What's rationally wrong with Islam?

iGetWood
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What's rationally wrong with Islam?

I just can't seem to find any irrationalities in Islam. I can in Christianity, but why doesn't Islam have irrationalities?


Cpt_pineapple
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Doesn't it believe that some

Doesn't it believe that some guy flew away on a horse on some meteriote or something?


Atheistextremist
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How are you defining irrationalities

iGetWood wrote:

I just can't seem to find any irrationalities in Islam. I can in Christianity, but why doesn't Islam have irrationalities?

 

Do you mean miracles and supernatural stuff?

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


truth
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Cpt_pineapple wrote:Doesn't

Cpt_pineapple wrote:

Doesn't it believe that some guy flew away on a horse on some meteriote or something?

 

I think that is said on a hadith. It goes something like Muhammad flew on a white winged horse to heaven and talked with Jesus and Moses..


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iGetWood wrote:I just can't

iGetWood wrote:

I just can't seem to find any irrationalities in Islam. I can in Christianity, but why doesn't Islam have irrationalities?

 

Theres a whole lot of non sense in the "hadiths" one of them says satan will pee in your ear if you dont wake up for morning pray.. i dont if to be sad or to laugh...


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If you are really interested

If you are really interested in finding answers to your question, I suggest you be more specific. I'm not aware of any believers in Islam on this site, so I'm pretty sure that everyone here will tell you that the whole premise is irrational. We Atheists do not believe in  God, and I'm quite sure no christians here believe that Muhammed was the last prophet of god. State one thing that you do find to be rational and we will go from there and pick it apart.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"...but truth is a point of view, and so it is changeable. And to rule by fettering the mind through fear of punishment in another world is just as base as to use force." -Hypatia


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iGetWood wrote:I just can't

iGetWood wrote:

I just can't seem to find any irrationalities in Islam. I can in Christianity, but why doesn't Islam have irrationalities?

It's irrational because it believes in the same thing that jews and christians do, a god which is based on faith.

Free will is an illusion. People always choose the perceived path of greatest pleasure.

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tonyjeffers wrote:If you are

tonyjeffers wrote:

If you are really interested in finding answers to your question, I suggest you be more specific. I'm not aware of any believers in Islam on this site, so I'm pretty sure that everyone here will tell you that the whole premise is irrational. We Atheists do not believe in  God, and I'm quite sure no christians here believe that Muhammed was the last prophet of god. State one thing that you do find to be rational and we will go from there and pick it apart.

He isn't interested at all. This is the fourth thread he has made where he asks a leading question that assumes that one thing or another provides evidence that support Islam. He never comes back to the thread and apparently doesn't notice when his absurd assumptions are shredded and his naked assertions are proven false. He comes back in a few weeks and posts a new thread. 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


tonyjeffers
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Beyond

Beyond Saving wrote:

tonyjeffers wrote:

If you are really interested in finding answers to your question, I suggest you be more specific. I'm not aware of any believers in Islam on this site, so I'm pretty sure that everyone here will tell you that the whole premise is irrational. We Atheists do not believe in  God, and I'm quite sure no christians here believe that Muhammed was the last prophet of god. State one thing that you do find to be rational and we will go from there and pick it apart.

He isn't interested at all. This is the fourth thread he has made where he asks a leading question that assumes that one thing or another provides evidence that support Islam. He never comes back to the thread and apparently doesn't notice when his absurd assumptions are shredded and his naked assertions are proven false. He comes back in a few weeks and posts a new thread. 

Before I answered I thought about his avatar and took a quick glance at his previous posts. Either he is that young man in the picture and could use some direction, or his name is igetwood for a reason. Why would an adult have that name and that picture of a half-naked child in a locker room? Weird.


 

"...but truth is a point of view, and so it is changeable. And to rule by fettering the mind through fear of punishment in another world is just as base as to use force." -Hypatia


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iGetWood wrote:I just can't

iGetWood wrote:

I just can't seem to find any irrationalities in Islam. I can in Christianity, but why doesn't Islam have irrationalities?

The idea of a super invisible power sounds pretty irrational to me. In that, the christians and moslems are identical.
For specifics, you'll have to ask someone who knows more about the moslem religion. The only reason I know as much about christianity as I do is because I've been force-fed it by a predominantly christian culture. I likely know more than I realise due to christian themes being subtly inserted into mainstream media. I certainly have no interest in studying the stupid things people believe in to feel better about themselves.

Proud Canadian, Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.


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tonyjeffers wrote:Before I

tonyjeffers wrote:
Before I answered I thought about his avatar and took a quick glance at his previous posts. Either he is that young man in the picture and could use some direction, or his name is igetwood for a reason. Why would an adult have that name and that picture of a half-naked child in a locker room? Weird.

It is probably a troll or poe, but it's not a bad one. This is the kind of thing people might ask having only a passing familiarity with a religion or after having spoken to a recruiter. Granted, I haven't read the other topics he's posted yet, but I like this one.

Edit: Just looked at the others, apparently I had actually seen one. Oops. > >
I stand by my opinion even more now, however. I would love another 50 of his type of visitor instead of the constant stream of jean chauvins, the theists, paisleys,... and you've seen where I'm going by now.

Proud Canadian, Enlightened Atheist, Gaming God.


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A little history mixed with

A little history mixed with opinion, facts can likely be verified with Wikipedia, since I recall this from memory:

The actual history of Islam, prior to the Quran being written starts with Muhammad traveling to a cave where he meditates for a very long period and upon return, brings new "revelation".

In my opinion, technically lacking any clear evidence to support this hypothesis, I believe Muhammad's meditation led him to realize the willingness of people to blindly follow beliefs, and he saw an opportunity to unite his fellow men by forming a religion based on the locality of cultural traditions in his area.

Prior to Islam, the region was frequented by various missionaries as well as having localized religious non-biblical mystical practices. Muhammad was a local trader and historically known to have been very smart and charismatic, and absorbed much information from this constant contact with different foreigners and their belief systems.

I do not think he actually believed to see anything in the cave. I speculate that he went inside, meditated on how to resolve the local situation and based on his life experience up until this point with various religions, he thought: Eureka! A new religion we can call our own!

This area was wrought with frequent family blood feuds and Muhammad saw an opportunity for unification.

Much of "jihad" and the "illustrious" sixth pillar of Islam are misinterpretations of actual battles Muhammad experienced (arguably defensively). The Islamic pilgrimage is similar as it is the result of one of the battles in which Muhammad returns to the previously abandoned city of Mecca.

In a sense Muhammad was successful in uniting the tribes of Arabia, and establishing a local cultural similarity which would also later be exploited by Saladin against Christendom.

Unfortunately, many descendants of Saladin even until modern day used the religion as Saladin did and extracted the wrong interpretation, as a system of control instead of peaceful unification - Muhammad's original message.

It is saddening, and the same can be said for many religions. If only followers could see these beliefs for what they really are - creations of man.

Muhammad in my opinion may have been a genius. But his journey into the cave was nothing more than a revelation of the mind.


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Islam itself? Or muslims?

Islam itself? Or muslims?

 

Rationality is mostly about context and (or so I believe) it is can only be 'decided' on an individual basis. I think, here in the West, we've seen many muslims (doctors, engineers, businessman and so forth) prove they can be amply well-reasoned, outside of religious practice.

Bring bacon in the room, and the tone changes. Yes, there are many secular reasons to not eat pork, and the 'cultural' reason for outlawing or religious categorical ban (they originally brought many diseases to humans) is actually quite "rational" in terms of survival... if you live in the Iron or Bronze Age. Nowadays, most people can 'cook' disease out of pork provided there are ample metal pans and cooking fuel available. In the barren sand heaps of Saudi and Sahara (among other places), it's safer to stick to lamb, fish, chicken, beef or wildlife (reptiles.)

 

Of course, most practitioners of Halal/Kosher diets fail to understand the practical reasoning that likely served as a basis for their pork-free diets. Eat pig flesh... die horrifically. Moderate Christians can eat anything, apparently.

“A meritocratic society is one in which inequalities of wealth and social position solely reflect the unequal distribution of merit or skills amongst human beings, or are based upon factors beyond human control, for example luck or chance. Such a society is socially just because individuals are judged not by their gender, the colour of their skin or their religion, but according to their talents and willingness to work, or on what Martin Luther King called 'the content of their character'. By extension, social equality is unjust because it treats unequal individuals equally.” "Political Ideologies" by Andrew Heywood (2003)


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Allah wrote the Quran

That's a rather irrational idea.

 

This fellow has done some research:

 

http://islam-watch.org/AbulKasem/WhoAuthoredQuran/who_authored_the_quran.htm

 


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That article got me thinking...

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.

iGetWood wrote:
I just can't seem to find any irrationalities in Islam. I can in Christianity, but why doesn't Islam have irrationalities?

You mean like a schizo who hears voices?

Islam avoids many of the obvious appearances of irrationalities by having no reasons or explanations for Allah. Allah is accepted as having arbitrary rules. Therefore people do not create irrational explanations for them.

 

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back. That is all anyone needs to know about Israel. That is all there is to know about Israel.

www.ussliberty.org

www.giwersworld.org/made-in-alexandria/index.html

www.giwersworld.org/00_files/zion-hit-points.phtml