Role Reversal

robj101
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Role Reversal

Here's the game, I am going to play a theist. I would like for a real theist to play an atheist and try to discredit my "religion".  I'm wondering if I could possibly do a better job of defending the "faith" than some theists.

If any are big enough to bite, I will begin:

God is real I have had experiences in my life that can't be attributed to faith alone. I also believe the bible is the written word of God. (capitalizing even har har)

There are many mistakes in the bible as it was written by men who were guided by god but may not have completely understood the divine nature of his influence therefore made some mistakes.

I believe that all gods are one and the messages seem different because different men were influenced while writing their holy books so it makes perfect sense for me to worship the translation I am surrounded by.

Human thought and emotion can't be compared to that of a god, what may seem right or wrong or mischevious even is our perception not his. On death and entry into heaven we shall gain all knowledge and a better understanding of why God does what he does.

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin


beardedinlair
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what if you give them

what if you give them ammunition?


Ktulu
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 hmmm I would have gone

 hmmm I would have gone with an ontological argument myself.  The bible thumping theists are sooooo boring.

"Don't seek these laws to understand. Only the mad can comprehend..." -- George Cosbuc


robj101
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Theres plenty to discuss,

Theres plenty to discuss, why not start simple.

I made a thread similair to this a long time ago. It's great because it can prove one of two points and possibly both.

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin


robj101
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 Going on two days and I

 Going on two days and I haven't seen a theist yet.


Mr_Metaphysics (not verified)
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robj101 wrote:Here's the

robj101 wrote:

Here's the game, I am going to play a theist. I would like for a real theist to play an atheist and try to discredit my "religion".  I'm wondering if I could possibly do a better job of defending the "faith" than some theists.

If any are big enough to bite, I will begin:

God is real I have had experiences in my life that can't be attributed to faith alone. I also believe the bible is the written word of God.

The experiences you've had are great evidences for you, but not for me.  Do you have evidence that is good for me as well?

Quote:
There are many mistakes in the bible as it was written by men who were guided by god but may not have completely understood the divine nature of his influence therefore made some mistakes.

They were guided by God to make mistakes?  So God wanted his revelation to be inaccurate?  Perhaps one of the Bible's mistakes is that God actually exists? 

Quote:
I believe that all gods are one and the messages seem different because different men were influenced while writing their holy books so it makes perfect sense for me to worship the translation I am surrounded by.

So there is more than one God?  A Christian polytheist?  Wow, monotheism must of been one of the Bible's aforementioned "mistakes".

Quote:
Human thought and emotion can't be compared to that of a god

Didn't you just say that your basis for belief in God was your experience, which involved your very own mental states?  Or was the fact that we are essentially souls one of the Bible's "mistakes" that God influenced men to write falsely?

Quote:
what may seem right or wrong or mischevious even is our perception not his. On death and entry into heaven we shall gain all knowledge and a better understanding of why God does what he does.

Is this belief based on the Bible, which you've admitted to being the fallible word of man?


robj101
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Mr_Metaphysics wrote:robj101

Mr_Metaphysics wrote:

robj101 wrote:

Here's the game, I am going to play a theist. I would like for a real theist to play an atheist and try to discredit my "religion".  I'm wondering if I could possibly do a better job of defending the "faith" than some theists.

If any are big enough to bite, I will begin:

God is real I have had experiences in my life that can't be attributed to faith alone. I also believe the bible is the written word of God.

The experiences you've had are great evidences for you, but not for me.  Do you have evidence that is good for me as well?

Quote:
There are many mistakes in the bible as it was written by men who were guided by god but may not have completely understood the divine nature of his influence therefore made some mistakes.

They were guided by God to make mistakes?  So God wanted his revelation to be inaccurate?  Perhaps one of the Bible's mistakes is that God actually exists? 

Quote:
I believe that all gods are one and the messages seem different because different men were influenced while writing their holy books so it makes perfect sense for me to worship the translation I am surrounded by.

So there is more than one God?  A Christian polytheist?  Wow, monotheism must of been one of the Bible's aforementioned "mistakes".

Quote:
Human thought and emotion can't be compared to that of a god

Didn't you just say that your basis for belief in God was your experience, which involved your very own mental states?  Or was the fact that we are essentially souls one of the Bible's "mistakes" that God influenced men to write falsely?

Quote:
what may seem right or wrong or mischevious even is our perception not his. On death and entry into heaven we shall gain all knowledge and a better understanding of why God does what he does.

Is this belief based on the Bible, which you've admitted to being the fallible word of man?

I don't require evidence for you, it is up to you to accept the spiritual nature given to you by god and to understand the evidence laid before you.

Of course God did not "want" mistakes, it was to be expected however due to the nature of men. No one can fully comprehend the will of God and no one may take his knowledge and lay it all on paper. Once again spirituality will lead you on the proper course but the bible is a guideline to such.

There is only one God. He is interpreted differently in different cultures but he is one and the same. Once again parshally due to the fallibility of men.

God has granted us free will and given us a head start! He has given us "spirituality" a guiding signpost that we may lead ourselves to him.

This belief is based on the bible and the way men interpreted it, but if you feel spirituality then you are feeling God's will.

 

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin


Mr_Metaphysics (not verified)
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robj101 wrote:I don't

robj101 wrote:

I don't require evidence for you, it is up to you to accept the spiritual nature given to you by god and to understand the evidence laid before you.

Of course God did not "want" mistakes, it was to be expected however due to the nature of men. No one can fully comprehend the will of God and no one may take his knowledge and lay it all on paper. Once again spirituality will lead you on the proper course but the bible is a guideline to such.

There is only one God. He is interpreted differently in different cultures but he is one and the same. Once again parshally due to the fallibility of men.

God has granted us free will and given us a head start! He has given us "spirituality" a guiding signpost that we may lead ourselves to him.

This belief is based on the bible and the way men interpreted it, but if you feel spirituality then you are feeling God's will.

You do require evidence for me because you are here on a discussion board telling me that I should believe that God exists.  What does my being a spirit have to do with belief in God?  Perhaps we are fundamentally spirits but still uncreated by God?  What kind of point is that?  Anyway, I don't really see you countering my point that your evidence is only good for you, so I'll take it that you concede this point and that you either have no evidence that is also good for everyone who is not you or you are simply unwilling to provide some evidence that you do have.

If God did not want mistakes, then why did he allow man to make them, especially if his goal was providing mankind with a special revelation?  "Spirituality" will lead you to the proper course?  What is "spirituality"?  And how is the Bible a guideline to such when you stated that it is full of mistakes?

Okay, there is only one God.  So when you talked about different Gods you were mistaken.  "Parshally"?  Do you mean "partially"?  

(In all seriousness, you do perhaps the worst impression of a theist that I've ever seen; either you are doing this deliberately in order to mock theists, or you really are so philosophically untrained that you just do not understand the arguments made on the other side.  This thread would have been much more entertaining if the original poster was not some prepubescent uneducated pimply faced teen, which is what I am guessing you are.)


robj101
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Mr_Metaphysics wrote:robj101

Mr_Metaphysics wrote:

robj101 wrote:

I don't require evidence for you, it is up to you to accept the spiritual nature given to you by god and to understand the evidence laid before you.

Of course God did not "want" mistakes, it was to be expected however due to the nature of men. No one can fully comprehend the will of God and no one may take his knowledge and lay it all on paper. Once again spirituality will lead you on the proper course but the bible is a guideline to such.

There is only one God. He is interpreted differently in different cultures but he is one and the same. Once again parshally due to the fallibility of men.

God has granted us free will and given us a head start! He has given us "spirituality" a guiding signpost that we may lead ourselves to him.

This belief is based on the bible and the way men interpreted it, but if you feel spirituality then you are feeling God's will.

You do require evidence for me because you are here on a discussion board telling me that I should believe that God exists.  What does my being a spirit have to do with belief in God?  Perhaps we are fundamentally spirits but still uncreated by God?  What kind of point is that?  Anyway, I don't really see you countering my point that your evidence is only good for you, so I'll take it that you concede this point and that you either have no evidence that is also good for everyone who is not you or you are simply unwilling to provide some evidence that you do have.

If God did not want mistakes, then why did he allow man to make them, especially if his goal was providing mankind with a special revelation?  "Spirituality" will lead you to the proper course?  What is "spirituality"?  And how is the Bible a guideline to such when you stated that it is full of mistakes?

Okay, there is only one God.  So when you talked about different Gods you were mistaken.  "Parshally"?  Do you mean "partially"?  

(In all seriousness, you do perhaps the worst impression of a theist that I've ever seen; either you are doing this deliberately in order to mock theists, or you really are so philosophically untrained that you just do not understand the arguments made on the other side.  This thread would have been much more entertaining if the original poster was not some prepubescent uneducated pimply faced teen, which is what I am guessing you are.)

You sir are blind to the world around us. Nothing comes from nothing and something comes from something. I started my belief and have not insinuated that you "have" to believe in it. I point out that perhaps you should because if nothing else you have nothing to lose by doing so. I stated that the evidence is all around you, I don't see how this equates to no evidence.

He allowed man to make mistakes to follow his own path and make his own decisions, would you expect this test to be sufficient with a full on tutor?

I don't think I said there were actually other gods you took it wrong.

(in all seriousness I wish I were a pimply faced teen, I never said I was philisophically trained and I have a high school education for whatever that is worth. What gave you the impression that one had to have a bachelors to argue something let alone believe or disbelieve in said something? Most theists are as educated as I and some less.)

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin


robj101
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If another atheist would

If another atheist would like to take up my obvious "slack" vs mr Plato here go for it.

_

Nm, he ran out of steam and just wanted to point out a pimply face with a small brain. I didn't even get a chance to get the circle spinning =/

I did plan to play on spirituality, I think this is an aspect of the human psyche that has not been abused enough by theists nor do we have any real evidence of what it is other than speculation. I do speculate.

Faith is the word but next to that snugged up closely "lie's" the want.
"By simple common sense I don't believe in god, in none."-Charlie Chaplin


robj101
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Seems I won this round.

Seems I won this round.