Debate Fact Check, Keeping them Honest

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Debate Fact Check, Keeping them Honest

The Daily Show with Jon StewartMon - Thurs 11p / 10c
Democalypse 2012 - O Bama, Where Art Thou? Pt. 2
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Obama didn't lie, so we don't have anything to cover there.

Here is a very limited Romney fact check courtesy of Alex Seitz-Wald (Salon's political reporter). Email him at aseitz-wald@salon.com, and follow him on Twitter @aseitzwald.  Please post any other debate fact check in this message thread.

10:45 — Big Bird is tiny: Mitt Romney says he’d help bring down the deficit by cutting PBS and “Big Bird.” PBS receives about $445 million from the federal government, which represents about .01 percent of the federal budget.

10:20 — Romney left his heart in Zurich: Romney tells Obama, “The place you put your money is a pretty good indication of where your heart is.” The obvious rejoinder, ready-made for a DNC attack, is that Romney’s heart must be in the Cayman Island, Bermuda or Switzerland, where Romney has put his money.

10:10 — “The same fucking bill”: Romney says his healthcare plan in Massachusetts is very different from Obamacare. The guy who designed both the plans calls them “the same fucking bill.

10:00 — Romney sees death panels: Romney comes dangerously close to invoking death panels, saying Obamacare has “a board that will tell people what kind of treatment they’re going to get.” He’s referring to IPAB, a board of doctors, hospital officials and government officials who try to find best practices to reduce the cost of Medicare (and only Medicare — no one else’s healthcare — which is already a government plan). IPAB does not decide on individual cases, is subject to congressional oversight and is legally prohibited from rationing care. In August, Paul Ryan told Florida seniors Obamacare has a “rationing board.”

9:45 — Obamacare still doesn’t cut Medicare: Romney revived one of the most repeated falsehoods of the campaign – that Obamacare cut over $700 billion from Medicare. It’s not true, and Paul Ryan’s budget included the same cuts; Ryan and almost every other Republican in the House voted for them. Obamacare did cut funds from Medicare, but from providers, not beneficiaries. The actuaries in charge of the program say the savings will actually extend the life of the program and experts say the cuts won’t affect benefits.

9:40 — NFIB fib:  Romney uses as a cudgel against Obama’s tax plan a study from the National Federation of Independent Business. The NFIB sounds like an anodyne business group, but like the U.S. Chamber of Commerce it is actually a very partisan Republican group funded mostly by large corporations, not small businesses.

9:35 — Some small businesses not so small: Romney says Obama wants to raise taxes on “small businesses” by letting the Bush tax cuts on the top tier of income expire. Indeed, many small businesses pay taxes as if they’re individuals via companies called S-corporations. Many of these small business are mom-and-pop stores, home businesses, doctors offices, etc. – real small businesses. But some large privately held large corporations classify themselves as S-corps for tax purposes. For example, one “small business” registered this way: Koch Industries, the country’s second-largest privately held corporation.

 9:20 — Romney’s curious studies: Responding to Obama’s waving around the Tax Policy Center Study, Romney said there are five other studies that show he’s right. The problem with this is some aren’t studies (Wall Street Journal Op-Eds are not studies) and others are by economists advising his campaign.

9:15 – Romney still can’t explain his tax plan:  One of Mitt Romney’s core economic policies is a 20 percent tax cut for all Americans, which economists estimate will cost about $5 trillion over 10 years. Nonetheless, tonight Romney said,“I don’t have a $5 trillion tax cut.” What he means is that the net cost of his plan will be zero because he’ll find ways to raise $5 trillion to make up for lost revenue by closing loopholes and expanding the tax base. He wants “no tax cut that adds to the deficit,” as he said tonight. The problem with this is he won’t say how. In a much-cited study, the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center found that there’s no way this is possible without significantly raising taxes on the middle class, which Romney also says he’s not going to do.

The Romney campaign has disputed that study and others that came to similar conclusions, but has so far refused to offer details as to how they would pay for the tax cut. Paul Ryan said Sunday that it would take too long to explain the math. Romney came a little closer last night by saying he would cap deductions rich people could take by $17,000, but it’s still unclear that this would be enough to cover the cost of his plan.

Fact check Obama Romney debate

 

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RationalResponseSquad

RationalResponseSquad wrote:

Obama didn't lie, so we don't have anything to cover there.

 

Yes he did.

http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/political/debate-fact-check-obama-romney-president-barack-obama-mitt-romney-dont-tell-the-whole-truth

 

Quote:

OBAMA: "Over the last two years, health care premiums have gone up — it's true — but they've gone up slower than any time in the last 50 years. So we're already beginning to see progress. In the meantime, folks out there with insurance, you're already getting a rebate."

THE FACTS: Not so, concerning premiums. Obama is mixing overall health care spending, which has been growing at historically low levels, and health insurance premiums, which have continued to rise faster than wages and overall economic growth. Premiums for job-based family coverage have risen by nearly $2,400 since 2009 when Obama took office, according to the nonpartisan Kaiser Family Foundation. In 2011, premiums jumped by 9 percent. This year's 4 percent increase was more manageable, but the price tag for family coverage stands at $15,745, with employees paying more than $4,300 of that.

When it comes to insurance rebates under Obama's health care law, less than 10 percent of people with private health insurance are benefiting.

More than 160 million Americans under 65 have private insurance through their jobs and by buying their own policies. According to the administration, about 13 million people will benefit from rebates. And nearly two-thirds of that number will only be entitled to a share of it, since they are covered under job-based plans where their employer pays most of the premium and will get most of the rebate.


Read more: http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/political/debate-fact-check-obama-romney-president-barack-obama-mitt-romney-dont-tell-the-whole-truth#ixzz28LJDvXzR

 

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/03/debate-fact-check_n_1937831.html

Quote:

 

OBAMA: It's important "that we take some of the money that we're saving as we wind down two wars to rebuild America."

THE FACTS: This oft-repeated claim is based on a fiscal fiction. The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were paid for mostly with borrowed money, so stopping them doesn't create a new pool of available cash that can be used for something else, like rebuilding America. It just slows down the government's borrowing.

 

Quote:

OBAMA: "Independent studies looking at this said the only way to meet Gov. Romney's pledge of not ... adding to the deficit is by burdening middle-class families. The average middle-class family with children would pay about $2,000 more."

THE FACTS: That's just one scenario. Obama's claim relies on a study by the Tax Policy Center, a Washington research group. The study, however, is more nuanced than Obama indicated.

The study concludes it would be impossible for Romney to meet all of his stated goals without shifting some of the tax burden from people who make more than $200,000 to people who make less.

In one scenario, the study says, Romney's proposal could result in a $2,000 tax increase for families who make less than $200,000 and have children.

Romney says his plan wouldn't raise taxes on anyone, and his campaign points to several studies by conservative think tanks that dispute the Tax Policy Center's findings. Most of the conservative studies argue that Romney's tax plan would stimulate economic growth, generating additional tax revenue without shifting any of the tax burden to the middle class. Congress, however, doesn't use those kinds of projections when it estimates the effect of tax legislation.

 


Brian37
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I couldn't believe Obama had

I couldn't believe Obama had so much ammo to nail him on but blew that debate and looked flat.

Romny has shit on the middle class and working poor and had the nerve to mimic the democratic platform trying to make himself look empathetic.  Romney is like the villian in a horror movie, he should go down and keeps going down but still manages to come back. Obama and the dems should have burried him long before this debate.

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Brian37 wrote:I couldn't

Brian37 wrote:

I couldn't believe Obama had so much ammo to nail him on but blew that debate and looked flat.

Romny has shit on the middle class and working poor and had the nerve to mimic the democratic platform trying to make himself look empathetic.  Romney is like the villian in a horror movie, he should go down and keeps going down but still manages to come back. Obama and the dems should have burried him long before this debate.

I don't know how many people are undecided at this point as to who they are going to cast their vote for.

(I would be willing to bet that not many people are) but the general consensus seemed to be that Obama lost that debate. Which could or could not hurt his voting base, depending upon how close the race is and depending upon who is straddling the fence.

How exactly did he loose the debate ?

Misinformation ? Dodging questions ? Not responding ? Evasiveness ? What exactly would have set Obama back ?

What exactly happened in last night's debate that made the newsmedia seem to feel this way ?

Some people said that Romney was on the aggressive. Being on the aggressive can go against someone. If that in fact is the reason that people are saying that Romney won the debate.

I know that it is probably on YouTube, but I simply don't know if I am going to get the time to watch it or not.

I missed it last night, even though it was on my to see list, but something came up.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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RationalResponseSquad

RationalResponseSquad wrote:

Obama didn't lie, so we don't have anything to cover there.

 

 

Seriously? Give me a fucking break, talk about delusional. 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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Beyond Saving

Beyond Saving wrote:

RationalResponseSquad wrote:

Obama didn't lie, so we don't have anything to cover there.

 

 

Seriously? Give me a fucking break, talk about delusional. 

So... give your version of the events.

Or are you playing "assert and run"?

 

"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
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jcgadfly wrote:Beyond Saving

jcgadfly wrote:

Beyond Saving wrote:

RationalResponseSquad wrote:

Obama didn't lie, so we don't have anything to cover there.

 

 

Seriously? Give me a fucking break, talk about delusional. 

So... give your version of the events.

Or are you playing "assert and run"?

 

 

I posted some of Obama's exaggerations or mistakes.

 

 

 


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Beyond Saving

Beyond Saving wrote:

RationalResponseSquad wrote:

Obama didn't lie, so we don't have anything to cover there.

 

 

Seriously? Give me a fucking break, talk about delusional. 

 

Very very dry sense of humor here.

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jcgadfly wrote:So... give

jcgadfly wrote:

So... give your version of the events.

Or are you playing "assert and run"?

 

They both lied their asses off, which is pretty standard in all political debates- honest people don't get far in politics. People arguing over their pet political candidates are as irrational as a couple of theists arguing over their pet gods and pretending that your guys shit doesn't stink just shows how much koolaid you are drinking. Granted, it isn't very effective to shill for your candidate while admitting to how your candidate is stretching the truth. 

 

But no, I'm not going through the effort to list Bama's fabrications, I simply don't care enough to. A simple google search can bring them to your attention. No matter what happens, the US is going to have another scummy lying politician as president. 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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I don't know why anyone

I don't know why anyone bothers watching. There's rarely, if ever, anything said in a debate between politicians that isn't already a part of their public campaign.

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