Fast-food conlgomerate pushing for taxpayer-funded Taco Bell

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Wow. Damn I love Taco Bell

Wow.
Damn I love Taco Bell too.

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I'll tell you what, if some


I'll tell you what, if some in society want people off food stamps, then get Taco Bell to pay decent wages and pay for health care. Otherwise I don't give a fuck that I pay taxes for food stamps I don't use. Poverty should not be a death sentence through starvation.

Remember that the next time you donate to a charity that sends food overseas to a third world country. If it is not ok for other country's poor to starve, why should that be ok here?

Maybe we should have more factories, more innovation and free higher education and less Taco Bells. That would take away the need for food stamps.

 

 

 

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Brian37 wrote:I'll tell you

Brian37 wrote:

I'll tell you what, if some in society want people off food stamps, then get Taco Bell to pay decent wages and pay for health care. Otherwise I don't give a fuck that I pay taxes for food stamps I don't use. Poverty should not be a death sentence through starvation.

Remember that the next time you donate to a charity that sends food overseas to a third world country. If it is not ok for other country's poor to starve, why should that be ok here?

Maybe we should have more factories, more innovation and free higher education and less Taco Bells. That would take away the need for food stamps.

 

 

 

Good point

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Especially about the higher

Especially about the higher education, Brian. It seems like in order to make any good money, you need a college or trade degree. But in order to get a degree, you need money to start with. So for those of us without well-off parents who will just pay for our degree, it's like a catch-22. It just keeps the wealthy wealthy, and the poor poor. I'm all for free higher education. Of course some Repubs (who probably got their college education handed to them by mommy and daddy) will call that "socialism", but I don't really give a crap.

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p { margin-bottom: 0.08in; }

p { margin-bottom: 0.08in; }

Actually, there is plenty of money out there for people to go to school. Part of the problem is that people waste that on useless degrees. I used to work for a catering company and the chef/owner had a degree in marine microbiology.

 

Really, if he had spent his free degree on an MBA, he would not have had to put me in charge while he took another job in order to put some cash into the company. Which went belly up two months after I quit anyway.

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Never ever did I say enything about free, I said "free."

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Recovering fundamentalist wrote:

Especially about the higher education, Brian. It seems like in order to make any good money, you need a college or trade degree. But in order to get a degree, you need money to start with. So for those of us without well-off parents who will just pay for our degree, it's like a catch-22. It just keeps the wealthy wealthy, and the poor poor. I'm all for free higher education. Of course some Repubs (who probably got their college education handed to them by mommy and daddy) will call that "socialism", but I don't really give a crap.

You are the second person in two days who has managed to make me feel slightly better about myself right at this point. Sometimes I just need to know that I am not the only one who feels this way.

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 Well if your just going to

 Well if your just going to throw around food stamps, who really cares what it is spent on anyway? Is there really a huge difference between taco bell and a frozen pizza?

 

If you really want to fix the food stamp program, allow it to be used only to purchase directly from farmers. Anyone who is on food stamps obviously has excess time, so just give them a lamb, pig or cow and have them slaughter and process it themselves. Have them purchase corn, beans and fruit directly from farmers. It will be cheaper (pigs are 65 cents a pound live), more environmentally friendly and will also provide incentive for people to get off food stamps. Especially if you just give them pigs. Make them butcher one pig and they will have great incentive to get a job and off food stamps ASAP.

 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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Beyond Saving wrote: Well

Beyond Saving wrote:

 Well if your just going to throw around food stamps, who really cares what it is spent on anyway? Is there really a huge difference between taco bell and a frozen pizza?

 

If you really want to fix the food stamp program, allow it to be used only to purchase directly from farmers. Anyone who is on food stamps obviously has excess time, so just give them a lamb, pig or cow and have them slaughter and process it themselves. Have them purchase corn, beans and fruit directly from farmers. It will be cheaper (pigs are 65 cents a pound live), more environmentally friendly and will also provide incentive for people to get off food stamps. Especially if you just give them pigs. Make them butcher one pig and they will have great incentive to get a job and off food stamps ASAP.

 

If YOU want to fix the food stamp problem then PAY LIVABLE WAGES, reduce the pay gap, bring jobs back here. Otherwise If I have to pay taxes so my fellow citizen doesn't starve to death. I DONT GIVE ONE FUCK WHAT DADDY WARBUCKS WANTS until Daddy Warbucks starts giving a shit how they make a buck.

"get a job"

LISTEN ASSHOLE, I have a job and I am not lazy, neither are most poor. You just think that class and money equals right and moral.

GET A FUCKING CLUE, your idea of what you want you have no right projecting on the rest of society, otherwise go make a law making it a crime to be poor, Then be willing to jail or fine or execute those who haven't managed to make your pay scale. Otherwise if you don't want to wash dishes or collect trash, SHUT THE FUCK UP AND BE HAPPY THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE WILLING TO DO IT.

You promote genocide through money. Those who have it live, and fuck anyone who doesn't have it.

I am so fucking sick of your bullshit.

 

 

 

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Brian37 wrote:If YOU want to

Brian37 wrote:

If YOU want to fix the food stamp problem then PAY LIVABLE WAGES, reduce the pay gap, bring jobs back here. Otherwise If I have to pay taxes so my fellow citizen doesn't starve to death. I DONT GIVE ONE FUCK WHAT DADDY WARBUCKS WANTS until Daddy Warbucks starts giving a shit how they make a buck.

"get a job"

LISTEN ASSHOLE, I have a job and I am not lazy, neither are most poor. You just think that class and money equals right and moral.

GET A FUCKING CLUE, your idea of what you want you have no right projecting on the rest of society, otherwise go make a law making it a crime to be poor, Then be willing to jail or fine or execute those who haven't managed to make your pay scale. Otherwise if you don't want to wash dishes or collect trash, SHUT THE FUCK UP AND BE HAPPY THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE WILLING TO DO IT.

You promote genocide through money. Those who have it live, and fuck anyone who doesn't have it.

I am so fucking sick of your bullshit.

 

LISTEN ASSHOLE, didn't I suggest we give them food? Did I say let them starve? I suggested we give them whole animals, which would result in far more food or a lower cost and since they are so hungry, they can butcher their own meat just like I do. It isn't going to kill them to learn how to cut up some meat (and also might provide a job opportunity, it costs $50-$100 to butcher a deer) I also suggested that they can purchase local fruits and grains from local providers, again saving huge costs and is much healthier and environmentally friendly.

 

Go take a fucking reading comprehension class. Or at least come up with something new to say. I'm sick of you following me around the forum and cutting and pasting your delusional accusations while ignoring the content of what I say and offering zero evidence to support your position. 

 

I never even said I have a problem with the food stamp program. As far as government programs it is definitely a small time offender. I would prefer that people turn to a local food shelf first and accept food that is given voluntarily, but whatever. If you want to cut anything in the Ag dept. your first target ought to be the billions we pay in farm subsidies.

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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Beyond Saving wrote: Well

Beyond Saving wrote:

 Well if your just going to throw around food stamps, who really cares what it is spent on anyway? Is there really a huge difference between taco bell and a frozen pizza?

 

If you really want to fix the food stamp program, allow it to be used only to purchase directly from farmers. Anyone who is on food stamps obviously has excess time, so just give them a lamb, pig or cow and have them slaughter and process it themselves. Have them purchase corn, beans and fruit directly from farmers. It will be cheaper (pigs are 65 cents a pound live), more environmentally friendly and will also provide incentive for people to get off food stamps. Especially if you just give them pigs. Make them butcher one pig and they will have great incentive to get a job and off food stamps ASAP.

 

Been there, done that.  Not a big deal.  But living in the city, the neighbors complain.  Last I heard, it was against the law within city limits here.  Check with your local enforcement agencies.  Living in the country, it was legal to slaughter your own meat.  And I have done it, and it was excellent.

And I did/do hit the local farms for produce.  Sometimes the local farmers allow gleaning for free to people receiving food stamps.  Looking forward to apple season locally.

As for providing incentive -- I would be off of food stamps in a heartbeat with or without a pig to slaughter if I could get someone to hire me.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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 Most people who receive

 Most people who receive food stamps probably have jobs.


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http://www.fns.usda.gov/ora/m

http://www.fns.usda.gov/ora/menu/Published/snap/FILES/Participation/2009CharacteristicsSummary.pdf

 

29% of recipient households have earnings. Which means that at least one recipient in the household has a job. That is hardly "most" unless most food stamp recipients lie and actually have jobs. 

The average monthly income of food stamp recipients is $711/month so if they are working, they certainly are not working full time. Only 64% of working age (16-64) are even participating in the workforce, so it really isn't that big of a surprise that most food stamp recipients don't work.  http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm 

 

@ CJ

Yeah, I could see a problem with the idea in highly urban areas, even if you provided an area for butchering some areas wouldn't have enough local supply. A more practical alternative (but less fun, I find the idea of city slickers having to go to the farm and receive a manure covered animal amusing) would be to arrange deals with butchers to simply quarter the animals, freeze the meat and ship it. By avoiding the grocer and the trimming work you can save significantly on costs. Which really was my main point. If you are concerned about the food stamp program as far as costs and health, make a radical change to provide meat at a huge discount. If you aren't willing to do that, I don't see why you would fret over taco bell. 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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cj wrote:Beyond Saving

cj wrote:

Beyond Saving wrote:

 Well if your just going to throw around food stamps, who really cares what it is spent on anyway? Is there really a huge difference between taco bell and a frozen pizza?

 

If you really want to fix the food stamp program, allow it to be used only to purchase directly from farmers. Anyone who is on food stamps obviously has excess time, so just give them a lamb, pig or cow and have them slaughter and process it themselves. Have them purchase corn, beans and fruit directly from farmers. It will be cheaper (pigs are 65 cents a pound live), more environmentally friendly and will also provide incentive for people to get off food stamps. Especially if you just give them pigs. Make them butcher one pig and they will have great incentive to get a job and off food stamps ASAP.

 

Been there, done that.  Not a big deal.  But living in the city, the neighbors complain.  Last I heard, it was against the law within city limits here.  Check with your local enforcement agencies.  Living in the country, it was legal to slaughter your own meat.  And I have done it, and it was excellent.

And I did/do hit the local farms for produce.  Sometimes the local farmers allow gleaning for free to people receiving food stamps.  Looking forward to apple season locally.

As for providing incentive -- I would be off of food stamps in a heartbeat with or without a pig to slaughter if I could get someone to hire me.

 

$7.25 an hour will get you off food stamps.

 

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Gauche wrote: Most people

Gauche wrote:

 Most people who receive food stamps probably have jobs.

No, they are all lazy fuckers who deserve to starve to death, well, according to some, not me.

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 You're counting people who

 You're counting people who didn't need jobs anyway. If you are old, or disabled, or a student then you don't need a job. 

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Beyond Saving wrote: Well

Beyond Saving wrote:

 Well if your just going to throw around food stamps, who really cares what it is spent on anyway? Is there really a huge difference between taco bell and a frozen pizza?

I think food stamps should be legal only for basic, inexpensive nutritional foods: meats, dairy. starch, etc. Not for Coca-cola, Taco Bell, or Whoppers. Hell, I'd like to see basic household necessities availble for food stamps, like toilet paper, toothpaste, etc. It should be for bare-bones necessities, not luxuries.

I'm not totally sure how the program works, but I work at home for a sales contractor, and one time I received a caller who was ordering a workout DVD system, and he tried to pay for it with an EBT card.

As far as this story goes though - I guess it shows how little these corporations actually care about the economy - the one pushing for the new law is a fast-food conglomerate - they want our tax dollars funneled into their own pocket.

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Brian37 wrote: I'll tell

Brian37 wrote:

 

I'll tell you what, if some in society want people off food stamps, then get Taco Bell to pay decent wages and pay for health care. Otherwise I don't give a fuck that I pay taxes for food stamps I don't use. Poverty should not be a death sentence through starvation.

And TB wouldn't pass on the cost to consumers??? Then just about everyone would stop buying there, no?

Somebody has to die to keep population growth from exceeding the capacity to produce food. Who else do you suggest die off, by what means?

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 Since when is Taco Bell a

 Since when is Taco Bell a luxury? Their food is cheap and it tastes like shit.


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EXC wrote:Brian37

EXC wrote:

Brian37 wrote:

 

I'll tell you what, if some in society want people off food stamps, then get Taco Bell to pay decent wages and pay for health care. Otherwise I don't give a fuck that I pay taxes for food stamps I don't use. Poverty should not be a death sentence through starvation.

And TB wouldn't pass on the cost to consumers??? Then just about everyone would stop buying there, no?

Somebody has to die to keep population growth from exceeding the capacity to produce food. Who else do you suggest die off, by what means?

 

Is there a food shortage I am not aware of? Why does anyone have to die?

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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Brian37 wrote:$7.25 an hour

Brian37 wrote:

$7.25 an hour will get you off food stamps.

 

In my area, it is $1780 US per month for a family of 2.  About $11.25 an hour.  And it is prorated - so if you have a job and you are paid less than that, your food stamp amount is reduced proportionally.  Don't know how your state handles it - since every state has different administrative rules.

The allowed amount goes up or down depending on the number of people in the household.  We are not eligible for cash payments since we are adults and not disabled.  Not yet, anyway. 

 

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Gauche wrote:You're counting

Gauche wrote:

You're counting people who didn't need jobs anyway. If you are old, or disabled, or a student then you don't need a job. 

 

I don't remember where you live - Canada?  Disability payments in the US are about $670 per month.  You are likely eligible for housing assistance - which means they look at your disability check and figure you are going to pay about half of it to your landlord.  So your actual cash is closer to $350.  You get food stamps - about $150-200 per month per person.  You get Medicaid - free health care.  That's it.

Landlord-tenant laws usually require a landlord to provide a working refrigerator and stove or range.  That's how we get the idiotic nonsense about poor people in the US having large appliances and therefore they aren't poor.  Trust me on this one, if it wasn't required by law, many landlords would not provide any appliances and their tenants would have to use campfires and cool chests.  Cable, phone, gasoline, car insurance, bus fare, clothing, and so on are paid out of that $350.  Some municipalities have reduced bus fare for disabled people, some don't, some don't have mass transportation at all.  I have seen a number of disabled people commuting on the bus in Portland who are obviously supplementing their income with honest work.

Students - most students work at least part time attempting to keep their student loans down to some reasonable amount.  What grants and scholarships are available usually don't cover tuition, let alone room and board.  That is, unless you are a sports star.  Not many qualify for that free ride.

People work.  People generally like to work, feel useful, and like getting paid fairly for the work they do.  Truly, most people prefer to work, most do not like the stigma of being poor and accepting assistance.  Seriously.  I have had to wait in enough offices to submit paperwork, I have overheard enough conversations, I firmly believe most of those who can work want to work. 

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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Gauche wrote: Since when is

Gauche wrote:

 Since when is Taco Bell a luxury? Their food is cheap and it tastes like shit.

 

I'll go along with you there. 

I personally don't see the difference between buying a frozen dinner at the grocery store and hitting one of the fast food places.  The two are very likely equally high in fat, salt and calories, and low in nutrition and taste.

 

-- I feel so much better since I stopped trying to believe.

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cj wrote:People work. 

cj wrote:

People work.  People generally like to work, feel useful, and like getting paid fairly for the work they do.  Truly, most people prefer to work, most do not like the stigma of being poor and accepting assistance.  Seriously.  I have had to wait in enough offices to submit paperwork, I have overheard enough conversations, I firmly believe most of those who can work want to work. 

 

I don't mean that the people have enough money. Obviously some people are elderly, disabled or students and they are penniless. 

Beyond Saving said that 29% of SNAP households have an employed person, implying that 71% should get a job. His own source however says 24% receive SSI and 22% receive social security. That means the people are disabled or elderly. Why should they have to get a job instead of receiving assistance? Only Ayn Rand knows for sure.

 

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Gauche wrote:cj wrote:People

Gauche wrote:

cj wrote:

People work.  People generally like to work, feel useful, and like getting paid fairly for the work they do.  Truly, most people prefer to work, most do not like the stigma of being poor and accepting assistance.  Seriously.  I have had to wait in enough offices to submit paperwork, I have overheard enough conversations, I firmly believe most of those who can work want to work. 

 

I don't mean that the people have enough money. Obviously some people are elderly, disabled or students and they are penniless. 

 

Beyond Saving said that 29% of SNAP households have an employed person, implying that 71% should get a job. His own source however says 24% receive SSI and 22% receive social security. That means the people are disabled or elderly. Why should they have to get a job instead of receiving assistance? Only Ayn Rand knows for sure.

 

 

And the point of my comment was to refute your statement that "most people who are on food stamps probably have jobs". They don't. I don't see how it matters why they don't have a job. Actually, I don't see why it even matters if they have a job or how their job status ties into the conversation except to my offhanded remark that butchering a pig would encourage them to get a job.

 

Ok, consider it amended to "butchering a pig will encourage them to find a way off food stamps ASAP". It was meant mostly as a jest, I guess you need to have actually butchered a pig to get it. Pigs are by far the most disgusting animal to butcher and visiting a pig farm is a decidedly unpleasant experience that takes forever to wash out of your skin.

 

 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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Beyond Saving wrote:Is there

Beyond Saving wrote:

Is there a food shortage I am not aware of? Why does anyone have to die?

There has never not been food shortages.

http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/03/the-global-food-crisis-mapped/

http://www.ers.usda.gov/Briefing/FoodSecurity/

 

It's been human history and human society for millions of years. We increase population until food insecurity (and other resourse) limits further growth. Unless we change the dynamics of human population growth, the only question is who is going to have to die.

In the USA we've decided to subsidise corn as fuel, so this means more food insecurity for someone else.

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EXC wrote:Beyond Saving

EXC wrote:

Beyond Saving wrote:

Is there a food shortage I am not aware of? Why does anyone have to die?

There has never not been food shortages.

http://green.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/03/the-global-food-crisis-mapped/

http://www.ers.usda.gov/Briefing/FoodSecurity/

 

It's been human history and human society for millions of years. We increase population until food insecurity (and other resourse) limits further growth. Unless we change the dynamics of human population growth, the only question is who is going to have to die.

In the USA we've decided to subsidise corn as fuel, so this means more food insecurity for someone else.

 

That is a distribution/poverty problem, not a quantity problem and specifically here in the US we have more than enough food to easily feed our entire population (probably several times over).

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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Gauche wrote: Since when is

Gauche wrote:

 Since when is Taco Bell a luxury? Their food is cheap and it tastes like shit.

Well the same is true with cigarettes - granted they're not "cheap" for someone who smokes a pack or more a day, but $4-5 for a pack of cigarettes is about the same as a taco bell combo for 1 person. So if a person eats there once a day every day, then they are potentially spending $150 a month on fast food, and that's only 1 meal.

In comparison, you can buy a 'family size' jar of peanuts at Wal-Mart - which contains about 6000 healthy calories and will last a long time - for about the same prices as a meal at Taco Bell, which contains maybe 400-600 calories, mostly from saturated fat.

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Beyond Saving wrote:And the

Beyond Saving wrote:

And the point of my comment was to refute your statement that "most people who are on food stamps probably have jobs". They don't. I don't see how it matters why they don't have a job. Actually, I don't see why it even matters if they have a job or how their job status ties into the conversation except to my offhanded remark that butchering a pig would encourage them to get a job.

 

Ok, consider it amended to "butchering a pig will encourage them to find a way off food stamps ASAP". It was meant mostly as a jest, I guess you need to have actually butchered a pig to get it. Pigs are by far the most disgusting animal to butcher and visiting a pig farm is a decidedly unpleasant experience that takes forever to wash out of your skin.

 

You said that people have excess time they should be compelled to spend slaughtering animals which is not only deranged but also wrong. 

The majority of people who receive food stamps don't have jobs because they are children or they are passed retirement age. I was talking about people who can seek employment. 

 

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Recovering fundamentalist wrote:

Gauche wrote:

 Since when is Taco Bell a luxury? Their food is cheap and it tastes like shit.

Well the same is true with cigarettes - granted they're not "cheap" for someone who smokes a pack or more a day, but $4-5 for a pack of cigarettes is about the same as a taco bell combo for 1 person. So if a person eats there once a day every day, then they are potentially spending $150 a month on fast food, and that's only 1 meal.

In comparison, you can buy a 'family size' jar of peanuts at Wal-Mart - which contains about 6000 healthy calories and will last a long time - for about the same prices as a meal at Taco Bell, which contains maybe 400-600 calories, mostly from saturated fat.

According to my sources one can buy a meal at Taco Bell for $2. Potentially you could eat three meals a day there for $180 a month which is less than the USDA low-cost food budget recommendation for any person over the age of 9.

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Gauche wrote:Beyond Saving

Gauche wrote:

Beyond Saving wrote:

And the point of my comment was to refute your statement that "most people who are on food stamps probably have jobs". They don't. I don't see how it matters why they don't have a job. Actually, I don't see why it even matters if they have a job or how their job status ties into the conversation except to my offhanded remark that butchering a pig would encourage them to get a job.

 

Ok, consider it amended to "butchering a pig will encourage them to find a way off food stamps ASAP". It was meant mostly as a jest, I guess you need to have actually butchered a pig to get it. Pigs are by far the most disgusting animal to butcher and visiting a pig farm is a decidedly unpleasant experience that takes forever to wash out of your skin.

 

You said that people have excess time they should be compelled to spend slaughtering animals which is not only deranged but also wrong. 

The majority of people who receive food stamps don't have jobs because they are children or they are passed retirement age. I was talking about people who can seek employment. 

 

 

If they were working 60 to 80 hours a week they would be making too much money to qualify for foodstamps even at minimum wage, therefore, they have time. We are not talking about a massive time commitment like raising an animal might be, we are talking about cutting up some meat. You can take one day and butcher the meat into meal sized portions for a month or two. And I'm not saying they should be compelled, just given the animal, they can butcher it or throw it away if they want but since they are hungry, I imagine most would choose to butcher it. Why is that deranged? Or wrong? 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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 Children don't have excess

 Children don't have excess time because they have to go to school and do chores when they get home. Their parents don't because they have to take care of the children and work or seek employment. Students have to study and do interships. 

 Only the elderly and disabled have excess time and they may not have the ability. What do you think killing a pig will do for them anyway make them not be old or disabled? 

  You want people to work sixty hours a week! Forty-hour work weeks were established nearly a century ago and there's been massive increases in productivity since then. If anything people should work less for food. 

   You want to humble and humiliate people who need food for some reason springing from a half-baked ideology that makes every attempt to help poor people take on some strange significance which makes it necessary for it to be counterbalanced with harm. That's why it's deranged. 

 

There are twists of time and space, of vision and reality, which only a dreamer can divine
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Brian37 wrote: I'll tell

Brian37 wrote:

 

I'll tell you what, if some in society want people off food stamps, then get Taco Bell to pay decent wages and pay for health care.

I'll tell you what, abolish workers unions abilities to stranglehold companies into paying insane wages for menial labor, which would allow for individuals and guilds to bid on contracts, where their 'performance/cost' ratios have to stay competitive, just like business has to.

The other answer is to put an end to illegal aliens infiltrating, and sweep the country for illegal aliens.

Brian37 wrote:
Otherwise I don't give a fuck that I pay taxes for food stamps I don't use.

Well, that's the problem. You should give a shit. It's a symptom that there is a huge problem with the way policies and laws are structured.

The fact that so many need food stamps is because they can't 'bid' on jobs, and undercut 'union' labor. Which leads to companies resorting to exploit the option to 'exporting' manual labor. And if your answer is to eliminate their ability to do that, you really don't have any grasp of how to problem solve, or economics.

Brian37 wrote:
Poverty should not be a death sentence through starvation.

1- It's not. The US is not a 3rd world country.

2- Have them become civil servants, fill potholes, garbage pickup, which would lower the costs governments incur which drive up the deficit.

 

 

I keep asking myself " Are they just playin' stupid, or are they just plain stupid?..."

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Gauche wrote: Children

Gauche wrote:

 Children don't have excess time because they have to go to school and do chores when they get home. Their parents don't because they have to take care of the children and work or seek employment. Students have to study and do interships. 

Wow, school must require a lot more time than it used to. I found time not only to butcher my own animals but to run a trap line, hunt and fish. I wonder how kids find time for all those video games? And I'm sure no one on food stamps watched football today.... nope, not a single one, they are SOOOOOOOO busy. Seriously, people can find a few hours in their schedule for something as important as preparing food to eat. Give me a break, I'm suggesting that they spend a few hours a month to butcher meat. 

 

Gauche wrote:

 Only the elderly and disabled have excess time and they may not have the ability. What do you think killing a pig will do for them anyway make them not be old or disabled? 
 And some disabled people can't get out of bed to go to the bathroom. Obviously, some people are in such bad shape they need special care. That is irrelevant to what services we ought to provide to people who can take care of themselves.

  
Gauche wrote:
 You want people to work sixty hours a week! Forty-hour work weeks were established nearly a century ago and there's been massive increases in productivity since then. If anything people should work less for food. 

 I worked 60 hour weeks when I was trying to make it. Maybe if I hadn't worked so much I would be more successful today? My point was that they are NOT working 60 hours a week, therefore, they have time to prepare their own food. Even at the busiest point in my life when I worked 2 jobs and was going to college I found time to butcher my own deer. Someone working 60+ hours a week might have a good excuse of not having enough time, but if they were working that many hours, even at minimum wage, they would be paying for other peoples food stamps, not receiving them. Someone working 40 hours (or probably far less) can find a few hours in their busy schedules.   
Gauche wrote:
 You want to humble and humiliate people who need food for some reason springing from a half-baked ideology that makes every attempt to help poor people take on some strange significance which makes it necessary for it to be counterbalanced with harm. That's why it's deranged. 

Humble and humiliate? Harm? I butcher almost all of my own meat, I'm not suggesting they do anything I don't do. I am simply offering a solution to the concerns expressed by others that the food available to food stamp beneficiaries is unhealthy. Purchasing directly from the farmer cuts the costs in half because you don't have the markup from the butcher, the markup from the distributor and the markup from the grocer. Furthermore, it provides the beneficiary with much higher quality meat as they would get every part of the animal instead of just the fatty scraps that weren't quite bad enough to go into a can of Alpo. They would get the chops, steaks, tenderloins and roasts which are probably too expensive in the supermarket for food stamp users to purchase. I would think that if you at least made it an option to purchase from a farmer, many beneficiaries in rural areas would jump at the opportunity just for the higher quality meat and produce. 

 

You know what I think is humiliating? Treating people like they are helpless and unable to do anything for themselves. It is degrading and patronizing to treat adults who fall on hard times like they are helpless kids who need everything done for them. And even more tragic, is when people start to believe that everything has to be done for them. They need a helping hand to get themselves back on their feet, not to be coddled like infants. They are capable of doing it, it would save money and it would provide them with much healthier, higher quality and even better tasting food.

 

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson


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Gauche wrote:Recovering

Gauche wrote:

Recovering fundamentalist wrote:

Gauche wrote:

 Since when is Taco Bell a luxury? Their food is cheap and it tastes like shit.

Well the same is true with cigarettes - granted they're not "cheap" for someone who smokes a pack or more a day, but $4-5 for a pack of cigarettes is about the same as a taco bell combo for 1 person. So if a person eats there once a day every day, then they are potentially spending $150 a month on fast food, and that's only 1 meal.

In comparison, you can buy a 'family size' jar of peanuts at Wal-Mart - which contains about 6000 healthy calories and will last a long time - for about the same prices as a meal at Taco Bell, which contains maybe 400-600 calories, mostly from saturated fat.

According to my sources one can buy a meal at Taco Bell for $2. Potentially you could eat three meals a day there for $180 a month which is less than the USDA low-cost food budget recommendation for any person over the age of 9.

Well ypu're right about the 2-dollar menu, but here's the "nutrients" they'd be getting:

http://www.tacobell.com/menuitem/two-dollar-meal-deal-beefy-five-layer-burrito

Basically fat, sodium, artificial preservatives, and processed carbs, 3 meals a day.

In comparison I spend about $200-240 on food each month, but I get in 2000-2500 calories a day, all from healthy sources, along with fruits and vegetables. It's not really extremely expensive to eat healthy.

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 You say let the poor buy a pig and butcher it themselves?  Have you any idea what that involves?  You need a bone saw and good sharp knives, a way to hang the beast at least 3 feet off the ground.  Then you have to know what you are doing.  A wrong cut in the wrong place can poison all the meat.  Then you have to chop it all up into steaks and such (more special knives or a electric cutter).  Then you have to have a large deep freeze and electricity to run it. Even if the poor person was knowledgeable and able enough to butcher the pig, I doubt they have a deep freeze ready to put all that meat in.  U sure r a genius  there Mr. Beyond Saving.  Veggies are the same story. You can manually can veggies to eat later, but it is not simple, nor easy, and is costly to someone who is already poor.      Just a canner costs a minimum of $100, more like 2 or 3 hundred.  If it were feasible , many poor would already be doing it.

As for the food stamps for Taco Bell issue.  Sounds just like our Govt., attacking the problem from the wrong end.  Taking money from US to give them handouts.  What they need to do is give them opportunities to make a living, either through education or training and placement.

 


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p { margin-bottom: 0.08in; }

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Butchering need not be that complicated. You cut the right way and you can get the pig apart with little risk of tainting the meat. Grtanted, most professional butchers use band saws but that is really more to get the job done faster. Then too, a whole neighborhood could go in one one and split the meat up, thus ending the storage issue.

 

Also, reusable jars cost about ten buks a dozen.

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It would probably be just as

It would probably be just as well for people to know how to safely butcher meat anyway.

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nude0007 wrote: You say let

nude0007 wrote:

 You say let the poor buy a pig and butcher it themselves?  Have you any idea what that involves?  You need a bone saw and good sharp knives, a way to hang the beast at least 3 feet off the ground.  Then you have to know what you are doing.  A wrong cut in the wrong place can poison all the meat.  Then you have to chop it all up into steaks and such (more special knives or a electric cutter).  Then you have to have a large deep freeze and electricity to run it. Even if the poor person was knowledgeable and able enough to butcher the pig, I doubt they have a deep freeze ready to put all that meat in.  U sure r a genius  there Mr. Beyond Saving.  Veggies are the same story. You can manually can veggies to eat later, but it is not simple, nor easy, and is costly to someone who is already poor.      Just a canner costs a minimum of $100, more like 2 or 3 hundred.  If it were feasible , many poor would already be doing it.

As for the food stamps for Taco Bell issue.  Sounds just like our Govt., attacking the problem from the wrong end.  Taking money from US to give them handouts.  What they need to do is give them opportunities to make a living, either through education or training and placement.

 

 

I know exactly what it entails as I am an avid hunter and have butchered hundreds (thousands?) of animals ranging in size from squirrels to moose and no there is no special "wrong cut" that will poison the meat, in fact contamination is far less likely when you do it yourself because if you get shit on the meat you will clean it off immediately rather than let it sit there. Saws do make it easier and quicker, but are not a necessity. I do the vast majority of my butchering with a 6 inch fixed blade buck knife the do the finishing work with a basic kitchen knife set. Obviously the nicer knives you purchase the easier it will be, but cutting a pizza is easier with a nice knife too. There are hundreds of thousands of hunters every year who manage to butcher their own meat without killing themselves, I'm sure you could do it too. 

 

The freezer is easy. The cost savings in having a deep freezer more than make up for the initial investment. We are giving there people a ton of money anyway, why not give them something that will be useful even after they get back on their feet? A 5.5 cubic ft freezer would be more than sufficient for most people and sells for around $150 and will last for many years. The electricity cost is negligible (around $30/year I think depending on where you live). There is absolutely no question that butchering your own meat saves a ton of cash.

 

Same thing with canning. You can get a pressure canner for less than a couple hundred bucks and much cheaper used and the rest of the required tools are cheap. Again, we are giving them a bunch of cash already, why not give them something they can USE. And many of the poor are doing it. Rural Ohio is about as poor as areas get and people canning and butchering for themselves to save money is common. Those poor just aren't the ones standing in the beggar line demanding that government give them something.

 

I'm just saying that since we are so insistent on throwing money at people, instead of giving them handouts, give them the tools to take care of themselves so they aren't on the government dole for extended periods.

I just usually go with my own taste. If I like something, and it happens to be against the law, well, then I might have a problem.- Hunter S. Thompson