Every sperm is sacred?

digitalbeachbum
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Every sperm is sacred?

I had a discussion with my brother, who happens to be a doctor and a research professor if infectious diseases.

He told me that when a sperm gets inside the egg it is nothing but two cells, then four cells, ect. and it isn't until the brain starts to receive information that you are a human.

This is bullshit that the egg is a human... that's like saying every sperm is human too.

 

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-april-11-2012/bro-choice

 

 

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I used to be amazed at the

I used to be amazed at the stupidity of man, but now I'm just either entertained or disgusted-depending on my mood.  I am however getting confused as to whether we are on the incline to or decline from an intelligence pinnacle.  Things like this sure make me think we are headed for the "idiocracy".  I'm just scared it won't be as funny as the movie.

"...but truth is a point of view, and so it is changeable. And to rule by fettering the mind through fear of punishment in another world is just as base as to use force." -Hypatia


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I've said it for years.

I've said it for years. Life begins at life. Christians are inconsistent dishonest hypocrites.

 

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Sapient

Good clip. Why aren't you posting more of your stuff within the threads? It doesn't matter if the long-timers here have already seen them.

Most newcomers aren't gonna seek the stuff out even if they knew how to go about finding it.

"...but truth is a point of view, and so it is changeable. And to rule by fettering the mind through fear of punishment in another world is just as base as to use force." -Hypatia


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tonyjeffers wrote:Good clip.

tonyjeffers wrote:

Good clip. Why aren't you posting more of your stuff within the threads?

Sorry I don't do it more often, I do try to post things like this when relevant.  

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I took out the calculator

I took out the calculator and did some rough estimates for how many sperm I've killed.

I started masturbating in the 6th grade. When I found out how good it felt I did it pretty much every day for seven years but then started to get busy in society with a job, joining the usmc, etc.

I'm also averaging when I started having sex with girls. When I started that stage in life the number jumped. Several women in my life were crazy sexual misfits so there were jumps in there during those years.

Here is the math:

I was 12 when I started.

44-12=32 years

32*7 million sperm= 224 million (if I did it once a year for 32 years)

224,000,000*365 (once a day, per year)= 81,760,000,000 trillion dead humans

If I did it twice a day for 32 years (163,520,000,000) trillion dead humans

I'm going to hell aren't I?

(edit)

Considering that there are over 100 billion people who have lived since "humans" started being humans, let's say half are men, 50 billion.

81,760,000,000 * 50,000,000,000 = 4,088,000,000,000,000,000,000 dead humans due to ejaculation.

Yeah I know some people don't ejaculate but that is like 1 male per year. I believe 99.9999999% of the male population masturbates.

 

 

 Yeah and I know not every one has sex once per day, every year, for 32 years. I'm using me as an average male. You must consider all the men who masturbate until they are in their 70's too. So it will average out.

 

 

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Bum

Hey Bum, do you think all those humans you killed will go to hell since they never accepted Jesus?  Fuck it's gonna be crowded.  I gotta start being a better sinner so i get a good spot in the lake of fire.

"...but truth is a point of view, and so it is changeable. And to rule by fettering the mind through fear of punishment in another world is just as base as to use force." -Hypatia


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tonyjeffers wrote:Hey Bum,

tonyjeffers wrote:

Hey Bum, do you think all those humans you killed will go to hell since they never accepted Jesus?  Fuck it's gonna be crowded.  I gotta start being a better sinner so i get a good spot in the lake of fire.

 

lol

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Another lol

It's gonna be a big gloopy sizzle down there in hell.


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Quote:He told me that when a

Quote:
He told me that when a sperm gets inside the egg it is nothing but two cells, then four cells, ect. and it isn't until the brain starts to receive information that you are a human.

Said it before and I'll keep saying it until I'm dead or someone, somewhere, actually comes up with a credible argument to support their belief.

This quote is an opinion, not a fact.

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Vastet wrote:Quote:He told

Vastet wrote:
Quote:
He told me that when a sperm gets inside the egg it is nothing but two cells, then four cells, ect. and it isn't until the brain starts to receive information that you are a human.
Said it before and I'll keep saying it until I'm dead or someone, somewhere, actually comes up with a credible argument to support their belief. This quote is an opinion, not a fact.

Hmmmm. I disagree. What defines a human? or human being?

If a person is brain dead, let's say.. no brain what so ever.. not even a brain stem... their head is intact, no exterior damage, but their heart keeps beating and as long as you feed, water and tend to the body, it will continue to poop, pee, grow, etc.

Does this make the "body" a human being? If it doesn't, what makes a egg with a sperm human?

Yes, an opinion, but I highly educated opinion.

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Of course it's still human.

Of course it's still human. What else would it be?

People in this controversy tend to confuse humanity with life. A human corpse is still human, by the definition of human. Hell, in some circles Neanderthals are referred to as human (because human isn't a scientific definition, and can be applied to species other than homo sapiens, provided they are of the same genus).
And they're so dead as to be extinct.

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Vastet wrote:Of course it's

Vastet wrote:
Of course it's still human. What else would it be? People in this controversy tend to confuse humanity with life. A human corpse is still human, by the definition of human. Hell, in some circles Neanderthals are referred to as human (because human isn't a scientific definition, and can be applied to species other than homo sapiens, provided they are of the same genus). And they're so dead as to be extinct.

Human is a word which has become abused in our society, but what makes a person human? human-being? humanoid? Each carries a different meaning which is influenced by society. The book definition is limited now because of those abuses.

 

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So then ignore the term

So then ignore the term human as irrelevant. Clearly no answers will come from using it.
Is a homo sapiens fetus a homo sapiens?
Yes, indisputably. There is absolutely no other species it could be, nothing else at all.
Is the fetus alive?
Yes, indisputably. The cells divide, it consumes resources, it has waste, it can be killed.

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Vastet wrote:So then ignore

Vastet wrote:
So then ignore the term human as irrelevant. Clearly no answers will come from using it. Is a homo sapiens fetus a homo sapiens? Yes, indisputably. There is absolutely no other species it could be, nothing else at all. Is the fetus alive? Yes, indisputably. The cells divide, it consumes resources, it has waste, it can be killed.

I'm assuming that once a sperm goes inside the egg you believe it is human?

Is a sperm human?

Is an egg human?

If a brain and brain stem are removed, is the body still human?

If a baby is born with out bones, is it human?

If a person is decapitated, are they still human?

If a person loses an arm, are they still human?

When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder. If you say that a human body with out a brain or brain stem is still human, then as soon as that sperm goes inside the egg, it becomes human to you.

I on the other hand do not believe this to be true. I believe it takes a lot more to be a human than to have two cells splitting.

 

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digitalbeachbum wrote:Vastet

digitalbeachbum wrote:

Vastet wrote:
So then ignore the term human as irrelevant. Clearly no answers will come from using it. Is a homo sapiens fetus a homo sapiens? Yes, indisputably. There is absolutely no other species it could be, nothing else at all. Is the fetus alive? Yes, indisputably. The cells divide, it consumes resources, it has waste, it can be killed.

I'm assuming that once a sperm goes inside the egg you believe it is human?

Is a sperm human?

Is an egg human?

If a brain and brain stem are removed, is the body still human?

If a baby is born with out bones, is it human?

If a person is decapitated, are they still human?

If a person loses an arm, are they still human?

When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder. If you say that a human body with out a brain or brain stem is still human, then as soon as that sperm goes inside the egg, it becomes human to you.

I on the other hand do not believe this to be true. I believe it takes a lot more to be a human than to have two cells splitting.

 

 

Is it relevant whether or not you call a fetus human?

 

I don't think so, unless you are trying to take a stand that it is 100% wrong to ever kill any human and virtually no one seriously takes that position. The only real question is when does a human enjoy the legal protections of society. It is laughable and impractical to grant those protections to eggs or semen. 

If, if a white man puts his arm around me voluntarily, that's brotherhood. But if you - if you hold a gun on him and make him embrace me and pretend to be friendly or brotherly toward me, then that's not brotherhood, that's hypocrisy.- Malcolm X


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Beyond Saving

Beyond Saving wrote:

digitalbeachbum wrote:

Vastet wrote:
So then ignore the term human as irrelevant. Clearly no answers will come from using it. Is a homo sapiens fetus a homo sapiens? Yes, indisputably. There is absolutely no other species it could be, nothing else at all. Is the fetus alive? Yes, indisputably. The cells divide, it consumes resources, it has waste, it can be killed.

I'm assuming that once a sperm goes inside the egg you believe it is human?

Is a sperm human?

Is an egg human?

If a brain and brain stem are removed, is the body still human?

If a baby is born with out bones, is it human?

If a person is decapitated, are they still human?

If a person loses an arm, are they still human?

When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder. If you say that a human body with out a brain or brain stem is still human, then as soon as that sperm goes inside the egg, it becomes human to you.

I on the other hand do not believe this to be true. I believe it takes a lot more to be a human than to have two cells splitting.

Is it relevant whether or not you call a fetus human?

I don't think so, unless you are trying to take a stand that it is 100% wrong to ever kill any human and virtually no one seriously takes that position. The only real question is when does a human enjoy the legal protections of society. It is laughable and impractical to grant those protections to eggs or semen. 

It's all about terminology. When you are dealing with these "law makers" yes, what words you use are very important.

I agree. A sperm and an egg are not "human" they are "human substance" with the potential to be human.

My point is when is a "human" a "human"? I believe that when an egg is fertilized that it is not human. It has the potential to be human.

There is a point and time when that egg becomes a fetus, but even then, that fetus is not human. It is not until a specific stage when it becomes active mentally that it is human.

Case in point, if a fetus is growing but has no brain or brain stem, is it human? The heart is pumping. Every thing else is fine. Does it afford the same rights as a adult human?

The reason for these changes in the law is to get their "foot in the door" and to slowly change the abortion rights.

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A sperm and egg are human

A sperm and egg are human (1), they simply aren't human (2).
See definitions 1 & 2 at http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/human

Quote:
If a brain and brain stem are removed, is the body still human?

What else would it be? A dog perhaps?

Quote:
If a baby is born with out bones, is it human?

If a person is decapitated, are they still human?

If a person loses an arm, are they still human?

See above.

Quote:
When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder.

That's effectively the same thing I said in my first post. So you agree with me now?

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Vastet wrote:A sperm and egg

Vastet wrote:
A sperm and egg are human (1), they simply aren't human (2). See definitions 1 & 2 at http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/human
Quote:
If a brain and brain stem are removed, is the body still human?
What else would it be? A dog perhaps?
Quote:
If a baby is born with out bones, is it human? If a person is decapitated, are they still human? If a person loses an arm, are they still human?
See above.
Quote:
When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder.
That's effectively the same thing I said in my first post. So you agree with me now?

Avoiding my question?

Yes, I agree to disagree.

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.

Sapient wrote:
I've said it for years. Life begins at life. Christians are inconsistent dishonest hypocrites.
 

Seems to me unless one declares eggs and sperm to be non-living life does not begin but continues and the current semantics used to frame the discussion are incorrect.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

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digitalbeachbum wrote:Vastet

digitalbeachbum wrote:

Vastet wrote:
A sperm and egg are human (1), they simply aren't human (2). See definitions 1 & 2 at http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/human
Quote:
If a brain and brain stem are removed, is the body still human?
What else would it be? A dog perhaps?
Quote:
If a baby is born with out bones, is it human? If a person is decapitated, are they still human? If a person loses an arm, are they still human?
See above.
Quote:
When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder.
That's effectively the same thing I said in my first post. So you agree with me now?

Avoiding my question?

Yes, I agree to disagree.

I didn't avoid anything. I thoroughly refuted you.

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sperm only should be in a vagina

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-april-11-2012/bro-choice

Its like women are trying to control men's bodies.

Religion Kills !!!

Numbers 31:17-18 - Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

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Quote:Its like women are

Quote:
Its like women are trying to control men's bodies.

 

Correction; it's the evil biological clock that controls women in order to try and control men.  Women are just an elaborate patsy, I tell ya.  Fight the real enemy!

 

 

Err, wait, wrong example...

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Vastet wrote:digitalbeachbum

Vastet wrote:
digitalbeachbum wrote:

Vastet wrote:
A sperm and egg are human (1), they simply aren't human (2). See definitions 1 & 2 at http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/human
Quote:
If a brain and brain stem are removed, is the body still human?
What else would it be? A dog perhaps?
Quote:
If a baby is born with out bones, is it human? If a person is decapitated, are they still human? If a person loses an arm, are they still human?
See above.
Quote:
When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder.
That's effectively the same thing I said in my first post. So you agree with me now?

Avoiding my question?

Yes, I agree to disagree.

I didn't avoid anything. I thoroughly refuted you.

LOL. OK.

 

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Glad we agree.

Glad we agree.

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Vastet wrote:Glad we

Vastet wrote:
Glad we agree.

Agree to disagree. I was being sarcastic in my previous post.


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1: This was sarcasm? "When

1: This was sarcasm?
"When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder."

If not, then you DO agree with me.

2: Whether you or anyone else likes it, I have thoroughly and completely destroyed the idea that ANYONE has EVER made a FACTUAL determination on when one becomes human.
I have conclusively refuted every argument suggesting a human embryo isn't human.

Noone can refute me, because I'm the only one with a logical grasp of the situatation. I've proved it year after year, challenger after challenger. I even took on multiple elite RRS members, who no offence, were much more knowledgeable on the subject than anyone perusing the forum today, and I defeated them all.

When life/humanity begins is a matter of opinion. Period.

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Vastet wrote:1: This was

Vastet wrote:
1: This was sarcasm? "When it starts and when it ends is in the eye of the beholder." If not, then you DO agree with me. 2: Whether you or anyone else likes it, I have thoroughly and completely destroyed the idea that ANYONE has EVER made a FACTUAL determination on when one becomes human. I have conclusively refuted every argument suggesting a human embryo isn't human. Noone can refute me, because I'm the only one with a logical grasp of the situatation. I've proved it year after year, challenger after challenger. I even took on multiple elite RRS members, who no offence, were much more knowledgeable on the subject than anyone perusing the forum today, and I defeated them all. When life/humanity begins is a matter of opinion. Period.

 

Let me start over...

The link to the definition you posted is to say the most of it, is pointless. It provides no proof of what makes a human a human. It only provides a definition of the word and the meaning behind it.

1) The human egg and sperm are not human. They are human material with potential to be human.

2) The human embryo is not human. It is human material with the potential to be human.

3) The human fetus is.. well, more human than not, but it remains to be seen at what phase it actually is human.

Given that, I'm assuming that you believe in evolution, DNA helps the fetus grow and develop, it is those stages of development which make it a completed human. With that being said, is a baby born with out a brain a human? No. It is not. It does not, even by the definition you provided previously, contain human attributes. It is no different than a manikin which looks human but does not function as a human.

My "eye of the beholder" comment pertains to #3 as the human fetus has various levels of development. The embryo is not considered a fetus until roughly eight weeks and it is at this point where things get a little grey for definitions. To fully be considered human one must contain all the attributes of being a human and not just fingers and toes. Being human you must function as a human, even if it is a fetus or a baby.

Either you are a pompous ass or you are being silly. No one has refuted you? You have refuted every one? That's like a theist saying they have proven god exists. No one can say for sure when a human embryo exactly becomes a human fetus as no one can say when a fetus becomes human. It varies from pregnancy to pregnancy;.each one is different.

In closing, you kinda contradict yourself. Either it is a matter of opinion or it isn't. But then you say you are the "only one" with a logical grasp of the situation. You also say "conclusively refuted" all arguments suggesting a human embryo ISN'T human.

Well, what is it? Human or not human? If it is an opinion, then what makes you an expert? You've already stated it "is a matter of opinion. Period".

 

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digitalbeachbum wrote:The

digitalbeachbum wrote:
The link to the definition you posted is to say the most of it, is pointless. It provides no proof of what makes a human a human. It only provides a definition of the word and the meaning behind it.

BECAUSE WE HAVE YET TO DEFINE HUMANITY OR LIFE CONCLUSIVELY AND DEFINITIVELY.
What part of this is so hard to comprehend? The definitions are about as broken as those referring to supernatural and god.
How can we determine exactly what makes one human when NOBODY knows?!?!?!?!

1: No. They are not representatives of the human species. Period.
They are representatives of the human reproductive system, ONLY.
Until they fuse and become a viable human embryo, at which point they are human.

2: False. A human embryo is defineable ONLY as a human embryo.

3: See 2:

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Vastet wrote:digitalbeachbum

Vastet wrote:
digitalbeachbum wrote:
The link to the definition you posted is to say the most of it, is pointless. It provides no proof of what makes a human a human. It only provides a definition of the word and the meaning behind it.
BECAUSE WE HAVE YET TO DEFINE HUMANITY OR LIFE CONCLUSIVELY AND DEFINITIVELY. What part of this is so hard to comprehend? The definitions are about as broken as those referring to supernatural and god. How can we determine exactly what makes one human when NOBODY knows?!?!?!?! 1: No. They are not representatives of the human species. Period. They are representatives of the human reproductive system, ONLY. Until they fuse and become a viable human embryo, at which point they are human. 2: False. A human embryo is defineable ONLY as a human embryo. 3: See 2:

Well the only thing I can see we agree on is that the definitions are as broken as those referring to to supernatural and god.

What confuses me is that you say that no person knows what exactly makes a human a human, then you later define what is human. Are you that god that the theists have been looking for? If so, please tell them to stop acting like idiots.

Also, I never said a human embryo was human. I said at some point and time it does become human.

 

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The apparent inability for

The apparent inability for my species to define a couple of terms provides me with the ability to define them myself. Should enough people agree with my definition, then my definition will become the standard.

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Vastet wrote:The apparent

Vastet wrote:
The apparent inability for my species to define a couple of terms provides me with the ability to define them myself. Should enough people agree with my definition, then my definition will become the standard.

Since you didn't respond to my question I'm going to assume that you are actually "the god".

Please tell your followers to stop being such ignorant bastards. They are getting on my nerves.

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Apologies, I thought your

Apologies, I thought your question was... I dunno the word atm. Facetious or something. lol.

If I was THE god, I wouldn't have followers. I get antsy and anxious when people depend on me for critically important mortal issues. I'm not sure I could handle being THE GOD. I'd tell everyone to fuck off and live their own lives every 10 years or so.

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Vastet wrote:Apologies, I

Vastet wrote:
Apologies, I thought your question was... I dunno the word atm. Facetious or something. lol. If I was THE god, I wouldn't have followers. I get antsy and anxious when people depend on me for critically important mortal issues. I'm not sure I could handle being THE GOD. I'd tell everyone to fuck off and live their own lives every 10 years or so.

 

Sign me up. At least hearing from you every 10 years even if it was to tell me to "fuck off" would let me know you were still there.

Their god has disappeared for like what? 6,000 years? not a fucking peep. off fucking other virgins and farting other universes most likely.

Free will is an illusion. People always choose the perceived path of greatest pleasure.

-Scott Adams