MS churches trying to repeal abortion.

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MS churches trying to repeal abortion.

Mississippi Voters Seeks Church Guidance on Parenthood.

By

Lauren Lee

http://www.myfoxmemphis.com/dpp/news/mississippi/mississippi-voters-seeks-church-guidance-on-personhood-rpt-20111106

SOUTHAVEN, Miss. - On Tuesday, Mississippi could be the first state to amend the state constitution to outlaw abortion. Proposition 26, also known as the personhood amendment, asks voters if "the term 'person' or 'persons' shall include every human being from the moment of fertilization, cloning, or the functional equivalent thereof."

This campaign has been rooted in churches. With the vote this Tuesday, many are looking to their church for direction.

Every Sunday, churches across Mississippi have a captive audience of hundreds of thousands of people. Brown Missionary Baptist Church in Southaven alone has a membership of several thousand people.

Proposition 26 declares life begins at fertilization and if passed, makes abortion illegal in Mississippi. Churches that typically stay out of politics are getting involved.

"We don't get involved in politics, so we're not going to tell you who to vote for, but Initiative 26 is not a political matter it is a biblical matter. The bible makes it plain, life begins in the mother's womb," said Bartholomew Orr.

As pastor of Brown Baptist, Orr even included the measure in his sermon.

"So as we vote yes on Proposition 26, I know folks don't like it, but we ought to speak up for the truth!"

But not every church is on board. The bishop of the Mississippi Episcopalian Church has come out against the proposition.

Bishop Duncan Gray writes:
I share their passion for the sanctity of human life. However, I am gravely concerned about the unintended consequences of this legislation. The moral nightmares of doctors no longer able to give preference to saving the life of the mother in such cases as an ectopic pregnancy and the uncertain impact on in-vitro fertilization are real.

The pastor at St. Timothy's Episcopalian Church in Southaven agrees with his bishop. "I think we should spend more time praying and listening, then being certain. And this reeks of certainty."

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


harleysportster
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If the churches

If the churches want to stick their noses into the rights of women to choose, then I say that the preachers, the protesters, and the Mississippi legislators should have to take each and every child they FORCE a woman to birth, into their homes and be solely responsible for the care and upbringing of that child without any form of government aid or assistance.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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This is what I cannot stand

This is what I cannot stand about the right wing and uber rich. They talk a great game about keeping government out of our lives, but what they really mean is "out of their lives". They don't mind taking your money for their religion or their tax cuts, and they don't mind legislating your morality. But who gives a fuck about poverty, or an old lady who has to chose between her rent or meds. As long as they can get into your womb, fuck everything else.

These assholes are hypocrites when it comes to claiming an "all powerful" god. Really? If it is your god's job to judge the actions of individuals, then why the fuck are you trying to do your god's job for him? You must not truly believe in this all powerful god, otherwise you wouldn't stick your nose into a crotch that doesn't fucking belong to you.

 

 

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Brian37 wrote:This is what I

Brian37 wrote:

This is what I cannot stand about the right wing and uber rich. They talk a great game about keeping government out of our lives, but what they really mean is "out of their lives". They don't mind taking your money for their religion or their tax cuts, and they don't mind legislating your morality. But who gives a fuck about poverty, or an old lady who has to chose between her rent or meds. As long as they can get into your womb, fuck everything else.

These assholes are hypocrites when it comes to claiming an "all powerful" god. Really? If it is your god's job to judge the actions of individuals, then why the fuck are you trying to do your god's job for him? You must not truly believe in this all powerful god, otherwise you wouldn't stick your nose into a crotch that doesn't fucking belong to you.

 

 

Agreed.

That statement by pastor Bartholomew Orr was especially infuriating to me :

"We don't get involved in politics, so we're not going to tell you who to vote for, but Initiative 26 is not a political matter it is a biblical matter. The bible makes it plain, life begins in the mother's womb," said Bartholomew Orr.

Talk about hypocrisy at it's finest. We don't want to get involved in politics, we just want to dictate your life to you because the Bible says so.

Plus, I don't recall the bible mentioning abortion. But maybe it does.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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harleysportster

harleysportster wrote:

Brian37 wrote:

This is what I cannot stand about the right wing and uber rich. They talk a great game about keeping government out of our lives, but what they really mean is "out of their lives". They don't mind taking your money for their religion or their tax cuts, and they don't mind legislating your morality. But who gives a fuck about poverty, or an old lady who has to chose between her rent or meds. As long as they can get into your womb, fuck everything else.

These assholes are hypocrites when it comes to claiming an "all powerful" god. Really? If it is your god's job to judge the actions of individuals, then why the fuck are you trying to do your god's job for him? You must not truly believe in this all powerful god, otherwise you wouldn't stick your nose into a crotch that doesn't fucking belong to you.

 

 

Agreed.

That statement by pastor Bartholomew Orr was especially infuriating to me :

"We don't get involved in politics, so we're not going to tell you who to vote for, but Initiative 26 is not a political matter it is a biblical matter. The bible makes it plain, life begins in the mother's womb," said Bartholomew Orr.

Talk about hypocrisy at it's finest. We don't want to get involved in politics, we just want to dictate your life to you because the Bible says so.

Plus, I don't recall the bible mentioning abortion. But maybe it does.

If you go by the stories in the bible, this fictional being could only be in support of abortion, He allowed/or caused, take your pick, the flood. If that is the case and the world's population with the exception of Noah's family were wiped out. That would mean that even pregnant girls drowned, Not to mention any born babies outside the family.

And the infanticide of the Egyptians and Roman first born.

The difference between the genocide of the bible, and a woman's right to chose, is that god is doing it out of spite and revenge. If a woman terminates her pregnancy she is most likely doing it for compassionate reasons in that it make be from rape, or defective, or outright too poor to raise it.

These fuckheads worship a bloodthirsty god who just wants women to be baby factories to make more fan members. The fans of this bloodthirsty god don't care about how many unwanted kids or cruel conditions that the child may grow up in as a result of their theocratic totalitarian view of a body that doesn't belong to them.

If life "begins at conception", then that must mean the sperm was dead before conception, and the egg too. So that means when a guy jacks off he is committing mass murder.

 

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I am begining to think a pro

I am begining to think a pro death approach might be the right idea. Abort every baby and all of humanities problems will be over shortly, no real harm done.

 

P.S. Don't take me seriously on this, but it is tempting.

Whatever goes upon two legs is an enemy.
Whatever goes upon four legs, or has wings, is a friend.
No animal shall wear clothes.
No animal shall sleep in a bed.
No animal shall drink alcohol.
No animal shall kill any other animal.
All animals are equal.


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Brian37 wrote:If life

Brian37 wrote:

If life "begins at conception", then that must mean the sperm was dead before conception, and the egg too. So that means when a guy jacks off he is committing mass murder.

 

Or one step further, every time you create sperm and do not copulate, those sperm cells dissipate and die in your body.  So either you save every sperm cell that god gave you, and impregnate every woman you meet, or you are killing god given possible humans by not doing that.  If you have to draw the line, why draw it at the embryo? it's the same self serving arbitrary line BS that theists draw relative to who created the universe, giving all your material possessions to the poor, thou shall not kill, unless in the name of god, in which case it's fair game.  The stench of hypocrisy is so overbearingly intense as to make you sick.

Fucking short minded self serving idiots.  Subjectively projecting their infantile fears and hopes onto everything and not giving a fuck about who gets hurt in the process.

Ironically the one thing that makes me irrationally angry, is gross irrationality.  

"Don't seek these laws to understand. Only the mad can comprehend..." -- George Cosbuc


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Ktulu wrote:Brian37 wrote:If

Ktulu wrote:

Brian37 wrote:

If life "begins at conception", then that must mean the sperm was dead before conception, and the egg too. So that means when a guy jacks off he is committing mass murder.

 

Or one step further, every time you create sperm and do not copulate, those sperm cells dissipate and die in your body.  So either you save every sperm cell that god gave you, and impregnate every woman you meet, or you are killing god given possible humans by not doing that.  If you have to draw the line, why draw it at the embryo? it's the same self serving arbitrary line BS that theists draw relative to who created the universe, giving all your material possessions to the poor, thou shall not kill, unless in the name of god, in which case it's fair game.  The stench of hypocrisy is so overbearingly intense as to make you sick.

Fucking short minded self serving idiots.  Subjectively projecting their infantile fears and hopes onto everything and not giving a fuck about who gets hurt in the process.

Ironically the one thing that makes me irrationally angry, is gross irrationality.  

I guess I am a mass murderer because I wack off every day. I know I know TMI.

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UPDATE

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2011/nov/08/ballot-when-is-an-egg-a-person/

Ballot : When is an egg a person ? MS voters decision today could cause national ripples.

By Phil West

OXFORD, Miss. -- Mississippi voters will decide today whether their state will become the first in the nation to declare constitutionally that life begins at fertilization.

If they do so, supporters of Initiative 26 say it could prompt a court challenge that seeks to overturn Roe v. Wade, the 1973 U.S. Supreme Court decision that established a legal right to abortion.

Under the item, backed by Colorado-based Personhood USA and one of three initiatives on a crowded general election ballot, a fertilized human egg would be granted the same rights as an adult.

That, some say, could leave physicians caught between their oath to do no harm and a potential manslaughter conviction and prison sentence for terminating problem pregnancies.

Physicians also have questioned what the amendment would mean to women trying to become pregnant through in vitro fertilization or those whose pregnancies put the mother's health at risk.

"What am I supposed to do? Watch mom bleed to death internally?" Dr. Blake Smith, an Oxford obstetrician, asked Monday.

The American College of Obstetrics and Gynecologists said the amendment substitutes ideology for science and "does not respect the autonomy of women and jeopardizes women's health."

"The vague and overly broad terms in Proposition 26 will prevent physicians from providing the care vital to women's health. Proposition 26 must be defeated in the best interest of women's health," ACOG said in a statement.

The physicians' group stands squarely against the state's top elected officials, all Republicans except for Atty. Gen. Jim Hood, who support the measure.

Hood and his opponent, former state Public Safety commissioner Steve Simpson, also support the initiative.

Republican Lt. Gov. Phil Bryant and Hattiesburg Mayor Johnny DuPree, a Democrat, have said they favor the proposal.

"Initiative No. 26 would amend the Mississippi Constitution to define the word 'person' or 'persons,' as those terms are used in Article III of the state Constitution, to include every human being from the moment of fertilization, cloning or the functional equivalent thereof," reads the ballot summary prepared by Hood.

Republican Gov. Haley Barbour, who has served two terms and cannot run again, said early last week that he was concerned about the initiative's ambiguity, but he later voted absentee in favor of it.

Tupelo lawyer and cattleman Brad Prewitt, a former counsel to U.S. Sen. Thad Cochran, wrote the pro-personhood amendment position in a pamphlet produced by Mississippi Secretary of State Delbert Hosemann.

"Every human embryologist worldwide states that the life of the new individual human being begins at fertilization," Prewitt quoted UCLA medical professor Dr. Fritz Bumgartner as saying.

"The Bible tells us that God created humans 'in his own image,' thereby making human life sacred," Prewitt wrote.

"Finally, the Constitution and the Declaration (of Independence) both ensure the fundamental right to life to all persons, without which all other rights are meaningless."

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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Christians LOSE !

The voters of Mississippi defeated the proposed bill.

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2011/nov/08/mississippi-defeats-personhood-ballot-initiative/

Mississippi defeats ‘personhood’ ballot initiative

by Phil West

Mississippi apparently won't become the first state in the nation to legally declare that life begins at fertilization.

Voters on Tuesday evening were headed toward defeating a constitutional initiative that supporters said would have prompted a court challenge aimed at overturning Roe v. Wade, the 1973 Supreme Court decision that established a legal right to abortion.

With 702 of the state's 1,876 precincts reporting Tuesday evening, 59 percent of voters said they opposed constitutional Initiative 26, the so-called "personhood" amendment.

To succeed, the proposed amendment needed to receive a majority of votes and at least 40 percent of the total votes cast in the general election.

Had voters approved the proposed amendment, fertilized human eggs would have been granted the same rights as adults.

The defeat is a setback for Colorado-based Personhood USA, which has sustained defeats in that state. The group's co-founder, Keith Mason, said he intends to renew efforts in Mississippi, either through legislation or through another ballot initiative.

The group is also trying to put similar initiatives on 2012 ballots in Florida, Montana, Ohio, Oregon, Nevada and California. Mason said the group also plans to pursue life-at-fertilization legislation next year in Alabama, Wisconsin and Michigan.

Mississippi already has tough abortion regulations and only one clinic where the procedures are performed, which made it a fitting venue for a national movement to get abortion bans into state constitutions.

The amendment's language was drafted by state Atty. Gen. Jim Hood, a Democrat, who said he supported the measure.

Hood's support of the amendment did not hurt him at the polls. He easily defeated his Republican challenger, former state Public Safety Commissioner Steve Simpson.

Opponents of the amendment charged that in vitro fertilization, in which more than one human egg is fertilized at a time, could be at risk.

understand the reasons for Initiative 26. I also understand that the unintended consequences will affect all physicians -- not just gynecologists," Mississippi State Medical Association president Dr. Thomas Joiner wrote in a message to the organization's 4,600 members.

Joiner wrote that highly technical and scientific testimony could be used against physicians who try to act the best interest of their patients.

Tupelo lawyer and cattleman Brad Prewitt, a former counsel to U.S. Sen. Thad Cochran, wrote the pro-personhood amendment position in a pamphlet produced by Secretary of State Delbert Hosemann.

 

 

 

 

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno


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It got shot down big time.

It got shot down big time. And not just this issue. But it seems the right wing fundy behind the policial curtain is finally being exposed for the fraud it is. The Ohio Governor got his anti-union legislation shot down. And the same day voter legislation in the North was brought back.

I think all this collective bitch slapping of the right, is a backlash to the class warfar the Cock brothers and his ilk started. The masses are finally getting wise to the fact that pet issues are being used to divide the working class.

I think the more the right wing allows the rich to have a monopoly on politics by pulling shit like this, the more the working class will fight back.

I think this backlash really does SHOW the vision of the founders in their anti-monopoly mindset. You can stack the deck, but that only lasts so long. As long as the Constitution is protected, there will always be a way for those with less money and political power to fight the bullies.

I really hope all the above mentioned will knock some sense in to those at the top. You can only screw the working class for so long.

So two things the top needs to do. Stop using social issues to divide America. And bring back decent jobs and decent pay. Otherwise you WILL get bitch slapped even more.

This country is not "Of the Christians for the Christians". This country is not of the Republicans for the Republicans", this country is not "Of the rich for the rich".

You are now finding out that OUR country does not revolve solely around your religion or your class. We need more jobs, and better pay. We need better education. We need big religion and big money out of politics.

Wake up before you destroy this country with ideology and money. The working class will NOT put up with more of the same.

"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers."Obama
Check out my poetry here on Rational Responders Like my poetry thread on Facebook under BrianJames Rational Poet also on twitter under Brianrrs37


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Brian37 wrote:It got shot

Brian37 wrote:

It got shot down big time. And not just this issue. But it seems the right wing fundy behind the policial curtain is finally being exposed for the fraud it is. The Ohio Governor got his anti-union legislation shot down. And the same day voter legislation in the North was brought back.

I think all this collective bitch slapping of the right, is a backlash to the class warfar the Cock brothers and his ilk started. The masses are finally getting wise to the fact that pet issues are being used to divide the working class.

I think the more the right wing allows the rich to have a monopoly on politics by pulling shit like this, the more the working class will fight back.

I think this backlash really does SHOW the vision of the founders in their anti-monopoly mindset. You can stack the deck, but that only lasts so long. As long as the Constitution is protected, there will always be a way for those with less money and political power to fight the bullies.

I really hope all the above mentioned will knock some sense in to those at the top. You can only screw the working class for so long.

So two things the top needs to do. Stop using social issues to divide America. And bring back decent jobs and decent pay. Otherwise you WILL get bitch slapped even more.

This country is not "Of the Christians for the Christians". This country is not of the Republicans for the Republicans", this country is not "Of the rich for the rich".

You are now finding out that OUR country does not revolve solely around your religion or your class. We need more jobs, and better pay. We need better education. We need big religion and big money out of politics.

Wake up before you destroy this country with ideology and money. The working class will NOT put up with more of the same.

I agree.

The same group that tried to start all of this trouble is pushing for this agenda in other states :

The group is also trying to put similar initiatives on 2012 ballots in Florida, Montana, Ohio, Oregon, Nevada and California. Mason said the group also plans to pursue life-at-fertilization legislation next year in Alabama, Wisconsin and Michigan.

If Mississippi soundly defeated this fundie fascism, I can't see any of these other states supporting it either.

“It is proof of a base and low mind for one to wish to think with the masses or majority, merely because the majority is the majority. Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people.”
― Giordano Bruno