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snug
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New to RRS

Hello,

 

I have just come across this site. I have noticed that all of the crime, war, hate, in this country is from religion. I think if we got rid of religion we would be a lot better of a society. So I am pretty sure I am in the right place here.

 

A little bit about myself. I am a recent veteran. I am currently living in up state NY while I go to school. Everything else I suppose will come up as I enjoy this site.

 

Thanks for the site guys,

SNUG

 

 


Philosophicus
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...

Welcome, snug.


Brian37
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snug wrote:Hello, I have

snug wrote:

Hello,

 

I have just come across this site. I have noticed that all of the crime, war, hate, in this country is from religion. I think if we got rid of religion we would be a lot better of a society. So I am pretty sure I am in the right place here.

 

A little bit about myself. I am a recent veteran. I am currently living in up state NY while I go to school. Everything else I suppose will come up as I enjoy this site.

 

Thanks for the site guys,

SNUG

 

 

How would you "get rid" of religion? Via force of government? Stalin tried that, it only pushed it underground. When the Soviet Union went down, the religious that never left became vocal again.

We live on a planet of 7 billion. You even see within religion, divisions amoung sects.

We are atheists, but before we are atheists we are humans, part of the same evolution that produces the natural alpha male strive for power and control. It is a mistake for any human to think they are above evolution and nature.

I DO however, think we can work towards a more secular society where NO religion is given a pedestal or political monopoly. I think the best thing we can do is compete through the same open market of ideas with our ability to question ALL RELIGIONS and all superstitions and all absurd claims.

But we cannot become part of what we rightfully condemn in the same tribal divisive manor we accuse religion of.

Humans are all part of the same species and same evolution and same ordinary psychology, REGARDLESS of label. We must not assume that by proxy of label that we are outside nature or above other humans. WE ARE NOT.

I too think our species would be better off. If our species never question social norms our species never would have left the caves. But my label itself, in the word "atheist" will not and does not make me automatically good or bad.

Tactic in how we reduce the harm religion does. It cannot be done through government force. It can only be done through questioning, ridicule and blasphemy, but not by force.

Welcome.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


Jeffrick
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Hi

             \

 

 

 

                       Welcome to the site, I'm from just over your boarder in Mississauga Ontario.

"Very funny Scotty; now beam down our clothes."

VEGETARIAN: Ancient Hindu word for "lousy hunter"

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luca
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hello snug

Brian37 wrote:
How would you "get rid" of religion? Via force of government? Stalin tried that, it only pushed it underground.

Well I don't support Stalin nor Stalin's methods, but playing for a moment the devil's advocate, I think Stalin remained in power for too little time (for religion to vanish). Probably with some more deep effort it would have been successful.


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Welcome to the forum.luca

Welcome to the forum.

luca wrote:
Well I don't support Stalin nor Stalin's methods, but playing for a moment the devil's advocate, I think Stalin remained in power for too little time (for religion to vanish). Probably with some more deep effort it would have been successful.

Ah, well I shall devil's advocate your devil's advocate (if that makes any sense).

By a more broad definition of religion, one that can include political ideologies and is not dependent on theism, Stalin's totalitarian state would be considered a religion itself, so perhaps he was not so much anti-religious as much as anti-all-non-Stalinism-religions. It certainly wasn't promoting science or freethinking or what we consider good morals.   

Our revels now are ended. These our actors, | As I foretold you, were all spirits, and | Are melted into air, into thin air; | And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, | The cloud-capped towers, the gorgeous palaces, | The solemn temples, the great globe itself, - Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve, | And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, | Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff | As dreams are made on, and our little life | Is rounded with a sleep. - Shakespeare


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butterbattle wrote:Welcome

butterbattle wrote:

Welcome to the forum.

luca wrote:
Well I don't support Stalin nor Stalin's methods, but playing for a moment the devil's advocate, I think Stalin remained in power for too little time (for religion to vanish). Probably with some more deep effort it would have been successful.

Ah, well I shall devil's advocate your devil's advocate (if that makes any sense).

By a more broad definition of religion, one that can include political ideologies and is not dependent on theism, Stalin's totalitarian state would be considered a religion itself, so perhaps he was not so much anti-religious as much as anti-all-non-Stalinism-religions. It certainly wasn't promoting science or freethinking or what we consider good morals.   

Amen. How about end politics as well as religion. Stalinism was a cult of personality. We see the same in North Korea.

“Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful.” Seneca


ex-minister
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 Welcome Snug. Look forward

 Welcome Snug. Look forward to reading your future comments.

Thank you for your service!

Religion Kills !!!

Numbers 31:17-18 - Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

http://jesus-needs-money.blogspot.com/


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welcome to the site  

welcome to the site Smiling

 


Brian37
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luca wrote:Brian37 wrote:How

luca wrote:

Brian37 wrote:
How would you "get rid" of religion? Via force of government? Stalin tried that, it only pushed it underground.

Well I don't support Stalin nor Stalin's methods, but playing for a moment the devil's advocate, I think Stalin remained in power for too little time (for religion to vanish). Probably with some more deep effort it would have been successful.

Another example of short term thinking. You take into account evolution, STALIN didn't give one fuck about religion existing, he only cared about ANYTHING competing with his power. As long as you kept your head low and mouth shut and kissed his ass, he would leave you alone. He'd squash political and business dissent as well. Religion wasn't his problem, competition to his power was.

If Stalin had had 1.000 years religion would still exist. I have no doubt that North Koreans have their own superstitions, even if they have no public square to display them. Humans will always have some degree of absurd superstitions and religions that they display, we always have. I don't see any amount of force long term or short term ending that.

China despite what people might think IS NOT an atheist country. It is full of Buddhists and other oriental ancient superstitions. Religion has never left that country either.

Now, this has everything to do with evolution because PART of our ENTIRE history as a species, just like all other living mammals, there is a strive to be the alpha male, to be on top. What we have learned in the west to prevent the "alpha male" is to create governments that ban monopolies of power.

The monopoly Stalin had was not anti-religion, it was anti competition. Iran's leaders have the same monopoly where the religion runs law, but still has the same anti competition mentality that Stalin's government had. One was worship of the state, Iran is worship of a god, but both had monopoly "alpha male" mentalities.

I do not know what you think will work in the future, but force via government is inhuman and reflects the bad side of evolution. Compassion in accepting that we are all the same species and knowing we are not above hurting others as a species helps us avoid doing to others what we dont want done to us.

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


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Welcome!

Welcome!

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Brian37 wrote:What we have

Brian37 wrote:

What we have learned in the west to prevent the "alpha male" is to create governments that ban monopolies of power.

Governments are monopolies on power. That said, you're right in that democracies are much better than dictatorships. Even though the US government is very powerful, that power is distributed in such a way that it would be difficult for any person or group to take control. However, the real problem lies in the incentives offered by the US political system: politicians generally don't get rewarded for doing nothing even if doing nothing is the best thing to do. I think this is where lots of the stupid laws come from.

 

Oh, snug, this debate could easily take over your thread.  Just let someone in the debate know if you don't want that to happen.

 


Conor Wilson
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First things first...

1. Welcome, snug!

 

2. Thanks for your service!

 

3. If you don't mind my asking, where, when and in what branch did you serve?

 

Conor

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