Jesus 'Lives'

Atheistextremist
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Jesus 'Lives'

 

 

Recently we've seen the claim on the board that 'jesus lives'. But how does jesus live? Jesus is alleged to have died as a man and been resurrected as the son of god/god/trinitarian hodge podge. 

Living organisms are self sustaining, exhibit homeostasis, grow, procreate, react to their environments. 

Does the son of god exhibit these qualities and if not, how can it be said that jesus lives?

Is it possible for an initial prime mover occupying non-space to be alive as we conceive it?

I assume this bumper sticker is another upwelling of anthropomorphism. What do others think? How can a supernatural being be alive, metaphysically speaking?

 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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Atheistextremist wrote: How

Atheistextremist wrote:
 How can a supernatural being be alive, metaphysically speaking?

It's a figure of speech, biblical scholars will agree.

That's why it takes years of study to properly interpret the bible.

Now, go back to reading the bible, you silly boy!

 

 

I keep asking myself " Are they just playin' stupid, or are they just plain stupid?..."

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to atheistextremist

I'm reminded of that Olivia Newton John mega hit from the early 80's

Let's get physical, meta-physical; meta-physical,

I wanna get physical, meta-physical,

so let me hear your body talk.

I know it's not exactly the real lyrics but work with me here.

I always thought the "jesus lives" crapola was about the same as Aesops' fabels and all his talking animals; ya know, like it isn't real.

 

 

[ edit] can I get a mod here to fix this piece of jumbled crap?????????

  

[mod edit:fixed format]

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ex-minister
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 It is all in the head.As a

 It is all in the head.

As a former fundie I hadn't focused on such a thing. DUH. But the whole thing of god living outside time and space becomes necessary and where you must go, that is the conclusion from your question. I think if I had of thought about this while a fundie I would have only used it when talking to atheist but inside it would have made no difference. How can something be real outside of time and space? Mah brain hurts.

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Hypothetically, anything

Hypothetically, anything outside spacetime would be unchanging. It is not a "place" for a commonly defined god.
Since nothing could ever change, there could be no omnipotence.
Because there is no space there could be no omnipresence.
Since ethics are irrelevant without the capacity for change there could be no omnibenevolence.
As an unchanging state cannot interact with a changing state and remain unchanged there could be no omniscience, else there could be no "outside" spacetime.

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Atheistextremist
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Interesting points, these.

 

Vastet wrote:

Since nothing could ever change, there could be no omnipotence. Because there is no space there could be no omnipresence.

Since ethics are irrelevant without the capacity for change there could be no omnibenevolence. As an unchanging state cannot interact with a changing state and remain unchanged there could be no omniscience.

 

I never thought of it like this...

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


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 Taking the assumption

 Taking the assumption Jesus is only a human, that would be true. He cannot live. However, hypothetically, if he was a deity, then no laws of physics would apply to him. So, he could indeed live between us if he was a God. We can't say Jesus doesn't live because he doesn't fall under the criteria we created for life if we look at him as someone who can bend the laws of physics and create new. He wouldn't fall under any categories for life he made because he would be above them. He's omnipresent, omnipotent. Anyway, in Christianity, I don't believe the definition for life was the same as in biology. 

That is only assuming he is a God. If he was not, then he just doesn't live.

 

Oh, btw, why would everything outside Space-Time be unchangeable? Just curious. 


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SarcasticIndeed

SarcasticIndeed wrote:

 Taking the assumption Jesus is only a human, that would be true. He cannot live. However, hypothetically, if he was a deity, then no laws of physics would apply to him. So, he could indeed live between us if he was a God. We can't say Jesus doesn't live because he doesn't fall under the criteria we created for life if we look at him as someone who can bend the laws of physics and create new. He wouldn't fall under any categories for life he made because he would be above them. He's omnipresent, omnipotent. Anyway, in Christianity, I don't believe the definition for life was the same as in biology. 

That is only assuming he is a God. If he was not, then he just doesn't live.

 

Oh, btw, why would everything outside Space-Time be unchangeable? Just curious. 

Anything goes in your imagination. Once you swallow the Kool Aid your super heros can be quite elaborate.

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SarcasticIndeed wrote:Oh,

SarcasticIndeed wrote:

Oh, btw, why would everything outside Space-Time be unchangeable? Just curious. 

If you are outside of time there is no past, present, and future.  Kind of hard to change if not even a second ticks by.

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Lol, I'm just saying if he

Lol, I'm just saying if he was God, then he would live. But since he ain't, he just doesn't live.


Atheistextremist
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But would he live in the

 

SarcasticIndeed wrote:

Lol, I'm just saying if he was God, then he would live. But since he ain't, he just doesn't live.

 

the way we live - in the way living cells live? What sort of existence would an exo-universal god have? I can't help thinking the insistence that jesus 'lives' is just another example of us over-rating anthropomorphic biological existence. Life is not a great way to extend your term of possible existence. Inanimate things last far longer. 

"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." Max Planck


Brian37
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Atheistextremist

Atheistextremist wrote:

 

 

Recently we've seen the claim on the board that 'jesus lives'. But how does jesus live? Jesus is alleged to have died as a man and been resurrected as the son of god/god/trinitarian hodge podge. 

Living organisms are self sustaining, exhibit homeostasis, grow, procreate, react to their environments. 

Does the son of god exhibit these qualities and if not, how can it be said that jesus lives?

Is it possible for an initial prime mover occupying non-space to be alive as we conceive it?

I assume this bumper sticker is another upwelling of anthropomorphism. What do others think? How can a supernatural being be alive, metaphysically speaking?

 

Hitchens is dead but he 'lives" on in our memories.

But with Jesus it goes way beyond the normal behavior in reality that we like what prior people said/did.

The fantastic claims of the super hero Jesus "live" as the placebo anthropomorphic evolutionary flaw that if an idea is comforting to our species, we will sell it to the next generation, even if there is no truth to the claims we sell.

But you are DEAD right in bringing up these objections from an empirical sense. But once the believer swallows the Kool Aid they can make up any stock dodge to avoid your objections.

Myth is sustained and sold through the idea of utopias. The only way it can be sold is by moving the goal posts.

 

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37