteries; as being the precinct of a label that has no coherent definition. 'God' has no comprehensible characteristics that are not anthropomorphic or terrestrial, and no transcendent qualities that are not inconceivable, irrational and illogical human inventions. 

 

All that fancy description to describe gap filling based on human ignorance. Hitchens would be proud of you.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


harleysportster
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Atheistextremist wrote: I

Atheistextremist wrote:

 

I think the contradictions and impossibilities of the omni characteristics of god provide a clear sign that 'god' exists solely within the template of human language. Humans simply ascribe more or less real things - feelings; coincidental, beneficial or unexpected events, as well as mysteries; as being the precinct of a label that has no coherent definition. 'God' has no comprehensible characteristics that are not anthropomorphic or terrestrial, and no transcendent qualities that are not inconceivable, irrational and illogical human inventions. 

 

A very eloquent way of expressing the truth AE. Always enjoy your educated posts. 

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno