Origin of Language = Epic Evolution/Atheist FAIL!

TWD39
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Origin of Language = Epic Evolution/Atheist FAIL!

Here is something I find quite puzzling.  If God did not create us, and we evolve from other creatures,  how did our languages come into existance?   The world is full of many rich cultures complete with an unique linguistic form of language following an agreed set of rules.  So who created the rules, the sounds, and how did this person or evolutionary ancestor get others to understand and agree with the rules?   THis is obviously a huge leap from the primitive grunts and noises that other animal species make.  Yes, primates can communicate on a basic level.  But they can't verbalize into words, or express complete sentences conveying abstract ideas. 

How would you convey to a fellow creature a metaphorical or philosophical question when there is no foundation for language?  You can point to objects and make a noise, but that only gets you so far in language.  The same problem exists for creating a written language.

 

Even if evolutionary linguists can come up with a plausible explanation, there remains one big problem.   Why don't we all speak the same language? 

 

Another issue is you don't see any transitional forms with anything resembling our complex voice box anatomy.  Why did we evolve to have this feature?  What was the enviromental factors that separated our genetic line from other animals and created the need for a voice box?  I would be more convinced if someone found a fossil that contained at least a primitive form of a voice box.

 

Sure, there are a number of theories, but they are pretty weak sauce with zero supporting evidence. 

 

OTOH, the Bible perfectly explains how language and culture came into being.  Man began with an universal language after the Flood with Noah.  Then after the man started building the tower of Babel, God confused the languages which scattered people all over the earth.  This also explains why we find global myth stories with many details striking similiar to the Bible's account.  They infused their own language and culture into the original story.

Yep, I'll take the truth of the Bible over fallible man's theories anytime.

 

 


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Misc.

 To answer ThunderJones . .

TWD39 wrote:
  What is my backlog now? 200? 
  She said 'what is my backlog up to' ?  200 ? Judging by the size of this thread a number easily disputed

 

 


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danatemporary wrote: To

danatemporary wrote:

 To answer ThunderJones . .

TWD39 wrote:
  What is my backlog now? 200? 
  She said 'what is my backlog up to' ?  200 ? Judging by the size of this thread a number easily disputed

 

 

Might be counting the other threads 'she' has had months to get to, but has not.

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cj
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ex-minister wrote: The great

ex-minister wrote:

The great cultures back as far as 7000 years ago practiced this and more. They also understood things such as avoiding contaminated water. The Babylonians, Egyptians, Greeks and Romans were definitely more advanced in health care than the Hebrews. 

http://www.vaclib.org/basic/history.htm

There is even evidence of Neanderthals (50k years ago) using plants/herbs for remedial purposes.

http://www.herbs2000.com/medica/2_antibioticsH.htm

 

Humans cleaning up after themselves go further back than 7000 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klasies_River_Mouth wrote:

While Middle Stone Age (MSA) assemblage associated with those people are described as anatomically modern, there is ongoing debate about when they were also behaviourally modern.[6] There is a marked difference between the Paleolithic stone technology used in the earliest layers from 125,000 years ago, and the superior MST blades of the 70,000 year old Howiesons Poort period that used raw material which had been 'mined' 20 kilometres inland. There is also a differentiation between the Paleolithic food detritus that accumulated underfoot inside the caves 125,000 years ago, but was ejected and accumulated into external middens by the MST occupants circa 75,000 years ago. This 'housekeeping' is an indicator that 'at least half of our species' had evolved 'modern behaviour' by the MSA.[5][7]

 

At least 75,000 years of sweeping out the cave.  It is a chore we should all still do today - at least occasionally.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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CJ, thanks

CJ, your research skills always impress me. Thanks.

Religion Kills !!!

Numbers 31:17-18 - Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

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ex-minister wrote:CJ, your

ex-minister wrote:

CJ, your research skills always impress me. Thanks.

 

It's the pre-history archaeology class I took last year.  We had a discussion of these caves in South Africa because that seems to be where modern humans originated.  And I remembered the professor (a young woman) mentioning evidence of housekeeping.  From there, it was just remembering the name of the cave.  I remember the concepts just fine, it's the details that keep getting fuzzy.  But I persisted, googled a lot, and there we are.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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ex-minister wrote:TWD39

ex-minister wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

I have no plans to give up.   You have said nothing that can't be address and countered.   The fact that you conveniently ignored my example in Deut. shows that you don't want to face a reality where you are the one who is wrong.

Silly boy. I ain't going away either. I think the details of my posts are very clear on that. Having something besides naked assertions on your part would impress me more. It is called research.

 

 

ex-minister wrote:

3a) Please identify how the Jews knew how to prevent the spread of diseases?

TWD36 wrote:

There are numerous verses in regards to this subject.   One example is in Deuteronomy 23:10-13 where the Israelities are told to stay outside the camp if they have an infectious discharge, and to dig and bury their feces outside of camp.

 

Your text has nothing to do with staying outside the camp if there is an infectious disease unless you consider semen, poop and urine infections.

 

Deu 23:9-11. If a guy has a wet dream he is unclean and needs to go outside the camp and stay there, wash himself and return at sunset. What medical procedure is this addressing? Do you separate yourself from people in this condition for a whole day?  Seriously, do you?

I think this points out just where their heads were. Ceremonies. Rituals identified with Clean/Unclean. A confusing morality lesson only. They nor their God really understood micro-organism or disease and what communicated disease.

 

Deu 23:12-14. Go outside the camp to go to the bathroom and bury it. Note this it is not about infections but decency. Text is clear on that.

Deu 23:12-14 wrote:

Designate a place outside the camp where you can go to relieve yourself. As part of your equipment have something to dig with, and when you relieve yourself, dig a hole and cover up your excrement. For the Lord your God moves about in your camp to protect you and to deliver your enemies to you. Your camp must be holy, so that he will not see among you anything indecent and turn away from you.

Gee Dude. You didn't even read the Bible text you gave me. I recommend if you think you got something golden you should actually read the text first. This has nothing to do with infectious disease, but body fluids that God is embarrassed by. He will turn away from you. The body is dirty to Jehovah. Name we a culture that didn't believe in putting human waste elsewhere. How many people crapped in their house? Show me how Israel was the first to learn of this.

 

The great cultures back as far as 7000 years ago practiced this and more. They also understood things such as avoiding contaminated water. The Babylonians, Egyptians, Greeks and Romans were definitely more advanced in health care than the Hebrews. 

http://www.vaclib.org/basic/history.htm

There is even evidence of Neanderthals (50k years ago) using plants/herbs for remedial purposes.

http://www.herbs2000.com/medica/2_antibioticsH.htm

 

The Hebrews believed in a God who caused/allowed diseases and what was important was to placate him in order to live the good and healthy life. That is the clear message of the bible. It is not a science book which you for some reason need to believe. Again this only distracts the intent of Bible. Most Christians have moved on. Time you give some thought to that. Let the book breathe fresh air, not modern agendas.

 

 

Let's go back to the Leviticus text I brought up which you have not addressed (you have accused me of conveniently ignoring stuff-shoe on the other foot now).

How brilliant is the medical advise there which simply says to remove sick people from the camp? They were NOT curing anyone. Not a huge leap in medical science. It would become obvious to any group of humans that some people get sick being around other sick people. If the bible had an actual cure for a sick person that would be something to boast about. But the "medical" procedure was to isolate and wait and see. How exactly does that prove Jehovah shared some great insight with the Jews?

 

Also, just a reminder, you have not addressed the positive application of animal blood to people who on their own got better and to bless homes where mold removed itself. (Lev  14:1-13; Leviticus 14: 33-57). Throwing blood about is an unhealthy practice, certainly in modern medicine. Can you imagine such a thing in an operating room? All hell would break loose if someone tried that.  Please explain why we don't do that anymore since Jehovah thought it was a good idea.

 

Summary of Biblical medical procedures

1) Remove yourself from camp for one day if you have a nocturnal emission

2) Poop and Pee outside the camp, bury it

3) If a priest says you have an infectious disease remove yourself from the camp for a week or so. The priest looks at you after that and if you got better all by yourself, he kills an animal and sprinkles blood on you (yuck).

4) If a priest sees a house has bad mold, lock it up for a week. If after the week the mold gets better all by itself, kill an animal and sprinkle blood about. Or if there is still mildew tear out the stones and throw them outside of town.

 

Why hasn't this been written up in some medical journal?

 

Seriously, TWD, how can we or even you be impressed by this when other nearby cultures were more advanced?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your contempt for all things Christian is pretty evident in your replies.   You couldn't even give me the courtesy of having time to respond to your earlier posts, but instead dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load.  Wow, if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible.

I'm on vacation now so this reply will be brief.  I'll gladly address your gross inaccuracies later,  but with just 5 minutes of quick research, I discovered that ancient Egyptians treated illnesses with feces.  So much for advanced medical knowledge huh?


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TWD39 wrote:Your contempt

TWD39 wrote:

Your contempt for all things Christian is pretty evident in your replies.   You couldn't even give me the courtesy of having time to respond to your earlier posts, but instead dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load.  Wow, if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible.

I'm on vacation now so this reply will be brief.  I'll gladly address your gross inaccuracies later,  but with just 5 minutes of quick research, I discovered that ancient Egyptians treated illnesses with feces.  So much for advanced medical knowledge huh?

Yet another ignorant dismissal of an argument coupled with personal insults. If you didn't have time to actually address why the things he said were wrong, why did you post? It is very different to say "I'm going on vacation, I'll get to this whenever I can" and what you just did. You are sweepingly dismissing his points with only the excuse of "I'm going on vacation"?

Additionally you are mad at him for "not giving you time to respond to (his) earlier posts", but you didn't seem to have ever asked him not to reply to your latest posts.

Every single post you make displays your poor understanding of discussion, argumentation, logic, and critical thinking.

Seriously, when I said "acknowledge that you can't answer the post right now" I did not mean make naked assertions of the argument's lack of validity, just to mention that it may take a time for you to reply.

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. . Willing to wait but don't forget.

 Willing to wait but don't forget.

 

 

Quote:
If you didn't have time to actually address why . . It is very different to say "I'm going on vacation, I'll get to this whenever I can" and what you just did. You are sweepingly dismissing his points with only the excuse of "I'm going on vacation"?Additionally you are mad ..


  ThunderJones and danatemporary have asked for a reply from you,. I mean 'each' of us asked you to reply what was previously posted. There is no rule saying you cannot address each of us specifically. In an attempt to keep others from commenting more and more. I believe it is ThunderJones' turn and then danatemporary. I vaguely recall it was about animals and the Sumerians

 


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ThunderJones wrote:Yet

ThunderJones wrote:

Yet another ignorant dismissal of an argument coupled with personal insults. If you didn't have time to actually address why the things he said were wrong, why did you post? It is very different to say "I'm going on vacation, I'll get to this whenever I can" and what you just did. You are sweepingly dismissing his points with only the excuse of "I'm going on vacation"?

Seems like he used this " I am on vacation, so I can't respond right now" before.  The first thread that he started.

Dude sure gets a lot of vacations. I need that job. Smiling

Plus, if this board is pissing him off that much, he's fucking up his vacation. I thought vacations were about seeing the sights, getting pics taken, tourist attractions, you know, stuff like that.

 

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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Yeah

harleysportster wrote:

 

Seems like he used this " I am on vacation, so I can't respond right now" before.  The first thread that he started.

Dude sure gets a lot of vacations. I need that job. Smiling

Plus, if this board is pissing him off that much, he's fucking up his vacation. I thought vacations were about seeing the sights, getting pics taken, tourist attractions, you know, stuff like that.

 

 

Couldn't be easy arguing with all of us when you have no objective evidence. Maybe part of this vacation could be spent looking at the Burgess Shales...perhaps they'll be informative. 

Whoever TWD is they are the master of denialism and profoundly irrational. Obviously we're all irrational by and large but TWD's literal interpretation of allegorical biblical texts is groan-worthy. 

I'm still waiting for an explanation as to how high the mud brick tower got before god interrupted the efforts of the builders. 

This is the largest mud brick building in the world - a mosque in Mali built in 1907.

 

 

Not exactly threatening to reach the vaults of heaven, is it....

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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Anyone an engineer who can

Anyone an engineer who can figure out how high a building made of mudbricks could be before its own weight crushed it into sand?

There's a reason that concrete and steel are standard building materials, after all.

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ThunderJones wrote:TWD39

ThunderJones wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

Your contempt for all things Christian is pretty evident in your replies.   You couldn't even give me the courtesy of having time to respond to your earlier posts, but instead dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load.  Wow, if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible.

I'm on vacation now so this reply will be brief.  I'll gladly address your gross inaccuracies later,  but with just 5 minutes of quick research, I discovered that ancient Egyptians treated illnesses with feces.  So much for advanced medical knowledge huh?

Yet another ignorant dismissal of an argument coupled with personal insults. If you didn't have time to actually address why the things he said were wrong, why did you post? It is very different to say "I'm going on vacation, I'll get to this whenever I can" and what you just did. You are sweepingly dismissing his points with only the excuse of "I'm going on vacation"?

Additionally you are mad at him for "not giving you time to respond to (his) earlier posts", but you didn't seem to have ever asked him not to reply to your latest posts.

Every single post you make displays your poor understanding of discussion, argumentation, logic, and critical thinking.

Seriously, when I said "acknowledge that you can't answer the post right now" I did not mean make naked assertions of the argument's lack of validity, just to mention that it may take a time for you to reply.

 

I haven't dismissed anything.  I was pointing out his hypocrisy since he stated that he would wait for me to respond, but no,  he just couldn't resist adding another lengthy post.   Yet, you contributed to the problem right here!  I've made it clear that I don't have time right now to do in depth research on the particular topic, oh but you claim it is just a tactic to dismiss the argument.   Someone earlier in this thread claimed I was ignoring their post.  I answered each question which resulted in more sarcastic replies.  Typical.

 

You atheists dismiss EVERY Christian argument as soon as it is presented.   You should wear a t-shirt with a capital H on it!  

 


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Look

Vastet wrote:
Anyone an engineer who can figure out how high a building made of mudbricks could be before its own weight crushed it into sand? There's a reason that concrete and steel are standard building materials, after all.

 

I mentioned this somewhere too but having done a bit of reading I discovered the compressive strength of mud bricks is ok for small structures but where they fall over, so to speak, is when confronted by earthquakes. 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1450280/Iranian-earthquake-kills-5000-in-mud-brick-city.html

Apparently there are some 11-story mud brick towers in Shibam dating from the 17th century but they've been rebuilt many times since first constructed.

11 stories is tall but it's hardly likely to scare god into a response given he's ignored far higher structures and is hardly lashing out at polyglots these days. 

To reach 'heaven' a mud brick building would have needed to be 80,000 high. Comparatively, the current tallest building is the all-steel Tokyo Sky tree which is only 634m high. You could climb a modest hill and be higher than this.  

For the record the compressive rating of mud bricks is 0.5 MPa. For comparison steel reinforced concrete is 500 MPa.... 

 

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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*Yawn* Noone gives a fuck,

@ TWD

*Yawn*

Noone gives a fuck, give it up already. You're making your side look stupid, which we all know you really don't have to do.

Hell, you aren't even arguing with a third of the active membership. Some of the most educated members haven't bothered to respond at all, you're mostly dealing with laymen (with a few exceptions). Other theists have had no problem taking on a thousand replies by dozens of members, even if it takes them a year to do so. Why is your belief so shallow you can't even handle 20 people's questions? Did you really think you could come to an atheist site and NOT be challenged by the membership?

I can only imagine you'd have already run to the hills if Deluded_God, Bob Spence, Hambydammit, Brian Sapient, and Pauljohntheskeptic (just to name a few) were also tearing your arguments a new asshole.

Theists...

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@ Atheistextremist Cool

@ Atheistextremist

Cool info. Thanks. Smiling

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ex-minister
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TWD39 wrote:ex-minister

TWD39 wrote:

ex-minister wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

I have no plans to give up.   You have said nothing that can't be address and countered.   The fact that you conveniently ignored my example in Deut. shows that you don't want to face a reality where you are the one who is wrong.

Silly boy. I ain't going away either. I think the details of my posts are very clear on that. Having something besides naked assertions on your part would impress me more. It is called research.

 

 

ex-minister wrote:

3a) Please identify how the Jews knew how to prevent the spread of diseases?

TWD36 wrote:

There are numerous verses in regards to this subject.   One example is in Deuteronomy 23:10-13 where the Israelities are told to stay outside the camp if they have an infectious discharge, and to dig and bury their feces outside of camp.

 

Your text has nothing to do with staying outside the camp if there is an infectious disease unless you consider semen, poop and urine infections.

 

Deu 23:9-11. If a guy has a wet dream he is unclean and needs to go outside the camp and stay there, wash himself and return at sunset. What medical procedure is this addressing? Do you separate yourself from people in this condition for a whole day?  Seriously, do you?

I think this points out just where their heads were. Ceremonies. Rituals identified with Clean/Unclean. A confusing morality lesson only. They nor their God really understood micro-organism or disease and what communicated disease.

 

Deu 23:12-14. Go outside the camp to go to the bathroom and bury it. Note this it is not about infections but decency. Text is clear on that.

Deu 23:12-14 wrote:

Designate a place outside the camp where you can go to relieve yourself. As part of your equipment have something to dig with, and when you relieve yourself, dig a hole and cover up your excrement. For the Lord your God moves about in your camp to protect you and to deliver your enemies to you. Your camp must be holy, so that he will not see among you anything indecent and turn away from you.

Gee Dude. You didn't even read the Bible text you gave me. I recommend if you think you got something golden you should actually read the text first. This has nothing to do with infectious disease, but body fluids that God is embarrassed by. He will turn away from you. The body is dirty to Jehovah. Name we a culture that didn't believe in putting human waste elsewhere. How many people crapped in their house? Show me how Israel was the first to learn of this.

 

The great cultures back as far as 7000 years ago practiced this and more. They also understood things such as avoiding contaminated water. The Babylonians, Egyptians, Greeks and Romans were definitely more advanced in health care than the Hebrews. 

http://www.vaclib.org/basic/history.htm

There is even evidence of Neanderthals (50k years ago) using plants/herbs for remedial purposes.

http://www.herbs2000.com/medica/2_antibioticsH.htm

 

The Hebrews believed in a God who caused/allowed diseases and what was important was to placate him in order to live the good and healthy life. That is the clear message of the bible. It is not a science book which you for some reason need to believe. Again this only distracts the intent of Bible. Most Christians have moved on. Time you give some thought to that. Let the book breathe fresh air, not modern agendas.

 

 

Let's go back to the Leviticus text I brought up which you have not addressed (you have accused me of conveniently ignoring stuff-shoe on the other foot now).

How brilliant is the medical advise there which simply says to remove sick people from the camp? They were NOT curing anyone. Not a huge leap in medical science. It would become obvious to any group of humans that some people get sick being around other sick people. If the bible had an actual cure for a sick person that would be something to boast about. But the "medical" procedure was to isolate and wait and see. How exactly does that prove Jehovah shared some great insight with the Jews?

 

Also, just a reminder, you have not addressed the positive application of animal blood to people who on their own got better and to bless homes where mold removed itself. (Lev  14:1-13; Leviticus 14: 33-57). Throwing blood about is an unhealthy practice, certainly in modern medicine. Can you imagine such a thing in an operating room? All hell would break loose if someone tried that.  Please explain why we don't do that anymore since Jehovah thought it was a good idea.

 

Summary of Biblical medical procedures

1) Remove yourself from camp for one day if you have a nocturnal emission

2) Poop and Pee outside the camp, bury it

3) If a priest says you have an infectious disease remove yourself from the camp for a week or so. The priest looks at you after that and if you got better all by yourself, he kills an animal and sprinkles blood on you (yuck).

4) If a priest sees a house has bad mold, lock it up for a week. If after the week the mold gets better all by itself, kill an animal and sprinkle blood about. Or if there is still mildew tear out the stones and throw them outside of town.

 

Why hasn't this been written up in some medical journal?

 

Seriously, TWD, how can we or even you be impressed by this when other nearby cultures were more advanced?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your contempt for all things Christian is pretty evident in your replies.   You couldn't even give me the courtesy of having time to respond to your earlier posts, but instead dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load.  Wow, if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible.

I'm on vacation now so this reply will be brief.  I'll gladly address your gross inaccuracies later,  but with just 5 minutes of quick research, I discovered that ancient Egyptians treated illnesses with feces.  So much for advanced medical knowledge huh?

You can't have it both ways asshole. You accuse me of conveniently ignoring your Deuteronomy text and when I address it you whine I haven't given you time to respond. Fucking grow up.

Religion Kills !!!

Numbers 31:17-18 - Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

http://jesus-needs-money.blogspot.com/


TWD39
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ex-minister wrote:TWD39

ex-minister wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

ex-minister wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

I have no plans to give up.   You have said nothing that can't be address and countered.   The fact that you conveniently ignored my example in Deut. shows that you don't want to face a reality where you are the one who is wrong.

Silly boy. I ain't going away either. I think the details of my posts are very clear on that. Having something besides naked assertions on your part would impress me more. It is called research.

 

 

ex-minister wrote:

3a) Please identify how the Jews knew how to prevent the spread of diseases?

TWD36 wrote:

There are numerous verses in regards to this subject.   One example is in Deuteronomy 23:10-13 where the Israelities are told to stay outside the camp if they have an infectious discharge, and to dig and bury their feces outside of camp.

 

Your text has nothing to do with staying outside the camp if there is an infectious disease unless you consider semen, poop and urine infections.

 

Deu 23:9-11. If a guy has a wet dream he is unclean and needs to go outside the camp and stay there, wash himself and return at sunset. What medical procedure is this addressing? Do you separate yourself from people in this condition for a whole day?  Seriously, do you?

I think this points out just where their heads were. Ceremonies. Rituals identified with Clean/Unclean. A confusing morality lesson only. They nor their God really understood micro-organism or disease and what communicated disease.

 

Deu 23:12-14. Go outside the camp to go to the bathroom and bury it. Note this it is not about infections but decency. Text is clear on that.

Deu 23:12-14 wrote:

Designate a place outside the camp where you can go to relieve yourself. As part of your equipment have something to dig with, and when you relieve yourself, dig a hole and cover up your excrement. For the Lord your God moves about in your camp to protect you and to deliver your enemies to you. Your camp must be holy, so that he will not see among you anything indecent and turn away from you.

Gee Dude. You didn't even read the Bible text you gave me. I recommend if you think you got something golden you should actually read the text first. This has nothing to do with infectious disease, but body fluids that God is embarrassed by. He will turn away from you. The body is dirty to Jehovah. Name we a culture that didn't believe in putting human waste elsewhere. How many people crapped in their house? Show me how Israel was the first to learn of this.

 

The great cultures back as far as 7000 years ago practiced this and more. They also understood things such as avoiding contaminated water. The Babylonians, Egyptians, Greeks and Romans were definitely more advanced in health care than the Hebrews. 

http://www.vaclib.org/basic/history.htm

There is even evidence of Neanderthals (50k years ago) using plants/herbs for remedial purposes.

http://www.herbs2000.com/medica/2_antibioticsH.htm

 

The Hebrews believed in a God who caused/allowed diseases and what was important was to placate him in order to live the good and healthy life. That is the clear message of the bible. It is not a science book which you for some reason need to believe. Again this only distracts the intent of Bible. Most Christians have moved on. Time you give some thought to that. Let the book breathe fresh air, not modern agendas.

 

 

Let's go back to the Leviticus text I brought up which you have not addressed (you have accused me of conveniently ignoring stuff-shoe on the other foot now).

How brilliant is the medical advise there which simply says to remove sick people from the camp? They were NOT curing anyone. Not a huge leap in medical science. It would become obvious to any group of humans that some people get sick being around other sick people. If the bible had an actual cure for a sick person that would be something to boast about. But the "medical" procedure was to isolate and wait and see. How exactly does that prove Jehovah shared some great insight with the Jews?

 

Also, just a reminder, you have not addressed the positive application of animal blood to people who on their own got better and to bless homes where mold removed itself. (Lev  14:1-13; Leviticus 14: 33-57). Throwing blood about is an unhealthy practice, certainly in modern medicine. Can you imagine such a thing in an operating room? All hell would break loose if someone tried that.  Please explain why we don't do that anymore since Jehovah thought it was a good idea.

 

Summary of Biblical medical procedures

1) Remove yourself from camp for one day if you have a nocturnal emission

2) Poop and Pee outside the camp, bury it

3) If a priest says you have an infectious disease remove yourself from the camp for a week or so. The priest looks at you after that and if you got better all by yourself, he kills an animal and sprinkles blood on you (yuck).

4) If a priest sees a house has bad mold, lock it up for a week. If after the week the mold gets better all by itself, kill an animal and sprinkle blood about. Or if there is still mildew tear out the stones and throw them outside of town.

 

Why hasn't this been written up in some medical journal?

 

Seriously, TWD, how can we or even you be impressed by this when other nearby cultures were more advanced?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your contempt for all things Christian is pretty evident in your replies.   You couldn't even give me the courtesy of having time to respond to your earlier posts, but instead dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load.  Wow, if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible.

I'm on vacation now so this reply will be brief.  I'll gladly address your gross inaccuracies later,  but with just 5 minutes of quick research, I discovered that ancient Egyptians treated illnesses with feces.  So much for advanced medical knowledge huh?

You can't have it both ways asshole. You accuse me of conveniently ignoring your Deuteronomy text and when I address it you whine I haven't given you time to respond. Fucking grow up.

 

LOL I see that turning your back on God has made you into a better nicer human being.  NOT!  


ex-minister
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TWD (Troll Whiner Dumbass)

 

TWD39 wrote:

LOL I see that turning your back on God has made you into a better nicer human being.  NOT!  

TWD (Troll Whiner Dumbass),

What does being nice have to do with truth?  

 

Religion Kills !!!

Numbers 31:17-18 - Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

http://jesus-needs-money.blogspot.com/


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ex-minister wrote: TWD39

ex-minister wrote:

 

TWD39 wrote:

LOL I see that turning your back on God has made you into a better nicer human being.  NOT!  

TWD (Troll Whiner Dumbass),

What does being nice have to do with truth?  

 

Funny how it is ok to say "All Atheists are-- (insert whatever derogatory statement you like) but yet, we are supposed to put on kiddie gloves when speaking. Double standard much ?

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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  TWD39 has to be one of

  TWD39 has to be one of the emotionally weakest Christians to ever post here.  What a cry baby.

 

I'm a right wing atheist because I enjoy being hated by everyone.

"When a man loves cats, I am his friend and comrade, without further introduction." Mark Twain.


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 I see TWD is using the old

 I see TWD is using the old "Appeal to pity" fallacy, with the a hefty dose of essentializing.

Cliché.

 

 


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TWD39 wrote:ThunderJones

TWD39 wrote:

ThunderJones wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

Your contempt for all things Christian is pretty evident in your replies.   You couldn't even give me the courtesy of having time to respond to your earlier posts, but instead dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load.  Wow, if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible.

I'm on vacation now so this reply will be brief.  I'll gladly address your gross inaccuracies later,  but with just 5 minutes of quick research, I discovered that ancient Egyptians treated illnesses with feces.  So much for advanced medical knowledge huh?

Yet another ignorant dismissal of an argument coupled with personal insults. If you didn't have time to actually address why the things he said were wrong, why did you post? It is very different to say "I'm going on vacation, I'll get to this whenever I can" and what you just did. You are sweepingly dismissing his points with only the excuse of "I'm going on vacation"?

Additionally you are mad at him for "not giving you time to respond to (his) earlier posts", but you didn't seem to have ever asked him not to reply to your latest posts.

Every single post you make displays your poor understanding of discussion, argumentation, logic, and critical thinking.

Seriously, when I said "acknowledge that you can't answer the post right now" I did not mean make naked assertions of the argument's lack of validity, just to mention that it may take a time for you to reply.

 

I haven't dismissed anything.  I was pointing out his hypocrisy since he stated that he would wait for me to respond, but no,  he just couldn't resist adding another lengthy post.   Yet, you contributed to the problem right here!  I've made it clear that I don't have time right now to do in depth research on the particular topic, oh but you claim it is just a tactic to dismiss the argument.   Someone earlier in this thread claimed I was ignoring their post.  I answered each question which resulted in more sarcastic replies.  Typical.

 

You atheists dismiss EVERY Christian argument as soon as it is presented.   You should wear a t-shirt with a capital H on it!  

 

"(you) dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load"

"if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible."

"your gross inaccuracies"

 

(No evidence to back up the naked assertions of invalidity)

I see what you mean, you aren't dismissing the argument at all.

 

You are acting even more stupid then your other thread, if that is possible.

You attacked one of my posts and I replied, my reply was post #75. Are you ever gonna respond, eh?

Secularist, Atheist, Skeptic, Freethinker


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ProzacDeathWish wrote: 

ProzacDeathWish wrote:

  TWD39 has to be one of the emotionally weakest Christians to ever post here.  What a cry baby.

 

 

"Boo Hoo, my post is being ignored after I worked so hard to write that big attack against those evil Christians.  "

 

Reality- check -  I am able to present an argument without resorting to insults and profanity.  That is the sign of an emotionally weak person.


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ThunderJones wrote:TWD39

ThunderJones wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

ThunderJones wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

Your contempt for all things Christian is pretty evident in your replies.   You couldn't even give me the courtesy of having time to respond to your earlier posts, but instead dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load.  Wow, if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible.

I'm on vacation now so this reply will be brief.  I'll gladly address your gross inaccuracies later,  but with just 5 minutes of quick research, I discovered that ancient Egyptians treated illnesses with feces.  So much for advanced medical knowledge huh?

Yet another ignorant dismissal of an argument coupled with personal insults. If you didn't have time to actually address why the things he said were wrong, why did you post? It is very different to say "I'm going on vacation, I'll get to this whenever I can" and what you just did. You are sweepingly dismissing his points with only the excuse of "I'm going on vacation"?

Additionally you are mad at him for "not giving you time to respond to (his) earlier posts", but you didn't seem to have ever asked him not to reply to your latest posts.

Every single post you make displays your poor understanding of discussion, argumentation, logic, and critical thinking.

Seriously, when I said "acknowledge that you can't answer the post right now" I did not mean make naked assertions of the argument's lack of validity, just to mention that it may take a time for you to reply.

 

I haven't dismissed anything.  I was pointing out his hypocrisy since he stated that he would wait for me to respond, but no,  he just couldn't resist adding another lengthy post.   Yet, you contributed to the problem right here!  I've made it clear that I don't have time right now to do in depth research on the particular topic, oh but you claim it is just a tactic to dismiss the argument.   Someone earlier in this thread claimed I was ignoring their post.  I answered each question which resulted in more sarcastic replies.  Typical.

 

You atheists dismiss EVERY Christian argument as soon as it is presented.   You should wear a t-shirt with a capital H on it!  

 

"(you) dumped this big steaming pile of nonsense on the load"

"if that's your understanding of my passage then you really don't know how to read the Bible."

"your gross inaccuracies"

 

(No evidence to back up the naked assertions of invalidity)

I see what you mean, you aren't dismissing the argument at all.

 

You are acting even more stupid then your other thread, if that is possible.

You attacked one of my posts and I replied, my reply was post #75. Are you ever gonna respond, eh?

 

I respond LIFI formation.  Therefore, stopping adding more nonsense replies and I'll get to it eventually.  Understand?   Probably not.  Your replies calling me stupid are nothing but a waste of time and space.

 


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TWD39 wrote: Reality- check

TWD39 wrote:

 

Reality- check -  I am able to present an argument without resorting to insults and profanity.  That is the sign of an emotionally weak person.

 Please do so then because at the moment i don't believe you. You are not presenting an argument. Ignore those you consider rude if you like; that is your right,  but there are plenty of polite people who would like to continue the debate.  Thanks

 


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TWD39 wrote: "Boo Hoo, my

TWD39 wrote:

 

"Boo Hoo, my post is being ignored after I worked so hard to write that big attack against those evil Christians.  "

   

                   How are you "ignoring" my post if you reply to it  .....are you a complete fucking idiot ?

 

 

 

      

 

      

I'm a right wing atheist because I enjoy being hated by everyone.

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TWD39 wrote:"Boo Hoo, my

TWD39 wrote:

"Boo Hoo, my post is being ignored after I worked so hard to write that big attack against those evil Christians.  "

 

Reality- check -  I am able to present an argument without resorting to insults and profanity.  That is the sign of an emotionally weak person.

 

I have written two posts on this thread full of evidence.  One was in direct response to you, the other was an enhancement of a reply by ex-minister to you.

I have seen no response from you, nor any evidence to support your claims.  I have been very polite.  You do not need to reply to me if you are feeling too much discomfort from your cognitive dissonance.  I do wish you would stop lumping me in with other people, however.  Thank you.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

"We are entitled to our own opinions. We're not entitled to our own facts"- Al Franken

"If death isn't sweet oblivion, I will be severely disappointed" - Ruth M.


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: I ve seen no response from you (either) :

cj wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

"Boo Hoo, my post is being ignored after I worked so hard to write that big attack against those evil Christians.  "

 

Reality- check -  I am able to present an argument without resorting to insults and profanity.  That is the sign of an emotionally weak person.

 

I have written two posts on this thread full of evidence.  One was in direct response to you, the other was an enhancement of a reply by ex-minister to you.

I have seen no response from you, nor any evidence to support your claims.  I have been very polite.  You do not need to reply to me if you are feeling too much discomfort from your cognitive dissonance.  I do wish you would stop lumping me in with other people, however.  Thank you.

 

  .. what she said.

 

 


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ProzacDeathWish wrote:TWD39

ProzacDeathWish wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

 

"Boo Hoo, my post is being ignored after I worked so hard to write that big attack against those evil Christians.  "

   

                   How are you "ignoring" my post if you reply to it  .....are you a complete fucking idiot ?

 

I wasn't speaking directly for myself.  Hence the quotes.  Now who is the idiot? 

 

      

 

      


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TWD39 wrote:I am able to

TWD39 wrote:

I am able to present an argument without resorting to insults and profanity.  That is the sign of an emotionally weak person.

or a person who has very little patience with fools.

"I asked my father,
I said, 'Father change my name.'
The one I'm using now it's covered up
with fear and filth and cowardice and shame."
--Leonard Cohen


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TWD39 wrote:I respond LIFI

TWD39 wrote:

I respond LIFI formation.  Therefore, stopping adding more nonsense replies and I'll get to it eventually.  Understand?   Probably not.  Your replies calling me stupid are nothing but a waste of time and space.

 

My reply did not call you stupid, it said you were acting stupid. There is a difference, Understand?

My replies to your posts are not 'nonsense' but actual attempts at genuine discussion, Understand?

You have ignored many of my points, questions, and posts. This is why I am annoyed, Understand?

Secularist, Atheist, Skeptic, Freethinker


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ThunderJones wrote:My reply

ThunderJones wrote:

My reply did not call you stupid, it said you were acting stupid. There is a difference, Understand?

My replies to your posts are not 'nonsense' but actual attempts at genuine discussion, Understand?

You have ignored many of my points, questions, and posts. This is why I am annoyed, Understand?

It takes TIME to get through all of these posts while on vacation and the backlog is getting MORE BACKED UP !

Especially with all of us evil, bullying, psychopathic atheists that exist to torment the christian people and can not hear ANY assertions about the Tower of Babel, or was it a Tower of Babble ?

Smiling

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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harleysportster wrote:

ThunderJones wrote:

My reply did not call you stupid, it said you were acting stupid. There is a difference, Understand?

My replies to your posts are not 'nonsense' but actual attempts at genuine discussion, Understand?

You have ignored many of my points, questions, and posts. This is why I am annoyed, Understand?

It takes TIME to get through all of these posts while on vacation and the backlog is getting MORE BACKED UP !

Especially with all of us evil, bullying, psychopathic atheists that exist to torment the christian people and can not hear ANY assertions about the Tower of Babel, or was it a Tower of Babble ?

Smiling

but he's not giving up, oh no.  us godless would-be murderers would LOOOVE that, but he ain't giving up!  even though this website is full of filibustering bullies who won't even let a good man SPEAK and are constantly PESTERING him for answers he HAS but needs more time to WRITE, a good christian martyr just has to suffer such things for the glory of god and his kingdom.  unless, of course, us heathens would just give him the lAST WORD...

"I asked my father,
I said, 'Father change my name.'
The one I'm using now it's covered up
with fear and filth and cowardice and shame."
--Leonard Cohen


harleysportster
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iwbiek wrote:harleysportster

iwbiek wrote:

harleysportster wrote:

ThunderJones wrote:

My reply did not call you stupid, it said you were acting stupid. There is a difference, Understand?

My replies to your posts are not 'nonsense' but actual attempts at genuine discussion, Understand?

You have ignored many of my points, questions, and posts. This is why I am annoyed, Understand?

It takes TIME to get through all of these posts while on vacation and the backlog is getting MORE BACKED UP !

Especially with all of us evil, bullying, psychopathic atheists that exist to torment the christian people and can not hear ANY assertions about the Tower of Babel, or was it a Tower of Babble ?

Smiling

but he's not giving up, oh no.  us godless would-be murderers would LOOOVE that, but he ain't giving up!  even though this website is full of filibustering bullies who won't even let a good man SPEAK and are constantly PESTERING him for answers he HAS but needs more time to WRITE, a good christian martyr just has to suffer such things for the glory of god and his kingdom.  unless, of course, us heathens would just give him the lAST WORD...

SEE ! The backlog is getting more back up with all this bullying Atheist mockery ! Maybe it is god's will that we can't find the Tower of Babble. After all, god values "faith" and suspension of things like logic and reason above all else.

Perhaps god is testing those researchers that can not find the evidence. If they can not find the evidence and refuse to believe, then they are just going to have to burn in hell. In a lake of fire FOREVER  !

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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harleysportster wrote:iwbiek

harleysportster wrote:

iwbiek wrote:

harleysportster wrote:

ThunderJones wrote:

My reply did not call you stupid, it said you were acting stupid. There is a difference, Understand?

My replies to your posts are not 'nonsense' but actual attempts at genuine discussion, Understand?

You have ignored many of my points, questions, and posts. This is why I am annoyed, Understand?

It takes TIME to get through all of these posts while on vacation and the backlog is getting MORE BACKED UP !

Especially with all of us evil, bullying, psychopathic atheists that exist to torment the christian people and can not hear ANY assertions about the Tower of Babel, or was it a Tower of Babble ?

Smiling

but he's not giving up, oh no.  us godless would-be murderers would LOOOVE that, but he ain't giving up!  even though this website is full of filibustering bullies who won't even let a good man SPEAK and are constantly PESTERING him for answers he HAS but needs more time to WRITE, a good christian martyr just has to suffer such things for the glory of god and his kingdom.  unless, of course, us heathens would just give him the lAST WORD...

SEE ! The backlog is getting more back up with all this bullying Atheist mockery ! Maybe it is god's will that we can't find the Tower of Babble. After all, god values "faith" and suspension of things like logic and reason above all else.

Perhaps god is testing those researchers that can not find the evidence. If they can not find the evidence and refuse to believe, then they are just going to have to burn in hell. In a lake of fire FOREVER  !

 

So you reply in sarcastic fashion about bullying atheist mockery in a mocking fashion.  Kinda defeats the purpose if there is one.   And let's face it, ancient ruins are not going to convnice you that God is real.  Bible archaelogy is a field onto its own, completely ignored by the secular world.

http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/biblehistorydaily/

 


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Thanks TWD. Interesting

Thanks TWD. Interesting website. Created a new forum topic about how christianity became anti-woman from the first article I saw. I didn't know you would be cool with that. I only tell you this here in case you miss the separate thread found here


http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/32807

Religion Kills !!!

Numbers 31:17-18 - Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

http://jesus-needs-money.blogspot.com/


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TWD39 wrote: And let's face

TWD39 wrote:
And let's face it, ancient ruins are not going to convnice you that God is real.  Bible archaelogy is a field onto its own, completely ignored by the secular world.

Because biblical archaelogists are notoriously untrustworthy. Pseudo-archealogy. Planting fake artifacts, blatantly lieing about their finds, and refusing to let others check to see if they are being honest, and much more.

Some, I'm sure, are honest. Enough aren't, however, to ruin the field's trustworthyness.

I mean, hey, Noah's Ark has been 'discovered' like two dozen times now.

I'm sure that now you will complain about my response to your response, in lieu of replying intelligently. The weird thing is, if you reply to someone, they usually reply back. OHMIGAWD. REALLY?

Yep. It's true.

Secularist, Atheist, Skeptic, Freethinker


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ThunderJones wrote:You have

ThunderJones wrote:

You have made the claim that NO animal has any type of moral compass. Prove it.

 

 

Wait,  you are the one making the extraordinary claim that animals have morals?  By your creed, shouldn't you be proving that animals have morals?  A moral choice at the very least would require a deviation from the animal's normal behavior pattern or routine.  If animals had morals, why do they act like beasts?  For years, Siegfried & Roy has entertained audiences with their white tigers.  They loved them dearly.  They probably felt like the tigers loved them back.  Then one day out of the blue, the tiger viciously attacks Roy and almost kills him.  Remember the chimp who ripped off the face of the owner's friend?   Humans make the mistake of protecting human like traits onto these creatures, and feel safe that they wouldn't harm then.  The animal knows no morality.  It attacks because of its animal nature.   Your examples really don't prove morality.  It is programmed behavioral responses especially if they do these things all the time.

 

 

ThunderJones wrote:

Humans ALSO make decisions based on instinct. How else would an infant function?

 

The point is humans operate primarily on emotional responses unlike animals.  A group of monkeys in one zoo pretty much acts the same way as a group of monkeys in another zoo.  Can you say the same for humans?

 

 

ThunderJones wrote:

Mice can make plenty of logical choices. They learn from experience, reason out basic logic problems like mazes. How is that any different than a more limited version of what humans do?

 

Mice can learn a maze simply by memorizing and trial and error.  That isn't proof that they worked out a logical solution.

 

ThunderJones wrote:

Many animals are quite capable of emotions, albeit a more limited range. Dogs are an obvious example.

 

Why would it be limited?  Because of brain size?  How do you really know an animal is experiencing human emotion?  Because of their expression?  That's a pretty big assumption.

 

ThunderJones wrote:

Human behavior has many unpredictable aspects, however it has many parts that are quite predictable. Emotional needs and responses to stimuli are very similair across the board, for most people.

Animal behavior is somewhat predictable, given that we have greater intelligence, and lots of data. Predictability is very subjective. Human behavior gets less predictable every day as science learns things about us. Humans are just harder to predict, because we are more complex. This is a relevant difference, but not a sign that we are somehow fundamentally different.

 

Take a group of 10 dogs and observe their actions.  They will either bark, lay down, stratch, wag their tails, yawn, and so on.  Take a group of 10 humans, and each one of them will act completely different.  We are all unique and respond to emotional needs and stimuli drastically different.  Some people can weather a tragedy well.  Others may commit suicide.  Others may turn to alcohol.  It's unpredictable behavior.

 

 

ThunderJones wrote:

 

Humans have a need of self identity.  Animals only care about sleeping, eating, mating etc...

Not true. More social animals desire companionship, pets often desire to please their masters. Animals interact in complex ways not at all covered by sleeping, eating, and mating. a 'need for self-identity' does not prove anything about humans other than the fact that they desire identity.

 

It proves that humans are different.  Animals don't need to feel special and unique.

ThunderJones wrote:

Really really wrong.

Primates have a significant capacity for creativity. They can do many things small children do, such as fit the right shape blocks in the holes, or build with small blocks. They can learn to sing with certain tones they can speak properly, and more than just repeating things they have heard.

Ants, who have very little intelligence, have amazing problem-solving abilities. Problem-solving requires creativity, in case you didn't know. Ants build giant hives, create living-ant bridges and ant super-highways. No creativity? Really?

 

Really, have ants decided to go against the normal and create like a Taj Mahal hive?  No it pretty much all looks the same.  But if you feel that way about ants then why yes you are commiting mass murder against these creatures when hiring an exterminator. 

 

Primates may have showed some intelligence by trial and error through reward incentive.  Oh I don't get the treat when I use the block, try another, oh finally I get the treat.  Doesn't prove that the creature reasoned that the shape of the object matched the outline.

 

According to this website, primates have very limited language ability too:

 

"Many researches have tried to teach primates language, and while some chimps and apes have been more successful than others in language acquisition, the end result has always shown that primates can only learn language to a certain extent, and usually only things related to stimulus-controlled phenomena like eating and drinking."

 

 

http://www.inforefuge.com/contrasting-human-language-with-animal-communication

 

See, I have no problem addressing your arguments.  Are you going to stop complaining that I ignore your posts?

 

 

 

 

 

 


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ThunderJones wrote:TWD39

ThunderJones wrote:

TWD39 wrote:
And let's face it, ancient ruins are not going to convnice you that God is real.  Bible archaelogy is a field onto its own, completely ignored by the secular world.

Because biblical archaelogists are notoriously untrustworthy. Pseudo-archealogy. Planting fake artifacts, blatantly lieing about their finds, and refusing to let others check to see if they are being honest, and much more.

Some, I'm sure, are honest. Enough aren't, however, to ruin the field's trustworthyness.

I mean, hey, Noah's Ark has been 'discovered' like two dozen times now.

I'm sure that now you will complain about my response to your response, in lieu of replying intelligently. The weird thing is, if you reply to someone, they usually reply back. OHMIGAWD. REALLY?

Yep. It's true.

 

Ahhh you wouldn't be just a tad bit biased against archaeologists who support the Bible, would ya?  How about some solid proof or examples showing that they manipulate and plant fake artifacts?

 

Noah's ark discovery claims have often proven to be hoaxes.  People know that such a claim will give them instant fame so hence the hoax.  Discoveries from legitimate bible archaeologists rarely get much press. 

 


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Ugh, I have to. Don't feel

Ugh, I have to. Don't feel you need to respond to this right away. I don't want to burden you overmuch.

TWD39 wrote:
The point is humans operate primarily on emotional responses unlike animals.

Animals have been observed to have emotions. In this very thread, Old Seer posted a link to studies of emotions in primates.
Anyone who's ever owned a pet of the mammal variety knows they have emotions. Other species can be trickier to identify with, but mammals are similar enough that those people who excel at reading emotions can read those emotions in mammals pretty easily. I'm one of them.

TWD39 wrote:
A group of monkeys in one zoo pretty much acts the same way as a group of monkeys in another zoo.  Can you say the same for humans?

Actually, yes. All humans share a range of behaviours.

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cj
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TWD39 wrote: Ahhh you

TWD39 wrote:

 

Ahhh you wouldn't be just a tad bit biased against archaeologists who support the Bible, would ya?  How about some solid proof or examples showing that they manipulate and plant fake artifacts?

 

Noah's ark discovery claims have often proven to be hoaxes.  People know that such a claim will give them instant fame so hence the hoax.  Discoveries from legitimate bible archaeologists rarely get much press. 

 

 

Any one who is published in a peer reviewed journal is more trustworthy than someone who refuses to have their work reviewed by their peers.  Archaeologists review other archaeologists.  In fact, archaeologists in the Middle East come in all religions and no religions.  It is called the "Cradle of Civilization" for a reason.  This is the first land out of Africa for all human migrations.  And so there are a lot of archaeological sites, prehistoric and historic.  And archaeologists of all religions and no religion study what happened in that area.

I've mentioned Finkelstein and Silberman before, they definitely are not of the literal bible truth variety.  Yet, if you bother to read their books, they do mention scholars and archaeologists who are religious and they acknowledge their accomplishments if the work is well done. 

A good scientist doesn't care what your personal beliefs are - including your personal religion or lack of - if your work is done in a scientific and logical fashion.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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My nice long labor day

My nice long labor day weekend has come to a close, unfortunately.

I will reply to your posts in full as soon as I get a chance. (Look! It took, like, five seconds to make a note that a reply might be delayed slightly!).

In the mean time, would you like to describe some of these 'legitimate archaelogical finds' that prove the Bible's events happened? All throughout your conversations in this forum you have alluded to this big 'mountain of evidence' in archaeology that 'we mean atheists' are denying. Any examples?

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TWD39 wrote: And let's face

TWD39 wrote:

 

And let's face it, ancient ruins are not going to convnice you that God is real.

that's true.  ancient ruins are going to convince me that ancient ruins are real.  because there's still something called an unjustified logical leap between finding a heap of stones in mesopotamia that might be the remains of the foundation of an old tower and the conclusion that therefore everything in the bible must be true and god exists.

after all, they're pretty sure they've found troy, yet only a moron would say that means everything in the iliad is 100% true, gods were coming down to fight alongside men, and achilles could only die when stabbed in his heel.

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I said, 'Father change my name.'
The one I'm using now it's covered up
with fear and filth and cowardice and shame."
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TWD39 wrote: How do you

TWD39 wrote:

 How do you really know an animal is experiencing human emotion?  Because of their expression?  That's a pretty big assumption.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/B8ISzf2pryI

I don't think it's a massive assumption to say that this dog is experiencing guilt. That's a human emotion.

 

Anyway, don't worry about replying to this - I'd prefer to stay on track about the origins and proof of the Babel myth, so if you feel like answering my questions on this, they are in posts #125 and #133.

 

Thanks.

 

 


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GodsUseForAMosquito

GodsUseForAMosquito wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/embed/B8ISzf2pryI

I don't think it's a massive assumption to say that this dog is experiencing guilt. That's a human emotion.

 

Anyway, don't worry about replying to this - I'd prefer to stay on track about the origins and proof of the Babel myth, so if you feel like answering my questions on this, they are in posts #125 and #133.

 

Thanks.

 

That dog did not even have an attorney present during questioning ! I am not convinced the dog was guilty and think someone needs to work pro-bono for that case.

It's obvious to me that the dog did it, PLANTED THE EVIDENCE, and the dog was a stand up dog and refused to snitch, the dog has a right to a fair trial.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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. . .

Re :: The Right Response might be in providing an answer . .

harleysportster wrote:

GodsUseForAMosquito wrote:

 

Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye." (Matthew 7:1-5 RSV)

I notice that he conveniently ignored danatemporary's post and went with the easiest one that he could type a one sentence answer to. The troll badge will be in route at this rate.

 

 No, apparently we are being conditioned to wait. It'll either make you bitter or better. No no no. Like most things, It's all in how you look at things . . .

See:Image

  

 

Image location . . . https://i.chzbgr.com/completestore/12/9/16/UyzvEB1N0kqM5d7L2TZxdA2.jpg

  [url=http://img44.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=28462_patience_is_a_virtue___122_492lo.JPG] 

 


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TWD39 wrote:ProzacDeathWish

TWD39 wrote:

ProzacDeathWish wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

 

Profanity is the resource of weak minded people, IMO.

 

   TWD39 said in post #34

 

  

TWD39 wrote:
I'm not a FUCKING idiot, and you fail miserably to answer my question."

 

                   Nice to meet you, you weak-minded idiot.

 

I was merely quoting back the exact terminology that was hurled at me.  It was not a creation of my own expression or thought.   If you are going to hold that ridiculous standard of legalism then a person would be a racist for quoting a racial term used in a speech by a racist. 

The word itself is harmless.  It's the context, intent and heart of the man behind the word which enters the realm of sin nature.   In this instance, the poster used this word to insult my intelligence.

 

 I don't have to use profanity as a crutch to get a reaction out of my opponent.  On that basis alone, Christians are much better people than atheists.

 

I'll give you this much - you haven't created an original thought yet.

"I do this real moron thing, and it's called thinking. And apparently I'm not a very good American because I like to form my own opinions."
— George Carlin


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TWD39 wrote:I don't have to

TWD39 wrote:

I don't have to use profanity as a crutch to get a reaction out of my opponent.  On that basis alone, Christians are much better people than atheists.

Would you like me to give you some examples of Christians using profanity?  I think you may be surprised...

 

What makes you think Christians are much better people than atheists?  Ever heard an atheist tell someone he/she deserves eternal fiery torment?

 


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blacklight915 wrote:TWD39

blacklight915 wrote:

TWD39 wrote:

I don't have to use profanity as a crutch to get a reaction out of my opponent.  On that basis alone, Christians are much better people than atheists.

Would you like me to give you some examples of Christians using profanity?  I think you may be surprised...

 

What makes you think Christians are much better people than atheists?  Ever heard an atheist tell someone he/she deserves eternal fiery torment?

 

 

What's better, spending time showing love and helping your neighbor, or devoting your life to trashing the message of Christianity and mocking Christians? 


Beyond Saving
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TWD39 wrote:What's better,

TWD39 wrote:

What's better, spending time showing love and helping your neighbor, or devoting your life to trashing the message of Christianity and mocking Christians? 

Are the two mutually exclusive? I can love my neighbors and mock christianity at the same time. Of course, christianity is such an absurdly large target that trashing it requires about as much thought as breathing.

The big question is why do consider certain words to be "profanity", it seems like a colossal waste of time to get upset over someone using a word you consider profane. That is time you could be helping your fucking neighbor... 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X