Old Seers Corner
Being that I'm causing to many threads to be hijacked I find it necessary to establish my own thread. I don't like the idea because in my world we don't engage much in self importance, a little but not much. And this seems to be getting into that area and I'm not comfortable with it.
Another is- where do I start. so after a bit of deliberation it occurred to me, why not start it where we (our group) started in 1985, and that was with biblical creation.
To us, as we learned over time, creation is not a material undertaking but rather spiritual. In 1985 we had no idea where this would lead. Personally I/we wasn't out to accomplish anything. It was a simple question given to a group of guys that were into various fields of life's work in which they made their monies for living as we all do, or at least in our case, did. Having met one of them by a chance meeting as he passed through town we got into a conversation of various interest as people normally do. He informed me of his club/group and among then was a Physicist which peaked my interest as I am also a Physicist, at least to some degree (old school). At that time I was an Atheist considering JC to be a street magician making a living.
I gave this "Smurf" several questions for The Physics Smurf (he referred to the group as a Smurfdom). The question was --creation doesn't match the laws of physics, things are out of order. And in giving my understanding of what it might be I gave a short list of my suspicions. The main suspicion was that it might be something spiritual because the bible mentions spirituals all over the place, and had no idea what it was all about.
A few week later as he passed through town again he dropped of a packet at the place we met, a local eatery. I was informed they were going to take on an analysis of creation and that it was something they hadn't seen before, and the Physicist confirmed that it wasn't physics feasible---he sent it to the Psycho Smurfs, That's when it really took off in directions no one suspected.
They determined it was something mental, and for whatever reason and how they saw it, it was a state of mind. Now here's the deal----IF, we are correct, this understanding of creation totally negates Christianity as is understood by the world. It literally destroys what is understood as Christianity. Because everything in the book is based and constructed and referred to from creation being the focal point. An Apostle refers to- those invisible things of creation which can be clearly seen, meaning- they recognize creation as a spiritual undertaking and that makes it a horse of a different color. As everything else in the book Christianity hinges on Creation, and Christianity is about spiritual things not material things. Then- there is no such thing as Christianity as an operating religion anywhere on planet earth.
Any questions are welcome.
The only possible thing the world needs saving from are those running it.
Old Seer wrote:
What you're dealing with there is the old testament. The OT isn't Christianity, it's the Hebrew civil system. This is the mistake the Europeans made/make. If one is to go by the OT then there's no point in having the NT. The reason we see the Euros use the OT is because it matches "their" idea of controlling a society.
everything is due to creation. You'll find it's reference used throughout the book. The book of Ezekiel- the vision that includes the lion, eagle/vulture, calf, face. The lion in creation = creeping thing,cat,predator. The eagle,=fowls of the air/firmament, status. The calf=innocent party/people/worker/ox. The face= nimrod, phony/liar/false front, false image, looking human but working the animal behind, the ruling class. This whole vision is symbolic of civilization. Namely, a class system run by liars.
You've previously used the old testament to provide examples of the hidden message. If you don't use it all, then you're just cherry picking. So my question stands - how does the Zechariah quote fit into your analysis?
(You have an excellent question. I'm glad you asked this)
in the OT and in Hebrew history that pertain to the coming of a Messiah and or the end times. But not all in the OT applies.
I can't see how your present OT passage is reference is in conjunction with JC or the end times. But the Hebrew religion as a whole is dependent on Creation as the main construction point, as well as Christianity.
Here's one (off hand) Go to OT Mali chi Ch 2:3. The Levites/priests will have dung on their faces.
OK, here's how it works (bear in mind we do not know every last detail of the book), Once one reaches a certain amount of knowledge on what the book is about one sees the intended mission. In this case the dung on their faces pertains to the end time. The Levites were the priestly class/tribe in the construction of Hebrew society. As in the general use of anyone,s language their terminology is used. In this case- Levite is equal to religious leader or clergymen in English. In the end time it is proven or shown that the world is on the wrong course--and who's leading the world---religious and secular leaders. When the people at large see the fallacy of how this is run the leaders will--have shit on there faces. It is a common term used today for a liar, hypocrite, or deceiver that's been exposed, and that is government and religious leaders the world over. With all their high kaflootinness not a single social problem has ever been solved---and over a time span of 6000 years. The knowledge of the book then, can be transferred to any society or civilization as all are constructed the same, and the propagation and maintenance is done by leaders, in today's world -religious and secular. But in the Hebrew society there was no secular as it was all religion---however, in the Hebrew mind there is no difference between civil and secular--they are both considered the same. And they are right. What we consider the "secular" is still a religion, and nothing more then the masses following those who've taken the place of God (overriding self rule). The purpose of those who lead in religion and civil government are exactly the same. Power over the masses prevails by belief--in any case- a belief in those who run the show. All religion of today is nothing but mini civilizations within the big circus tent. The Vatican has pulled the trick of creating itself as a mini civilization on religious grounds--it's all the same. Everyone one has become victims of terminology. Control of the masses partially is done by skewing words. Who controls the meaning of words controls the people.
Here's another for the end time---I will confound the wisdom of the wise and make fools out of the scholars. How many theologians are the in the world, and how long have there been theologians. The only reason there's theologians is because they haven't got it right. Consider the absurdity---people are following those who don't know. The same with government---all government has to operate on is---If.
I see all the book of Malachi as dealing with the end times. I can understand it but changing it from the Hebrew mentality to Euro mentality is mind boggling. The two thought processes and terminologies are different. It's hell on wheels to translate it into Euro thinking.
The "I" in Malachi can be the same as--- the people of the end times--- as in Hebrew and Christianity it's people that are God. But Malachi is dealing with his own people but the undersatnding can be transferred to any on the planet. What goes for Hebrew society goes for all other societies, as they all involve the same components.
The only possible thing the world needs saving from are those running it.