Very loud and strange sound heard in a neighborhood in Dallas, OR.

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Very loud and strange sound heard in a neighborhood in Dallas, OR.

http://youtu.be/M8ccEPOhvlo

I am not sure what to make of this. A lot of Christians are going crazy on YouTube of course, thinking it's end-time type of stuff, and others are saying it's UFO-related, and then some are thinking it's all fake. What do you guys think?


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 The video says it might be

 The video says it might be solar radiation hitting the atmosphere or something.  That's an interesting hypothesis - only I'd say it's at night, away from the sun. What about cosmic rays?

Well, of course aurora borealis doesn't make any sound and it's hell of a more visible phenomenon.

My sources say something on that topic. They say not to worry.

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Zeeboe wrote:

http://youtu.be/M8ccEPOhvlo

I am not sure what to make of this. A lot of Christians are going crazy on YouTube of course, thinking it's end-time type of stuff, and others are saying it's UFO-related, and then some are thinking it's all fake. What do you guys think?

Search for strange sounds on youtube. There are dozens of them. However there are very few hits for google news. Obviously there is simple fraud to account for (Look at all the views I got!) but very few appear to be worth a news report. If everyone is honest the sounds are very localized.

 

 

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It's bullshit. When I

It's bullshit. When I googled "strange noises dallas oregon" I got all these UFO and End of Days websites. Nothing in google news, nothing on a 'normal" website.

The other thing I noticed was that the fucking street was empty. I mean, come on...  the noise was loud enough that the entire fucking city should be awake... but nope... the fucking street is empty. Like where are the interviews with other neighbors? Why isn't this in the news? Why is this only one person, with one video, which is obviously a fake since the audio overlay is messed up (did you notice?).

Fail.

 

 

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If space junk or a meteor

If space junk or a meteor are going fast enough when they hit the atmosphere they can create a sonic boom. In any case, not knowing the source of something doesn't make a god real or little green men real. So you have two choices. It is faked, or it is a natural unknown source.

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My gut reaction is telling

My gut reaction is telling me this is a prank. I think some guys turned up the volume and decided to play some music for everyone. Although there is of course a strong chance the woman in the video is apart of it, and it could just be something she or a group did on her computer, then put it on the film. The first time I saw this, I wondered why none of the neighbors came outside. I'm also wondering why no one called the police. So yeah, I'm on Team Bullshit on this one. And it's pretty funny seeing so many Christians freak out on YouTube. lol. But that's why they're Christians. They read or hear or see crazy stuff, and they just assume things, and never bother to think it through.
 


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Brian37 wrote:
If space junk or a meteor are going fast enough when they hit the atmosphere they can create a sonic boom. In any case, not knowing the source of something doesn't make a god real or little green men real. So you have two choices. It is faked, or it is a natural unknown source.

In one case a man reported hearing meteorite noises in real time but his wife heard nothing. He said took him a while to realize he was wearing a hearing aid. He could have written about his psychic powers and special sensitivity instead.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

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Serious media may hesitate

Serious media may hesitate to publish unusual articles, regardles of their truth. 

For example, there were found cave paintings in India, thousands of years old. They seem to resemble (read: totally look like) an extraterrestrial in a space suit, flying saucer and a wormhole. (more about the caves)

The publishers however need to make a pragmatic decision. Will they maintain the sober reputation of the Times or Guardian by omitting one small news item, or will they publish all facts and attract the unwanted crowd of UFO crazies, ruining the magazine reputation and lowering the sales to regular serious readers? It's a simple conservativism, no deliberate desire to keep anything under cover.

 

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Luminon wrote:Serious media

Luminon wrote:

Serious media may hesitate to publish unusual articles, regardles of their truth. 

For example, there were found cave paintings in India, thousands of years old. They seem to resemble (read: totally look like) an extraterrestrial in a space suit, flying saucer and a wormhole. (more about the caves)

The publishers however need to make a pragmatic decision. Will they maintain the sober reputation of the Times or Guardian by omitting one small news item, or will they publish all facts and attract the unwanted crowd of UFO crazies, ruining the magazine reputation and lowering the sales to regular serious readers? It's a simple conservativism, no deliberate desire to keep anything under cover.

I can't remember where I read this, but there was a researcher who took all the discovered paintings in caves and compared them. They made a nice cross referencing of all the types of paintings (animals, painted hands, sexual, hunting, etc).

They found that in ever continent of almost all the tribes of those periods, they had pictures which he had to classify as "extraterrestrial&quotEye-wink because they either had an object which looked like a spaceman or a spacecraft like drawing. Some of the spacemen were boxed, some rounded, some had eyes or a visor, others were void of facial features. The same goes for the space craft.

The funny thing about the cross referencing is that there were other non-extraterrestrial paintings which were the same. So does this mean humans as a whole paint these things from imagination? Are the coincidental? or maybe it's drugs?

 

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Probable UFO hoax

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread631182/pg1

This site seems to be a mix of true UFO believers and skeptics and their conclusion is that this image was first seen in a 2007 documentary and is probably a hoax though possibly a Bradshaw.

Look at the post on page 2  reply posted on 18-11-2010 @ 02:35 AM by this_is_who_we_are

 

I can't find much else about it as most searches lead to David Icke.

 


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x wrote:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread631182/pg1

This site seems to be a mix of true UFO believers and skeptics and their conclusion is that this image was first seen in a 2007 documentary and is probably a hoax though possibly a Bradshaw.

Look at the post on page 2  reply posted on 18-11-2010 @ 02:35 AM by this_is_who_we_are

 

I can't find much else about it as most searches lead to David Icke.

 

I agree with the one post about how this appears to be a hoax because the "scientist" can not be verified and that the information given is very sparse.

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 The thing about UFO's of

 The thing about UFO's of the alien type is that I am convinced that it is perfectly possible. At some point in the future, maybe tomorrow maybe a million years from now, there actually could be an alien spacecraft. It would be a real shame if such an event was written off as a hoax because so many people have falsely cried wolf. That being said, I don't think there is any evidence that aliens have visited us yet and these videos are either intentional frauds or wishful thinking. 

 

If we ever do have actual contact with aliens I suspect that the first form of contact will not be face to face. If any being manages to solve the problem of traveling across the universe it is far more likely that the first contact will be in the form of an unmanned scientific vessel or a random piece of wreckage that crashes into us.

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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Beyond Saving wrote: The

Beyond Saving wrote:

 The thing about UFO's of the alien type is that I am convinced that it is perfectly possible. At some point in the future, maybe tomorrow maybe a million years from now, there actually could be an alien spacecraft. It would be a real shame if such an event was written off as a hoax because so many people have falsely cried wolf. That being said, I don't think there is any evidence that aliens have visited us yet and these videos are either intentional frauds or wishful thinking. 

 

If we ever do have actual contact with aliens I suspect that the first form of contact will not be face to face. If any being manages to solve the problem of traveling across the universe it is far more likely that the first contact will be in the form of an unmanned scientific vessel or a random piece of wreckage that crashes into us.

One way to look at it is, that when the planet doesn't have advanced technology (no radio or TV transmissions detectable) then it's possible to land safely and privately. This is why there are people like Dogons who knew that Sirius is a double star, because some amphibian visitors from the space told them. The descriptions are pretty detailed. Another example are some cannibal tribesmen on New Guinea who till this day perform rituals and dances of aliens in space suits made of wickers. We can find similar legends in China, middle East, India, south America and so on. Looks like we had quite a vacations resort before the civilization came.

But today the space is full of our transmissions and everyone passing around knows that the moment they land shit will hit the fan. There would be massive reaction from the public, media, military and so on. Not a moment of peace and quiet. No more vacations among submissive and ignorant tribesmen. No wonder they avoid us.

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Luminon wrote:Beyond Saving

Luminon wrote:

Beyond Saving wrote:

 The thing about UFO's of the alien type is that I am convinced that it is perfectly possible. At some point in the future, maybe tomorrow maybe a million years from now, there actually could be an alien spacecraft. It would be a real shame if such an event was written off as a hoax because so many people have falsely cried wolf. That being said, I don't think there is any evidence that aliens have visited us yet and these videos are either intentional frauds or wishful thinking. 

 

If we ever do have actual contact with aliens I suspect that the first form of contact will not be face to face. If any being manages to solve the problem of traveling across the universe it is far more likely that the first contact will be in the form of an unmanned scientific vessel or a random piece of wreckage that crashes into us.

One way to look at it is, that when the planet doesn't have advanced technology (no radio or TV transmissions detectable) then it's possible to land safely and privately. This is why there are people like Dogons who knew that Sirius is a double star, because some amphibian visitors from the space told them. The descriptions are pretty detailed. Another example are some cannibal tribesmen on New Guinea who till this day perform rituals and dances of aliens in space suits made of wickers. We can find similar legends in China, middle East, India, south America and so on. Looks like we had quite a vacations resort before the civilization came.

But today the space is full of our transmissions and everyone passing around knows that the moment they land shit will hit the fan. There would be massive reaction from the public, media, military and so on. Not a moment of peace and quiet. No more vacations among submissive and ignorant tribesmen. No wonder they avoid us.

While I believe that there is life forming on other planets and I believe that there are civilizations out there more (way more) advanced that we are, the odds that aliens found us are pretty limited. If you look at the history of UFO's you will see a trend in the popularity of it and that before a specific time the thought of aliens coming to visit us was non-exist ant.

Thanks to sci-fi writers, television and technology the public has gone crazy on the subject.

Also, as in regard to the Dogons. I find it more likely that they had never believed this previously and it was through outside sources that they found the knowledge from; I do not believe they had prior knowledge of the second star.

It has been suggested that they originally thought that Venus was the second star because of the path Venus takes in relation to Sirius. This path also coincides with an important religious festival which might explain how the mix up between researcher and tribal wise men took place.

I'd also like to point out that the Dogons claim there is a third star. Science has yet to confirm this so most people in the field will sit back and wait while our technology investigates. If there is no 3rd star then the Dogons wisdom was infected from outside sources. If it is true then it could be a basis for research on how they know (aka aliens) or that it could be a lucky guess?

Either way, stories like this are far too common. The Incas knew the Earth was round long before any one else in Europe or China knew. They also had masks that looked alien. Does this mean they were visited by aliens? No.

 

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Luminon wrote:
Serious media may hesitate to publish unusual articles, regardles of their truth.

Not in my part of the country. Strange smells are almost regular features TV crews and all.

Quote:
For example, there were found cave paintings in India, thousands of years old. They seem to resemble (read: totally look like) an extraterrestrial in a space suit, flying saucer and a wormhole. (more about the caves)

Which begs the question how you learned what real aliens look like in real alien space suits. It boggles the mind anyone would pretend to know what a wormhole looks likes. I leave the appearance of a "real" flying saucer as an exercise for the reader.

Quote:
The publishers however need to make a pragmatic decision. Will they maintain the sober reputation of the Times or Guardian by omitting one small news item, or will they publish all facts and attract the unwanted crowd of UFO crazies, ruining the magazine reputation and lowering the sales to regular serious readers? It's a simple conservativism, no deliberate desire to keep anything under cover.

Pictures and films of one more blurry or non-descript light in the sky does nothing but take up space and adds nothing. That there are dozens if not hundreds of amateurs faking images does not help. And as the warming element of an egg incubator has become iconic as a "real" UFO picture, having far outlived its debunking with clear photos of the hardware, there is really no point in encouraging those so desperate to believe.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

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Beyond Saving wrote:
The thing about UFO's of the alien type is that I am convinced that it is perfectly possible. At some point in the future, maybe tomorrow maybe a million years from now, there actually could be an alien spacecraft. It would be a real shame if such an event was written off as a hoax because so many people have falsely cried wolf. That being said, I don't think there is any evidence that aliens have visited us yet and these videos are either intentional frauds or wishful thinking.
 

If tomorrow there is one more one time unidentfied light in the sky I fail to see the value of noticing it or loss in missing it.

If you use google news set up a filter for UFO. They are very common. If 1% of the truly unidentified are real we are a popular destination. But what does it matter if it is just one more fuzzy light in the sky? Should a "real" one appear and it is not obvious by inspection in an entirely different class from everything else what would it matter?

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

www.giwersworld.org/made-in-alexandria/index.html

www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml


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Luminon wrote:
One way to look at it is, that when the planet doesn't have advanced technology (no radio or TV transmissions detectable) then it's possible to land safely and privately. This is why there are people like Dogons who knew that Sirius is a double star, because some amphibian visitors from the space told them. The descriptions are pretty detailed. Another example are some cannibal tribesmen on New Guinea who till this day perform rituals and dances of aliens in space suits made of wickers. We can find similar legends in China, middle East, India, south America and so on. Looks like we had quite a vacations resort before the civilization came.

Again "authenticity" implies a person knowledge of the real thing. Who has seen the real thing to know? And the dual star thing, when actually listening to what they say, is clearly another example of wishful thinking. The force to believe is strong in this one. 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

www.giwersworld.org/made-in-alexandria/index.html

www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml


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digitalbeachbum wrote:While

 

digitalbeachbum wrote:

While I believe that there is life forming on other planets and I believe that there are civilizations out there more (way more) advanced that we are, the odds that aliens found us are pretty limited. If you look at the history of UFO's you will see a trend in the popularity of it and that before a specific time the thought of aliens coming to visit us was non-existant. Thanks to sci-fi writers, television and technology the public has gone crazy on the subject.

Not exactly. Ancient civilizations were crazy about the subject, many of them might have called the aliens gods or demons, but the space travel bit remained. There might be a decrease of interest in UFO in medieval ages, but people still remembered to put them into paintings. Well, and then the modern age came. 

As for them finding us, the odds are very good actually. Even we have very good planet-finding technologies today and we already found potentially habitable planets. It just needs to detect stars that have planets (they wobble), pick some that have right distance from the sun not to fry or freeze, and watch their spectrum when they pass the solar disc, for water. Getting there and back might be a problem, unless they've advanced string theory to string practice.

digitalbeachbum wrote:
 Also, as in regard to the Dogons. I find it more likely that they had never believed this previously and it was through outside sources that they found the knowledge from; I do not believe they had prior knowledge of the second star.

It has been suggested that they originally thought that Venus was the second star because of the path Venus takes in relation to Sirius. This path also coincides with an important religious festival which might explain how the mix up between researcher and tribal wise men took place.

I'd also like to point out that the Dogons claim there is a third star. Science has yet to confirm this so most people in the field will sit back and wait while our technology investigates. If there is no 3rd star then the Dogons wisdom was infected from outside sources. If it is true then it could be a basis for research on how they know (aka aliens) or that it could be a lucky guess?

That's certainly possible, it would require some real digging into the subject if someone wasn't just making career on the otherwise ignorant Dogons. Looks like this guy Laird Scranton wrote a book on that. I remember from other sources that Dogons also had peculiar knowledge of cellular biology and DNA, not only the astronomy.

digitalbeachbum wrote:
 Either way, stories like this are far too common. The Incas knew the Earth was round long before any one else in Europe or China knew. They also had masks that looked alien. Does this mean they were visited by aliens? No. 
Actually, it might just as well mean that. If not, how else would our ancestors pass the message? But it doesn't mean we can change our opinion because some ancient civilization had an opinion. We're conservative, not believing in aliens worked very well for us so far, specially because our society doesn't believe in aliens. So why change that, why endanger our sane reputation? 

 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Again "authenticity" implies a person knowledge of the real thing. Who has seen the real thing to know?
 We don't need to see the real thing to know, it's easy enough to understand. Visitors. From other stars. In big flying metallic things. Wearing a heavy full body suit (a very strange concept for naked painted tribesmen wearing only their penis-cases) with windows in place of eyes, so the aliens can, you know, see where they are going. I'd say this is a pretty universal cultural theme. Don't underestimate the ancient civilizations, most of them were more interested in astronomy than today's civilization. To archeologists they must seem like whole civilizations of nerds, you know, with all these writings, sci-fi stories and astronomy obsession. In India specifically such things have tradition, you know, in Mahabharata with the elaborate description of technical principles behind the flying vimana machines. Hell, I even remember the Japanese have a fairytale of the princess Kaguya (hime), which is basically the same as the story of the Rosswell serial Smiling 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
And the dual star thing, when actually listening to what they say, is clearly another example of wishful thinking. The force to believe is strong in this one. 

Well, I've just seen too many weird things, it kind of shifts the perception of weird. Maybe this is what the open-mindedness is about. (except that, amphibians from Sirius really do sound far-fetched and Dogons drew them catfish-like) But actually listening to what people say has been the daily work of all ethnographs in both god-forsaken and god-ridden parts of the world. Seems like a good idea to me. Sorry, but beachbum's objections seem more reasonable to me. There are some hits but also misses, the third Sirius star is unlikely and Dogons had some funny ideas of Sirius once being in our solar system instead of our sun. No tribesman is perfect, apparently. 

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Luminon wrote:Not exactly.

Luminon wrote:

Not exactly. Ancient civilizations were crazy about the subject, many of them might have called the aliens gods or demons, but the space travel bit remained. There might be a decrease of interest in UFO in medieval ages, but people still remembered to put them into paintings. Well, and then the modern age came. 

As for them finding us, the odds are very good actually. Even we have very good planet-finding technologies today and we already found potentially habitable planets. It just needs to detect stars that have planets (they wobble), pick some that have right distance from the sun not to fry or freeze, and watch their spectrum when they pass the solar disc, for water. Getting there and back might be a problem, unless they've advanced string theory to string practice.

That's certainly possible, it would require some real digging into the subject if someone wasn't just making career on the otherwise ignorant Dogons. Looks like this guy Laird Scranton wrote a book on that. I remember from other sources that Dogons also had peculiar knowledge of cellular biology and DNA, not only the astronomy.

Actually, it might just as well mean that. If not, how else would our ancestors pass the message? But it doesn't mean we can change our opinion because some ancient civilization had an opinion. We're conservative, not believing in aliens worked very well for us so far, specially because our society doesn't believe in aliens. So why change that, why endanger our sane reputation?

The subject was very limited to a very small group of people. Today it is woven in to our culture in a much larger level of interest. The ancients civilizations you speak of are very much inflated by UFO researchers. If they see a religious head mask that looks like a robot they instantly think it was aliens who influenced it.

Actually I was thinking about them finding us, but the reverse is also true. There are about 2,000-6,000 visible stars in the night sky, but not all these are stars, some are planets and some are galaxies. I've heard estimates that there are 10^22 stars in the universe and recently that there are three times as many. While it is true that not all of these stars are a capable of supporting life, I believe that we will never be able to find another alien life form based on listening to radio or other wave sources.

The Dogons have no prior knowledge of DNA or cellular biology. The information I have found leads me to believe that the Dogons were infected with information. I see people making money off the books they write concerning this story.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Dogon_people

 

 

 

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Luminon wrote:

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Again "authenticity" implies a person knowledge of the real thing. Who has seen the real thing to know?
 

We don't need to see the real thing to know, it's easy enough to understand. Visitors. From other stars. In big flying metallic things.

Metal? Where did you get that idea?

Quote:
Wearing a heavy full body suit (a very strange concept for naked painted tribesmen wearing only their penis-cases) with windows in place of eyes, so the aliens can, you know, see where they are going. I'd say this is a pretty universal cultural theme. Don't underestimate the ancient civilizations, most of them were more interested in astronomy than today's civilization. To archeologists they must seem like whole civilizations of nerds, you know, with all these writings, sci-fi stories and astronomy obsession. In India specifically such things have tradition, you know, in Mahabharata with the elaborate description of technical principles behind the flying vimana machines. Hell, I even remember the Japanese have a fairytale of the princess Kaguya (hime), which is basically the same as the story of the Rosswell serial Smiling

Reading too much van Daniken is harmful to reason. Yes, I know he said the things you are repeating it is also true he lied, knowingly or unknowingly is the only question. The oddest thing of all is aliens looking like properly proportioned humans in the first place. That should be a very big hint to even the most ardent believer. The interest in astronomy is quite well established in ancient times. Our interest is rather far beyond keeping track of the seaons.

It should also be obvious if there were the technical description you falsely claim someone would have built one. As it is it does not raise to bad B movie standards.

Quote:
A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
And the dual star thing, when actually listening to what they say, is clearly another example of wishful thinking. The force to believe is strong in this one. 

Well, I've just seen too many weird things, it kind of shifts the perception of weird. Maybe this is what the open-mindedness is about. (except that, amphibians from Sirius really do sound far-fetched and Dogons drew them catfish-like) But actually listening to what people say has been the daily work of all ethnographs in both god-forsaken and god-ridden parts of the world. Seems like a good idea to me. Sorry, but beachbum's objections seem more reasonable to me. There are some hits but also misses, the third Sirius star is unlikely and Dogons had some funny ideas of Sirius once being in our solar system instead of our sun. No tribesman is perfect, apparently. 

I fail to see how your claim to have seen many weird things leads to some fool's idea that the drawings represent alien catfist.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

www.giwersworld.org/made-in-alexandria/index.html

www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml


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digitalbeachbum wrote:The

digitalbeachbum wrote:

 

The subject was very limited to a very small group of people. Today it is woven in to our culture in a much larger level of interest. The ancients civilizations you speak of are very much inflated by UFO researchers. If they see a religious head mask that looks like a robot they instantly think it was aliens who influenced it.

Actually I was thinking about them finding us, but the reverse is also true. There are about 2,000-6,000 visible stars in the night sky, but not all these are stars, some are planets and some are galaxies. I've heard estimates that there are 10^22 stars in the universe and recently that there are three times as many. While it is true that not all of these stars are a capable of supporting life, I believe that we will never be able to find another alien life form based on listening to radio or other wave sources.

The Dogons have no prior knowledge of DNA or cellular biology. The information I have found leads me to believe that the Dogons were infected with information. I see people making money off the books they write concerning this story.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Dogon_people

 

That's interesting, looks like there were some very irrational people visiting the land of Dogons. Melanin in the skin allows them to receive messages from Sirius, that sounds almost like a slander to say someone claimed that. So Dogons aren't a safe bet, you say. I hope I won't have to go over and look up on Google every tribe I've read about in last 15 years.

I'm influenced by the work of Arnost Vasicek, a journalist, writer and filmmaker who travels around the world in search of strange phenomena, animals, cultures and artifacts. I've read his books and been to his lecture once. Many things he found out are impressive, considering that he was there, interviewed local people, recorded their legends (or encounters) and photographed things. Yep, it looks like he went a little overboard with the mysteries, so it's important to tell his conclusions from his observations. He brought lots of tribal folk lore from around the world, which certainly vibes with the alien visitor stories. It's fun to read, but not so easy to fit this all into a single Earth's history, unless the last 100,000 years or so were really weird.

 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:

Metal? Where did you get that idea?

From Bible, I think. And Zecharia Sitchin. (not Daniken, I didn't read him much) The word "God's glory" or "kabod" in Hebrew is supposed to be a bad translation. It certainly makes no sense at all for God's glory to shake rocks off mountains or to fly or land on a hill. However, there are many words in neighbouring languages similar to "kabod" like "kibad-du" etc, which don't mean a glory but a metallic object, massive object, or even an object into which wings can be retracted. It's funny what loose bits we can sometimes find in memory, I used to read lots of this stuff when I was a kid.

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Reading too much van Daniken is harmful to reason. Yes, I know he said the things you are repeating it is also true he lied, knowingly or unknowingly is the only question. The oddest thing of all is aliens looking like properly proportioned humans in the first place. That should be a very big hint to even the most ardent believer. The interest in astronomy is quite well established in ancient times. Our interest is rather far beyond keeping track of the seaons.
This is diffcult to say, if we have a statistic sample one. But we know about convergent evolution, we know that eye evolved independently several times, we know that ecologic niches tend to shape their animals. We know that stereo vision (two eyes) and duplicity of organs is an advantage and symmetry is a standard, that upright position has many advantages (free hands, better view, free vocal chords), that water dwellers aren't likely to evolve the use of fire and toolmaking, and so on. 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 It should also be obvious if there were the technical description you falsely claim someone would have built one. As it is it does not raise to bad B movie standards.
Not really, not without an industry and science. I've read of ancient descriptions and paintings that resemble the description of ramjet engine or other technologies... Yet they are often rejected as "religious art", which is sometimes misused an academic label for something we don't understand. Even though with our technology today we can understand. 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 I fail to see how your claim to have seen many weird things leads to some fool's idea that the drawings represent alien catfist. 

No, not that idea. All such ideas in general. It's an exercise in pattern recognition. It's interesting how native mythologies and cultures very much look like they describe specific advanced technologies, like ramjet, VTO interceptor, Gauss cannon orbital launcher, capacitor, nuclear battery, arc loudspeaker, blimp, and so on. I have no real idea how these technologies would get on Earth before our time, but I'm not going to say that is impossible. It is a historically new and very interesting way of looking at the strangest passages of Popol Vuh, Enuma Elis, Bible, Egyptian religion, carvings, paintings and so on. And it requires some solid knowledge of science and engineering.

I will however smell bullshit when Arnost Vasicek goes from documenting the New Guinea savages to making claims that a sacred geometry of architecture in Prague may be a "gate to other worlds". That is just a vague superstitious claim. He's partially right, last time I checked Prague indeed turned into a gate to another world, at the mystical time of solar equinox. But it was a world of commercialism and decadence, with all the people selling their dignity to crowds of tourists at the Easter market.

 

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Beyond Saving wrote:If we

Beyond Saving wrote:
If we ever do have actual contact with aliens I suspect that the first form of contact will not be face to face. If any being manages to solve the problem of traveling across the universe it is far more likely that the first contact will be in the form of an unmanned scientific vessel or a random piece of wreckage that crashes into us.

We are more likely to detect them from extreme distances than have any direct contact at all, at least for awhile, I think.
We'll probably detect life long before actually meeting them is even a consideration. They'll probably be hundreds or thousands of light years away.
Either that, or we'll be lucky enough to observe another species entering the age of radio, who are only a few light years away. Which would be pretty cool. In multiple ways.

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Luminon wrote:

digitalbeachbum wrote:
The subject was very limited to a very small group of people. Today it is woven in to our culture in a much larger level of interest. The ancients civilizations you speak of are very much inflated by UFO researchers. If they see a religious head mask that looks like a robot they instantly think it was aliens who influenced it.

Actually I was thinking about them finding us, but the reverse is also true. There are about 2,000-6,000 visible stars in the night sky, but not all these are stars, some are planets and some are galaxies. I've heard estimates that there are 10^22 stars in the universe and recently that there are three times as many. While it is true that not all of these stars are a capable of supporting life, I believe that we will never be able to find another alien life form based on listening to radio or other wave sources.

The Dogons have no prior knowledge of DNA or cellular biology. The information I have found leads me to believe that the Dogons were infected with information. I see people making money off the books they write concerning this story.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Dogon_people

That's interesting, looks like there were some very irrational people visiting the land of Dogons. Melanin in the skin allows them to receive messages from Sirius,

Albinos do not have melanin in their skin. The rest of us do. What do you hear from Sirius and how is Zephod?

Quote:
A_Nony_Mouse wrote:

Metal? Where did you get that idea?

From Bible, I think.

I was thinking rather that since we are close to making all of our flying machines including spacecraft out of carbon fiber materials, why would they be so primitive? 

Quote:
A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Reading too much van Daniken is harmful to reason. Yes, I know he said the things you are repeating it is also true he lied, knowingly or unknowingly is the only question. The oddest thing of all is aliens looking like properly proportioned humans in the first place. That should be a very big hint to even the most ardent believer. The interest in astronomy is quite well established in ancient times. Our interest is rather far beyond keeping track of the seaons.

This is diffcult to say, if we have a statistic sample one.

We have Chinese, Mesopotamian, Egyptian, Indian and Mayan as major and well understood examples. All are primarily tracking the seasons. There are lesser understood examples from northern Europe and the southwest US to Aztec.

Quote:
But we know about convergent evolution, we know that eye evolved independently several times, we know that ecologic niches tend to shape their animals.

We know for a fact that endoskeletal forms came on land with four lets instead of 6, 8, or many more. We know of nothing relating endo to four only and exo to all the rest. We know of many examples of four legs going to legs and arms. Tyranosaurs, birds and kangaroos show they do not necessarily to go hands in our sense.

We have any number of primates from lemurs to monkeys to apes to us and only us has our proportions. That aliens have our proportions is reserved for TV and B movie science fiction for production reasons.

Quote:
We know that stereo vision (two eyes) and duplicity of organs is an advantage and symmetry is a standard, that upright position has many advantages (free hands, better view, free vocal chords), that water dwellers aren't likely to evolve the use of fire and toolmaking, and so on.

While bilateral symetry appears dominant it is not universal. Beyond that symetry the number of eyes is back to the endoskeleton ancestor. The number of eyes on each side of the head is not limited to two. If there are two the location on the head is quite varied. The most obvious is in front instead of on the sides as in these supposed aliens. Having them in the same place as humans in proportion to the top and bottom of the head is the homo sapien location and where they would be in lemurs if they had brains that enlarged upwards. However upward is not the norm. It did not happen in Erectus or Australopithecus and about half way in Neanderthal.

But the drawings are in the Sapiens location. Therefore you have a drawing of a human. If you have never seen natives in ceremonial costume I suggest you acquaint yourself with the subject. I further suggest you pay attention to the masks. I suggest you stop paying attention to people misreporting facts in the most sensational manner possible while ignoring what is known.

Quote:
A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 It should also be obvious if there were the technical description you falsely claim someone would have built one. As it is it does not raise to bad B movie standards.

Not really, not without an industry and science. I've read of ancient descriptions and paintings that resemble the description of ramjet engine or other technologies... Yet they are often rejected as "religious art", which is sometimes misused an academic label for something we don't understand. Even though with our technology today we can understand.

You are telling me because someone who has no idea of those technologies tells you it "looks like" you believe it. Why? As you should be aware there has been exactly one successful application of a ramjet. Could you explain why some clown would not at least describe a turbine jet after coming all this way? Shall I go back to what you described as a picture of a wormhole? Does not that give you a very big hint? Seek and ye shall find is a description of human nature. Assume the conclusion and you will find the conclusion.

Quote:
A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 I fail to see how your claim to have seen many weird things leads to some fool's idea that the drawings represent alien catfist. 

No, not that idea. All such ideas in general. It's an exercise in pattern recognition. It's interesting how native mythologies and cultures very much look like they describe specific advanced technologies, like ramjet, VTO interceptor, Gauss cannon orbital launcher, capacitor, nuclear battery, arc loudspeaker, blimp, and so on. I have no real idea how these technologies would get on Earth before our time, but I'm not going to say that is impossible. It is a historically new and very interesting way of looking at the strangest passages of Popol Vuh, Enuma Elis, Bible, Egyptian religion, carvings, paintings and so on. And it requires some solid knowledge of science and engineering.

From what I have seen given such labels it requires an incredible ignorance of those technologies to create those labels. Rather than wondering how they got here you should ask where are they now? You have to suggest these magic aliens brought technology very primitive for them all the way here and then took it with them and cleaned up all the evidence of having been here except for a few drawings they happened to miss. It is a bit like Bigfoot cleaning up his turds so they are never discovered. Why?

Quote:
I will however smell bullshit when Arnost Vasicek goes from documenting the New Guinea savages to making claims that a sacred geometry of architecture in Prague may be a "gate to other worlds". That is just a vague superstitious claim. He's partially right, last time I checked Prague indeed turned into a gate to another world, at the mystical time of solar equinox. But it was a world of commercialism and decadence, with all the people selling their dignity to crowds of tourists at the Easter market.
 

 

Your BS sense is rather out of whack. You have aliens making no secret of their presence while here. They bring technology thousands of years ahead of the natives but at least centuries primitive to them and show it off for some elusive purpose. Then they take is all away and clean up the mess to the point where not a single scrap or broken spare part is left to find in the thousands of years since then. A just so story.

Imagine time travelers from today going back to ancient Rome and bringing with them flintlock rifles and steam engines, making a big show of them to the city for years and then taking it all away and never having dropped a single steel nut or bolt or lost a single piece of plastic or synthetic anything.

I can see it as a massive practical joke but no credible purpose to it.

We would have no interest in Roman natural resources. If aliens were interested in natural resources they would mine the asteroids as much easier. It they needed labor they would use robots to mine the asteroids. If they wanted to play gods they would literally move mountains. If they wanted to help people they would bring corn from the new world to the old and wheat to other way and rice from east to west in the old world AFTER explaining the germ theory of disease.

Saying, we don't know why they came here but they did, is assuming they did come here and then rationalizing why. That is logical fallacy and has been recognized as such for at least 2500 years.

OTOH we have people with vivid imaginations making a living on gullible people. We know those types have existed from the beginning of recorded history.

Which is simpler?

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Vastet wrote:
Beyond Saving wrote:
If we ever do have actual contact with aliens I suspect that the first form of contact will not be face to face. If any being manages to solve the problem of traveling across the universe it is far more likely that the first contact will be in the form of an unmanned scientific vessel or a random piece of wreckage that crashes into us.
We are more likely to detect them from extreme distances than have any direct contact at all, at least for awhile, I think. We'll probably detect life long before actually meeting them is even a consideration. They'll probably be hundreds or thousands of light years away. Either that, or we'll be lucky enough to observe another species entering the age of radio, who are only a few light years away. Which would be pretty cool. In multiple ways.

The bad news is we are moving away from high power radio transmissions. It is narrow beam to comm satellite and back down to cable on the ground or beamed towards earth for satellite TV. We don't radiate megawatts out into space. We almost always have had antennas that kept most of the power horizontal. Less than a century after megawatt radio stations we no longer have a use for that kind of power.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

www.giwersworld.org/made-in-alexandria/index.html

www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml


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No, but someone might still

No, but someone might still be funding SETI by then, or something similar. And despite the apparent 100 year window (judging from human progress), there's still a fair chance of picking something up.
There are also a number of radio telescopes as it is, and their usefullness will not wane with the change in how we use radio. There's a possibility that such a telescope would pick up a radio signal and prompt some astronomers to dust off old radio equipment.

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Vastet wrote:Beyond Saving

Vastet wrote:
Beyond Saving wrote:
If we ever do have actual contact with aliens I suspect that the first form of contact will not be face to face. If any being manages to solve the problem of traveling across the universe it is far more likely that the first contact will be in the form of an unmanned scientific vessel or a random piece of wreckage that crashes into us.
We are more likely to detect them from extreme distances than have any direct contact at all, at least for awhile, I think. We'll probably detect life long before actually meeting them is even a consideration. They'll probably be hundreds or thousands of light years away. Either that, or we'll be lucky enough to observe another species entering the age of radio, who are only a few light years away. Which would be pretty cool. In multiple ways.
As far as I am concerned, there already was a contact, unfortunately due to our stupidity one-sided. I recommend you to read through this website, focused on deciphering the 12-numbered WOW signal from space. It is a supplement to the book, but the message, numbers and diagrams should be clear enough, even despite of the Google Translate follies.

 

 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:

Albinos do not have melanin in their skin. The rest of us do. What do you hear from Sirius and how is Zephod?

Sounds crazy, I agree. That was the point. 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 We have Chinese, Mesopotamian, Egyptian, Indian and Mayan as major and well understood examples. All are primarily tracking the seasons. There are lesser understood examples from northern Europe and the southwest US to Aztec.
That was a point on biology and convergent evolution on our (one) planet, not cultures or races...

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 We know for a fact that endoskeletal forms came on land with four lets instead of 6, 8, or many more. We know of nothing relating endo to four only and exo to all the rest. We know of many examples of four legs going to legs and arms. Tyranosaurs, birds and kangaroos show they do not necessarily to go hands in our sense.

We have any number of primates from lemurs to monkeys to apes to us and only us has our proportions. That aliens have our proportions is reserved for TV and B movie science fiction for production reasons.

 While bilateral symetry appears dominant it is not universal. Beyond that symetry the number of eyes is back to the endoskeleton ancestor. The number of eyes on each side of the head is not limited to two. If there are two the location on the head is quite varied. The most obvious is in front instead of on the sides as in these supposed aliens. Having them in the same place as humans in proportion to the top and bottom of the head is the homo sapien location and where they would be in lemurs if they had brains that enlarged upwards. However upward is not the norm. It did not happen in Erectus or Australopithecus and about half way in Neanderthal.

That's a possibility too, but how far can we go from the humanoid form and still remain sentient and toolmaking? Obviously many non-humanoid TV aliens are pure fiction, insectoids or blobs can't exist in a significant size and under standard gravity. Two eyes sort of makes sense, I know there are exceptions, but none in big animals (except that one lizard with exposed pineal gland). Two is the minimal number for stereo vision, too many eyes means too many vulnerable points. 

 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:

You are telling me because someone who has no idea of those technologies tells you it "looks like" you believe it. Why? As you should be aware there has been exactly one successful application of a ramjet. Could you explain why some clown would not at least describe a turbine jet after coming all this way? Shall I go back to what you described as a picture of a wormhole? Does not that give you a very big hint? Seek and ye shall find is a description of human nature. Assume the conclusion and you will find the conclusion.

Believe it? It's not a belief, it's just an interest and open-mindedness. And many interesting memories. Maybe being open-minded means taking something as a possibility, that's why not many people do it. 

I remember passages describing the supposed "Anunnaki" flying vehicles from Egyptian and south American legends. The drawings resembled a space shuttle in shape, only with bigger wings and snail-like spiral structures on the wings. The airplanes were described as "hawks", referring to their behavior, to rise high on rocket-like engine and then to accelerate downwards as a hawk pouncing on prey. That was supposed to gain speed, so the spirals on wings can work as compressors of air to liquify the oxygen and start the ramjet engines. Such an engine could use only 1/8 of fuel, any fuel, even alcohol mixed with honey, the rest would be oxygen from the air. More speculations were drawn on the shape of wings, which would create two differently moving layers of air, decreasing heating from air friction. If the legendary Anunnaki would want a reliable airplane, low-maintenance, with minimum moving parts (no turbines), taking any hydrocarbon fuel and capable of a cheap ground-to-orbit flight, that would make lots of sense. If I remember, someone summed up these ideas and used them to design a new type of aircraft. I can't find it right now, but there is another well-known design based on the book of Ezechiel.

Oh, how I love science fiction! 

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Your BS sense is rather out of whack. You have aliens making no secret of their presence while here. They bring technology thousands of years ahead of the natives but at least centuries primitive to them and show it off for some elusive purpose.
For the purpose of playing gods and commanding ignorant tribes.

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Then they take is all away and clean up the mess to the point where not a single scrap or broken spare part is left to find in the thousands of years since then. A just so story.
Not exactly. If they used local materials and resources as much as possible (being far away from home it makes sense) and tried to not let the people have their technology, then no wonder there's nothing left. Except some strange drawings, carvings and whole freakin' radioactive areas in India and on Sinai peninsula. There are supposed to be plains and walls of glassy molten ground, like at the nuclear shooting range of White Sands, so these ancient sci-fi writers say.

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Imagine time travelers from today going back to ancient Rome and bringing with them flintlock rifles and steam engines, making a big show of them to the city for years and then taking it all away and never having dropped a single steel nut or bolt or lost a single piece of plastic or synthetic anything.

I can see it as a massive practical joke but no credible purpose to it.

People are industrious and metals were rare. I don't know how about your country, but in my country even a 10 ton iron bridge can disappear overnight and end up in smelters. As for plastic, that would hardly last long enough, I've got these plastic clothes pins and after a few years outside on the line they're all fragile and crumble if I squeeze them.

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 We would have no interest in Roman natural resources. If aliens were interested in natural resources they would mine the asteroids as much easier. It they needed labor they would use robots to mine the asteroids. If they wanted to play gods they would literally move mountains. If they wanted to help people they would bring corn from the new world to the old and wheat to other way and rice from east to west in the old world AFTER explaining the germ theory of disease.
Here these writers go hardcore. Sitchin says they were interested in gold. And not just in gold, but also this beautiful planet full of life. And primitive and obedient humanoids. So it's not exactly a help. You seem to presume that such a "gods" would be interested in educating people. I liked the interpretation of Old Testament, how El Shaddai (Yahweh) was one of smaller "gods" and commanded his Jewish tribe with Abraham in command, sometimes aiding him in battles technologically. And he wasn't a particularly merciful god who would explain people germs and stuff. He used them on people too, as a punishment of plague for disobedience or something and certainly didn't want to spoil the divine mojo. 

I recommend you to read the story of ark of covenant, how the Philistines got hold of it. When they opened it, they started dying massively on something resembling a radiation poisoning. Other times it killed people by something like an electric short circuit, if they touched it when the carrying (and circuit-shorting safety) poles were not in place. And if God spoke out of it, it might be through these winged "cherubim" on top, acting as a plasma speaker
"Hey Asaf, Yahweh's calling! Will you pick up the phone... I mean, the Ark?"

A_Nony_Mouse wrote:
 Saying, we don't know why they came here but they did, is assuming they did come here and then rationalizing why. That is logical fallacy and has been recognized as such for at least 2500 years.

OTOH we have people with vivid imaginations making a living on gullible people. We know those types have existed from the beginning of recorded history.

Which is simpler? 

Which is simpler? I mean, which is more boring? I'm not trying to convert you or assert this as my belief system (which it isn't) but show you a really interesting line of thought, a different look at history. It's interesting how atheistic scientists try to explain everything by other people's religions.

There seems to be something from the technologic point of view, though the historical hows and whys are a different question. We must not make a mistake that these writers make, thinking that we can find all answers of the past. And we also must not extend this to the present with where did these "gods" disappear. You know these crazy people, who search for reptilians underground or in photographs of American presidents. Without even knowing the original Sitchin's work. No, as far as I am concerned the past is the past, and even so a relatively small and very mysterious chapter in human history. I have no idea what it was about, but it's fascinating as long as the people don't get too crazy with their claims.

 

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I don't believe that an

I don't believe that an intelligent species searching for other intelligent species would try only once, then give up. If it were 1978 then there would potentially be some logical reasons why further contact hadn't been attempted on their part. But it was a full generation ago.

It is also probable that the presence of aliens on Earth at any time in the last couple billion years would have been detected by now. An artifact, language, molecule, or even evidence of mining or energies that humanity has yet to harness (the detonation of the nuclear devices literally changed the entire Earth forever, detectably, as an example). Or alterations in DNA from sources outside the evolution of Earth life (you can't be on the planet without interacting with the life, which changes the life). And probably a whole bunch of other things I haven't thought of.

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There's many mines

Zeeboe wrote:

http://youtu.be/M8ccEPOhvlo

I am not sure what to make of this. A lot of Christians are going crazy on YouTube of course, thinking it's end-time type of stuff, and others are saying it's UFO-related, and then some are thinking it's all fake. What do you guys think?

in Oregon. It may have been a mine collapsing. 

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Old Seer wrote:Zeeboe

Old Seer wrote:

Zeeboe wrote:

http://youtu.be/M8ccEPOhvlo

I am not sure what to make of this. A lot of Christians are going crazy on YouTube of course, thinking it's end-time type of stuff, and others are saying it's UFO-related, and then some are thinking it's all fake. What do you guys think?

in Oregon. It may have been a mine collapsing. 

I live in a miner country near east borders. The coal mining industry here is in decline, because it's mostly mined out and there are old tunnels all over the adjacent county. Just a few kilometers east there are far reaches of old mine tunnels that collapse and sit down. That makes the ground all wavy and there's even a half-abandoned shop and parking lot with big waves on the asphalt. In northern towns there were cave-ins right down into holes. 

 

And yet, no such sounds were ever heard around here. In fact, these mysterious sounds were recorded in a completely different area in my country, in south, central and west cities. (Svitavy, Cesky Krumlov, Brno, Pilsen) Never east where I live. So I'd say it's not mines or caves or anything like that. For all we don't know, it might be just as well an atmospheric phenomenon that makes the ground reverberate.

Here is the news item and interview with an expert. He says there's no way the sounds come from the ground. (He thinks it's all people's fantasy)

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